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[Dirtyshubb]

Posts like this are giving me Kinect 1 flashbacks.

Remember all those favorable impressions and reviews that glossed over its fundamental shortcomings?

I can see where you are coming from but personally the writing was on the wall before Kinect even came out as it was clear that it wasnt going to deliver anything worthwhile in the long run.

This is different however, we have the majority of reviewers coming out and saying that PSVR is good and if you are interested you should buy it. Kinect was always a novelty that had no way of providing a legitimate alternative to playing games other than small mini games.

VR does have the potential to provide more than that,even if many launch games are mini game style experiences. Will it in the long term? Well that depends on adoption and developers willingness to experiment but it clearly has more options available to it than kinect did.

Just because you can say both kinect and VR are add ons, it doesnt mean the situations are the same or that both have the same potential.

 

[The Omega Man]

Just heard about the lack of being able to see behind you. Thats really disappointing to me since VR is supposed to be about the immersion and feeling you're there.

You are not supposed to turn around and look behind you while on VR, rumor has it that you look into your soul and die.

 

[Briarios]

You can see behind yourself, but you wont be able to turn around and use the Move controllers.

I guess he's that use head tracking to let you aim would allow you to shoot behind yourself ... that might be a good way around that limitation

 

[eifer]

As long as cockpit games work well, that's all I really care about. This is 1st gen VR. AKA the NES of VR. We're just getting started, and it's gonna be awesome, but will require some patience.

 

[16BitNova]

Some of you are trying awfully hard to hate this thing aren't you?

No not at all. I'm really looking forward to this actually. I was just going based off what I saw in the OP. The list of impressions, under IGNs summary it says "inability to see behind you". I got pretty bummed reading that. But according to many here, you can see behind you. Thank you all for clearing that up!

Edit: I see now, i misread. Its talking about the cameras inability to see behind you. Oops. Sorry guys.

 

[orioto]

People wanting to do everything like in real life in VR.... It's just an incredibly immersive viewing method, it's not fucking westworld -_-

Personally i never liked the idea of turning 360 while playing VR. That's already too much physical investment. But i don't like the whole use of space for VR anyway. I want a videogame in my living room or bedroom, not a fucking Disneyland attraction

 

[Cheech]

I had to cancel my preorder, placed March 24 on Amazon.

Just one too many reports of motion sickness, and Tested's... 'instant' illness? I do not want to upchuck in my finished basement.

Once they fix the teething pains, I'll gladly pick up a set. Right now it just sounds like $500 down the toilet, perhaps literally, IF I made it that far.

It's a hell of a weird thing that the title I'm most looking forward to this fall is a remaster of a 5 year old RPG. Maybe I'm just getting old and jaded.

 

[mckmas8808]

The output to the TV is cropped and distorted. Eurogamer goes into this a bit if you're curious.

It's a much lower fedility image than the headset is using.

Are you sure? Because the screens below to me look really really good if you are correct.

[

And seeing this in motion looks even better than these screenshots.

 

[Brandon F]

I had to cancel my preorder, placed March 24 on Amazon.

I'm sitting here waffling over doing the same. Dying to play Driveclub and Rez, but not if I'm rolling the dice on the risk of a faulty unit or living area setup or whatever.

 

[CyberChulo]

You can see behind yourself, but you wont be able to turn around and use the Move controllers.

There must be a way. Obviously if the balls of light are blocked from the camera's view, then it won't work. Maybe position the camera on top of the tv and then when you turn around and extend your arms to shoot, the camera will pick it up?

 

[Zalusithix]

I guess he's that use head tracking to let you aim would allow you to shoot behind yourself ... that might be a good way around that limitation

You can use gazed based aiming, or you can use tracked controllers as pointer based aiming. Mixing the two wouldn't turn out well. Your gaze would override the absolute positioning of your hands which would kill the sense of presence dead.

Edit:

There must be a way. Obviously if the balls of light are blocked from the camera's view, then it won't work. Maybe position the camera on top of the tv and then when you turn around and extend your arms to shoot, the camera will pick it up?

