cyborgnumberblue
Member
Yeah, I play mostly action games, STGs, and fighters, and I've never found myself in a position where I've felt input lag shoulders a significant portion of the blame.
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Retro AV Club Thread 2: Classic Gaming Done Right!
- Thread starter Mega
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socksfelloff
Member
The ks8000 has 18ms of input delay which is just over 1 frame( fantastic for a tv). It's completely tolerable and your brain will adjust to it in a matter of seconds. Try playing on older flat panels with 90+ms of delay. I have a friend with a shit Samsung tv and occasionally we play umvc3 there and inputs register well AFTER my finger has left the button on my stick. It drives me fucking insane and I get so salty!
Laevateinn
Member
A lot of people think old games are needlessly hard but I bet a lot of them are just playing emulators on shitty displays.
I got a lot better when I ditched my old flat screen.
I got a lot better when I ditched my old flat screen.
PumpkinSpice
Banned
Yeah that's a big factor but there's also:
- Some games just being fucked up hard to try and combat rentals (Lion King, Contra Hard Corps, Castlevania Bloodlines, many others)
- Game design borrowed from Arcades to try and eat quarters
- Games without much content trying to pad length (Dragon Warrior 1)
- Even for games outside of that list, there's stuff like Castlevania which is tough-but-fair, but if you're not used to having to restart whole levels would really be annoying
Kiddy Dong
Member
Some people are more sensitive to it than others, you probably have a much higher threshold than some of us ITT. Input lag is the entire reason I got into CRT gaming in the first place (competitive Melee); I can feel it a mile away lol.
I wonder about this often as well. People hook their N64 to a 60" HDTV and expect it to look and play as well as they remember, but they're actually getting a gimped experience without realizing it. Their perspective on retro gaming is often negatively affected by it. But to be fair, there isn't really a precedent to expect otherwise. I can't think of another entertainment medium where consumption of the "classics" is so severely hampered by technological disparities.
This also might explain why execution heavy games have become more niche since HDTV and input lag became the norm. Game designers can't build games anymore knowing that everyone is playing on a lagless display.
I recently just realized how lag sensitive I am by accident. I have always shot for the lowest lag on devices but didn't know how much it actually affected me until about a month ago. I was playing Hollow Knight doing the coliseum challenge, and I was getting utterly destroyed to the point I got really angry because I had done the same challenge before and done way better. I thrb noticed my projector wasn't in game mode (21ms lag) but in reference mode (80+ ms lag). Switched it to game and replayed the same challenge and beat the challenge vs lasting 45 secs. Pretty definitive difference in my eyes since I didn't know going into it that I basically just checked how I played between the two lol. I play all my old school stuff on pvm and arcade machine, so even more glad now I have those options.
I started playing 720p/1080i games on the 20l5 now. Splatoon on Wii U feels just heavenly with the gyro aiming.
My HDTV is pretty fast (about a 22ms of lag), but the CRT just feels like magic in comparison. I'm sure some of it is a placebo effect.
I'm going to try playing Bayonetta on Wii U on my CRT tonight to see how that feels. W101 was really cool too.
My HDTV is pretty fast (about a 22ms of lag), but the CRT just feels like magic in comparison. I'm sure some of it is a placebo effect.
I'm going to try playing Bayonetta on Wii U on my CRT tonight to see how that feels. W101 was really cool too.
PumpkinSpice
Banned
I don't think it's a big difference in the kind of games I play but I can definitely feel the difference between 20ms on my TV and 5ms on my 120hz PC monitor when using a mouse to move windows around. It feels so much nicer with lower lag. Otherwise if you were to ask me to pick out 15ms lag difference in say a platformer I don't know that I could.
davidwhangchoi
Member
it's actually legit. years ago my friend, who's a top Halo player, told me he uses a CRT with his 360. i thought it was all mumble jumble but he told me it's a big advantage.
It really depends on the platformer. On something like SMB, I could probably feel the difference. On something like SMB3, probably not.
Even though it's the same hardware/series/developer, the physics feel different enough in the 3rd game where input lag matters a lot less. SMB1, by contrast, feels like a very terrible experience on almost everything other than a CRT.
Yo dude, you still coming over Sunday? We need to play some games!
Windjammers Mwhahaha
davidwhangchoi
Member
ah, that's right this is the weekend. let me text you and see what's going on.
i want to check out the 20L5. pretty hyped about it.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
I wish I had friends.
socksfelloff
Member
ThanksVision
Member
i wish CRTs were easier to get
RadarScope1
Member
Said it many times now about CRTs: accept no substitutes.
sixteen-bit
Member
PVM = Profesional Video Monitor
BVM = Broadcast Video Monitor
Right?
How about:
GVM = Gaming Video Monitor
That's a free idea for anyone out there that wants to make an epic gaming CRT.
You're welcome.
BVM = Broadcast Video Monitor
Right?
How about:
GVM = Gaming Video Monitor
That's a free idea for anyone out there that wants to make an epic gaming CRT.
You're welcome.
digita1alchemy
Member
I need to replace my NES AC adapter. I've always been an OEM-only kind of guy, but does anyone have any impressions of the Retro-Bit power adapter?
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001S2VT6I/?tag=neogaf0e-20
I thought this might be extra handy since I wouldn't have to switch out the power adapter if I were to change out from the NES to the SNES or Genesis (I only have room to have 1 retro console hooked up at a time).
EDIT: Ok, reviews on Amazon are not promising...
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001S2VT6I/?tag=neogaf0e-20
I thought this might be extra handy since I wouldn't have to switch out the power adapter if I were to change out from the NES to the SNES or Genesis (I only have room to have 1 retro console hooked up at a time).
