Giallo Corsa
Member
Get a load of Nostradamus over here!
Don't you mean Quasimodo ?
Get a load of Nostradamus over here!
If Returnal wasn't a roguelike, it would have 6 stages. Estimating the game could take you anywhere from 6-8 hours, maybe 10 if you die a lot. That's pretty short. This is assuming it was designed like a normal shooter with Easy, Medium, Hard mode, continues, save spots, 2-3 lives, etc. Most people wouldn't consider a 6 hour game worth $70. What they could have done is put it out just like that and charge $40-50, which is about double the price of all their previous games. Would've been a smash hit. A TPS with cool graphics, cool audio design, and anyone can play it how they want. You could unlock when you beat it once an "Arcade Mode" where you have to beat the game on 1 life and it randomizes.I heard you have to play through it at least twice™.
If Returnal wasn't a roguelike, it would have 6 stages. Estimating the game could take you anywhere from 6-8 hours, maybe 10 if you die a lot. That's pretty short. This is assuming it was designed like a normal shooter with Easy, Medium, Hard mode, continues, save spots, 2-3 lives, etc. Most people wouldn't consider a 6 hour game worth $70. What they could have done is put it out just like that and charge $40-50, which is about double the price of all their previous games. Would've been a smash hit. A TPS with cool graphics, cool audio design, and anyone can play it how they want. You could unlock when you beat it once an "Arcade Mode" where you have to beat the game on 1 life and it randomizes.
As a roguelike, it's too expensive. It's too short. It's going to alienate too many people. It's a solid shooter, but a bad roguelike. There's limited weapons, limited power variety, which is the essence of repeat runs not feeling stale. Limited progression.
So yeah, I don't know what they meant by premium. Paid titles, yes I support. $70 titles, or higher, you do have to really rethink the value of the product. It didn't even sell well on PC which has a large roguelike audience. They didn't understand the genre and doubled the price and sales reflect that. They know how to make a fun shooter though.
If Returnal wasn't a roguelike, it would have 6 stages. Estimating the game could take you anywhere from 6-8 hours, maybe 10 if you die a lot. That's pretty short. This is assuming it was designed like a normal shooter with Easy, Medium, Hard mode, continues, save spots, 2-3 lives, etc. Most people wouldn't consider a 6 hour game worth $70. What they could have done is put it out just like that and charge $40-50, which is about double the price of all their previous games. Would've been a smash hit. A TPS with cool graphics, cool audio design, and anyone can play it how they want. You could unlock when you beat it once an "Arcade Mode" where you have to beat the game on 1 life and it randomizes.
As a roguelike, it's too expensive. It's too short. It's going to alienate too many people. It's a solid shooter, but a bad roguelike. There's limited weapons, limited power variety, which is the essence of repeat runs not feeling stale. Limited progression.
So yeah, I don't know what they meant by premium. Paid titles, yes I support. $70 titles, or higher, you do have to really rethink the value of the product. It didn't even sell well on PC which has a large roguelike audience. They didn't understand the genre and doubled the price and sales reflect that. They know how to make a fun shooter though.
It's meant as an insult. As long as Gamers buy $70+ games and $100+ for "Early Access" that are worth at most $30 they don't need to nickel and dime you with a GaaS model.So yeah, I don't know what they meant by premium.
That may be, but very on brand as well.I mean, you're not wrong
DeepEnigma , c'mon brother the man has a point - this would have been a pretty short game if it wasn't a rogue like (and a pretty bad one at that).
In fact, I get the impression that it was made into a rogue like because they either didn't have any more content to add, or, they did but had to ship the game for the PS5's launch and also had to - somehow - justify the 70 pricetag.
I love everything about the game except the absolutely shite progression system , it REALLY.brungs the whole thing down and it's a shame.
Out of pure curiosity, what are your thoughts on the game ?That may be, but very on brand as well.
Yeah it was a great tps, not so great roguelite.Saros will 100% be a roguelike. I thought Returnal was phenomenal, but I agree they can do so much to improve the roguelike experience. The variety in gameplay from run to run was not there in Returnal. Hopefully Saros can fix that. Returnal is still one of the best TPS ever created
That's because returnal progression between runs is terrible, other than the weapons and the gadgets (and only some of them can be used in combat) you barely unlock anything useful, the objects are very situational and single use, they don't feel much like progression and the larger the pool gets, the more useless objects you find instead of the useful ones.Wolf, the problem is that even with unlocked perks, you still start with 0 weapon proficiency...
I'm pretty sure I'd have managed to beat the 3rd boss yesterday but the fucking game only dropped either a higher lvl pistol or a shotgun during the run, had I had the Tachyomatic carbine I'd have probably beat him.
Here's the thing now : I just can't muster the courage to do EVERYTHING again from the beginning 'cause I'd be looking at another 2.5-3 hours run, and let's face it, taking the shortcuts doesn't really help since you'll be skipping on the health/weapon upgrades etc etc.
