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[Air]

"I believe that the Church not only should apologize to the person who is gay whom it has offended," the Pope told reporters, "but has to apologize to the poor, to exploited women, to children exploited for labor; it has to ask forgiveness for having blessed many weapons."

"Asked about Martin Luther, the German monk who launched the Protestant Reformation, Francis said, 'His intentions were not wrong. He was a reformer protesting against a Church rife with corruption, worldliness and lust for power.' "

Link to the story

It's been a while since the last pope thread. Thought it was a nice story. Glad he's not afraid to acknowledge the horrible things the church has done and is calling for a change in attitude. Hopefully he addresses the other scandals plaguing the church. Whether you believe in the doctrine or not, the church is a massive force in this world so every step to a more progressive and empathetic attitude can hopefully make real waves in society.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Him and Obama would totally slay some fools

 

[WedgeX]

Best Pope continues to be the best. This is a really huge thing for moderate and liberal Catholics.

Him and Obama would totally slay some fools

That's the best buddy cop movie I can think of.

 

[antonz]

It is a good statement and has potential if followed through to send a good message around the world. Sadly in America too much of American Christianity is based on Puritanism and will be way behind on catching up

 

[Mimosa97]

Holy shit that statement about Luther.

That's huuuuge.

 

[Razorback]

You're the Pope, do it.

 

[chefbags]

You're the Pope, do it.

Don't let dreams be dreams.

 

[Volimar]

Holy shit that statement about Luther.

That's huuuuge.

Yeah. You buried the lead there OP.

 

[lupinko]

Great Pope or Greatest Pope?

 

[Air]

Yeah. You buried the lead there OP.

It's the title of the article.

 

[HabeeNo]

Him and Obama would totally slay some fools

Provided us with the most badass pic last year

 

[HStallion]

It's the title of the article.

They are talking about what the Pope said about Martin Luther which is nowhere in the title and is arguable a fairly big deal for the Catholic church.

 

[Llyranor]

That is an impressive statement.

Though, why doesn't he - as the Pope - apologize on behalf of the Church, rather than saying it should?

 

[Ridli]

Holy shit that statement about Luther.

That's huuuuge.

Yeah I did a double take when I heard that bit on the radio. The other stuff is great but I did not expect that.

 

[Yaboosh]

Using the word offended minimizes what the Catholic Church and other Christian organizations have done to gay people.

You don't need to apologize for offending them. You need to apologize for contributing to their massacre over the course of Christianity's history. You need to apologize for encouraging violent treatment of gay people in third world countries.

Be specific about what you have done. Call these things out. Condemn them.

Don't keep things general and say you have offended gay people.

 

[Air]

They are talking about what the Pope said about Martin Luther which is nowhere in the title and is arguable a fairly big deal for the Catholic church.

I know. I copy pasted the article title from npr. I didn't write the article, I'm just posting what was there.

 

[jediyoshi]

Great photo

 

[Dai101]

The Dope Pope

 

[TheFatOne]

They should be apologizing for hiding, and enabling pedophiles. This is just an empty platitude.

 

[Yagharek]

Him and Obama would totally slay some fools

Pope and the RCC are still covering up and protecting pedophiles from facing legal proceedings by allowing them to stay in the Vatican.

An apology means precisely zero until it is backed up by action to make up for wrongdoing.

They can apologise for their treatment of LGBT people all they like but they are still circulating material which calls it unnatural and a sin.

 

[hodayathink]

Using the word offended minimizes what the Catholic Church and other Christian organizations have done to gay people.

You don't need to apologize for offending them. You need to apologize for contributing to their massacre over the course of Christianity's history. You need to apologize for encouraging violent treatment of gay people in third world countries.

Be specific about what you have done. Call these things out. Condemn them.

Don't keep things general and say you have offended gay people.

I feel like does say that in the whole quote:

"I believe that the Church not only should apologize to the person who is gay whom it has offended," the Pope told reporters, "but has to apologize to the poor, to exploited women, to children exploited for labor; it has to ask forgiveness for having blessed many weapons."

 

[teruterubozu]

You're the Pope, do it.