Another camera is the only way. One camera will always have occlusion issues. That's just a limitation for PSVR that games will have to be designed around.

 

[Wallach]

Are you sure? Because the screens below to me look really really good if you are correct.

And seeing this in motion looks even better than these screenshots.

Remember that even though the resolution in the headset is higher than the image being sent to the TV, it doesn't "look" like that really. Things like distance, scale and movement come into play; like you couldn't resolve the bats flying in front of the waterfall like you can in a screen grab within the headset itself.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

I'm sitting here waffling over doing the same. Dying to play Driveclub and Rez, but not if I'm rolling the dice on the risk of a faulty unit or living area setup or whatever.

If you preordered from Amazon I'm sure it's safe to open and test out, and you can return it if there are issues with your setup that can't be resolved...obviously if you get a faulty unit then you can get it replaced.

 

[Got the Shakes]

I had to cancel my preorder, placed March 24 on Amazon.

Just one too many reports of motion sickness, and Tested's... 'instant' illness? I do not want to upchuck in my finished basement.

Once they fix the teething pains, I'll gladly pick up a set. Right now it just sounds like $500 down the toilet, perhaps literally, IF I made it that far.

It's a hell of a weird thing that the title I'm most looking forward to this fall is a remaster of a 5 year old RPG. Maybe I'm just getting old and jaded.

I'm sitting here waffling over doing the same. Dying to play Driveclub and Rez, but not if I'm rolling the dice on the risk of a faulty unit or living area setup or whatever.

I did the same, but in fairness I've been thinking about cancelling for months. My heart said keep it, but my brain said that I should cancel my preorder and let units get out into the wild to wait for many more impressions. Add that to the fact that there isn't anything that I felt like I have to play at launch and that all added up to cancelling. Can't wait to read impressions from people here who get them and there is a reasonably good chance that I end up buying a PSVR in the near future if real world impressions are good. Just not worth the $500 gamble to me right now.

 

[aorange999]

As a Vive user and VR developer, it makes me sad to see all these hardcore gamers being so down on Playstation VR. Its by far the best way to play videogames thats come along. Even playing 2D games in 3D large screen environment is awesome. Sony has done something special here in creating a system that is not godawful expensive but still delivers an experience close to Oculus or Vive, reusing old peripherals is a master stroke IMO.
Give it a chance and return it if you don't like it. VR only gets better the more you are in it.

 

[orioto]

Are you sure? Because the screens below to me look really really good if you are correct.

And seeing this in motion looks even better than these screenshots.

Something i wanted to say about some reviews, about the graphics. People are soo fucking spoiled nowadays..

We have the first ever console VR in the entire history right now. It's amazing. Graphics looks way above PS3 level for textures and shaders, even models in some cases with good optimizations. They look super fiiine. I mean anyone having tried the Oculus was amazed with 95 pc graphics in VR, really.

VR is amazing. The tech could have had N64 graphics. First thing i tried was an Ocarina of Time demo and it was surreal, i wanted to stay there forever.

The first VR tech could have been there earlier, with PS2 graphics, or below. But no, it's VR, for the first time in your living room, and it looks something between PS3 and PS4, for fuck sake. VR is directly at THAT level of graphics. With realistic human representation and super detailed environments.

And reviewers are like "well sure with PSVR don't count on good graphics cause that's all you'll got for that price".. really ?

 

[mckmas8808]

Remember that even though the resolution in the headset is higher than the image being sent to the TV, it doesn't "look" like that really. Things like distance, scale and movement come into play; like you couldn't resolve the bats flying in front of the waterfall like you can in a screen grab within the headset itself.

Hmmm....interesting. So why are video game outlets saying it looks better in the headset then?

 

[Crumpo]

Are you sure? Because the screens below to me look really really good if you are correct.

Yup, they explained that the second screen sees the image from one eye, which is circular, meaning the breakout box needs to "straighten" the edges. If you zoom into the top corners you'll see the IQ is much worse than the centre.

