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[zoukka]

I logged in for the first time in SO LONG just to call you out on this.
The WHOLE POINT humans are on Pandora is to mine the mineral that has STRANGE PROPERTIES, the result of which is that things FLOAT, presumably which can be used on Earth for a variety of things (hence valuable enough to travel to Alpha Centauri to obtain).
The rocks were "floating" because they were very light because they contain this mineral + vines.

If you didn't understand this, you probably weren't paying attention at all. They make sure its very very understandable (e.g. the corporate guying fiddling with the floating shard of it).

I am disgusted, I can see why someone might dislike aspects of the movie and could make a reasoned argument, but you sir, and just a plain hater.

Just disgusted.

Haha yeah who was doozing in the theater again? The little scrap of whatevernium was floating because it was in a fucking floater. The big tree was supposed to lie in top of the biggest chunk of that material. Did the area have anything floating around?

*logs out for another 6 months*

Thank god.

I think Pandora, and the Na'vi are so similar to Earth and humans because they are meant to represent us. In the film the bad guys are these super over the top, single focus, blind by greed people, I don't think they're meant to represent what humanity would become, I think they're just the worst aspects of society amplified. Where as the Na'vi are the best elements of humanity amplified. Pandora isn't so dissimilar to an ocean bed without an ocean at times.

I really don't agree. The humans in the movie were so clearly this b&w representation of America. I got strong native american vibes from the top brass of Navi. Pocahontas pretty much. I mean it's pretty clear what the movies message was. "We are bad, we are destroying earth, learn something from the primitive tribes mkay".



I find that it's really hard for me to get impressed with CGI nowadays. Probably because it's everywhere and the animated characters tend to have this universal feel to them and the way they express themselves. Like strong theatrics. I love gollum though and probably because he was so heavily dependant of the real life actor Serkis. I watch LotR movies regularly and the effects haven't really aged too much. Sure the lighting especially looks bland when compared to Avatar, but I'd say LotR will most definately stand the test of time better than Avatar.

 

[nib95]

Watched it a second time at the IMAX yesterday. Again, absolutely loved it. Did feel overly drawn out in one segment.

Spoiler

After Home Tree gets destroyed

. But besides that one lul period, everything else was as riveting as it was the first time. I just want to be a Na'vi, and live on Pandora. The movie gives you this sense of beauty and freedom that is just lacking in other adventure/fantasy films. But it's not just the aesthetics of the world that draw you in, but everything else with in it too. The appreciation for the tribes and everything they stand for, how everything is interlinked spiritually and biologically with the planet and the creatures that live there. All goes a long way. Will watch a third time, this time on a 2D Digital screen.

 

[cory]

I find that it's really hard for me to get impressed with CGI nowadays. Probably because it's everywhere and the animated characters tend to have this universal feel to them and the way they express themselves. Like strong theatrics. I love gollum though and probably because he was so heavily dependant of the real life actor Serkis. I watch LotR movies regularly and the effects haven't really aged too much. Sure the lighting especially looks bland when compared to Avatar, but I'd say LotR will most definately stand the test of time better than Avatar.

What. The facial expressions and movements of the Na'vi and Avatars were the best I've ever seen.

 

[StuBurns]

I find that it's really hard for me to get impressed with CGI nowadays. Probably because it's everywhere and the animated characters tend to have this universal feel to them and the way they express themselves. Like strong theatrics. I love gollum though and probably because he was so heavily dependant of the real life actor Serkis. I watch LotR movies regularly and the effects haven't really aged too much. Sure the lighting especially looks bland when compared to Avatar, but I'd say LotR will most definately stand the test of time better than Avatar.

I think the LotR films are utterly mediocre and already look pretty bad in places, so we should just agree to disagree I think.

 

[nib95]

What. The facial expressions and movements of the Na'vi and Avatar's were the best I've ever seen.

