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Rottenwatch: AVATAR (82%)

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Solo said:
Grace got kicked out because of the mercs killing people, not because her work was a failure.
I didn't say it was directly because of her own actions that she got kicked out, but she did get kicked out, regardless of fact that she was interacting with them in Navi form, supposedly engendering more trust towards her.

And as far as her work being a failure, it was. She wasn't simply supposed to be a scientist, she was supposed to be a diplomatic envoy between the two peoples. Before Jake arrived, who wasn't her pick, diplomatic relations had broken down, from all indications.
 
stuburns said:
They were just going to fix his spine, the 'get your legs back' thing is not literal.

Just read an interesting thing about the amp suits, originally they did have mounted guns, and were controlled by a similar linking system than Avatars.
It's a shame they changed it. The last fight is silly and heavy handed as a result.
 
stuburns said:
It's said Grace's job is to find a diplomatic solution to the humans need for unobtanium, that's her 'mission statement' as far as the movie goes. I get the sense she didn't care about that, and just wanted to study the moon, but that was why she was allowed to do it anyway.
I can't really tell if that was a repurposing of her team or the entire reason for her team, though.

*shrug*
 
kaching said:
And as far as her work being a failure, it was. She wasn't simply supposed to be a scientist, she was supposed to be a diplomatic envoy between the two peoples. Before Jake arrived, who wasn't her pick, diplomatic relations had broken down, from all indications.


It was a diplomatic failure yes.
But her work would have paid off had the battle went the other way.

Did you forget the intel that Jake received due to being a Na'vi in Avatar form?
 
stuburns said:
They were just going to fix his spine, the 'get your legs back' thing is not literal.

Just read an interesting thing about the amp suits, originally they did have mounted guns, and were controlled by a similar linking system than Avatars.

Oops, I knew I shouldn't have typed it since I figured I missed something.
 
I see a lot of people wondering about the design of the AMP suits. Here's what the wiki says about their functionality:

The Amplified Mobility Platform (or “AMP” Suit) is a distant descendant of the first military exoskeletons used on Earth in the mid 21st century. It was improved during military service in a myriad of combat theaters– from arctic to jungle to desert– over the decades. Sealed and pressurized models for toxic environments were developed as well. The suit is used extensively on the Moon and Mars colonies (where they are powered by fuel cells and/or monopropellant ceramic turbines). Its well-tested capabilities have proved invaluable in the deadly environment of Pandora.

The human-operated walking machine magnifies the strength and mobility of a soldier or civilian worker while providing protection from military and environmental threats. Unlike fanciful designs in which weapons were integrated into limbs, the AMP suit is a multi-purpose machine, able to duplicate all functions of the infantry soldier. Since soldiers spend much of their time loading and unloading, and performing other tasks besides operating weapons, it was determined that the AMP suit needed the same functionality as a human: two legs, two arms, and highly dexterous hands. This allows not only a wide range of functions, but allows the suit to operate a variety of weapons systems.

The servo-actuated limbs instantly respond to the driver's hand and leg movements inside the sealed cab, greatly magnifying the driver's strength.

The operator’s arms move servo armatures and the suit’s arms follow in perfect synchronization. Because of limited space inside the cockpit, the servo armatures move in a 1:2 ratio relative to the suit’s arms. It requires many hours of training for an AMP suit driver to become agile and dexterous, with the biggest difficulty being this scaled ratio of movement. The legs are actuated by foot-pedals which amplify on an even larger ratio. In fact the leg sensors work slightly differently than the arms. Due to the confining spatial envelope around the feet and legs of the operator, the pedals cannot move in long strides, even on a scaled relationship. Instead, they sense the force and direction of the input and the onboard computer triggers a corresponding programmed movement of the legs. So the operator creates pressure and direction “cues” which trigger leg movements. The suit executes the “intention” of the pilot, calculating terrain factors and momentum to perform balanced movement.

The arms on the other hand, operate in a directly scaled relationship to the operator’s arms, which allows better spatial positioning of the hands. The fingers and thumb are in direct 1:1 ratio. The servo armature has force feedback, and resists the movement of the operator’s arms when the suit’s limbs meet an obstacle. The operator can “feel” what the suit is doing. It is said that the suit can be operated in full darkness, by a skilled driver, by “feel” alone.