But you'll be wearing the headset-it's only your friends who will see this anyway. And if you don't notice it then it's OK for you

 

[panda-zebra]

Yes it absolutely did.

Well yes of course we saw the tape come out - but it did not happen as mnz said it did - view the sequence of posts I replied to:

does that mean they had set the stuffs up and advanced through some games more than what they've showed in the stream at home without any idea on the recommended distance??

No, they checked the distance and were well within the recommended range. They even brought out the measuring tape.

The kit was set up with the distance well outside the recommended range.

It wasn't until over 2 hours into the stream that "They even brought out the measuring tape":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_mF6m_WJF8&feature=youtu.be&t=2h4m36s

And it was a few minutes later that a viewer points GB to PSVR FAQ details including the 5 feet play distance they then read out:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_mF6m_WJF8&feature=youtu.be&t=2h6m19s

To which the players in PSVR responded with 16 seconds of silence and then continued to talk about the game they were playing.

The whole stream is right there to see - the timeline is not up for debate. There was no correct setup using a tape before they went live - that happened over 2 hours later.

 

[Kyne]

several reviews/streams/videos later and I still have no idea if I want this thing.

bah.

 

[CyberChulo]

You can use gazed based aiming, or you can use tracked controllers as pointer based aiming. Mixing the two wouldn't turn out well. Your gaze would override the absolute positioning of your hands which would kill the sense of presence dead.

Edit:


Another camera is the only way. One camera will always have occlusion issues. That's just a limitation for PSVR that games will have to be designed around.

True. But I guess the only way is to try it for yourself to find out. Can't wait to pick up my VR baby next Thursday! I'll try this method with Rush of Blood and let you guys know.

 

[JordanN]

VR is amazing. The tech could have had N64 graphics. First thing i tried was an Ocarina of Time demo and it was surreal, i wanted to stay there forever.

The first VR tech could have been there earlier, with PS2 graphics, or below. But no, it's VR, for the first time in your living room, and it looks something between PS3 and PS4, for fuck sake. VR is directly at THAT level of graphics. With realistic human representation and super detailed environments.

And reviewers are like "well sure with PSVR don't count on good graphics cause that's all you'll got for that price".. really ?

This is why I'm so glad to own a 1st gen headset.

I want the graphics to look bad. Because it means we'll get games that are stylized and focus on gameplay.

The last time gaming was like this was during the PS1 era, and look at the huge variety of games we got.

VR seems to be the last time in gaming history we'll get to experience something like that again.

 

[gustave154]

Have tried PSVR multiple times on game conventions and was impressed every time i tried it. Glad to see the reception is very positive like my experiences.

 

[Qwyjibo]

I don't think I saw it anywhere in this thread but here's Victor Lucas' review for EPN:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eV4Lcd1lXB0

Even though he can be overly-positive at times, I'll always respect his view on gaming given his experience.

 

[mnz]

The kit was set up with the distance well outside the recommended range.

It wasn't until over 2 hours into the stream that "They even brought out the measuring tape":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_mF6m_WJF8&feature=youtu.be&t=2h4m36s

"Jeff is currently 5.5 feet away"

Come on...where did you get the 10 feet from? You made it up.

 

[panda-zebra]

"Jeff is currently 5.5 feet away"

Come on...

He moved there after being told he was too far away (when he was around 10 feet away).

Come on...

https://youtu.be/x_mF6m_WJF8?t=14m35s

that's not 5.5 feet away.

 

[Curufinwe]

Well yes of course we saw the tape come out - but it did not happen as mnz said it did - view the sequence of posts I replied to:





The kit was set up with the distance well outside the recommended range.

It wasn't until over 2 hours into the stream that "They even brought out the measuring tape":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_mF6m_WJF8&feature=youtu.be&t=2h4m36s

And it was a few minutes later that a viewer points GB to PSVR FAQ details including the 5 feet play distance they then read out:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_mF6m_WJF8&feature=youtu.be&t=2h6m19s

To which the players in PSVR responded with 16 seconds of silence and then continued to talk about the game they were playing.