Same. When watching the movie again, there's this immensely powerful scene

Spoiler

just after Home Tree gets destroyed, and there's this haunting hum of a choir slowly chanting whilst destruction is being shown all around in slow motion. This scene on it's own was not enough to pull at the old anger and sorrow emotion, but as soon as it cuts to Jake, he makes the smallest little clench of his teeth, but not an obvious one at all. In-fact, you can almost miss it. This tiny emotion was enough to build the rage inside me lol

. But there are many examples in Avatar where the facial expressions are just beyond sublime. The most subtle nuisances of the face are detailed to give you a sense of depth to the characters that just doesn't exist in ANY other CG model. Golem and Davy Jones included. Another example is when

Spoiler

Nytiri is talking about the fact that Jake now needs to find a mate. As she turns away, the main indication of her sadness is the way her muscles pout up above her top lip in the way they often do in people about to cry. Such attention to detail, it's just phenomenal.

 

[duckroll]

It's pretty funny how Avatar has turned around. Just a few months ago, most of us weren't on the same side! :lol

 

[catchabad0ne]

I think you two are on the same page, just disagreeing on the quality of the story itself. I get the sense that you do appreciate and understand the technical marvel, just that the tech should be used to support a story worth telling, and you don't think this is, but Sculli does.

I have to agree with Sculli, I think the story is fine, a more abstract story might not have even been green lite. I greatly look forward to whatever happens next on Pandora.

It doesn't have to be abstract, or even original. I enjoy plenty of movies that do nothing original. Again my main gripe I think, and it is probably my fault for misinterpreting the hype or what James Cameron was saying in the run up to the release, but I was under the impression that the story had something to do with justifying the tech, and that the tech was necessary to truly tell this story and realize his vision for the film. But again, I did not follow really anything other than bits and pieces overheard here and there. I had no personal investment or attachment to the movie and had very low expectations. I never even saw the trailer or a commercial for the damn thing before watching it today.

I didn't really know what the plot was before going in other than that this guy takes over an alien body on some distant planet.

Shit that would have been good enough for me, make it an hour and a half with some snappy dialog and some cool explosions, but leave out the heavy-handed "we need to save the earth, indigenous people are better" BS and the movie would have been an enjoyable experience. Or if he is gonna leave that in, at least have some subtlety somehow. The movie was an hour too long for the story it told, the characters were mostly bland even though the acting was good enough, and the 3D annoyed the piss out of me.

I'm glad people enjoyed it, again the tech is impressive. I'd love to see a movie with an inspired script go toe-to-toe with the inspired technology.

 

[Timbuktu]

What. The facial expressions and movements of the Na'vi and Avatars were the best I've ever seen.

It might be another case of 'best CGI character' vs' best CGI character'.

 

[shintoki]

It's pretty funny how Avatar has turned around. Just a few months ago, most of us weren't on the same side! :lol

Being fair...the first images(even details!) we got was from the Ubisoft conference where James Cameron spoiled the plot, talked about how revolutionary it would be, and spent 20 something more odd minutes doing nothing....All at a game show. Where nothing was actually shown once more about the movie. We had to wait another few months. :lol

You'd have to be insane or Sculli to be hype after that.

 

[zoukka]

What. The facial expressions and movements of the Na'vi and Avatars were the best I've ever seen.

I was speaking generally about CGI movies. Navis were nicely animated, but there's a shitload of things to still improve.

I think the LotR films are utterly mediocre and already look pretty bad in places...

Well that cleared many things for me, thanks.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

It's pretty funny how Avatar has turned around. Just a few months ago, most of us weren't on the same side! :lol

I stand by my skepticism prior to seeing the film. The trailer did nothing for me at the time, nor did any of the released media I was exposed to.

I have no qualms about admitting that something I thought would fail actually blew me away, because that's usually one of the best experiences possible. Avatar is one of those glorious cases.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

It's pretty funny how Avatar has turned around. Just a few months ago, most of us weren't on the same side! :lol

But then everything became different. You fell in love.

 

[NG28]

I went into this movie with normal expectations and left extremely satisfied. Usually while watching movies I pay close attention to the music, but after watching Avatar I realized I couldn't remember any of it. It was so visually attention grabbing I didn't pay attention to the music at all.

 

[JonnyBrad]

Saw it last night - normal 3d not IMAX. I thought the effects were awesome and about as seemless as i've ever seen. No one seemed to be "floating" as you get with a lot of CGI.

