bgassassin
Member
People also didn't know what was in Wii dev kits at that time.
Rumor: Xbox 3 = 6-core CPU, 2GB of DDR3 Main RAM, 2 AMD GPUs w/ Unknown VRAM, At CES
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People also didn't know what was in Wii dev kits at that time.
Astounding.
higherARC05
Banned
HALO 5 will make me fap forever.
I will save this post when it finally shows on Next-XBOX to repost.
I will save this post when it finally shows on Next-XBOX to repost.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
Because with double the RAM and a modern (read: 2007 or later) video card you could take literally anything the PS3 could do on its best day and do it better. Demos aside, it's impossible for the system to be inferior to the dated hardware in our current boxes even based on the limited specs that have leaked. I cannot understand people who, in any way shape or form, could logically conclude that the Wii U is incapable of reproducing anything we've seen on the PS3 or 360.
Again, Darksiders and the other games weren't so much "hey, look how much better our shit is" announcements as much as they were, "hey, there are actually going to be M-rated 3rd party HD games on the next Nintendo console."
bgassassin
Member
What? We (as in posters) already have a very good idea what is in Wii U's kit. No one really knew what was going on with Wii before launch.
You on the other hand are using some very, very weak evidence as proof of your stance.
bgassassin
Member
Wii U speculation is like an amoeba. 
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
I don't even know what to say about this comment. You're actually arguing that the Wii U may be LESS powerful than current gen hardware? WTF?
Thunder Monkey
Banned
You're right.
This thing sounds like it will have quite a bit of power. Even with the naysayers. It should easily produce prettier games than it's next closest competitor. But I'm pretty sure I've already argued that earlier in the thread. Unified 2 gigs of some modern blazing fast RAM (because of already argued constraints) and even a 2011 derivative GPU is going to produce games of much higher quality than the prior consoles.
I don't see the differences being so stark. If only because the tech possible limits them.
It was quite crazy when like a year before launch the Red Steel guys expected performance to be like a mainstream AMD processor that was popular at that time. Nintendo actually told third parties just to use GameCube's in tandem with the new controller. At E3 2006 pretty much everything was running on GameCube's with this setup actually.
bgassassin
Member
Xbox Ten:
4-6 core CPU @ 3.5Ghz
2GB of GDDR5
1000-1300 ALUs on the GPU @ 800+Mhz
4-6 core CPU @ 3.5Ghz
2GB of GDDR5
1000-1300 ALUs on the GPU @ 800+Mhz
Proelite
Member
4 core OOE ppus @ 4.0 GHZ
20 SPEs @ 4.0 GHZ
64 mb Edram on CPU
4GB Unified XDR2 System Ram
2500 ALUs at 1.0 GHZ
bgassassin
Member
ROFL! What in the world are you cooling that with and how much is that going to cost?
Proelite
Member
Liquid cooling.
bgassassin
Member
Well it's too outrageous, so I know you're joking.
higherARC05
Banned
I will take a sh*t immediately after Microsoft confirms specs like this for their next XBOX. Pooping in pure joy.
Saw this, agreed and thought to myself "holy shit what a monster this could be."
Saw this and thought "wat."
bgassassin
Member
^ I definitely think that would be a very good console that could be manufactured at an affordable cost to MS.
LOL. I'm sure their CPU will be solid, but I think Cell in any form is dead for console gaming. I see MS going after the OoO CPU they wanted for 360.
I still currently expect the GPU to use GCN compute units. The range I gave is approx. 16-20 compute units.
I think 2GB is adequate for memory and I don't know what they might do with the HDD, though I could see it having a 500GB HDD at launch.
LOL. I'm sure their CPU will be solid, but I think Cell in any form is dead for console gaming. I see MS going after the OoO CPU they wanted for 360.
I still currently expect the GPU to use GCN compute units. The range I gave is approx. 16-20 compute units.
I think 2GB is adequate for memory and I don't know what they might do with the HDD, though I could see it having a 500GB HDD at launch.