They REALLY need to do something about this shit in Saros.
I did. I'm normally not a big rogue or rogue-like fan. At first glance I tried it and put it down due to that.Out of pure curiosity, what are your thoughts on the game ?
Did you manage to finish it ? Do.you think it was well balanced /had its systems properly in place ?
What would you like to see different in Saros ?
Honest questions btw love![]()
I did. I'm normally not a big rogue or rogue-like fan. At first glance I tried it and put it down due to that.
Then I read a few tips on Gaf and abroad, picked it up again a few weeks later and was hooked. The gameplay was fantastic, per their specialty. The Geiger-like art design/atmosphere was great, and once I got into a routine unlocking the story elements, it sucked me in and I couldn't put it down. The music layered with the gameplay made it feel like one giant suffocating nightmare.
It felt very rewarding as you finally beat biomes that were challenging your resolve. But yes, I would've liked better static items or progression unlocks. On the other hand, it felt really good when you got a good roll as well.
Fuck the AI robot Derelict Citadel level though at first glance
RIP Helios.
They're not a studio that repeats itself (pun intended), so I do expect them to hone their craft more and build upon the feedback from the gamerverse.
3 things i hope they fix:
Jumping\platforming with laser and shit, the platforming wasn't as tight as the shooting and loosing health because of that in a game where losing even a bit of health can traduce into a game over was kinda infuriating.
Get rid of falling down and losing health, the challenge should come from hard enemies, not being careful to not fall down because i swear, i lost way more health falling down than from enemies, great tps don't need this shit to be hard and challenging.
Get rid of money from enemies exploding everywhere and disappearing, it's a cheap, artificial way to make combat harder when you have to take care of enemies and money exploding everywhere and falling down or disappearing after 5 sec, one could say that it force you to play aggressively but countless games have an aggressive playstyle without this bullshit, you don't want the player to hide and pot shot from distance? Fix your enemy ai and make them more aggressive and with better path-tracing or whatever the name is, also if you make long range weapons in your game make me use them as long range weapon without forcing me to run towards enemies like a dumbass while using a long range rifle.
No hyperbole or bullshit, Derelict Citadel is one of my favorite videogame levels of all time. Not saying the game is perfect on all fronts but the way that level brings together gameplay bliss, total isolation, oppressive personal tragedy (to be a bit pretentious), absolutely insane art and architecture and topped by the fucking soundtrack? Dude...I did. I'm normally not a big rogue or rogue-like fan. At first glance I tried it and put it down due to that.
Then I read a few tips on Gaf and abroad, picked it up again a few weeks later and was hooked. The gameplay was fantastic, per their specialty. The Geiger-like art design/atmosphere was great, and once I got into a routine unlocking the story elements, it sucked me in and I couldn't put it down. The music layered with the gameplay made it feel like one giant suffocating nightmare.
It felt very rewarding as you finally beat biomes that were challenging your resolve. But yes, I would've liked better static items or progression unlocks. On the other hand, it felt really good when you got a good roll as well.
Fuck the AI robot Derelict Citadel level though at first glance
RIP Helios.
They're not a studio that repeats itself (pun intended), so I do expect them to hone their craft more and build upon the feedback from the gamerverse.
The level definitely felt good, and became better understood after you learned the tricks to it. It was a puzzle in itself thrown at you that changed up the gameplay loop a bit in the process.No hyperbole or bullshit, Derelict Citadel is one of my favorite videogame levels of all time. Not saying the game is perfect on all fronts but the way that level brings together gameplay bliss, total isolation, oppressive personal tragedy (to be a bit pretentious), absolutely insane art and architecture and topped by the fucking soundtrack? Dude...
It's one of those games that feels like someone rummaged around in my brain and put together all the shit that gets me off in a way that I didn't know I wanted. Returnal is like Bloodborne for me that way and that level is just orgasmic.
I got a like on my take/theory from the game director so I'm gonna continue to run with that the citadel is literally built by yourself against your endlessly returning self. The Destroyer/Creator. The lore in the game fucking rules whether it contradicts itself and actually fully makes sense or not (it doesn't lulz).The level definitely felt good, and became better understood after you learned the tricks to it. It was a puzzle in itself thrown at you that changed up the gameplay loop a bit in the process.
![]()
![]()
Returnal studio Housemarque has no plans for a live-service title "as long as people are buying premium games"
Developer Housemarque, known for the likes of Returnal and Nex Machina, has no plans to go down the free-to-play or live-service route any time soon.www.eurogamer.net
Take my money, Housemarque.
You can get back to that boss fairly quickly in future runs. Probably less than 10 minutes. Take a carbine for that boss and stay as far away as possible. Also regarding unlocks the thing that gets better each run is you.Bless their heart(s).
I'm going through Returnal right now and man, the music, sound production and art-direction/esthetics are really something else...
