Support NeoGAF

[Mr.Shrugglesツ]

lol

But if you want money for people with minds that hate
All I can tell you is brother you have to wait

It's clearly a song about getting money out of politics

Don't you know it's gonna be alright
Alright, alright, al...

You say you'll change the constitution

Fixing gerrymandering

We all want to change your head
You tell me it's the institution
Well, you know
You'd better free your mind instead

Weed legalization

Alright, alright
Alright, alright
Alright, alright
Alright, alright

Alright

 

[TestOfTide]

Absolute majority: 289

And this right here is why I am not gonna assume that every place in the western world needs to go hard left to win big.

Macron's party is winning big by being moderates.

Corbyn's Labour Party is winning big by unapologetically going in hard against the Tories.

And both Merkel and Shultz are seeing their parties bounce back up in Germany since 2016.


Winning against conservatives in 2017 (and I assume 2018 and beyond) is going to be 50% riding what is now the backlash against both the far-right and Neo-fascism and the other 50% is actually catering your message to each of your constituencies.

For the UK, Corbyn needed that youth turnout so he focused a lot of his campaign on messaging towards that. I assume the next step for him is gonna be showing the UK that the Tories have been the cause for the UK's problems for years.

For France, Macron knew that people were both sick of Hollande and disgusted with LePen, so he played to those factors very well as an actual moderate.

Here in America, its going to be a lot of factors, such as capitalizing on how pissed 45% of voters are going to be when the GOP fucks with their healthcare, as well as the death by a thousand cuts Trump is receiving.

 

[ShadowSwordmaster]

The problem now what will the Democrats will do. At this point, I don't trust them to run a good candidates for 2018.

 

[Mr.Shrugglesツ]

The problem now what will the Democrats will do. At this point, I don't trust them to run a good candidates for 2018.

They'll probably run Ossof for President in 2018.

 

[TestOfTide]

The problem now what will the Democrats will do. At this point, I don't trust them to run a good candidates for 2018.

What do you mean? That's up to the people of each individual state and district to find someone who is willing to run first.

This isn't like the POTUS run where you can just pick anyone from the country.

 

[ShadowSwordmaster]

My mistake. What I should say support those candidates.

 

[theprodigy]

how did France create a system more broken than the electoral college

Have you seen Italy's system though

 

[TestOfTide]

My mistake. What I should say support those candidates.

well yeah, many of us have been saying that the DNC, DCCC, and DSCC need to go VERY wide in their investments rather than the Rahm Emanuel approach of focusing entirely on "competitive" races.

 

[Aaron Strife]

The problem now what will the Democrats will do. At this point, I don't trust them to run a good candidates for 2018.

Candidate recruitment for 2018 has been better than 2006/08 so far.

But those DNC dumbocrats mirite

Edit: Saw your clarification, DCCC is planning on competing in like 300 districts so for now I don't think this fear is very grounded.

 

[Bonen no Max'd]

Candidate recruitment for 2018 has been better than 2006/08 so far.

But those DNC dumbocrats mirite

how many veterans named Jason do we have so far though

I only know Thompson and Crow but hopefully we can get some more. Maybe they can all do a blindfolded gun assembly ads together to cut down on costs

 

[Plinko]

They'll probably run Ossof for President in 2018.

I'm up for Kander. I don't care that he lost in Missouri. The guy is new, has a great background, is incredibly smart, has a great sense of humor, and isn't afraid to vocally attack what is wrong. I appreciate the work he is doing to eliminate voter suppression, but other people could do that, too.

 

[Box of Kittens]

The runoff system is bad and frankly no better than FPTP. You have a tendency for ideologically similar opponents to knock each other out of the runoff by splitting the vote. I don't really see that as a good thing.

 

[Holmes]

Statehood at 97% in Puerto Rico with 236k votes in.

 

[Suikoguy]

Candidate recruitment for 2018 has been better than 2006/08 so far.

Seriously, people see the opportunity next year is going to afford.
I mentioned it before, but it's good the shit with Trump is going down this year to get good candidates to enter the race.

Statehood at 97% in Puerto Rico with 236k votes in.

What the hell, the last vote in 2012 was for 54.00% to change, and 61.16% for statehood. What changed?

Edit: I really like this 51 star layout:

 

[Wilsongt]

Statehood at 97% in Puerto Rico with 236k votes in.

Awesome, too bad it won't happen because 2 extra Dem votes in the senate that belong to brown people.