I don't think there's anything stopping the Cell from using an OoO main core(s); in fact, the original specifications allowed for anything from the PPU that was used to an x86. I think the main distinguishing feature of the Cell is the SPUs with directly accessible local stores (as opposed to a cache).
bgassassin
Member
I don't see anything stopping that from happening either. I still believe though that Cell as we know it is dead for consoles. MS using OoO cores would mean it's not using the PPE as we currently know it. And I think Sony has (hopefully) learned their lesson about development difficulty and will leave SPEs alone for a more "traditional" CPU they can put money into.
Aizu_Itsuko
Member
I think this whole conversation is out of place in this thread when there's already an official Wii U thread, but this bit you just posted is simply not true.
You have to understand that it was rather easy showing something in the old 2D days, but now companies unveil their next gen systems way before the hardware or the software are finished, meaning most of the time all they can show is either tech demos, (outsourced) unachievable target renders or underwhelming unfinished games.
That holds true for Nintendo too; don't make me google and show you some stuff they showed in the past.
Even MS, that unveiled the 360 just a few months before it was released, had to show plenty of concept videos, tech demos and yes, underwhelming unfinished games back at the beginning of this gen.
And Sony were launching a year later so what could they show other than tech demos/concept vids.
Digital-Hero
Member
Microsoft doesn't need a giant HDD. I'm sure they will do it exactly like they did last time and make larger sizes (if they do that proprietary stuff again.) That would allow them to have low costs on that end and force the consumer to upgrade later.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
You forgot the Zelda factor.
Any time they show a Zelda tech demo it is summarily eclipsed by the actual game. GCN Zelda demo versus Twilight Princess. Sure the GCN demo has a lot more polies than the TP model, but the TP model still looks a hell of a lot better.
Aizu_Itsuko
Member
Also, I don't know why are people doubting Nintendo's next console is going to be more powerful than the current HD twins.
Based on the rumored specs the Wii U should be 2-3 times faster hardware and overall just plain better than 360/PS3, even if it's closer to them than it is to MS/Sony's next gen systems.
And now let's stop derailing this thread.
Anyway, many tech demos shown over the years by different companies have been surpassed by actual games overall (even though tech demos usually have the advantage of being like cutscenes and therefore being more dramatic).
In other cases, like GC's Metroid concept art or the infamous Killzone vid (and many many others), the actual game looks far less detailed.
Based on the rumored specs the Wii U should be 2-3 times faster hardware and overall just plain better than 360/PS3, even if it's closer to them than it is to MS/Sony's next gen systems.
And now let's stop derailing this thread.
You are confusing art with actual detail.
Anyway, many tech demos shown over the years by different companies have been surpassed by actual games overall (even though tech demos usually have the advantage of being like cutscenes and therefore being more dramatic).
In other cases, like GC's Metroid concept art or the infamous Killzone vid (and many many others), the actual game looks far less detailed.
You mean the studio that was a big supporter of the Wii?
The developer that understands Nintendo's consoles architecture inside and out?
Sorry, but I take whatever they say with a grain of salt.
Aizu_Itsuko
Member
DBZ time!
Grampa Simpson
Banned
The base unit of the Xbox 720 will have no spinning discs. It will be entirely solid state with an expansion port on the bottom. That expansion port connects to a bay station with - you guessed it - a hard drive and an optical drive. This will be $150 more in the retail package, but will sell for $200 separately. Instead of including spinning disks with their system, MS will include 16 gigs of flash. This will necessitate the occasional cleaning of the fridge for those too cheap to spring for the Pro unit, but will save MS money on those who are only interested in downloading COD once a year. It will also make it a more attractive competitor to the Roku.
You heard it here first.
You heard it here first.
So you think Microsoft will be distributing 20-30GB games entirely digitally?
TheExecutive
Member
Heat is no longer an issue in the future!
Grampa Simpson
Banned
They'll also sell them on discs.
higherARC05
Banned
Clouds my friend clouds
Chuck Norris
Banned
Sho_Nuff82
Member
No optical drive + only 16GB storage included? What is this, the PSP Go?
