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Rob Fahey 14:04 24/09/2004

World's favourite music format joins ATRAC3 on the PSP's supported list

Sony's forthcoming handheld console, the PlayStation Portable, will support MP3 audio files in its music player, it has emerged at the Tokyo Game Show, following on from a company U-turn on the format earlier this week.

An eagle-eyed reader at the show noticed that the firm has put MP3 onto the specification sheet for the console, along with Sony's proprietary music format, ATRAC3, which is used by the Sony Connect music store, minidisk players and Sony hard drive music players.

A few days ago, Sony revealed that it was reconsidering its stance on MP3 support in its music playback devices, which had formerly only supported the ATRAC3 system - leading to significant criticism from consumers, since competing devices such as Apple's iPod support the more popular MP3 format.

The same specification sheet revealed that the PSP will support video playback of the H.264/AVC format, an advanced video codec which supports a wide range of quality settings, and which is set to be used in the next generation of DVD systems.

It's not clear, however, whether this indicates that the system will be able to play H.264 video off Memory Stick storage devices, or if it just means that Sony has chosen the standard as the compression format for movies on its UMD discs.

that's good. sorry if old.

 

[Nerevar]

yeah, that's huge. That is actually a huge helping factor in whether or not I decide to pick one up.

 

[BeOnEdge]

DoomedSystem....huh what oh...

 

[TekunoRobby]

I want to beleive this so badly but with all the TGS craze only an official picture would atleast convince me.

ATRAC3 is basically worthless considering the conversion software and the fact that it isn't MP3. Having MP3 playback would instantly elevate the PSP into a functional music playback device.

 

[Kiriku]

"A few days ago, Sony revealed that it was reconsidering its stance on MP3 support in its music playback devices, which had formerly only supported the ATRAC3 system - leading to significant criticism from consumers, since competing devices such as Apple's iPod support the more popular MP3 format."

Good to see they're listening to consumers.

 

[DaCocoBrova]

And we'll be storing these MP3's... Where?

 

[Razoric]

This might actually change my mind on PSP.... depending on how they store the Mp3s and how easy it is to access them.

 

[DCX]

Memory Sticks no doubt.

DCX

 

[aoi tsuki]

On Memory Stick Duos. Hopefully, this extends across their entire product line, or at least the products using Sonic Stage. i have a feeling that if it's true, it'll be crippled somehow. For example, the Clie music player doesn't play VBR MP3s.

 

[kaching]

DoomedSystem....huh what oh...

Don't go thinking it's going to get off that easily. The argument will now just shift to Memory Sticks being too expensive and not being able to hold someone's entire music collection anyway.

 

[Sho Nuff]

On your Memory Stick Duo.

Oh, by the way, you can get a 512mb MSD for $149 or so.

Oh, by the way, you can get 512mb of Compactflash for $45.

Oh, by the way, Sony can eat me.

 

[TekunoRobby]

The argument will now just shift to Memory Sticks being too expensive and not being able to hold someone's entire music collection anyway.

Of course the argument will shift to that because that's A VALID ARGUMENT, jesus. Fitting the entire music collection, now that is silly.

EDIT: Some of you people with your platform alliances are getting pretty silly.

 

[DarienA]

On your Memory Stick Duo.

Oh, by the way, you can get a 512mb MSD for $149 or so.

Oh, by the way, you can get 512mb of Compactflash for $45.

Oh, by the way, Sony can eat me.

I don't think it's far to compare the price of a Memory Stick Duo to a format as old as Compact flash... How long has the MSD format been out in the US now and what formats have come since? sd? xd?(I don't follow the portable mem formats so I don't know).

 

[Drexon]

So are there any compact flash mp3 players (w/o flash card, just player)?

 

[TekunoRobby]

If any of you TGS people find the spec sheet in question please post the picture!

I mean having MP3 playback is very good news, and I don't want to jump on the rumor bandwagon.

 

[Sho Nuff]

Well, first they had Memory Stick, which was pricy, but got a little cheaper. Then they had Duo, which was the same shit, but smaller. Oh, and then they had Memory Stick Pro, which tried to cater to pros who needed large storage who didn't know any better.

It's a terrible, expensive, proprietary format that I would very much like to see go away.

 

[Lord Error]

Oh, by the way, you can get a 512mb MSD for $149 or so.