 

[Suikoguy]

Awesome, too bad it won't happen because 2 extra Dem votes in the senate that belong to brown people.

I think it just needs a majority vote in the House and Senate (not sure if it needs 60 votes).

 

[Holmes]

~fwiw~ statehood for Puerto Rico is in the Republican platform. I don't see it happening unless Democrats take back Congress in 2018 but it might get more Republican support than we think.

Turnout is really low, though. Like... it might not cross 30%.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

Puerto Rico had a lot of suffering since the last vote.

 

[Mr.Shrugglesツ]

What exactly is the argument against statehood.

A legitimate one.

 

[kirblar]

I'm not sure why we should all be cheering the death of the left in France. Macron and his party aren't even center-left, they're well to the right of Clinton AFAIK. I mean, obviously I'm glad they won rather than the far right, but it still doesn't exactly feel like an outright victory.

Their party is NOT rightwing, jfc.

Their employment laws are far to the left of ours. So much so that it's actively fucking up their economy. Just because he wants to modernize laws/institutions doesn't mean that he's not left-wing, he's proposing all sorts of social spending.

This idea that going "as far left is possible" is a good thing is incredibly awful.

 

[Suikoguy]

What exactly is the argument against statehood.

A legitimate one.

The only legit argument is if PR does not want it.
They are giving up a degree of independence.

Turnout is really low, though. Like... it might not cross 30%.

They will fit right in!

 

[Spoiled Milk]

Are you guys kidding me? Republicans would absolutely love Puerto Rico to be admitted. Businesses will swoop in and buy all the failing assets at bargain prices. Meanwhile, statehood would restore confidence in PR government and cause an influx of people + capital returning, causing a small boom in the economy. The vultures would eat well for the foreseeable future.

Puerto Rico had a lot of suffering since the last vote.

I looked at the numbers and suffering is an understatement. It's a tragedy what an actually fiscally irresponsible country can do to a nation.

 

[Mr.Shrugglesツ]

The only legit argument is if PR does not want it.
They are giving up a degree of independence.



They will fit right in!

But, over the past 5-7 years, anecdotally perhaps from what I've seen, hasn't it been something PR wants?

 

[Crocodile]

Their party is NOT rightwing, jfc.

Their employment laws are far to the left of ours. So much so that it's actively fucking up their economy. Just because he wants to modernize laws/institutions doesn't mean that he's not left-wing, he's proposing all sorts of social spending.

This idea that going "as far left is possible" is a good thing is incredibly awful.

People REALLY need to stop trying to analogize our parties to parties in other countries. The platforms of each party and the contexts of each party are too different for it to work well. It ends up producing some really bad takes and expose people's ignorance something fierce.

 

[Suikoguy]

But, over the past 5-7 years, anecdotally perhaps from what I've seen, hasn't it been something PR wants?

Correct. So basically the only legit reason I can think of does not apply.
The other being cost to the Federal Government as PR is not in a good financial situation right now.

 

[K-Marx]

Their party is NOT rightwing, jfc.

Their employment laws are far to the left of ours. So much so that it's actively fucking up their economy. Just because he wants to modernize laws/institutions doesn't mean that he's not left-wing, he's proposing all sorts of social spending.

This idea that going "as far left is possible" is a good thing is incredibly awful.

His rhetoric on the issue is the exact same as every Republican that has ever gone after labor unions and collective bargaining. Its the exact same arguments verbatim.

What is right-wing in your opinion? Is David Cameron a leftist because he legalized gay marriage and was pro-remain? Honestly you come across as a conservative who is in denial about the fact that he's a conservative.

 

[Nordicus]

For fuck's sake May

EU threatens year-long delay in Brexit talks over UK's negotiating stance

"Theresa May to be told it would take 12 months to draft new mandate for Michel Barnier if she insists on discussing trade and divorce bill at same time"

An EU source disclosed that Brussels had also been secretly briefing Downing Street on the 27 member states’ negotiating position for months, well ahead of it being public, to allow the government to shape its response.

“They have had everything, sometimes before senior people here have seen the positions”, the source said. “May has known about the sequencing of talks since last September. None of this has been a surprise to her.”

Roberto Gualtieri, an Italian Socialist who leads his group on Brexit, said: “The previous government did not show a full awareness of what the negotiation is going to be,” Gualtieri said. “I hope the interlocutor will be fully aware.”

 

[Mr.Shrugglesツ]

Correct. So basically the only legit reason I can think of does not apply.
The other being cost to the Federal Government as PR is not in a good financial situation right now.

Beach taxes!