EDIT: Ok, reviews on Amazon are not promising...
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
Kawika
Member
I think I talked myself into buying the new Analog NT Mini which means I have a Analog NT (HDMI) going up for sale. I am going to probably list it in the buy sell trade forum. Some people had issues with their's not working with Everdrives (mine does) and its updated to the latest firmware. I really love this thing and I am really having a tough time wanting to part with it (since its real hardware) but from what people are saying that the Mini's FPGA is solid I think I have (want) to jump in.
I thought I would list it here first. Just PM if you are interested.
I thought I would list it here first. Just PM if you are interested.
CrashPrime
Member
Are these AGS-101 GBA's on eBay a scam for like $80? (note they are GBA not SP) I feel like its as good as it gets for GBA. 3DS's 240p resolution makes 1:1 pixel mapping really small, same goes for the K101+.
Pricing one out on retromodding ends up being like $180 which is where I even learned they existed (via MetalJesusRocks).
Pricing one out on retromodding ends up being like $180 which is where I even learned they existed (via MetalJesusRocks).
Woo! I'm pretty sure i'll be in that batch. Sold my OSSC a few months ago, and I've been itching to play some Genesis since!
Whenever I use emulators(at times) I only play on my PC monitors, never HDTVs. But I can see crappy displays with input lag being a problem.
CharlesDangus
Member
The NT Mini has the benefit of having both analog and digital video outputs, no choosing between the two.
Also you get the added bonus of it being a GB, GBC, SMS, SG-1000, Game Gear, Gamate, GameKing, Watara Supervision, Colecovision, Atari 2600, Atari 7800, Arcadia 2001, Fairchild Channel F, Creativision, Odyssey^2, RCA Studio 2, Adventure Vision, Videobrain plus whatever else Kevtris finishes and the NT Mini's FPGA has space for.
FPGA's are undoubtedly the future of video game hardware preservation and hi-fidelity playback.
9" is average on GAF.
davidwhangchoi
Member
congrats on the sale =)
Barrel Cannon
Member
Does it even take Scart.... wait do all PVMs take Scart?
socksfelloff
Member
Lol wasn't my sale just an auction I was watching. Though if people pay that for a 9" now I wonder what I'd get for my 14" and 20"...
It had RGB via BNC. Still... 9"...
None of my pvms take scart. They do take rgbS over BNC though
One of mine takes SCART (2030) but it's an outlier.
Missed this. Needs quoting lmao.
Some are composite only. Some may also be composite and s-video only. Some are pure black and white monitors.
They come in a ton of configurations.
$350 is insane for a screen that small.
It works out to $250 USD but still insane IMO.
RadarScope1
Member
All in how you use it, baby.
Laevateinn
Member
I don't know about you all but I'm 20"
bodine1231
Member
I bought one last week from one of the bigger sellers of modded GBA's and it arrived without the extra backlight setting soldered in. The glass screen had a chip in the top right. The seller wouldnt fix or give a refund and eBay removed my negative feedback so I can't even let others know.
I'M RICH BITCH!!! (not really they are all black and white)
Laevateinn
Member
Thread should be renamed: "Retro AV Club Thread 2: Seeking Trained Addiction Specialists"
PumpkinSpice
Banned
TBH with Mega seemingly perma'd (maybe 6 months?) I'd kinda like a new thread.
I'M RICH BITCH!!! (not really they are all black and white)
Should get some OG monochrome Gameboy goodness going on them.
davidwhangchoi
Member
all black and white? maybe you can create this MV with those monitors:I'M RICH BITCH!!! (not really they are all black and white)
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
You should throw that trash away.
bodine1231
Member
Some pics of the Ikegami. I really like this monitors picture,it has a very consumer CRT look but still retains the sharpness of a pro monitor. Only annoying part is there arent very many options for controlling the H and V like the sub menu on a PVM but the geometry seems better than almost all the PVM's I've had. I'm really liking the full curved screen compared to the semi flat on a PVM too.
RadarScope1
Member
Looks quite nice. My JVC has the full convex shape and I like it as well.
Kawika
Member
I am not that interested in all of those but I am definitely excited to get GB, GBC, SMS, Game Gear, and would kind of be neat to revisit the 2600/5200 (even though i was too young to really appreciate them). Oddly, I am not sure how much i care about getting a fpga to run snes and genesis as those sold well enough but I really want a TG16/PCE, NeoGeo and maybe other 80s-90s arcade boards too.
CrashPrime
Member
Which seller? I feel like gambling so I want to minimize my risk.
Kiddy Dong
Member
How did he get banned? He was always one of the most helpful posters in this thread and OT1.
socksfelloff
Member
I'm not sure but I recently came off a 6 month ban (My first ban too). Mods be handing out some long sentences.
CharlesDangus
Member
Well you're in luck because Kevtris does plan on implementing SNES, Genesis, TG-16/PCE and NeoGeo.
One benefit of Kevtris' SNES implementation will be that he's implementing the SA-1 enhancement chip, which no flashcarts currently support. I imagine he would take a crack at the SuperFX chips too. The purely economic/convenience benefit of having any of these systems in FPGA is that it's the system, a built in Everdrive, and basically a built in lagless upscaler.
With Genesis in particular though, you'd still want to keep the original hardware around for 32X and Sega CD functionality. I asked Kevtris about those on AtariAge and he said the my seemed like a nightmare and not to expect any FPGA implementations of them anywhere in the foreseeable future.
I can't wait to simplify my setup, having everything below 5th gen in one FPGA box and only keeping original hardware hooked up for 5th gen and above.
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