Oh, by the way, you can get 512mb of Compactflash for $45.

Almost noone in the electronics industry is using CF anymore. It's pretty much all SD and MS now, at least in the really compact devices.

 

[Sho Nuff]

So are there any compact flash mp3 players (w/o flash card, just player)?

In Japan, anyway, yeah. And you can always slam a gig or four of CF into your PocketPC and use that as a player (if you're talking about multifunctional devices).

 

[DarienA]

Well, first they had Memory Stick, which was pricy, but got a little cheaper. Then they had Duo, which was the same shit, but smaller. Oh, and then they had Memory Stick Pro, which tried to cater to pros who needed large storage who didn't know any better.

It's a terrible, expensive, proprietary format that I would very much like to see go away.

I meant what competing formats have come out since the MSD came out. Compactflash has been around for eons so of course it's f*ckin dirt cheap at this point.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Well, first they had Memory Stick, which was pricy, but got a little cheaper. Then they had Duo, which was the same shit, but smaller. Oh, and then they had Memory Stick Pro, which tried to cater to pros who needed large storage who didn't know any better.

It's a terrible, expensive, proprietary format that I would very much like to see go away.

Do you know other formats that have the same Read and Write speed capabilities and size as Memory Stick Pro Duo devices ?

 

[Lord Error]

MS Pro Duo is actually a very good, very *very* fast little card. It amazed me when it copied a ~30MB video file in just seconds from my photo camera to the computer, and I don't even have USB2.0 on the mother board to take real advantage of the camera's USB speed. In comparision, it takes minutes (around 5 minutes for sure) for my Pocket PC to copy such file over from the SD card. I know it's more of a limitation of the shitty USB implementation in the Pocket PC hardware, but still.

It does suck for people who jumped on the bandwagon too soon, and bought older devices that only used old MS, but if you are only starting to buy electronics now, MS Pro Duo is really good.

SD is not much different actually. There was SD, then there's high performance SD, so if you want more speed you have to buy new card again.

 

[Panajev2001a]

On your Memory Stick Duo.

Oh, by the way, you can get a 512mb MSD for $149 or so.

Oh, by the way, you can get 512mb of Compactflash for $45.

Oh, by the way, Sony can eat me.

Try again: $109 at newegg.com and it is not a regular Duo, it is a Pro Duo .

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewprodu...-417&ATT=Memory+Flash+Memory+&CMP=OTC-B1zrat3

 

[G4life98]

a little ot but this could be huge if they unshackle all their portable media players from atrac .

 

[Kintaro]

Hmmm... good news on the MP3 front...

But I'm still not buying a goddamned memory stick for a portable gaming system (and make no mistake, this is what I would be using it for mainly).

 

[Panajev2001a]

ATRAC3+ is good, not having to transcode and ahving ATRAC3+ along MP3 is better.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Hmmm... good news on the MP3 front...

But I'm still not buying a goddamned memory stick for a portable gaming system (and make no mistake, this is what I would be using it for mainly).

How are you going to save your games ?

 

[TekunoRobby]

How are you going to save your games ?

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-171-059&depa=0

 

[sohka88]

Sony has changed their tune on MP3s. They Have just announced MP3 support on their Netwalkman line. You can get a bios upgrade if u already have one or wait till it is on the hardware.

 

[Insertia]

Not supporting .mp3 with a casual piece of hardware like PSP would have hampered the whole portable music thing. A year or two ago when I heard PSP would have Atrac3 playback over mp3, I knew that decision was too stupid to stick with.

 

[kaching]

Of course the argument will shift to that because that's A VALID ARGUMENT, jesus. Fitting the entire music collection, now that is silly.

EDIT: Some of you people with your platform alliances are getting pretty silly.

Tekuno, let me translate for you since you seem unable to read my post in an unbiased fashion because you've made a final judgment on my alliances and how badly they affect my reasoning.

I didn't say that Memstick price wasn't a valid concern. What I was suggesting was that the concern will suddenly gain importance out of proportion with its validity as a tool to marginalize the value of the PSP for people with certain platform alliances around here. You know full well that there are a number of people around here that have been exagerating various concerns for the sake of partisanship.

 

[Panajev2001a]

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-171-059&depa=0

DUH DUH

I know that Capt. Obvious .

I was askiong him, how did he plan to save the games if he did not want to buy a Memory Stick.