Using the suit, a driver is able to punch through a tree trunk, lift a half ton cargo crate, or rapidly build prefab units without a construction crew. Its cannon obliterates anything in its targeting sights with a rain of armor-piercing rounds, at a 250 round per minute cyclic rate of fire.

Regarding weaponry:

Unlike more exotic designs in which weapons were integrated into limbs, the AMP suit is a multi- purpose machine, able to mimic all the abilities of the infantry soldier.This allows a wide range of functions, including the ability to operate a variety of weapons systems.

The suit's weapons are even more lethal than its raw strength. It is heavily armored, and armed with a huge hip-fired GAU-90 30mm autocannon, as a rifle.

The other non-standard weapon is a combat knife of self- sharpening diamond-hard ceramic. To match the scale of the suit, the blade is over three feet long and cuts through many metals.

I dunno, the design seems well thought to me as something that would be feasible in the real world. That's how Cameron has always done things.
 
Yes! Will finally get to see this in 1 hour since last two times the theaters have all been packed. Real3D here!
 
Ferrio said:
I'm curious how they reproduce.
Again from the wiki: (such a nice resource)
The Na'vi are monogamous creatures who mate for life. The mechanics of reproduction in Na'vi are similar to that of humans and other Terran mammals. But their unique physiology provides the Na'vi with a level of intimacy unknown to Earthborne creatures.

Cultural anthropologists believe that when an appropriate mate has been selected (which can take many years), the male and female Na'vi will connect queues to create an emotional bond that lasts a lifetime. The intertwining of queues is both highly erotic and profoundly spiritual, but does not in itself lead to reproduction.

It is possible after a male Na'vi tames a Banshee (Na'vi name: Ikran) they are able to mate.
 
Can someone explain to me why IMAX 3d is so much better than a regular digital 3d theater? Besides the obvious of course. I've seen this in 3D at the IMAX already, but I want to see it again and bring some people. Will the 3d experience be roughly the same in a regular digital 3d theater?
 
Combine said:
I see a lot of people wondering about the design of the AMP suits. Here's what the wiki says about their functionality:



I dunno, the design seems well thought to me as something that would be feasible in the real world. That's how Cameron has always done things.
I love how they descibe mounted weaponry as "fanciful". :lol

At least they admit the rifle has to be hip fired.
 
Leatherface said:
Can someone explain to me why IMAX 3d is so much better than a regular digital 3d theater? Besides the obvious of course. I've seen this in 3D at the IMAX already, but I want to see it again and bring some people. Will the 3d experience be roughly the same in a regular digital 3d theater?
The 3D is obviously still spectacular, but it's a lot less impressive, especially from the back, which is where you will probably be if the theaters are anywhere near as packed as they were when I went. It can get really distracting when a 3D arm floats in from offscreen or something and it's well inside your field of vision.
 
According to the pandorapedia page the avatar program didn't start out with Navi control. It was human to human test in the beginning. The RDA found out two humans could communicate mentally. Its not specified how exactly. This was before they went to Pandora so development of mind transfer had already begun. When they found the navi they were originally communicating human to navi but it wasn't working so they decided to see if the mental link would work with other species.


it took years(no specific amount) of testing on brain wiped primates and criminals and dissecting of navi to perfect the link. the link will work with human twins, human to animals with similar DNA structure, and Human to Navi. Interesting fact: Navi don't have DNA or RNA.

They use psionic amplification and custom reception nodes grown in the avatar's brain to control the body for up to 10 km.
 
I'm gonna see it again together with a friend who hasn't seen it yet. I just need to experience the world of Pandora once more before the movie leaves the theaters, even though the RealD 3D version costs obscene amounts of money to see here in Sweden (150 SEK, which is about $20, though that includes taxes).
 
Sharp said:
The 3D is obviously still spectacular, but it's a lot less impressive, especially from the back, which is where you will probably be if the theaters are anywhere near as packed as they were when I went. It can get really distracting when a 3D arm floats in from offscreen or something and it's well inside your field of vision.
This is why I need to see it again, I sat too far back because we got to the theater late and it was really dark. We could have easily gotten better seats had the lights been on. It was like a window, not as immersive as it could have been.
 