However the plot was pretty much throw away - from the first instant when the

Spoiler

Marines are taking the piss out of him being a cripple

we know that its going to be black and white good and evil from then on. I wish there had been more middle ground but oh well. Its not gonna be a film i will watch again - well maybe once to see what the blu ray looks like. I also thought it was too long. It seemed like the

Spoiler

death of Weavers character

was only put in to facilitate him becoming a Na'vi at the end. And we could have done without that 15 minutes.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

COME GIT SARRRM! :lol That guy says it twice in the movie. I swear it almost felt like Cameron hated that same character in movies of recent years and just wanted to set him up to be trampled on.

 

[VisionaryQuest0]

Looks good but I doubt it will beat The Abyss as my favorite James Cameron film.

That's a quote from me back in October. I'm proud to say that Avatar has now become my favorite James Cameron film.

Can't believe how amazing and breathtaking this movie was. Every bit of hype that was being thrown around by Cameron himself these past few years have been completely met. I already can't wait to take in another showing.

And seriously, I never thought I'd end up having a crush on Neytiri by the end of the movie.

 

[StuBurns]

That's a quote from me back in October. I'm proud to say that Avatar has now become my favorite James Cameron film.

Can't believe how amazing and breathtaking this movie was. Every bit of hype that was being thrown around by Cameron himself these past few years have been completely met. I already can't wait to take in another showing.

And seriously, I never thought I'd end up having a crush on Neytiri by the end of the movie.

The Abyss was your favorite? wow

Avatar is my favorite Cameron film at the moment, but I can't be sure it has the staying power to remain there, it could, Cameron's use of CG hasn't really dated in any of his other films. I actually think the Abyss is the only one that's really dated poorly, but that's more story than anything else, I just watched it yesterday and it looks great.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

I just pray that if Cameron does Battle Angel, he doesn't use Horner for it. Hell, if he pulled Brad Fiedel out of retirement I would be happy, but otherwise (out of his previous collaborators) there is nothing wrong with Silvestri!

Silvestri could have done an awesome score for AVATAR, though I get the feeling Cameron used Horner to woo back the ladies.

 

[duckroll]

I just pray that if Cameron does Battle Angel, he doesn't use Horner for it. Hell, if he pulled Brad Fiedel out of retirement I would be happy, but otherwise (out of his previous collaborators) there is nothing wrong with Silvestri!

Silvestri could have done an awesome score for AVATAR, though I get the feeling Cameron used Horner to woo back the ladies.

I just pray that if Cameron does Battle Angel, it stays as a R, instead of being dumbed down to PG-13.

 

[VisionaryQuest0]

The Abyss was your favorite? wow

Avatar is my favorite Cameron film at the moment, but I can't be sure it has the staying power to remain there, it could, Cameron's use of CG hasn't really dated in any of his other films. I actually think the Abyss is the only one that's really dated poorly, but that's more story than anything else, I just watched it yesterday and it looks great.

The story is very very dated for sure, but it is still thoroughly entertaining and still the one Cameron flick I can pop in anytime and not get tired of for some reason. The characters and story still pulls me in. Avatar, I can tell, will be the same for me years down the line.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

I just pray that if Cameron does Battle Angel, it stays as a R, instead of being dumbed down to PG-13.

Yeah, I've said for a long time that this is the main reason I want AVATAR to do well, so that he can bargain with FOX on Battle Angel's rating, despite it being a $200m project. Sort of a 'I'll direct the sequel if you let me have final cut on BA'.

 

[duckroll]

Yeah, I've said for a long time that this is the main reason I want AVATAR to do well, so that he can bargain with FOX on Battle Angel's rating, despite it being a $200m project. Sort of a 'I'll direct the sequel if you let me have final cut on BA'.

Yeah, because honestly, if he can't get the R rating approved, he might as well not do it. No point wasting his time on what will have to be a compromised half-ass adaptation. He could focus his energy on other things in that case.

 

[D23]

God damn it.