Yea, they need statehood, but with "smaller gov" fucks in congress...meh.

 

[Wilsongt]

Oh boy. Hillary clinton indictment imminent!

I feel like I've gone back in time to a year ago.

Sen. Dianne Feinstein on Sunday said Congress should look into former FBI Director James Comey’s revelation that former Attorney General Loretta Lynch asked him to downplay the nature of his investigation into Hillary Clinton’s emails.

Testifying before the Senate Intelligence Committee on Thursday, Comey said Lynch had asked him to refer to the probe as a "matter" rather than an investigation, an exchange that he said made him feel queasy.

STOP 👏 GIVING 👏 THE 👏 GOP 👏 FODDER

 

[kirblar]

His rhetoric on the issue is the exact same as every Republican that has ever gone after labor unions and collective bargaining. Its the exact same arguments verbatim.

Are you completely unable to understand context?

Like seriously, France's employment laws are having an incredibly nasty effect on large swathes of the population AND on businesses, and yet you're upset because "it sounds like US right wing rhetoric"

The problem is you. Not Macron.

 

[Bonen no Max'd]

Ah yes, the hero of the left that wants to privatize public property.

 

[kirblar]

What is right-wing in your opinion? Is David Cameron a leftist because he legalized gay marriage and was pro-remain? Honestly you come across as a conservative who is in denial about the fact that he's a conservative.

I'm a liberal who actually understands the basics of how economics work.

Unions are no better than corporations when it comes to markets. Just like companies will lobby for laws that make it more difficult for competitors to start up and contest their market share via government regulation, union will lobby for laws that make it difficult for outsiders to gain employment in the field. Occupational licensing a modern concern, actively working to prevent black workers from entering their fields in earlier days.

This is not to say that unions are a inherently "bad" thing, but to say that just like w/ business, you have to strike a balance w/ the power they have because they're inherently self-interested. This is the whole reason they're a good counterweight against business in the first place!

 

[kirblar]

Ah yes, the hero of the left that wants to privatize public property.

Because they need to raise money to fund their nuclear power systems, which are underwater- http://www.reuters.com/article/us-areva-restructuring-france-idUSKBN14O1JW

They need the cash influx, and there aren't a lot of great ways for them to do it.

 

[Suikoguy]

Ah yes, the hero of the left that wants to privatize public property.

That's one framing of it, if you ignore that it's about airports of which the government owns 50.6 % of. Not exactly traditional Public Property.

 

[Maledict]

Their party is NOT rightwing, jfc.

Their employment laws are far to the left of ours. So much so that it's actively fucking up their economy. Just because he wants to modernize laws/institutions doesn't mean that he's not left-wing, he's proposing all sorts of social spending.

This idea that going "as far left is possible" is a good thing is incredibly awful.

One of the biggest problems people have is not realising the *context* of different countries politics. Its why European's call the Democrat's a right wing party. They fail to understand that the context of your country determines your policies - you can't instantly move from centre right to far left.

Is Obamacare to the right of the NHS? Yes. Doesn't mean Obama is right wing in Britain.

Is Macron going to deliver some measures to the right of current french politics, with labour reform etc?? Yes. Doesn't make him a republican or Tory.

 

[Plinko]

Oh boy. Hillary clinton indictment imminent!

I feel like I've gone back in time to a year ago.



STOP 👏 GIVING 👏 THE 👏 GOP 👏 FODDER

I cannot understand what the point of her statement was. Was she asked specifically about it? If so, why?

 

[barber]

Seriously, people see the opportunity next year is going to afford.
I mentioned it before, but it's good the shit with Trump is going down this year to get good candidates to enter the race.



What the hell, the last vote in 2012 was for 54.00% to change, and 61.16% for statehood. What changed?

Edit: I really like this 51 star layout:

Bankruptcy of the state

 

[kirblar]

One of the biggest problems people have is not realising the *context* of different countries politics. Its why European's call the Democrat's a right wing party. They fail to understand that the context of your country determines your policies - you can't instantly move from centre right to far left.

Is Obamacare to the right of the NHS? Yes. Doesn't mean Obama is right wing in Britain.

Is Macron going to deliver some measures to the right of current french politics, with labour reform etc?? Yes. Doesn't make him a republican or Tory.

The stream of "is actually right wing" from Euros and American fanboys and girls who love their terrible far left dogma but couldn't give a shit about minority rights because they live in a monochromatic country has been incredibly poisonous to discussion.

