Speedymanic
Banned
Non-one knows. It was originally supposed to be one of those bowls from the opening but they changed it for some reason.
PROMETHEUS UNMARKED SPOILER THREAD!
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Non-one knows. It was originally supposed to be one of those bowls from the opening but they changed it for some reason.
http://media.libsyn.com/media/skepticsguide/skepticast2012-06-30.mp3
Skeptics Guide to the Universe discusses the science of Prometheus. Just listening it and they have lots of criticisms I hadn't even seen in this thread. They really have the knowledge to tackle everything the movie got wrong.
Skeptics Guide to the Universe discusses the science of Prometheus. Just listening it and they have lots of criticisms I hadn't even seen in this thread. They really have the knowledge to tackle everything the movie got wrong.
Did they talk about how you can't carbon date an alien on an alien planet you know nothing about?
no, it didn't bother me all that much, or at all.
Yep, the thing goes for over half an hour, haven't listened to it all yet, but they start from the beginning and go through the movie.
Monday's commute it is then!
I thought when faced with a hissing cobra you're suppose to maintain eye contact and hold your ground, not run away. Or I could just be making that up.
WordAssassin
Member
Thanks. Holy shit does that sound better than what we got.
I was really pissed that the whole movie Aliens was about saving Newt and then she dies in the first few minutes of Alien 3, off camera. That was such bullshit, it made it feel like all the struggle in Aliens was for nothing. Then the whole rest of the movie was just Alien in a prison instead of on a space ship. God dammit.
And it set up them wanting to find the source of the Xenomorphs at the end, too. So Alien 4 could have been Prometheus instead of Resurrection. (Well, I mean, Prometheus was written as a prequel, but given that Alien 3 set up you could totally do it as a sequel too. A sequel and an origin story.)
Fuck! Now I'm all pissed at how poorly handled this franchise was when it had so much potential. Alien and Aliens were so good and the universe is so interesting. ;__;
Nappuccino
Member
Speedymanic
Banned
Newt should died in Aliens. That hack Cameron lacked the halls to do it.
parrotbeak
Member
Finally saw it last night, and I'm glad this thread is so filled with confused ideas. I'll go through and read but my thoughts without having read any reviews or discussion:
The motivations for the characters were not defined but they acted interesting enough so it didn't bother me.
Theron reminded me of her character Rita from Arrested Development in certain moments, like when she was talking alone to her father and to the android.
I don't think this had anything to do with Alien. I just took it as a separate movie set in the same world with the same creatures. It obviously implies that the alien creature is some bioweapon created by these Engineers or whatever they are called, but these guys are/were doing this shit all over the universe and it's way bigger than Earth and Ripley's story. I think Stringer Bell was right; not going to find any answers from these guys. They're probably like us with individual motivations but not necessarily in control of their mission. Probably just doing their jobs.
My friend had an interesting idea: maybe the alien species itself is somehow "controlling" the engineers as part of how they spread their species. Not consciously, but maybe through chemical influence the way some parasites control insects. This would give some "motive" to populating planets with food species and then later bringing the aliens.
The most jarring line for me what "trick the nervous system into thinking it's still alive." What? And then the head scene made us laugh out loud. After that I was fine with whatever.
Also the scene where the android gets some of that organic shit on his finger tip, then touches the glass to give the scientist the wine. I got that he touched the inside of the glass with his infected finger the first time. No need to dumb it down and have him stir his finger in the wine itself right in front of the scientist.
All in all, very entertaining movie and will watch again. I wouldn't mind a 30 minute extended cut to help explain some things.
The motivations for the characters were not defined but they acted interesting enough so it didn't bother me.
Theron reminded me of her character Rita from Arrested Development in certain moments, like when she was talking alone to her father and to the android.
I don't think this had anything to do with Alien. I just took it as a separate movie set in the same world with the same creatures. It obviously implies that the alien creature is some bioweapon created by these Engineers or whatever they are called, but these guys are/were doing this shit all over the universe and it's way bigger than Earth and Ripley's story. I think Stringer Bell was right; not going to find any answers from these guys. They're probably like us with individual motivations but not necessarily in control of their mission. Probably just doing their jobs.