I've already seen this movie twice and I want to see it again.

same here! i want to see it in real imax 3d this time

 

[near]

Got to watch Avatar again yesterday. It's definitely even more enjoyable the second time round, really really fun. The first time I watched it I was overwhelmed with the amount of adventure I had to take in, this time, it's a case of getting the opportunity to appreciate all the components that make this a masterpiece. The foundation to the film itself is rather simple, but it's that touch of Cameron that makes this quite a treat. Extraordinary amount of detail packed into this film, and I'm sure it'll take a few more views and glimpses to notice new things. There is just so much going on the screen at any given time, it's impressive. I tip my hat to 'King of the World' James Cameron and Weta Digital for delivering what has to be one of the most enjoyable movies of my time.

 

[Maxwell House]

And it bothered me to death that they rambled about the dangers of Pandora for ages, and yet it felt more empty and sterile than your typical forest? I mean Jacksons King Kong had a way more intimidating jungle areas going on than Avatar. I thought Pandora looked lovely and very welcoming aside from the few mandatory threat scenes.

Completely agree. The military in the beginning made Pandora sound like an absolute hell-hole, a place no one could survive more than 5 minutes in. The reality was WAY tamer than that.

 

[nib95]

Completely agree. The military in the beginning made Pandora sound like an absolute hell-hole, a place no one could survive more than 5 minutes in. The reality was WAY tamer than that.

That's because the military are loud and as Neytiri put it "ignorant" to the ways of the jungle. "Like a baby". When Jake was like that, he did indeed run in to risk countless times and nearly die a few times more. But with Neytiri, it's different. She lives there, knows the ways of the jungle, what is safe what isn't, where to go or where not to, how to be etc. Aside from when they run in to Taruk, around Neytiri, Jake is generally safe. Makes perfect sense if you ask if. It is after all the Na'vi's jungle.

 

[GalacticAE]

Visually, I was impressed. It was a fun movie to watch. But the story didn't really interest me. I'd probably be down to see it again if someone paid for me.

My glasses got a little smudged and it annoyed me throughout the whole movie too. I couldn't clean them no matter how much I scrubbed.

 

[duckroll]

Honestly, I think Pandora is a pretty deadly place for humans. Which parts of the movie featured normal humans taking a walk around in Pandora and not facing any danger whatsoever? The point is that as a Navi, even in an avatar form, it is much easier to move around and survive the environment - firstly because of their size, and secondly because of the way the environment reacts with native lifeforms.

 

[∀ Narayan]

James Horner needs to quit composing music for anything. Save for -- like, three tracks, I didn't enjoy this film's score at all.

 

[Maxwell House]

Saw it last night - normal 3d not IMAX. I thought the effects were awesome and about as seemless as i've ever seen. No one seemed to be "floating" as you get with a lot of CGI.

However the plot was pretty much throw away - from the first instant when the

Spoiler

Marines are taking the piss out of him being a cripple

we know that its going to be black and white good and evil from then on. I wish there had been more middle ground but oh well. Its not gonna be a film i will watch again - well maybe once to see what the blu ray looks like. I also thought it was too long. It seemed like the

Spoiler

death of Weavers character

was only put in to facilitate him becoming a Na'vi at the end. And we could have done without that 15 minutes.

Agreed. The storyline was sooo cheesy and unoriginial. I also thought the whole alien race was cheesy with their native american war screams, etc. Seriously, the shit was stupid.

Comparing this movie to good Sci-Fi like Aliens and the Abyss is like night and day. I came away very disappointed.

 

[zoukka]

How did the Graces team survive so easily in Pandora before? They had no danger until Jake went on to piss off the rhino guy. They showed one menacing bug in the whole movie. The pack of wolfhybrids were dealt with a sharp stick and a torch. Sure there were some dangers like in any natural enviroment, but the immense hype by the mercenaries made me expect a total death trap, where every animal wanted to peel off your skin.

Honestly, I think Pandora is a pretty deadly place for humans.

Same could be said of Amazon or any jungle/great forest.

 

[sasimirobot]

I've seen it three times now, and the last time I sat in the perfect place.... the 3D was so smooth and had so much depth, its mind numbing.

Im sure this has been stated many times already but where is the perfect place? I am going to see it again in Dolby 3-D it that makes a difference.

 

[near]

Honestly, I think Pandora is a pretty deadly place for humans. Which parts of the movie featured normal humans taking a walk around in Pandora and not facing any danger whatsoever? The point is that as a Navi, even in an avatar form, it is much easier to move around and survive the environment - firstly because of their size, and secondly because of the way the environment reacts with native lifeforms.

