"Save Our SIFTD"
- Thread starter Gigarator
- Start date
JSoup
Banned
So, just sifting through this thread and poking around the SIFTD site, I'm not really sure what it is that they are offering. Like, they are a news aggregate? If that's it, there are several, several, several already around that seem to do it better. Like the one I'm posting on right now.
Living the Dream
Member
The service as what it is, is just plain dumb. Who the hell would pay for this? Literally a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.
snail_maze
Member
A news aggregator doesn't sound so bad, especially if it woud add non-gaming aspects too, would be covenient on the go. It should also be free and advertising supported though.
I don't see how or why original content is mixed in with the news aggregator. That's like a very different idea and must take up a lot of time, effort and money. I don't know how many people are interested in both of these aspects of the site, so strange that they were combined together
I don't see how or why original content is mixed in with the news aggregator. That's like a very different idea and must take up a lot of time, effort and money. I don't know how many people are interested in both of these aspects of the site, so strange that they were combined together
ClosingADoor
Member
So he's selling $5000 party tickets, of which half goes to charity. I mean... if that $8000 is rock bottom you need to break even, why are you giving half your top tiers to charity. That is kind of strange.
Devilgunman
Member
I'm really confused with the direction in which siftd is heading right now. From the sound of it, it started as a news curation site but then more focuses are being on exclusive shows to the point that the curation part of the website is just a bonus. If you want to focus on producing contents then maybe it's better to just shut everything down and launch YouTube channel like everyone else.
Whatever Shane has in his mind is clearly not sustainable and we're witnessing it slowly crashes and burns.
Edit: my curiosity led me to check siftd.net traffic on Alexa. Its bounce rate is currently at 76.6%. Goddamn....
Whatever Shane has in his mind is clearly not sustainable and we're witnessing it slowly crashes and burns.
Edit: my curiosity led me to check siftd.net traffic on Alexa. Its bounce rate is currently at 76.6%. Goddamn....
Shane posted on SIFTD that the 8000 goal is what they need minus what they already get from subscribers on the site... but the site encourages people to shift from SIFTD to Patreon if they want to give them more money. You'd assume a lot of the current patrons are people who were subbing to the site... so they'll likely need quite a bit more than the 8000 goal to keep things running. It's just discouraging.
What's generally a good bounce rate for regular sites? My one is 48% which is apparently down 9% but I have no idea what I should be aiming for.
ClosingADoor
Member
Totally depends on the market. A high bounce rate is not always bad, it can also mean people just found what they were looking for on your site and that's it.
Next to that, Alexa isn't really the most trustworthy source for these indications.
Bounce rate might be a bit flawed for siftd since it basically just load siftd's banner and comment section on top of the webpage being served.
That's probably a request from Pachter, since he is the main draw and the one giving away those tickets. Pachter is helping him out a lot and putting his name on the line a little when he gets nothing out of it (but exposure which he likes of course), so I think this is a fair deal.
Monkeyball
Banned
I have been following this thread for the drama and I still don't know what the website is exactly. Says it all.
My impression is that it's a space made entirely for gaming and media enthusiasts that feel left behind by newer news media and changes in how media is presented to it's audience. People who don't want to go on Reddit, Twitter, etc or the bigger sites like IGN, etc.
I guess it's also there for those interested in their particular personalities and for people interested in what they have to say about media.
It's a niche market but that's what a lot of people rely on, for me personally as someone who did visit Gametrailers it makes sense on the transition from that to this, but I feel it's an outdated concept that most people don't really require or at least aren't willing to pay for given the alternatives. But again I wish them no ill will and for the people who feel it works for them it's a good thing
Novel Mike
Member
Right but why doesn't he have any form of that (or a much more detailed) explanation on the Patreon itself. I just don't get it.
It crossed 3k but it needs a lot more patrons and I think one of the biggest problems Shane has had is just getting the word out about the site and what it is actually for. Like I know what the site does but I still don't know what SIFTD actually stands for and I'm assuming its meant to stand for something since its in all caps.
I still don't think Shane knows what the hell hes doing and hasn't since the beginning. I'm sure he thought he did after he had success in multiple different sites over the years but advertising alone he has massively failed and doesn't seem to recognize that which is why nothings changed with this site really. Sure you can throw a patreon out there because your desperate but when you continue to fuck even that up then I can't help but think he just doesn't have a good grasp of this.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
I think it says more about you than it does about SIFTD, no offense. I don't see what's so complicated to understand if you've been following this thread.