My friend had an interesting idea: maybe the alien species itself is somehow "controlling" the engineers as part of how they spread their species. Not consciously, but maybe through chemical influence the way some parasites control insects. This would give some "motive" to populating planets with food species and then later bringing the aliens.
The most jarring line for me what "trick the nervous system into thinking it's still alive." What? And then the head scene made us laugh out loud. After that I was fine with whatever.
Also the scene where the android gets some of that organic shit on his finger tip, then touches the glass to give the scientist the wine. I got that he touched the inside of the glass with his infected finger the first time. No need to dumb it down and have him stir his finger in the wine itself right in front of the scientist.
All in all, very entertaining movie and will watch again. I wouldn't mind a 30 minute extended cut to help explain some things.
I had surprisingly never heard of this podcast and would like to thank you for linking to it. They're actually awesome to listen to.
Gotta agree with this, I love prometheus despite the fact it had some holes in it's storyline. It was still worth watching. Idk bout full price cause im broke, but definitely again in the near future.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
Loved this!
Unknown Soldier
Member
Finally saw the movie.
It was a confused mess almost right from the beginning, with the opening scene which doesn't make any sense even after the movie is over. It feels like a mishmash of ideas which didn't completely fit together, purposely made more obscure and confusing by the creator of Lost for no apparent reason, and a tenuous connection to Alien thrown in for even less apparent reason than none.
Sure, it was pretty. But for all the hype the story was dumber than a bag of rocks and filled with senseless pseudo-mythology building that would make Chris Carter proud. It should come as no surprise that this movie had Alien Black Oil just like The X-Files, because it made just about as much sense.
Oh right, ROFL at the spaceship which weighs 194,276,375,144 tons falling down and somehow being wedged up by a rock so the main character survives.
It was a confused mess almost right from the beginning, with the opening scene which doesn't make any sense even after the movie is over. It feels like a mishmash of ideas which didn't completely fit together, purposely made more obscure and confusing by the creator of Lost for no apparent reason, and a tenuous connection to Alien thrown in for even less apparent reason than none.
Sure, it was pretty. But for all the hype the story was dumber than a bag of rocks and filled with senseless pseudo-mythology building that would make Chris Carter proud. It should come as no surprise that this movie had Alien Black Oil just like The X-Files, because it made just about as much sense.
Oh right, ROFL at the spaceship which weighs 194,276,375,144 tons falling down and somehow being wedged up by a rock so the main character survives.
i watched Prometheus today and liked it quite a bit.
i'll need to watch it side by side along the alien movies to rank it but i like it so far. sure, some things weren't polished as they could be (crew development and stuff) but the numerous elements that connect it with Alien were a treat to see. the end of it was pretty awesome and going in full-blackout mode totally paid off (i hadn't seen absoultely anything about the movie since it was confirmed in production just to see everything in the movie).
the setup for the sequel has me anticipating it already (and scared that something goes bad and it doesn't get made)
btw, is the scene that was making people faint at cinemas the one where the alien is taken out of Elizabeth's(that's the name, right?) belly? i can see why it causes that heh.
i'll need to watch it side by side along the alien movies to rank it but i like it so far. sure, some things weren't polished as they could be (crew development and stuff) but the numerous elements that connect it with Alien were a treat to see. the end of it was pretty awesome and going in full-blackout mode totally paid off (i hadn't seen absoultely anything about the movie since it was confirmed in production just to see everything in the movie).
the setup for the sequel has me anticipating it already (and scared that something goes bad and it doesn't get made)
btw, is the scene that was making people faint at cinemas the one where the alien is taken out of Elizabeth's(that's the name, right?) belly? i can see why it causes that heh.
WordAssassin
Member
Just read up on more of the unused Alien 3/4 scripts, and fucking hell. Literally every single one of them sounds better than what we actually got. Even the Wooden Planet one, which is pretty similar (since they lifted most of it for the actual movie) sounds cool.