Just about 3 hours until my second viewing!

kaching said:
And as far as her work being a failure, it was. She wasn't simply supposed to be a scientist, she was supposed to be a diplomatic envoy between the two peoples.

I see this as the failure of the company in selecting Grace, and not the failure of Grace herself. Grace obviously had no interest in unobtanium, the company's bottom line, or any of that. She is interested in scientific study. The company should have appointed someone more suitable if they were looking for someone to bridge the gap between Navi and humans.
 
RoadHazard said:
I'm gonna see it again together with a friend who hasn't seen it yet. I just need to experience the world of Pandora once more before the movie leaves the theaters, even though the RealD 3D version costs obscene amounts of money to see here in Sweden (150 SEK, which is about $20, though that includes taxes).

What cities have Real3D? Does that include Real3D glasses?
 
Pctx said:
Not that I know of. It's either reel projector vs. DLP. There's a big difference.

All film is "HD". Thats why 2001 and Blade Runner can be given 4K remastering treatment and come out looking spectacular.
 
Pctx said:
Not that I know of. It's either reel projector vs. DLP. There's a big difference.
They're both high definition, depending on the res of the DLP it's often QuadHD, and 35mm rains the pain on 1080p.
 
CassidyIzABeast said:
According to the pandorapedia page the avatar program didn't start out with Navi control. It was human to human test in the beginning. The RDA found out two humans could communicate mentally. Its not specified how exactly. This was before they went to Pandora so development of mind transfer had already begun. When they found the navi they were originally communicating human to navi but it wasn't working so they decided to see if the mental link would work with other species.


it took years(no specific amount) of testing on brain wiped primates and criminals and dissecting of navi to perfect the link. the link will work with human twins, human to animals with similar DNA structure, and Human to Navi. Interesting fact: Navi don't have DNA or RNA.

They use psionic amplification and custom reception nodes grown in the avatar's brain to control the body for up to 10 km.

That's interesting...
 
Manager said:
What cities have Real3D? Does that include Real3D glasses?

Stockholm, Gothenburg (that's where I live and saw the movie), Malmö, Uppsala, Umeå and Piteå.

Yes, of course that includes RealD glasses. What else would you use...? This is what they looked like:

2uj72ud.gif
 
Solo said:
Indeed it is. As far as Im concerned, it, not 3D, is the future.
How far in the future are you talking about? Next ten years sure, really long term future, I think 3D is a more likely direction.
 
`Avatar' creator Cameron shares alien shop talk (AP) (dunno how old the quotes are, but the article is just an hour old)
LOS ANGELES - James Cameron offers what may be the most exotic planet full of aliens ever put on film in his sci-fi epic "Avatar."

Yet if and when humans do meet creatures from other worlds, they'll be unimaginably more far-out than anything Hollywood can dream up, Cameron said.

"It'll be much beyond what we can imagine," said Cameron, whose "Avatar" opened big this weekend with $232 million worldwide. "There are creatures right on Earth that are absolutely amazing, and all the aliens are already here, if you look at a small-enough scale or you look under the ocean."


"Avatar" tells the story of a human, Jake Sully (Sam Worthington), who takes on the form of the Na'vi, 10-foot-tall blue creatures that are the dominant species on the distant moon Pandora. Jake goes native, becoming a warrior in a Na'vi clan and falling for Na'vi huntress Neytiri (Zoe Saldana).

With pointed ears, huge eyes and tails, the Na'vi are anything but human. Yet like most extraterrestrials created by Hollywood, they still have a general humanoid form — two eyes, ears, arms and legs, a nose and mouth, smiles, grimaces and facial expressions we all can recognize.

"We looked at designs for the Na'vi that initially were much more alien," Cameron said. "When we would draw Neytiri and she had fins on her back and gills and all kinds of weird protuberances and so on in odd places, the question was, well, would you want to do her? No? OK, let's back off from that. ... We just didn't want to take it so far that she had kind of a fish mouth or anything."

Along with blue skin and tails, the alienness of the Na'vi was conveyed largely through differences in scale. They tower over humans but have delicate proportions, thin frames and limbs, but eyes about twice as wide as ours.