They wouldn't of been able to take a walk through Pandora even if the atmosphere and wildlife permitted so, because they still would have to of encountered a very resistant Navi at some point.

 

[nib95]

How did the Graces team survive so easily in Pandora before? They had no danger until Jake went on to piss off the rhino guy. They showed one menacing bug in the whole movie. The pack of wolfhybrids were dealt with a sharp stick and a torch. Sure there were some dangers like in any natural enviroment, but the immense hype by the mercenaries made me expect a total death trap, where every animal wanted to peel off your skin.

The same marines who said the Na'vi were monkeys and savages? People tend to demonise, villainise or criticize what they do not understand or fear. I think the whole point was that with Neytiti guiding Jake, we got to see the other side of Pandora, that the marines did not understand and appreciate. The one that wasn't about danger and death, but beauty, depth and spirituality.

I'd imagine Pandora is just like our own tropical jungles (which are also quite/very dangerous). The difference being that everything is bigger. I.e bigger poisonous creatures, carnivorous beasts and so forth.

 

[Conrad Link]

Really enjoyed it! Going to go see it again.

One thing I wanted to see happen though, his original dragon thing come back! I said to my GF oh it would have been perfect when he fell of the helicopter thing near the end for his original dragon to swoop in and save him or something.

I know it probably doesn't work like that, but still would have been cool.

 

[duckroll]

How did the Graces team survive so easily in Pandora before? They had no danger until Jake went on to piss off the rhino guy. They showed one menacing bug in the whole movie. The pack of wolfhybrids were dealt with a sharp stick and a torch. Sure there were some dangers like in any natural enviroment, but the immense hype by the mercenaries made me expect a total death trap, where every animal wanted to peel off your skin.

I think you're missing my point. I'm saying that to a Navi (this includes avatars), it is EXACTLY like a normal rain forest. It's not -that- deadly. But to a normal human soldier or worker, who are mostly the people he was talking do during the security brief, it IS insanely dangerous. You have to take into account that the Navi are like twice the size of a regular human. Which means everything we see them ride/fight/interact with in the movie is significantly bigger than a human. Considering the banshees can take down gunships, and the mechs can be overrun by any of the wildlife, I would say that's pretty deadly.

 

[Maxwell House]

Yeah, I've said for a long time that this is the main reason I want AVATAR to do well, so that he can bargain with FOX on Battle Angel's rating, despite it being a $200m project. Sort of a 'I'll direct the sequel if you let me have final cut on BA'.

On the other hand, if Avatar does make a crapload of money (which it is sure to do), FOX can point to it being PG-13 as one of the reasons it was able to rake in so much money, making greenlighting an R rating on Cameron's next film even more difficult.

 

[Zaptruder]

Honestly, I think Pandora is a pretty deadly place for humans. Which parts of the movie featured normal humans taking a walk around in Pandora and not facing any danger whatsoever? The point is that as a Navi, even in an avatar form, it is much easier to move around and survive the environment - firstly because of their size, and secondly because of the way the environment reacts with native lifeforms.

Seriously... the black 'dogs' that attack Jake in avatar form... they're actually a pack of aggressive and ravenous panther sized creatures.

When was the last time panthers grouped up like a pack of hyenas trying to rip something to shreds? NEVER!

Plus the entire atmosphere is unsuitable for human breathing, so it's not exactly like visiting your friendly wildlife park.

 

[Zaptruder]

On the other hand, if Avatar does make a crapload of money (which it is sure to do), FOX can point to it being PG-13 as one of the reasons it was able to rake in so much money, making greenlighting an R rating on Cameron's next film even more difficult.

What? Is Cameron a Fox exclusive director? He's got the upper hand here.

 

[Solo]

Fucking hell. It is uncanny. Frighteningly so. It's to the point where it's frankly insulting for people to bring up Davy Jones.

It really is. The bar has been raised.

I almost agree. I adore that scene and it's one of my favorites, but my single favorite one is when Neytiri herself first flies the Banshee. Beautiful music, and that wild, grinning look on her face, stunning. Davy Jones and the prawns couldn't emote like that if their lives depended on it.