But damn, knowing there could have been several different breeds of Xenomorphs in the movie (Spike Xeno, Chameleon Xeno, etc) or even more animal-like Xeno-hybrids with that virus idea (dog Xeno, chicken Xeno, computer space-station Xeno) and then winding up with just one, is so unfair. Especially since it looks like they won't really make anymore Alien movies, even if they do make a Prometheus 2. Plus it's not like there's really a chance for Xenomorphs in that.
But damn, knowing there could have been several different breeds of Xenomorphs in the movie (Spike Xeno, Chameleon Xeno, etc) or even more animal-like Xeno-hybrids with that virus idea (dog Xeno, chicken Xeno, computer space-station Xeno) and then winding up with just one, is so unfair. Especially since it looks like they won't really make anymore Alien movies, even if they do make a Prometheus 2. Plus it's not like there's really a chance for Xenomorphs in that.
PantherLotus
Professional Schmuck
Just saw it yesterday.
Points/Questions:
1. I think the film stands on its own and didn't necessarily need the Alien reference.
2. What was David's motivation to poison Holloway? / Why was David so malicious to Dr. Shaw? ("just like your father died, hmm? Ebola?")
3. How did David know there were other ships?
4. What's the deal with cutesy/wootsy snake scene? Criticism above nailed it.
5. How did the thing in her belly continue to grow after she had it removed?
6. Was Ms. Vickers an android after all? I know she called Weyland father and everything, but why did David call her mum?
Even with some pretty gaping holes and easily misunderstood references, I thought the film was excellent and fun. Several scenes made me roll my eyes, but I thought others were quite profound.
Points/Questions:
1. I think the film stands on its own and didn't necessarily need the Alien reference.
2. What was David's motivation to poison Holloway? / Why was David so malicious to Dr. Shaw? ("just like your father died, hmm? Ebola?")
3. How did David know there were other ships?
4. What's the deal with cutesy/wootsy snake scene? Criticism above nailed it.
5. How did the thing in her belly continue to grow after she had it removed?
6. Was Ms. Vickers an android after all? I know she called Weyland father and everything, but why did David call her mum?
Even with some pretty gaping holes and easily misunderstood references, I thought the film was excellent and fun. Several scenes made me roll my eyes, but I thought others were quite profound.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
I think David despised the people on the ship. He loves the idealized, non-real humans in fiction, but as soon as he interacts with the people on the ship he is treated with disrespect, scorn, and outright hate.
PantherLotus
Professional Schmuck
Whoa this is outstanding!
He's saying "ma'am," the pronunciation just sounds like mum.
In fairness to Fincher the effects/design team didn't seem to do justice to what he wanted. He wanted a panther-like Xeno, much faster, leaner and agile than the ones in the first two. Geiger's designs were awesome looking and what we got in the movie didn't really live up to them.
Here's what I think they were going for there. The biologist sits down and tries to befriend a clearly hostile guy in Fifield, and keeps it up after having been told to stay away. Then he tries to make cute with a clearly hostile alien snake thingy. I think they were setting him up as this guy who has terrible judgment and it's a wonder he lived to be as old as he was. I don't think it worked, but that seems like the idea.
The scene would be so much scarier had they recognized the things as a threat and tried to get away and failed. Stupidity is such a tiresome plot device. :\
parrotbeak
Member
I just watched the 2003 dc of Alien. I agree with the Half in the Bag review. Alien actually had some of the problems that people are having with Prometheus, but it was a much simpler story and the characters behaved more like real people.
But you could go through and find issues with it. To mimic the HitB Prometheus spoilers section:
Why did a massive ship carrying ore only have 7 crew members? Why would a company clearly set up for profit risk a full cargo ship on this mission? Why did the first guy stick his head in the egg pod? Where did the mass come from when the alien morphed from chest burster to full grown? Where did the mass for the stuff the captain was encapsulated in come from? Why would a ship like that have a self destruct procedure that could be set in motion by a single person in a couple of minutes? Why would Ripley wander around the ship looking for the cat by herself after most of the crew had been killed? Why didn't the alien kill the cat? How did the alien know to go into the escape pod?