 

[Bonen no Max'd]

Because they need to raise money to fund their nuclear power systems, which are underwater- http://www.reuters.com/article/us-areva-restructuring-france-idUSKBN14O1JW

They need the cash influx, and there aren't a lot of great ways for them to do it.

well I may not be an economist but it seems to me like a good way to not lack money would be to not raise military spending while cutting corporate income taxes

 

[Mr.Shrugglesツ]

Oh boy. Hillary clinton indictment imminent!

I feel like I've gone back in time to a year ago.



STOP 👏 GIVING 👏 THE 👏 GOP 👏 FODDER

Maybe McCain wasn't having a stroke. hmm

 

[nature boy]

This guy isn't very bright, is he:

 

[Suikoguy]

I cannot understand what the point of her statement was. Was she asked specifically about it? If so, why?

What are we talking about?

Edit: oh the post was edited

The politico article it was sourced from says: "Asked whether Lynch was providing cover for Clinton, Feinstein said she couldn't answer."
So, it appears to be an interview, but it's terribly written and I can't tell for sure.
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/06/11/feinstein-lynch-clinton-emails-239391

 

[kirblar]

well I may not be an economist but it seems to me like a good way to not lack money would be to not raise military spending while cutting corporate income taxes

The corporate income tax cut is to bring them in line w/ other EU countries and make them more attractive to foreign investment. It's being done to increase their competitiveness.

The nuke bailout doesn't need a tax change, it needs a one-time infusion.

 

[Bonen no Max'd]

The corporate income tax cut is to bring them in line w/ other EU countries and make them more attractive to foreign investment. It's being done to increase their competitiveness.

The nuke bailout doesn't need a tax change, it needs a one-time infusion.

now sure, two and a half years of his planned increases in military spending would cover that but Syria isn't going to bomb itself!

Spoiler

well actually it is but you get my point

 

[Vimes]

I really like this 51 star layout:

Too globalist

 

[TiredofWinning]

Ah yes, the hero of the left that wants to privatize public property.

Partial privatization of state assets has been the political consensus of the center left and center right in Europe since the 1980s. En Marche is a radical centrist movement. I really don't see anything surprising about this.

When those labor law changes come tho, that should be interesting. Considering Macron's watered down bill sparked riots on streets of Paris and was so unpopular Hollande had to rule it through executive decree the changes that Macron talked about in his campaign are sure to cause a mighty shit storm.

 

[TestOfTide]

well I may not be an economist but it seems to me like a good way to not lack money would be to not raise military spending while cutting corporate income taxes

The corporate tax thing I can understand you taking issue with, although personally I think better results come from taxing high income individuals and capital-gains rather than having a really high corporate tax.

But considering what Russia has been doing lately, Europe absolutely needs to ramp up its military spending. I don't even mean this in Trump's bullshit "pony up or else" sort of way. I mean that for their own sake they need to be better equipped to defend themselves against Russia because Russia has shown they are VERY eager to start taking some European land for themselves.

And the military spending needs to be ramped up ESPECIALLY in the areas of cyber-security and intelligence.

 

[kirblar]

The corporate tax thing I can understand you taking issue with, although personally I think better results come from taxing high income individuals and capital-gains rather than having a really high corporate tax.

I've seen this view from a lot of people across the political spectrum.

 

[Suikoguy]

The corporate tax thing I can understand you taking issue with, although personally I think better results come from taxing high income individuals and capital-gains rather than having a really high corporate tax.

But considering what Russia has been doing lately, Europe absolutely needs to ramp up its military spending. I don't even mean this in Trump's bullshit "pony up or else" sort of way. I mean that for their own sake they need to be better equipped to defend themselves against Russia because Russia has shown they are VERY eager to start taking some European land for themselves.

And the military spending needs to be ramped up ESPECIALLY in the areas of cyber-security and intelligence.

France % of GDP spending of Military was 2.1% in 2015. That puts them in the top of Military spending in Europe the list of big western European Union members. (Greece is higher for some reason) So I totally get the argument of not wanting to put more money into it. Much like the United States (at 3.3%) redirecting funds to meet the changing world is a must regardless.

I've seen this view from a lot of people across the political spectrum.

What's your view on it? I think it's more effective to tax capital gains and people.
Corporate taxes tends to create a race to the bottom, so why play the game?
Just go straight to the proverbial end, and tax situations where race to bottom does not apply as much. (it also encourages creating environments where people want to live).

 

[kirblar]

I was under the impression the spending increase was aimed at local police? Or was he proposing both?