 

[PS2 KID]

Try again: $109 at newegg.com and it is not a regular Duo, it is a Pro Duo .

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewprodu...-417&ATT=Memory+Flash+Memory+&CMP=OTC-B1zrat3

less than that even: $103.98 shipped.
http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=134670&_LOC=US

There's also the new mini-SD card. I also heard of a new flash memory format from the Taiwanese. They'll never stop making new formats. You'll just have to live with it or buy a CF enabled device to show manufacturers what you want with your wallet. Better do it quck. SD will overtake CF soon and MS is not far behind SD either.

 

[Sho Nuff]

I hardly think a high-speed media is required for simple MP3 playback. Could you please tell me what kind of application requires the speed of a Memory Stick Pro?

I hardly think photography would qualify, as no professional would be caught dead using a Sony camera vs. a Canon or Nikon digital SLR.

I wouldn't bitch nearly as much if it just supported normal Memory Sticks, which are quite cheaper (and I have a few of, anyhoo).

 

[TekunoRobby]

Tekuno, let me translate for you since you seem unable to read my post in an unbiased fashion because you've made a final judgment on my alliances and how badly they affect my reasoning.

In regards to platform fanboyism, I wasn't speaking to you slick hence the edit and not added in as part of the text. Don't take it personally and PLEASE don't pretend to read into things that aren't there (Being unable to read your post in an unbiased fashion? Now you're getting ridiculous).

I understand your point (and goddamn you're eloquent) but that mem stick example you initially provided didn't fit the equation so I wanted to point that out.

EDIT: Sorry Pana I added that in for laughs. ALSO BECAUSE IT'S ONLY $36 WOO!

 

[Panajev2001a]

I hardly think a high-speed media is required for simple MP3 playback. Could you please tell me what kind of application requires the speed of a Memory Stick Pro?

I hardly think photography would qualify, as no professional would be caught dead using a Sony camera vs. a Canon or Nikon digital SLR.

I wouldn't bitch nearly as much if it just supported normal Memory Sticks, which are quite cheaper (and I have a few of, anyhoo).

Hint: video recording, photography and video playback all things you will be able to do on PSP.

 

[Sho Nuff]

Hint: video recording, photography and video playback all things you will be able to do on PSP.

This is news to me, please explain more

 

[kaching]

Gimme a break Tekuno - the same tone of exasperation was apparent in what you originally posted, directed at me, as was apparent in your edit.

So, if it wasn't targeted at me, who was it targeted at?

 

[PS2 KID]

I hardly think a high-speed media is required for simple MP3 playback. Could you please tell me what kind of application requires the speed of a Memory Stick Pro?

I hardly think photography would qualify, as no professional would be caught dead using a Sony camera vs. a Canon or Nikon digital SLR.

I wouldn't bitch nearly as much if it just supported normal Memory Sticks, which are quite cheaper (and I have a few of, anyhoo).

Remember when Sony used to use floppies to save your pictures on (I thnk they still do actually). People bought them in droves making Sony the number one digital camera manufacturer. Unfortunately or fortunately that didn't last long. Why? Because CCD and CMOS sensors went up in Megapixels. The more megapixels the larger in size a single shot would be. So even for non professionals, they wanted more storage space instead of a floppy and they grew less patient with waiting for their pictures to write to their flash cards. Not to mention they liked faster shot to shot times and niceities such as burst (number of shots in quick succession) and movie mode. Faster read and write times were the hallmark of the Memory stick pros. So even if you're not a pro you'll soon discover the megapixels will overwhelm slower media.

As for the PSP. I'm not sure what Sony's take or implementation on video on their MSDP's will be. They recently approved MP3 for the PSP. I would prefer the MSD pro's if only because of faster write times transferring from the PC to the PSP. I hope movies or video on MSDP will be implemented and might be with the addition of the camera. Possibility of recording movies? Maybe voice too. Maybe Movies with sound? Who knows. I rather be with speed than without. Just my opinion.

 

[TekunoRobby]

So, if it wasn't targeted at me, who was it targeted at?

After I give you a break I shall provide you an answer.

...

The ether.

EDIT: You know who are the offending many, you don't need to ask me.

 

[aoi tsuki]

I hardly think a high-speed media is required for simple MP3 playback. Could you please tell me what kind of application requires the speed of a Memory Stick Pro?