Seriously, is he going to put together a committee or something? We're waiting!

 

[The Albatross]

Great Pope or Greatest Pope?

Every Pope has his place in progressing the Church.

Hope one day to be able to say, "Every Pope has his or her place in progressing the Church"

They should be apologizing for hiding, and enabling pedophiles. This is just an empty platitude.

I mean, he did over a year ago

http://www.delawareonline.com/story...7/pope-apologizes-sex-abuse-scandal/72946870/

Is the Pope not allowed to apologize for anything else, or only the sex abuse?

 

[Yagharek]

Every Pope has his place in progressing the Church.

Hope one day to be able to say, "Every Pope has his or her place in progressing the Church"



I mean, he did over a year ago

http://www.delawareonline.com/story...7/pope-apologizes-sex-abuse-scandal/72946870/

Is the Pope not allowed to apologize for anything else, or only the sex abuse?

He apologised then nothing changed and the cover ups continue. Which in context explains why this latest apology should not be believed.

Actions count.

 

[commedieu]

Great photo

Dude in black is on ted cruz wife/dad mode..lol

 

[Alex_Mexico]

They should be apologizing for hiding, and enabling pedophiles. This is just an empty platitude.

Arguably the church has done more to combat this in the last 10 years than they've done in the last 100 years.

Catholic or not I admit they're doing progress. Not as much as some would want but they're getting there.

 

[Chicken]

Using the word offended minimizes what the Catholic Church and other Christian organizations have done to gay people.

You don't need to apologize for offending them. You need to apologize for contributing to their massacre over the course of Christianity's history. You need to apologize for encouraging violent treatment of gay people in third world countries.

Be specific about what you have done. Call these things out. Condemn them.

Don't keep things general and say you have offended gay people.

He did?

 

[TimeEffect]

He did?

He's saying that the Church needs to sit down and be absolutely detailed and critical in their crimes. And most importantly, they need to condemn their own followers who, especially in 3rd world countries, continue to persecute gays.

Also, this kind of small acknowledgement by the pope is welcome, but it is well overdue and should be expected from him, and others like him, and those who come after him.

 

[collige]

The Church should stop marginalizing gay people.

 

[Square2015]

I am blown away to be hearing this from the pope, lets heal those wounds; Western world we can do this!

 

[Strike]

It's a start.

 

[Soriku]

I feel like this dude flip flops every so often...but good message for now.

 

[chrisPjelly]

This pope to Benedict is what Josuke is to Jotaro

 

[Vigilant Walrus]

Regarding Marthin Luther and what it meant, you have to listen to this episode of Hardcore History;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x79MW1gWtJ8


It's.. insane.

 

[Square2015]

Regarding Marthin Luther and what it meant, you have to listen to this episode of Hardcore History;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x79MW1gWtJ8


It's.. insane.

Been listening...super interesting. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Monocle]

Good sentiment—marvelously progressive coming from a Pope—and a necessary statement for the long overdue modernization of the Church.

I wonder how many generations humanity will have to wait before Judeo-Christian homophobia and its brutal and commonly fatal effects on innocent people will be expunged from the world. In the meantime, families are broken, people are dead, and individuals have been condemned to entire lifetimes of repression and shame. How many thousands or millions?

Baby steps on a road paved with corpses and private misery. If that sounds a little dramatic, where's the lie?

 

[excelsiorlef]

Is he going to move the church towards supporting birth control, a legal access to abortion, women priests, same-sex marriage, same-sex sexual activity, same-sex marriage, etc...?

Don't bother I know the answer to that.

 

[azyless]

He still wants abortion to be illegal, right ? still considers homosexuality a sin and disapproves of same-sex marriage ? indirectly supports pedophiles in the Church ?
All this talk of "best pope" is honestly tiring.

 

[choodi]

Well what is he waiting for?

He IS the church.

 

[excelsiorlef]

He still wants abortion to be illegal, right ? still considers homosexuality a sin and disapproves of same-sex marriage ? indirectly supports pedophiles in the Church ?
All this talk of "best pope" is honestly tiring.

I mean he is the "best" pope but that's not really meaningful when being the best pope just means being slightly less far right than the others.