The whole stream is right there to see - the timeline is not up for debate. There was no correct setup using a tape before they went live - that happened over 2 hours later.

There's a group of Giant Bomb fanboys who will never admit that Giant Bomb is even partially at fault for anything, ever. I'll never forget the guy who told me that no one on the Bombcast knowing that you could download PS2 games on PS3 was Sony's fault for not telling them. And when I pointed out that one of the people on that Bombcast had written a story for the site about it, he said it was Sony's fault for not reminding them.

 

[family_guy]

If you preordered from Amazon I'm sure it's safe to open and test out, and you can return it if there are issues with your setup that can't be resolved...obviously if you get a faulty unit then you can get it replaced.

It's a ton of crap to have to put back in the box though. I remember when I had the Oculus Rift the contents were much less and easier to repackage.

 

[alarre1]

Think I'll just stick with the PS4 Pro for now and wait till the 2nd gen of VR to get released. Might pick up a used Vive down the line to see if VR is really worth it.

 

[Wallach]

Hmmm....interesting. So why are video game outlets saying it looks better in the headset then?

Well, the resolution is definitely higher, I'm just saying things like jagged edges and general resolution doesn't translate from a screen grab to what you perceive in VR. It's a bit hard to explain if you've never had the chance to use a headset. By all accounts the visuals in PSVR are pretty nice for the resolution of screen they're using. Just keep in perspective that the same number of pixels they would have used to draw that 1080p image on your 20-60 inch display is the same amount of pixels they have to draw an image across ~100 degrees of your field of view.

To get something with the kind of general clarity of a 1080p image in VR, you need a panel way higher than 1080p.

 

[Kaako]

As a Vive user and VR developer, it makes me sad to see all these hardcore gamers being so down on Playstation VR. Its by far the best way to play videogames thats come along. Even playing 2D games in 3D large screen environment is awesome. Sony has done something special here in creating a system that is not godawful expensive but still delivers an experience close to Oculus or Vive, reusing old peripherals is a master stroke IMO.
Give it a chance and return it if you don't like it. VR only gets better the more you are in it.

You are not the first VR developer to have this view. Which I find interesting because most of the people developing actual games for VR/PSVR are pretty damn positive on it and it reaffirms me keeping my preorder. It seems PSVR is actually a pretty great kit for mid to almost high fidelity level VR.

 

[Durante]

Another camera is the only way. One camera will always have occlusion issues. That's just a limitation for PSVR that games will have to be designed around.

It's a bit sad that this was pointed out for months and seems to still surprise lots of people now.

I expect that the gameplay / immersion implications will also come as a surprise to some when they actually try the thing and see how difficult it can be to keep aligned in one direction when you are immersed in a game.

 

[pj]

Well yes of course we saw the tape come out - but it did not happen as mnz said it did - view the sequence of posts I replied to:





The kit was set up with the distance well outside the recommended range.

It wasn't until over 2 hours into the stream that "They even brought out the measuring tape":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_mF6m_WJF8&feature=youtu.be&t=2h4m36s

And it was a few minutes later that a viewer points GB to PSVR FAQ details including the 5 feet play distance they then read out:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_mF6m_WJF8&feature=youtu.be&t=2h6m19s

To which the players in PSVR responded with 16 seconds of silence and then continued to talk about the game they were playing.

The whole stream is right there to see - the timeline is not up for debate. There was no correct setup using a tape before they went live - that happened over 2 hours later.

The part you are talking about with the tape measurer on screen, they measured a distance of 5.5 feet. The measuring was prompted by jeff saying the world in battlezone was moving so much that he may not be able to play.

I'm not sure what you're trying to argue. They were absolutely within the recommended distance while experiencing these problems. He had similar "world moving in and out" and "controller moving on is own" problems while playing Job Sim, while standing in front of the chair.