Maybe you should focus less on the drama :b
As you said, you know what the site does; its a link curator. So you dont have to see any other crap you dont want in your feed. The site sifts through all the crap for you. or sifted. Take out a vowel and put it in caps and you have how you name things on the internet haha.
I tried SIFTD for a couple months, thought it was a pretty good service actually. I just don't have the time to go to every media outlet out there and click around until I find what I'm looking for, so I guess it worked for me until I realized that the vast majority of ''Video Games Journalism'' is just, uh...really shit.
That Patreon tho...I dunno man... dropping all in one funding tier seems like a bad idea. Pachter would've been a perfect funding goal for example. Gotta entice people to drop some bucks you know... Maybe it would'v been better to go to ''Maintain Operations'' with incremental tiers, start with the least expensive content and go from there or something...
But I never checked out their produced content besides Pachter Factor, so no idea tbh. And I can't even keep up with the few patreons I already support...
That Patreon tho...I dunno man... dropping all in one funding tier seems like a bad idea. Pachter would've been a perfect funding goal for example. Gotta entice people to drop some bucks you know... Maybe it would'v been better to go to ''Maintain Operations'' with incremental tiers, start with the least expensive content and go from there or something...
But I never checked out their produced content besides Pachter Factor, so no idea tbh. And I can't even keep up with the few patreons I already support...
"Sifted" as in it sifts through the information for you. Weird that the .com is not owned since it is for sale. I think the problem is that the people who consume so much video game news that they need to be granular about already have the tools and browsing habits they are happy with. A forum like this and a few YouTube channels keep you covered. If you follow certain games closely, there is Twitch. The amount of dumbass non-gaming content posted on sites lately already made them inefficient to browse. The site idea makes sense, but it is ultimately offering an information consumption technique that people already evolved on their own. As for original content, lack of exposure to it could not have helped.
That is the other problem. A more efficient route to the manure farm is still just a trip to shitsville.
Chronospherics
Member
Why use this over N4G? What other gaming news aggregation sites do people use, out of curiosity?
Salty Hippo
Member
So is he going to put his non Pachter shows regurlarly on YT, with a delay? I don't see people embracing the "cause" if they're not hooked to the content. One free EP for each is not enough.
Novel Mike
Member
And now I know why I never knew... That name is stupid as hell.
Being all caps makes me think its really S.I.F.T.D. which is meant to actually mean something but nope, like you said caps because its the internet and REASONS.
Dear god at least give a clue on that with a tagline or something like 'We sift through media for you!' to at least clue anyone in on what the hell the name or the site is actually suppose to be. Hell call it Sifted, Sift'd something along those lines so it actually looks like a damn name instead of an acronym.
cantona222
Member
I never heard of SIFTD. However, I hope they recover.
GAF, and that's it.
Patrick Young
Member
The Michael Pachter tier! Now I'll give it a go.
I think if he'd started the Patreon while this thread was still blowing up and people on twitter were talking about this, the Patreon would have a good change of being at 8000 already
Also, I know I'm echoing other people at this point, but the biggest problem with the site is that it fixes a problem that either doesn't exist, or that people can't know they have. When I come here to look at the news, or browse trending topics tailored for me on twitter, or go to IGN or Kotaku, I see what's there. I don't lose sleep thinking "oh boy, am I missing part of the puzzle, here?" I simply take what's shown to me and move on. There's no way to see what I'm missing unless I see it. I know SIFTD is about that, but it's hard to find SIFTD because it's hard to realize you might be missing something you'd like.
outunderthestars
Banned
GAF.
Chronospherics
Member
GAF is good for discussion and whatnot but a lot of stuff just isn't posted here or only ends up being posted here after it's presented someplace else, and, it's variable what's at the top. It's not necessarily the hotest articles or news that's up there, so I use N4G which does exactly that (places the most clicked articles at the top of the feed).
Considering that $8000 was said to be the minimum they need to stay in business, I wonder what will happen to all that money.
I pretty much use Twitter as a gaming news aggregation tool and I've never felt the need to use an actual site for it. I just follow a bunch of gaming journos and a few major sites like Polygon and Game Informer and that's enough for me to keep track of everything that's going on. I don't think "hand-crafted" curation is really necessary, at least for me.