But there are way more unanswered questions and unclear motives in Prometheus and I can see why people are disappointed. You definitely need to shut part of your brain off and just enjoy it, but it also seems complex so it invites you to speculate, when really, I think it's probably not worth looking for answers.
But you could go through and find issues with it. To mimic the HitB Prometheus spoilers section:
Why did a massive ship carrying ore only have 7 crew members? Why would a company clearly set up for profit risk a full cargo ship on this mission? Why did the first guy stick his head in the egg pod? Where did the mass come from when the alien morphed from chest burster to full grown? Where did the mass for the stuff the captain was encapsulated in come from? Why would a ship like that have a self destruct procedure that could be set in motion by a single person in a couple of minutes? Why would Ripley wander around the ship looking for the cat by herself after most of the crew had been killed? Why didn't the alien kill the cat? How did the alien know to go into the escape pod?
But there are way more unanswered questions and unclear motives in Prometheus and I can see why people are disappointed. You definitely need to shut part of your brain off and just enjoy it, but it also seems complex so it invites you to speculate, when really, I think it's probably not worth looking for answers.
Yup. :lol
I share some of these questions, but some of them do have answers.
They were basically a tug boat, not the full mining crew. They were just taking a shipment home.
I've always had issues with this as well. That said, I think they heard the beacon coming from that region and decided to retrieve it asap. But yeah, wouldn't it be better to send a crew with that specific purpose? In the film the company is said to have a weapons division. Send those guys.
He didn't stick his head in, he looked inside from a foot or so above the egg. The contents of eggs don't typically leap out at people.
From a scene cut from the script, alas. It broke into the food storage. In the film, it's something that's always bugged me as well. When I was younger I imagined the tubes on its back sucking in air and converting what it collects into biomass, somehow. Dunno.
To be fair, it also had a fail safe that would allow it to be turned off if someone tried to blow the ship up.
Because she liked the cat more than people. She's the only person in the film shown petting the cat and holding him, and had a bad relationship with everyone else on the crew sans Dallas. But yeah, film cliche.
It wasn't a threat, and wasn't a suitable host.
It was fleeing the loud noises and steam jets in the rest of the ship - the escape pod was the only quiet place it could find.
The way you describe the alien reminds me of a cat.
It WAS puma-like in Aliens 3.
Speedymanic
Banned
regarding Weyland's company spending all that money, I thought it was pretty obvious that Weyland himself forced it through in the hopes of finding the key to living forever.
Vickers says as much when she's talking to her dad.
That and he also seems to be a dictator type character within the company, wouldn't be surprised if he ignored all the protests and just went ahead with the mission.
Vickers says as much when she's talking to her dad.
That and he also seems to be a dictator type character within the company, wouldn't be surprised if he ignored all the protests and just went ahead with the mission.
parrotbeak
Member
Thanks for the answers and discussion. I'd buy most of the other ones, but this one I still have a problem with. For one he just came from a dead body that had died violently and mysteriously. I think the close up camera of the egg probably made it seem like he was closer, but he was about to prod the insides with something after having seen something moving inside. I would have gotten out of there as soon as it opened. Actually I wouldn't have rappelled down the hole in the first place. Giant humanoid corpse ripped open from inside, oh look a rip in the ship's floor, lower me down.
One more question: if Mother's order was to bring back the specimen, why would she allow the self destruct? I guess maybe the cooling system was just manually disengaged and out of Mother's control, but then why would Ripley be upset at Mother for not stopping the self destruct sequence later?
Anyway, I love the first 2 Alien movies and they will always be classics to me, having seen both at a young age (Alien when I was 5, Aliens when I was 11). Just saying there were turn your brain off moments in those too. It was just easier because the movies were more streamlined, and you knew what to focus on and what to ignore.
Yeah, the idea that the Company meant for the Nostromo to bring a sample back never quite worked for me... I try to rationalize it by assuming that they knew there was something in that (big) region of space, but had no idea where exactly, and just started assigning asshole androids as science officers to all the mining ships that had to travel in that area, "just in case", but... why not simply send a bunch of probes? Why expect an unknowing crew to do a good job at securing a sample?