Also I'm 90% sure Dan at one point said he measured before the stream (Notice how they happened to have a tape measurer lying around when he later measured on camera) and the greenscreen PSVR was at around 7 feet. Jeff said it was around the same distance he had his setup at home, 7-8'. He moved his chair closer to see if that would improve things and the rest of the stream was at 5'-5.5'.

 

[KORNdoggy]

It's a bit sad that this was pointed out for months and seems to still surprise lots of people now.

I expect that the gameplay / immersion implications will also come as a surprise to some when they actually try the thing and see how difficult it can be to keep aligned in one direction when you are immersed in a game.

it's why i prefer seated/cockpit games in VR. it's hard to get yourself turned around when you're sat in a chair. lol

 

[User123456]

It's a bit sad that this was pointed out for months and seems to still surprise lots of people now.

I expect that the gameplay / immersion implications will also come as a surprise to some when they actually try the thing and see how difficult it can be to keep aligned in one direction when you are immersed in a game.

PS VR is for seated VR. I don't think it's going to be a problem for games designed with this in mind, like Farpoint which allows rotation with a stick.

To be honest, that's the kind of VR I want. I don't want to stand around.

 

[fastest finger]

One hell of a big thread, so apologies if this has already been raised, but I think I see why the green screen could be messing with the tracking.

Look at this shot here.

The blue lights on the headset show up as black, same as the image being shown on the green screen.

In this second image the blue light in the middle looks silver, same as the object behind him.

If Giant Bomb's own camera equipment can't differentiate between the lights and the screen behind, how can anyone expect the PS Camera to?

 

[mnz]

There's a group of Giant Bomb fanboys who will never admit that Giant Bomb is even partially at fault for anything, ever. I'll never forget the guy who told me that no one on the Bombcast knowing that you could download PS2 games on PS3 was Sony's fault for not telling them. And when I pointed out that one of the people on that Bombcast had written a story for the site about it, he said it was Sony's fault for not reminding them.

Kinda tired of this, but I feel like you're calling me out.

Here's what he said:

No, they were massively beyond the optimal recommended range.

Total guess.

The tape came out only after Jeff already moved forwards to check. Even then he had to shuffle further forwards (only 6" or so) to be at the optimal 5 feet distance.

He didn't move at all afterwards and he was 5.5" away when they checked.

Judging by how far he came forwards, I believe he was originally 10 feet away or more.

Total guess.

Well yes of course we saw the tape come out - but it did not happen as mnz said it did

I just said they checked and were at the optimal range. And they had similar problems at home and they had problems after measuring so I'm really not sure why they are still at fault for anything here.

 

[belvedere]

Guys there's literally dozens of hands-on previews up on YT and none of these previews demonstrate any significant or widespread tracking issues. Why is this myth still being perpetuated?

 

[Neuromancer]

So did we ever find out for sure what GB's problem was? Faulty headset? Not sitting close enough? Too many confusing things in the background?

 

[c00l3ru]

After much deliberation, I've decided to cancel. It's a shame as some of the games seem really good but I'd rather wait a couple of months and see if the problems can be ironed out.

 

[Zalusithix]

It's a bit sad that this was pointed out for months and seems to still surprise lots of people now.

I expect that the gameplay / immersion implications will also come as a surprise to some when they actually try the thing and see how difficult it can be to keep aligned in one direction when you are immersed in a game.

To be fair, many of the roomscale Vive games are designed knowing that you don't have to be conscious about what way you're facing. For something like Raw Data, I have no damn idea which way I'm facing after a minute or two into it. It doesn't matter either. The lighthouses will take care of that. In Audioshield or SPT, however, I know exactly where I'm facing. Oculus Touch games will likely also be designed so you're always aware of what way you should be facing. Those sorts of games will work with PSVR (assuming the Move is up to the task).

It certainly limits the scope of the experiences, but c'est la vie.

 

[Servbot24]

Some of you are trying awfully hard to hate this thing aren't you?