Yeah, that $8,000 minimum really rubs me the wrong way because Shane is getting $3500 regardless. If SIFTD shuts down is he just going to keep that money? I don't know why he's treating Patreon like Kickstarter.
LoveCake
Member
I don't know, doesn't the amount have to be reached the first month before anything is paid out? I really do not know.
I sub but on the main site, I have not gone to the Patreon, I don't think the minimum was high enough personally, it should have been the same $4.
The number of supporters compared to the amount pledged is nearly one to ten 331 / $3675 so there needs to be about 800 supporters on there?
No, that's the slightly shady part. By establishing a minimum, he's positioned Patreon as some sort of workaround Kickstarter. Patreon isn't designed to have a minimum amount like that (to my knowledge).
Blackage
Member
Yeah I dunno how they're gonna do it.
Easy Allies was 9 people and they started with the min goal of $4,000 a month I think? They had the benefit of running Gametrailers and made that shift to be more social media-like before GT went down, which helped them in the long run.
Jim Sterling again, had years to build up fan base through Destructoid and The Escapist, and love him or hate him he has a distinct personality that really stands out and meshes with Gamers and the Games Industry at large.
SIFTD has been locked behind a paywall for it's entire existence for anything that mattered. Shane and the Pachter Factor(Which was started on GT even) are the only recognizable things I know about SIFTD, and honestly I wouldn't be shocked if Pachter was a driving for behind the Patreon because it was one of the few things Shane was forced to keep outside of the paywall for all 75 episodes or whathave you.
Easy Allies was 9 people and they started with the min goal of $4,000 a month I think? They had the benefit of running Gametrailers and made that shift to be more social media-like before GT went down, which helped them in the long run.
Jim Sterling again, had years to build up fan base through Destructoid and The Escapist, and love him or hate him he has a distinct personality that really stands out and meshes with Gamers and the Games Industry at large.
SIFTD has been locked behind a paywall for it's entire existence for anything that mattered. Shane and the Pachter Factor(Which was started on GT even) are the only recognizable things I know about SIFTD, and honestly I wouldn't be shocked if Pachter was a driving for behind the Patreon because it was one of the few things Shane was forced to keep outside of the paywall for all 75 episodes or whathave you.
dickroach
Member
they didn't have a minimum. no patreon has a minimum.
some have stretch goals, yea, but "this is the bare minimum we need" is not a stretch goal
Immortal Technique
Member
He's not collecting it regardless.
Has he explicitly said that he'll cancel the patreon at the end of the month if it doesn't reach the $8000 goal? Because otherwise he'll get the money, unless Patreon has some kind of feature where it won't pay to a creator until a certain limit is reached (I've never heard of this).
I don't see anything on the SIFTD patreon explicitly saying he'll cancel the patreon if the first month total isn't $8000.
They get the money regardless. This isn't Kickstarter where its all or nothing.
dickroach
Member
"This is the rock bottom amount SIFTD needs per month to stay in business. At this level of funding SIFTD will be able to continue producing Pachter Factor, GameFace, GIFE, PlayView, Bad Dudes, Dossier, The Big Six, and SIFTD Hangouts (gameplay streams)."
the bare minimum is keeping the base site going and producing 8+ shows?
what the Patreon should have been is
- we're going to keep doing the content aggregation regardless, because that's apparently the main draw
- $2,000 / month and we'll produce [Show 1]
- $4,000 / month and we'll produce [Show 2]
- $6,000 / month and we'll produce [Show 3]
- $8,000 / month Pachter
etc...
you don't need $8k a month to run an aggregation website
the bare minimum is keeping the base site going and producing 8+ shows?
what the Patreon should have been is
- we're going to keep doing the content aggregation regardless, because that's apparently the main draw
- $2,000 / month and we'll produce [Show 1]
- $4,000 / month and we'll produce [Show 2]
- $6,000 / month and we'll produce [Show 3]
- $8,000 / month Pachter
etc...
you don't need $8k a month to run an aggregation website
Immortal Technique
Member
He has stated this on the SIFTD forums, yes.