Cool Pope however is a complete joke because nothing he does on social issues is cool.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

I'll never understand why people are gushing for this pope, he says some not even progressive but common sense shit without following up on it with actual actions and people are just eating it up.

He's just more of the same which made me loathe the church from childhood on.

 

[Already Torn]

I'll never understand why people are gushing for this pope, he says some not even progressive but common sense shit without following up on it with actual actions and people are just eating it up.

He's just more of the same which made me loathe the church from childhood on.

There was a very low bar for him coming in. It is weird that he's saying the church should do these things when he's basically the church.

But still, it's kind of weird that the Catholic Church is now the more progressive side of Christianity.

 

[excelsiorlef]

I'll never understand why people are gushing for this pope, he says some not even progressive but common sense shit without following up on it with actual actions and people are just eating it up.

He's just more of the same which made me loathe the church from childhood on.

When you set the bar 2 inches, jumping a foot in the air looks impressive.

It's completely sad that Cool Pope is a thing, this guy ain't cool , he's just smarter about how he speaks than his predecessors.

 

[Speely]

When you set the bar 2 inches, jumping a foot in the air looks impressive.

It's completely sad that Cool Pope is a thing, this guy ain't cool , he's just smarter about how he speaks than his predecessors.

This. Easy to adapt to current trends. Come at me with some real change and we will talk.

 

[Nephtis]

I think it should be celebrated that it's actually starting. This Pope is trying to steer the church in the right direction. He has said some things that's made people upset, and that's fine, but he has done a lot more good than bad. He is trying to set an example for everyone that follows the Catholic church.

If things continue like this, I think it won't be too long before we see more widespread acceptance of LGBT folks in the church. I don't think they will be in leadership positions, but in time it may happen. While the Pope is well, the Pope, he is but one man, and he's already done some things to shake things up in the church. I hope that those that commit sex abuse will be brought out to justice and not just shuffled off to some other church.

Hopefully, this will happen in my lifetime.

The church has been given an opportunity to turn into something that all can look up to, even if they don't follow the religion. If we're lucky, they won't fuck this up.

 

[VendettaRed07]

When you set the bar 2 inches, jumping a foot in the air looks impressive.

It's completely sad that Cool Pope is a thing, this guy ain't cool , he's just smarter about how he speaks than his predecessors.

The US didn't become as socially progressive as it is today over night. It took a lot of time to move the country to where we are now. Almost every single Dem that we like, just 3, 4, 5 or 10 years ago, held positions that we would consider pretty unacceptable today.

I think people do gush over Francis too much considering what his positions on certain things still are. But I don't think that assessment is quite giving him enough credit considering how difficult a job moving a religious institution like the Catholic Church in the right direction is. I really think he is doing what he can, (for the most part) it's just going to take more time.

 

[exmachina64]

There was a very low bar for him coming in. It is weird that he's saying the church should do these things when he's basically the church.

But still, it's kind of weird that the Catholic Church is now the more progressive side of Christianity.

In Catholic theology, neither the pope nor the clergy nor the institution itself are "the Church." When he says the Church, he means the individual laypeople that go to Mass and identify as Catholic.

Here's a direct quote:

“The church must say it is sorry for not having behaved as it should many times, many times — when I say the ‘church,’ I mean we Christians because the church is holy; we are the sinners,” the pope said. “We Christians must say we are sorry.”

And here's a line from one story that popped up in search results:

The pope said people have a right to complain about certain gay-pride demonstrations that purposefully offend the faith or sensitivities of others.

Hmm.

 

[Violet_0]

isn't his stance on gay relationships always swinging back and forth, or was that only with gay marriage?

 

[metalslimer]

He doesn't get brownie points for barely acknowledging gay people as human.

 

[gofreak]

Well what is he waiting for?

He IS the church.

He's not.

The Church is a community.

He has been repeatedly scuppered in his attempts to soften the Church's stance on gay people by others within the hierarchy.

All of this is nice but ultimately empty until there's formal changes to the doctrinal approach to gay people.

Let's remember, just last week the Vatican finally accepted a representative from France having refused their first choice for months seemingly because he was gay.