Still, the Na'vi look human enough that audiences can relate to them the way they relate to other characters on screen. Cameron has an explanation for why the Pandora natives bear similarities to humans, which he plans to share down the road.

"We were doing a science fantasy, not true science fiction. We're not really predicting that there will be humanoids" on other planets, Cameron said. "When I write the novel of `Avatar,' which I'm going to do as soon as the dust clears on the film release, I'm going to deal with the issue of why they look so much like us. Because there needs to be an overarching explanation of that, which I have."


"Avatar" presents a wild ecosystem in which the Na'vi commune with other animals and even plant life by tendrils that form a mental link. Pandora features giant plants that suck themselves into the ground when threatened, six-legged beasts of burden called direhorses, flying reptilian banshees and tiny jellyfish-like spores that float about the jungle landscape.

A seasoned diver with a passion for the life aquatic, Cameron explored the rich diversity of deep-ocean species in his documentary "Aliens of the Deep."

Cameron and his design team borrowed ideas from some of the most striking species on our world to augment the fantastic look of the lifeforms on Pandora — bioluminescent dot patterns on the skin of the Na'vi or elaborate designs inspired by tropical fish and frogs on the hides of the banshees.

"I wanted there to be a real exoticism. It was what I had sort of hoped they would do in `Jurassic Park,' not make dinosaurs just kind of like we imagine dinosaurs, but make dinosaurs the way they might have been, which is like purple and gold. Because there are some lizards and amphibians and fish on this planet, granted on a smaller scale, that are absolutely stunning in their color patterns.

"So maybe it's just an overall kind of reverence and sense of wonder for nature and its inventiveness, and that really imbued every decision we made in terms of the creature design."


What's alien also comes down to who's doing the talking. In Cameron's "Aliens," the story was told from the perspective of Sigourney Weaver as she joins human Marines in a death match with savage alien predators.

Weaver battled hostile otherworldly monsters in four "Alien" movies, but this time, the tables are turned. Cameron reunites with Weaver on "Avatar," casting her as a scientist whose fellow humans wage war on the Na'vi to obtain an energy-rich mineral found on Pandora.

The term alien is used only a few times in "Avatar," in each case among Jake and the Na'vi referring to the humans, including Weaver's character.

"To me," Cameron said, "the irony is that she's in another kind of high-tech, futuristic, humans-vs.-aliens story, and she's the alien this time."
The Avatar novel should be pretty interesting then. I imagine it will fill up all the back-stories that could not have been shown on film
 
Finally watched it in RealD but then I lost my glasses during the break and I had to watch the last half without them. Fuck, I'm pissed so much!
 
35mm film prints that are used to project movies at your local cinema have less resolution than a movie projected on a 2k DLP movie theater.
 
Combine said:
`Avatar' creator Cameron shares alien shop talk (AP) (dunno how old the quotes are, but the article is just an hour old)
Cameron wants me to want Neytiri? Sick fuck...



Job well done Sir
 
Brimstone said:
35mm film prints that are used to project movies at your local cinema have less resolution than a movie projected on a 2k DLP movie theater.

Eh....the 35mm showing I went to of Basterds looked a hell of a lot sharper than Avatar in RealD.

2k is crap.
 
i think that the blu-ray will be a directors cut, with "plot holes" etc. explained... cameron couldnt do the movie any longer for now.

films like terminator salvation or the like deserve all the shit they got- but this movie is good, peroid. stop trying to be all "cool" about hating it...

stuburns said:
I'm sure some people will know this sort of thing here, I really couldn't even guess. But is it likely Fox would fork out the rendering costs for Cameron to have the material left out rendered just for a home release? Typically a directors cut/extended edition is restoring material that was shot, yeah it needs mastering etc, but the price for that is very cheap compared to what would be needed here.

lord of the rings? troy? watchmen?

all of them had expensive scenes cut for theater... with lots of cgi
this will be no different... and if someone gets the money to do it its cameron
... at least i hope so. i love good directors cuts

edit: i also think that cameron and his cutting crew might had hours of perfectly fine material to work with... and ended up with 2 and a half hours of it for now
 
I'm sure some people will know this sort of thing here, I really couldn't even guess. But is it likely Fox would fork out the rendering costs for Cameron to have the material left out rendered just for a home release? Typically a directors cut/extended edition is restoring material that was shot, yeah it needs mastering etc, but the price for that is very cheap compared to what would be needed here.
 
stuburns said:
I'm sure some people will know this sort of thing here, I really couldn't even guess. But is it likely Fox would fork out the rendering costs for Cameron to have the material left out rendered just for a home release? Typically a directors cut/extended edition is restoring material that was shot, yeah it needs mastering etc, but the price for that is very cheap compared to what would be needed here.