Yeah, the paywall is the big issue. It's the correct move to pivot to the more open model with Patreon, but it's a shame that SIFTD doesn't have more time to build up a following and make it work. It's a big ask for people to decide they like it enough to support it financially in such a short timeframe. One would assume most of the current Patreon support is from the existing subs, and Pachter fans.
snail_maze
Member
So they still have the LA studio?
Novel Mike
Member
Just watched the EZA Pax west panel and Brandon pretty much just laid out everything Shane did wrong with this patreon.
"The most important thing in the beginning and this was an asset for us was to create a successful mission statement. basically make it clear to your audience who you are, what you are about and what you are going to be doing. Basically the mission of your patreon. If your patreon doesn't seem to have a mission it can drag or you don't get a sense of what they are doing. You may support them as a favor to them but you don't really get behind what they are doing."
Not word for word but I think you get the idea. Shane covers a little bit of this but I think most of the money he has gotten from this patreon is largely from people trying to do them a favor but most people don't get behind what they are doing. SIFTD's messaging couldn't be worse in this. What exactly is their mission statement? It's not to continue what they are doing because they won't be able to without reaching a relatively high goal so I guess its a desperate attempt to survive? Why would I or anyone else want to put money into that kind of patreon?
I hate to continue to be negative on this but hearing Brandon speak about it just made think about how poorly Shane's messaging has been for this site and the Patreon which is a shame because I'd hate to see him lose it all after all this work but I just don't know how he meets and maintains that 8k goal. It's possible he'll hit it this month but what about after that? What happens if it drops below that the following month?
There are just to many unanswered or impossible to answer questions about this move to Patreon.
"The most important thing in the beginning and this was an asset for us was to create a successful mission statement. basically make it clear to your audience who you are, what you are about and what you are going to be doing. Basically the mission of your patreon. If your patreon doesn't seem to have a mission it can drag or you don't get a sense of what they are doing. You may support them as a favor to them but you don't really get behind what they are doing."
Not word for word but I think you get the idea. Shane covers a little bit of this but I think most of the money he has gotten from this patreon is largely from people trying to do them a favor but most people don't get behind what they are doing. SIFTD's messaging couldn't be worse in this. What exactly is their mission statement? It's not to continue what they are doing because they won't be able to without reaching a relatively high goal so I guess its a desperate attempt to survive? Why would I or anyone else want to put money into that kind of patreon?
I hate to continue to be negative on this but hearing Brandon speak about it just made think about how poorly Shane's messaging has been for this site and the Patreon which is a shame because I'd hate to see him lose it all after all this work but I just don't know how he meets and maintains that 8k goal. It's possible he'll hit it this month but what about after that? What happens if it drops below that the following month?
There are just to many unanswered or impossible to answer questions about this move to Patreon.
Ben Morales
Member
I wish he'd just use the money he makes from the patreon this month to re-focus.
Drop the damn studio. Get a nice backdrop and film it from someone's house and use a nice mic if he doesn't have one already.
Push the aggregation to the back and focus on showing off your podcasts (and not just clips!). They should be front and center on the website. Aggregation can be a bonus that people can optionally explore.
Get past podcast episodes up on YouTube ASAP.
Don't cancel the freaking patreon because you didn't make your goal in one month. This is not Kickstarter! Make smaller stretch goals.
Drop the damn studio. Get a nice backdrop and film it from someone's house and use a nice mic if he doesn't have one already.
Push the aggregation to the back and focus on showing off your podcasts (and not just clips!). They should be front and center on the website. Aggregation can be a bonus that people can optionally explore.
Get past podcast episodes up on YouTube ASAP.
Don't cancel the freaking patreon because you didn't make your goal in one month. This is not Kickstarter! Make smaller stretch goals.
I think part of the problem is that all of the GameFace episodes (save for the one made to show it off in the Patreon) are behind a paywall. Having been a subscriber in the past, the show is great and extremely well produced. But making all of the content (save for Pachter Factor) behind a paywall won't entice new people to come to the site. I like Shane and I think he's made something really cool here, but he should just drop the curation aspect and focus on video production. He's amazing at it and he's wasting his talents on fixing a problem that doesn't need to be fixed. I really don't want Shane to fail here but it seems like the current state of affairs is rather bleak...
It's getting sadder and sadder to see him argue with people on the site who tell him to drop the office. But no matter what he won't budge on that. The guy is stubborn as I've ever seen. It took him forever to adopt the Patreon model but now it's too little too late.