...shame then that its whole rogue-like nature is what - IMO - brings it down : there's just no real progression ffs (minus some shortcuts) and everytime you start from zero - I managed to reach the 3rd biome yesterday and its boss with almost 3 health bars, 3 healing items, an astronaut figurine (2nd life basically) AND also managed to activate the respawn machinery - thing took me about 4 sittings and 3+ hours (thank God for the suspend feature they implemented) and yet, I fucking lost everything at the boss...
It's one of the most disheartening games I've ever played since I lost all the will to continue - and this is the 2nd time that it happens.
That's the key argument in my opinion, there's not enough variation for good roguelike gameplay.If Returnal wasn't a roguelike, it would have 6 stages. Estimating the game could take you anywhere from 6-8 hours, maybe 10 if you die a lot. That's pretty short. This is assuming it was designed like a normal shooter with Easy, Medium, Hard mode, continues, save spots, 2-3 lives, etc. Most people wouldn't consider a 6 hour game worth $70. What they could have done is put it out just like that and charge $40-50, which is about double the price of all their previous games. Would've been a smash hit. A TPS with cool graphics, cool audio design, and anyone can play it how they want. You could unlock when you beat it once an "Arcade Mode" where you have to beat the game on 1 life and it randomizes.
As a roguelike, it's too expensive. It's too short. It's going to alienate too many people. It's a solid shooter, but a bad roguelike. There's limited weapons, limited power variety, which is the essence of repeat runs not feeling stale. Limited progression.
So yeah, I don't know what they meant by premium. Paid titles, yes I support. $70 titles, or higher, you do have to really rethink the value of the product. It didn't even sell well on PC which has a large roguelike audience. They didn't understand the genre and doubled the price and sales reflect that. They know how to make a fun shooter though.
sameI'd rather have a follow sequel for super stardust HD or delta. Also a sequel to Dead Nation. So much could be done with those. Instead they went full 3d. I loved their indy projects.
In fact I really miss twin stick shooters in general like that and even something like Geometry wars.
Is there any good twin stick shooters that came out in the last few years?
They can't, high visual fidelity traduce in less content compared to what you can do with the shit, basic graphic/animations of risk of rain 2.That's the key argument in my opinion, there's not enough variation for good roguelike gameplay.
Only a few mutations really change the way you approach the game, obviously there's only one character and each run feels very same-ish.
I dream of a game with Returnal's gunplay and feedback coupled with the variety of something like Risk of Rain 2. Maybe they can achieve that in their next game but I wouldn't bet on it, it wasn't a design priority for sure.
Pc all day.I have yet to give myself the pleasure of playing this game. I'm too conflicted about the platform PC or PS5.
I did and have 80 hours in it.Resogun studio Housemarque has no plans for a premium game "as long as people are buying arcade games".
You (yes, you) should have bought Nex Machina.
No hyperbole or bullshit, Derelict Citadel is one of my favorite videogame levels of all time. Not saying the game is perfect on all fronts but the way that level brings together gameplay bliss, total isolation, oppressive personal tragedy (to be a bit pretentious), absolutely insane art and architecture and topped by the fucking soundtrack? Dude...
It's one of those games that feels like someone rummaged around in my brain and put together all the shit that gets me off in a way that I didn't know I wanted. Returnal is like Bloodborne for me that way and that level is just orgasmic.
I don't know how to reply to any of these posts because I genuinely don't see that. I think the game works beautifully as it is and I put over 200 hours into it with no real incentive just because I fucking love playing it. I view it as highly modern take on a 16 bit shooter or arcade game. I missed that pure moment-to-moment gameplay joy, over and over. I love that all these weird elements just coexist and that they didn't overthink it, it all just works for me.This.
I LOVE sci-fi and the game represents EXACTLY what i love about the genre - the sense of isolation, wonder, mystery, dread even, all wrapped up in an (almost) perfect package, add to that some amazing music and sounds and...
Esthetics/art-direction wise is perfect man, the towers in the distance, the piles of xeno bodies rounded up in rooms, the magnificent statues, the dark and gloomy atmosphere...it's what sci-fi exists for (OK it also leans into horror territory but it's mostly sci-fi).
Which is why, for the 3rd time in here, I'll have to mention that IMO, this would have worked so much better as normal, linear game.
I previously said that I thought that it'd have worked better as a tough, souls-like shmup, but, upon 2nd thought, I'd have loved it even more if it took the action-adventure route where you're exploring biomes, finding hints, translating text, platforming etc etc, in fact, I'd go as far as to say that the action actually gets in the way of this weird, beautiful and atmospheric built /realized world, I don't care about "surviving" waves of randomized enemies, I just want to bathe in the game's atmosphere and learn more about the xenos and Selene.
Remember Scorn ? on one hand, the fact that it was mostly a 3D adventure game sucked, on the other hand, you could just immerse yourself in the game's atmosphere and take it all in since there was no pressure of dying.
Mediocre game gameplay wise but very memorable, I still have the game's imagery burnt into my retinas, and that ending...