Would work better if the Company had no prior knowledge at all...
symphonask
Member
Agree with this part.
My justification, right or wrong, for his actions there are that he probably thought that his suit and helmet gave him adequate protection against the snake-like creature. Even when the thing attached itself to his arm he didn't seem too upset. It was only when he asked Fifield ("I'm not touching that!") to help him get it off and the thing tightened its grip that he really seemed freaked out.
Still it was really dumb, not really trying to make excuses for a poorly written scenario.
One other thing that always bugged me in that scene is the lack of communication between Kain and Dallas/Lambert. He relays very little information, including "the egg just opened". Pretty sure Dallas' response would have been something along the lines of, "Get the hell out of there," before reeling him back in and bailing.
Mother's programming was to stop the ship if it received a transmission of uknown origin, and tell the Captain such. The clause in the crew's contract requiring them to investigate it or lose their pay for the trip was there to compel compliance. Ash was planted as a fail safe to ensure anything found got back home safely. I don't think Mother really kept tabs on what was happening in between - she just stopped the ship and altered the crew to the beacon.
Likewise, I grew up with these movies. Some of the issues I now have with them never really occurred to me when I was younger. But even as an adult, they don't bother me when I watch the movies, because they are so effective at sucking me into the moment. That's broadly similar to Prometheus, in that the experience of seeing it in theaters is one I really enjoyed, sans a few really dumb moments (snake thing, etc.). But Prometheus' flaws run so much deeper that I find myself tearing into it much harder. It's a more ambitious film, but also a much more muddled one. A cleaner, more streamlined narrative with the same material could have been extraordinary.
This.
Also, re. some complaints about both Prometheus and Alien, please keep in mind that in both cases the crew is very new to the idea that we're not alone in the universe. They aren't prepared for first contact. I also do think that the crew of Prometheus was chosen largely as fodder both in and out of universe, so them being extra dumb didn't bother me at all. Beyond a certain point, nit-pick complaints are just a manifestation of disappointment with the overall script anyways.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
He probably also assumed that his huge, thick helmet would have offered some sort of protection. That whole burning through your helmet thing took Kane by surprise.
I agree for the most part, but I still get a nagging feeling when I think that Weyland should have been too much of a genius/planner to have staffed his crew with morons. Especially when he's on the ship, too.
Phat Michael
Banned
Is English your 5th language?
Blu-ray special features revealed?
http://collider.com/prometheus-blu-ray-deleted-scenes/177495/
Shit is PACKED. But doesn't seem to list an extended cut at all. Either were not getting one at all, or its getting released later. Im wagering on the former.
http://collider.com/prometheus-blu-ray-deleted-scenes/177495/
Shit is PACKED. But doesn't seem to list an extended cut at all. Either were not getting one at all, or its getting released later. Im wagering on the former.
TheJollyCorner
Member
Shiiiiii-et. :/
I'll still get it.
Maybe the extended version will be released prior to the sequel?
Anton Sugar
Member
Wow. With no extended cut, I'll basically be buying this just to own it. It really seems like an extended cut would make it a better movie, from what we've seen.
No sale if that is accurate.
Not a Jellyfish
but I am a sheep
So....it comes with the first draft of the script meaning? SPACE JESUS!
Demoncarnotaur
Member
No extended cut? Blah. I bet they double dip at some point to try to make more money off of the film.
None the less, Day 1, that seems to be an incredibly solid Blu Ray set.
None the less, Day 1, that seems to be an incredibly solid Blu Ray set.
parrotbeak
Member
I don't mind waiting for the extended cut if they spend time editing it so the movie makes sense.
TUROK
Member
Even more confirmation that Prometheus isn't hard sci-fi, despite what Lindelof says.
BlueSummers
Member
Insane Metal
Member
Can I use a Prometheus' engineer as avatar?
Nappuccino
Member
no extended cut, no sale.
of course, I'll probably buy it anyway :/
of course, I'll probably buy it anyway :/
Hah, I pre-ordered it the day it became available on Amazon. I'm getting it regardless, and I'll happily double-dip for an extended cut if/when it comes.
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