An optical drive is probably the cheapest component in the console, why would they bother to rip it out? $200 for an HDD?
We all know Goku (Xbox 720) is holding back full power (SSJ3)
...yeah
Man, if I were an industry insider that had access to reliable knowledge of all 3 future consoles, I'd TOTALLY tease people by talking in DBZ terms rather than actual specs. Would that be a violation of NDAs?
2-3 times isn't huge. Plus look at uncharted 3 compared with uc1. Won't it take Nintendo teams some time to get used to the new tech and really leverage it? Ms/sony have had a generation of getting up to speed
Grampa Simpson
Banned
A blu-ray drive is a $50 to $60 part (remember, these are often sold as loss leaders):
http://www.newegg.com/Store/SubCategory.aspx?SubCategory=598&name=Blu-Ray-Drives
and a 500 gig laptop hard drive (this is a reasonable assumption for what would be included) is rather variable at the moment but bottoms out at $54, but that's the abberation on this particular list - once again sold often as a loss leader:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...E&N=100007605 600030594&IsNodeId=1&name=500GB
Same pattern holds if we go to desktop hard drives at 500 gig:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...603 600003274 600003290&IsNodeId=1&name=500GB
Even assuming that hard drive prices flatten back to their prices 6 months ago, we're still talking about $110-$120 in parts, not including about $10 in minor incidentals. $150 would be a low margin sale of the combined parts + distribution + retailer markup.
Has MS ever been known for their low-margin accessory pricing?
Aizu_Itsuko
Member
2-3 isn't a traditional generational leap but it's still big, something along the lines of GC>Wii or bigger.
Of course both MS and Sony will have more powerful next gen machines and multiplatform titles will have to be scaled down on the Wii U but I don't think the average Wii owner will complain. Well, I guess Nintendo enthusiasts would be happier if it was on par with the other two (or better) and Nintendo fans will downplay any difference, but at least Wii U's architecture is modern enough to get multiplatform titles, even if they aren't as good. That's a big step over the Wii.
As for getting used to the hardware, Nintendo doesn't seem to be so out of touch with current tech as you may think (you can already tell with their demos) and they are pretty talented so I don't think they'll have much trouble adjusting.
And no matter what, they'll get plenty of ports from 360/PS3/PC and from next gen systems when they are released, so the Wii U will benefit from all the industry has learnt during the last few years.
Eliciel
Member
x D
seriously only 4 GB ? You serious? I think 16GB of XDR2 is much more realistic in this case
There's a lot more to HD development than a superficial demo of a single scene that only allows the player to control the camera angle.
I love Nintendo, but the idea that they can ignore HD game development for so long, then hop on board at the 11th hour and just "get it" is a slap in the face to all the devs who spent the last 7-10 years building up their resources and experience, as well as to all the other Japanese devs who have stumbled all gen learning.
I think it's going to be very similar to their situation with online. They'll probably have to call in some outside help to get their teams up to speed.
It's going to be a very interesting gen for Nintendo.
What is R&D?
Also,
completely obliterates anything that come out in 2005-2006. Nintendo's probably been keeping up with the tech and practicing since before the Wii even launched.
Well, sure, if you assume that they've been ignoring it, you'd have a good point. However, a company doesn't survive as long as Nintendo has by completely ignoring the world around them. Maybe they aren't quite at the level other companies are at, but there's no way that they're 6 years behind.
The same goes for Sony and MS, who I'm sure have been watching PC development closely and won't end up with all of their games looking worse than BF3 at launch.
Yes and no. It's true that Nintendo teams don't have experience shipping a game with current-gen production. However, the tools for building a current-gen game are far more mature today than they were in 2004/2005. So Nintendo won't have to go through the same challenges that everyone else had.
What is R&D?
Also,
completely obliterates anything that come out in 2005-2006. Nintendo's probably been keeping up with the tech and practicing since before the Wii even launched.
It's worth mentioning that this is not a game. Even if it's rendered in real time on actual WiiU hardware, it's still a tech demo.
History has shown that all Zelda tech demos look worse than the game we get. So if that is the worse version I am fine with that lol
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