If you throw enough false information into the ether, people will start to take it for granted and it will form a narrative that even if recognized as false will have a subtle negative effect. Those are Trump-like tactics, except some people are choosing to use them to cast a poor light on electronic toys that aren't made by the company they like the best.

 

[belvedere]

If you throw enough false information into the ether, people will start to take it for granted and it will form a narrative that even if recognized as false will have a subtle negative effect. Those are Trump-like tactics, except some people are choosing to use them to cast a poor light on electronic toys that aren't made by the company they like the best.

I've witnessed this tactic for years and it's still just as bewildering today!

 

[c00l3ru]

Guys there's literally dozens of hands-on previews up on YT and none of these previews demonstrate any significant or widespread tracking issues. Why is this myth still being perpetuated?

But a lot of reputable review sites have said there is.
People playing a 10 minute demo in a store or at a show is not the same as having it at home and playing it for hours and hours.

 

[pj]

One hell of a big thread, so apologies if this has already been raised, but I think I see why the green screen could be messing with the tracking.

Look at this shot here.

The blue lights on the headset show up as black, same as the image being shown on the green screen.

In this second image the blue light in the middle looks silver, same as the object behind him.

If Giant Bomb's own camera equipment can't differentiate between the lights and the screen behind, how can anyone expect the PS Camera to?

Uh, I expect it to work because it's a consumer product and homes have painted walls? Or should PSVR only be sold to people who don't own macbooks and don't have green walls?

GB's keying is probably pretty aggressive to make sure none of the screen comes through. Not to mention different cameras have different exposure settings and apertures and so on.

Also, the reason GB's camera is falsely recognizing the blue LEDs as greenscreen is because they are so bright relative to the rest of the image that they are saturating the green channel of the image. PSVR's camera doesn't care about the green channel for headset tracking, it would only need to look at the blue channel. You are conflating two entirely separate things. If anything it shows the LEDs are much brighter than anything else in the environment and should be easily detected by the PSVR camera

Besides, if that's the problem why did turning the lights off not fix it?

 

[Oni Jazar]

I cancelled yesterday because of Giant Bomb but now I'm regretting it

 

[RootCause]

I cancelled yesterday because of Giant Bomb but now I'm regretting it

How's the return policy with the store you had preorder? If it's Amazon, you can return the product for the full refund, as longs it's not missing anything, or damaged.

I'm keeping mine, and if it doesn't me sick, and it plays nice with my room then I'm keeping it. If not, well it's going back to Amazon, or it's being sold for the actual price.

Edit

Never mind. Read it wrong.

 

[Poker Face]

can we already pre-load games for PSVR? or not yet?

 

[fastest finger]

Uh, I expect it to work because it's a consumer product and homes have painted walls? Or should PSVR only be sold to people who don't own macbooks and don't have green walls?

GB's keying is probably pretty aggressive to make sure none of the screen comes through. Not to mention different cameras have different exposure settings and apertures and so on.

Also, the reason GB's camera is falsely recognizing the blue LEDs as greenscreen is because they are so bright relative to the rest of the image that they are saturating the green channel of the image. PSVR's camera doesn't care about the green channel for headset tracking, it would only need to look at the blue channel. You are conflating two entirely separate things. If anything it shows the LEDs are much brighter than anything else in the environment and should be easily detected by the PSVR camera

Besides, if that's the problem why did turning the lights off not fix it?

Did they adjust the tracking lights as detailed in the user manual?

 

[Peltz]

This is why I'm so glad to own a 1st gen headset.

I want the graphics to look bad. Because it means we'll get games that are stylized and focus on gameplay.

The last time gaming was like this was during the PS1 era, and look at the huge variety of games we got.

VR seems to be the last time in gaming history we'll get to experience something like that again.

I'm 100% with you on this. Hopefully we live long enough for hologram gaming to be possible.

I do also think the Wii was a great breeding ground for cool experiments. But this is the next level of progress. I think VR is sort of continuing what the Wii started.