Both are fantastic scenes. No one has done flying before in such a satisfying way.

How the hell did Cameron convince the CGI team to

Spoiler

render out the entire final battle. Holy fuck, that must've taken months if not years to complete with Pandora in the background and all the other CG effects going on.There were dozens of Scorpions and a Dragon, and there were HUNDREDS of Banshees fully rendered out and not simply pasted.

Magic.

Its the most impressive action scene that I have ever witnessed.

 

[Solo]

Solo or anyone, when you were watching the second time, did you notice the awesome music during the scenes where

Spoiler

Jake is revealing the interior structure of the Home Tree to Quaritch.

Really great fucking tune that I can't find anywhere on the soundtrack which is a shame.

I dont recall it. Sadly I cannot think about the music without thinking about the "War" butchering :lol

Oh yeah. James Cameron is Canadian.
Another reason I love Canadians.

I am Canadian. Love me.

The more I think about Avatar, the more I grow to like it even more. It's a really strange feeling, but Cameron must have perfected the concept of a visual drug. I'm not sure if I really want to watch it again for the third time so soon, but I think I might make some time after the new year to watch it one more time. It's a really well crafted movie, and for some reason, the longer I'm away from Pandora, the more I think about the little things that were there throughout the movie. The different areas, the different plants and animals, how they all relate together both in practical natural purpose, and in awesome art direction. So good.

If it gets even better with the third viewing, that may be too much awesome to handle. Its already the best theatrical experience ever.

 

[Tricky I Shadow]

It's pretty funny how Avatar has turned around. Just a few months ago, most of us weren't on the same side! :lol

I'm proud to have been a believer from when I saw the teaser. I mean come on people, its James freaking Cameron!

 

[Solo]

I was always onboard the Avatar train. Only thing I ever doubted was the box office, and Ive gladly eaten crow on that one. Movie deserves every cent it makes.

Random thought: if the Fox execs are right and the movie somehow does make as much the second weekend (I dont believe that is even remotely possible; Im calling a 30% drop), suddenly $400M isnt out of the question.

 

[Zaptruder]

I'm proud to have been a believer from when I saw the teaser. I mean come on people, its James freaking Cameron!

I think the real magic of the film is that the more time you spend with it (in most cases anyway) the more you grow to love it.

If only hollywood made these types of epic action blockbusters in a TV series format instead.

 

[roxya]

I think you're missing my point. I'm saying that to a Navi (this includes avatars), it is EXACTLY like a normal rain forest. It's not -that- deadly. But to a normal human soldier or worker, who are mostly the people he was talking do during the security brief, it IS insanely dangerous. You have to take into account that the Navi are like twice the size of a regular human. Which means everything we see them ride/fight/interact with in the movie is significantly bigger than a human. Considering the banshees can take down gunships, and the mechs can be overrun by any of the wildlife, I would say that's pretty deadly.

Indeed. The thing that chased Jake... it's like a fucking dinosaur. HUGE.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

I'm proud to have been a believer from when I saw the teaser. I mean come on people, its James freaking Cameron!

Only from when you saw the teaser? You will never be one of the people!

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

A lot of people talking about how safe Pandora seemed to be are forgetting that when they first go into the Jungle, its under Grace's guidance. She has been in the jungle and learnt what to do and what not to do within it.

 

[DieNgamers]

James Horner needs to quit composing music for anything. Save for -- like, three tracks, I didn't enjoy this film's score at all.

I did, however I found his score for Apocalypto pretty much perfect for the jungle setting. No real memorable themes but still very fitting with the flutes and stuff. I thought he would go for something similar in Avatar but I still liked it.

 

[Tricky I Shadow]

I'm proud to have been a believer from when I saw the teaser. I mean come on people, its James freaking Cameron!

Only from when you saw the teaser? You will never be one of the people!

I was waiting for you to post something like that...glad you didn't disappoint me! :lol

 

[Solo]

Only from when you saw the teaser? You will never be one of the people!

Speaking of this quote, one minor thing that I loved that I dont think anyone has touched on is how well the subtitles were handled in 3D.