If it means milking the multiple home-format releases, I don't think Fox would mind.

For some reason, I think there is a film that did this, but I can't recall which one. Any ideas? Chronicles of Riddick, maybe?
 
Tyrant_Onion said:
Finally watched it in RealD but then I lost my glasses during the break and I had to watch the last half without them. Fuck, I'm pissed so much!

:lol

Damn that sucks.
 
Combine said:
"We looked at designs for the Na'vi that initially were much more alien," Cameron said. "When we would draw Neytiri and she had fins on her back and gills and all kinds of weird protuberances and so on in odd places, the question was, well, would you want to do her? No? OK, let's back off from that. ... We just didn't want to take it so far that she had kind of a fish mouth or anything."
So I am not the only one that was thinking this while watching the movie was I?
 
stuburns said:
I'm sure some people will know this sort of thing here, I really couldn't even guess. But is it likely Fox would fork out the rendering costs for Cameron to have the material left out rendered just for a home release? Typically a directors cut/extended edition is restoring material that was shot, yeah it needs mastering etc, but the price for that is very cheap compared to what would be needed here.
That's what I've been wondering too. I know Cameron has said there were final rendered scenes (I think only 10 minutes though) that were simply cut from the film. But there are probably many other scenes (especially since one article noted the movie was 40 minutes shorter than it was supposed to be) that didn't get the proper rendered treatment (though were probably filmed with his camera), and yeah, those would cost a lot of money to render. I'm guessing it will depend on how well the movie does. Thankfully early signs point to a very solid performance so hopefully FOX will be kind to spend some money.
 
stuburns said:
I'm sure some people will know this sort of thing here, I really couldn't even guess. But is it likely Fox would fork out the rendering costs for Cameron to have the material left out rendered just for a home release? Typically a directors cut/extended edition is restoring material that was shot, yeah it needs mastering etc, but the price for that is very cheap compared to what would be needed here.

I cant see that happening, even for Cameron. To get those extra 40 minutes up to the level of the rest of the film could cost $50M-$100M (just throwing a number out there - I have no idea). Doesnt seem like the kind of investment any studio is interested in for a home video release, regardless of how big the movie is.
 
ShinAmano said:
So I am not the only one that was thinking this while watching the movie was I?
zoe_saldana_3.jpg


Solo said:
I cant see that happening, even for Cameron. To get those extra 40 minutes up to the level of the rest of the film could cost $50M-$100M (just throwing a number out there - I have no idea). Doesnt seem like the kind of investment any studio is interested in for a home video release, regardless of how big the movie is.
Given the nature of the 3D, and the lack of compelling content in the coming year, maybe they could justify it by rereleasing the film. I have no idea though, I'd say $50m doesn't seem insane for the project, although I would have thought less than that, but who knows if you can justify that.
 
stuburns said:
zoe_saldana_3.jpg



Given the nature of the 3D, and the lack of compelling content in the coming year, maybe they could justify it by rereleasing the film. I have no idea though, I'd say $50m doesn't seem insane for the project, although I would have thought less than that, but who knows if you can justify that.

They could render some of the footage and re-release it in theatres a few months before Avatar 2 hits maybe.

Also, Zoe = yummy
 
sankt-Antonio said:
i was constantly searching for nippels, and was so sad by the fact that weavers avatar had a shirt on.... :D
Neytiri's were frequently visible, though never in a really gratuitous way.

Not that I was watching them closely or anything.
 
GhaleonEB said:
Neytiri's were frequently visible, though never in a really gratuitous way.

Not that I was watching them closely or anything.
Jokes aside, they're actually distracting in the scene where they met and she knocks him to the ground, every cut to Jake on the floor is featuring a pounced blue nipple.
 
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