I hardly think photography would qualify, as no professional would be caught dead using a Sony camera vs. a Canon or Nikon digital SLR.

I wouldn't bitch nearly as much if it just supported normal Memory Sticks, which are quite cheaper (and I have a few of, anyhoo).

Actually, if you want to save EX (640x480 IIRC) video on a Sony digicam, you'll need Pro sticks. And the faster your memory card, the faster large images are saved to them. You're pretty much right on the Canon/Nikon comment (from my experience), but it's a given across the board. Using the fastest card your camera supports leads to quicker followup shots.

 

[Sho Nuff]

Ah, ok -- so the Pro sticks are basically there for the purpose of video.

I shoot DSLR + Betacam or DVCam, so I've never used the prosumer stuff. I wonder how many minutes of progressive video you can cram on 512mb of stick? (Wonders)

 

[kaching]

EDIT: You know who are the offending many, you don't need to ask me.

But what I'm trying to get a handle on is who YOU are offended by and why, Tekuno. I've personally noted a number of jabs at my expense from you in recent memory. A pattern's forming but since you generally try to dodge responsibility for your comments (like you're doing now) it's hard to get a bead on exactly what the issue is.

 

[TekunoRobby]

But what I'm trying to get a handle on is who YOU are offended by and why, Tekuno. I've personally noted a number of jabs at my expense from you in recent memory. A pattern's forming but since you generally try to dodge responsibility for your comments (like you're doing now) it's hard to get a bead on exactly what the issue is.

I'm not offended, just annoyed by:
PSP DOOMED
DS DOOMED
NINTENDO DOOMED
SONY DOOMED
MICROSOFT DOOMED
PC DOOMED

Whatever amazingly negative thing you can conjure up also genuinly gets pretty annoying after a while.

KACHING DOOMED also is annoying too, thankfully there's no hint of that so all is well in GAF land.

EDIT: Why do I bother?

 

[Tritroid]

I'm not offended, just annoyed by:
PSP DOOMED
DS DOOMED
NINTENDO DOOMED
SONY DOOMED
MICROSOFT DOOMED
PC DOOMED

Whatever amazingly negative thing you can conjure up also genuinly gets pretty annoying after a while.

KACHING DOOMED also is annoying too, thankfully there's no hint of that so all is well in GAF land.

So why didn't you attack this:

DoomedSystem....huh what oh...

...instead of kaching's reply?

 

[sohka88]

I am sure you will also be able to use a USB keydrive. Those are cheap now too (well not the 2 gig ones).

 

[TekunoRobby]

So why didn't you attack this:


...instead of kaching's reply?

SOMEONE ISN'T KEEPING UP/PAYING ATTENTION.

Damn I can't beleive you thought my reply was an 'attack', now that's being overly sensitive.

 

[Kintaro]

How are you going to save your games ?

Guess I probably won't be buying one then huh? Unless a very cheap memory stick like the link mentioned is available at launch. I'm talking cheaper than one of the goddamned games too. Otherwise, I'll just buy something else. =)

 

[Lord Error]

I hardly think a high-speed media is required for simple MP3 playback. Could you please tell me what kind of application requires the speed of a Memory Stick Pro?

Well, speed of copying those mp3 and video files to the card is one very obvious benefit, and so is playback of video files (much less bitrate concerns)

I hardly think photography would qualify, as no professional would be caught dead using a Sony camera vs. a Canon or Nikon digital SLR.

Are you talking about the PSP or the photo cameras in general? Because if you are talking about cameras in general, there's an obvious benefit of being able to record higher quality video which some of the latest Sony models make use of. With DSC T1 camera that I have, you can record maybe 12 minutes of progressive 640x480 30FPS video. Camera records it in plain MPEG format, though, (as it has to record and compress in realtime) so the compression ratio is obviously not the greatest.

There's also the benefot of quicker storing of high resolution images (5+Mpixels) that every digital camera has nowadays, and also quicker file transfer to your computer.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Guess I probably won't be buying one then huh? Unless a very cheap memory stick like the link mentioned is available at launch.

That Memory Stick or smaller (32 MB and 64 MB are available) are out now .

 

[kaching]

I couldn't care less if you're "supportive" of me Tekuno. You want to criticize, be my guest, but have the presence to stand up for having done so when challenged. You don't need to post here at GAF if all you want to do is talk to the ether.