• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Sega Saturn Appreciation and Emulation Thread

Karin does make SFA3 better than the previous versions and is great, but where's a non-handheld-or-CFE home Street Fighter game with Ingrid in it, already, Capcom?

Karin is my favorite character alongside Skullomania from EX.

Shame we didn't get the EX games on Saturn. Then again, I appear to be the only person who like the EX games.
EX2 released well after the Saturn was dead, but yeah, games like SF EX1 and Mega Man Legends not being on Saturn show how Capcom had little interest in releasing their 3d games on Saturn; the only two polygonal games Capcom released on Saturn were RE1 and Final Fight Revenge.
 

MikeMyers

Member
I believe that edion's site said Capcom was going to port Resident Evil 2 to the Saturn at one point, but was cancelled in favor of a Dreamcast version.

Also. It is true Nintendo's Shigeru Miyamoto praised NiGHTS? I've seen that alleged a lot, but the only sources I can find are Wiki's...which aren't exactly a credible source.
 
Karin is my favorite character alongside Skullomania from EX.

Shame we didn't get the EX games on Saturn. Then again, I appear to be the only person who like the EX games.

EX games aren't terrible. I still like the original characters a lot. Apparently some of them showed up in an arcade fighter called Fighting Layer which was never ported to anything.

Also, the soundtracks were great.
 
Also. It is true Nintendo's Shigeru Miyamoto praised NiGHTS? I've seen that alleged a lot, but the only sources I can find are Wiki's...which aren't exactly a credible source.
I distinctly recall it coming up in an interview with him. The phrasing was along the lines of "if there was one game made by somebody else that I wish I'd invented, it'd be NiGHTS".
 

Timu

Member
It's been ages since I played Street Fighter Alpha 2 and 3, but I think 2 might be better, not 100% sure as it's been over a decade since I last played them.
 

Trevelyon

Member
Think my Action Replay 2.01 pins are bent or my connectors are no good. doesn't seem to boot anymore no matter how much I clean either end.

I need JP Guardian Heroes in my life.
 

Timu

Member
Think my Action Replay 2.01 pins are bent or my connectors are no good. doesn't seem to boot anymore no matter how much I clean either end.

I need JP Guardian Heroes in my life.
Did you use disinfection wipes? Well, that sucks since you have to pay around 40 some bucks for a new one.
 
I believe that edion's site said Capcom was going to port Resident Evil 2 to the Saturn at one point, but was cancelled in favor of a Dreamcast version.
Yeah, I have heard that as well. That was after they passed over MML and SFEX, though.

And on a related note, what about DC versions of SFEX2 and SFEX3? Both released during the time Capcom was being a big DC supporter, after all. And yet SFEX was Sony-exclusive, and Megaman Legends mostly was (the PC and N64 ports of the first game excepted).
 

Coda

Member
I should probably post this in the official Dreamcast thread but since we're all on the topic of SFA 3, I never knew this existed. I wonder if it's any different other than the online component.

$_57.JPG
 

MikeMyers

Member
Yeah, I have heard that as well. That was after they passed over MML and SFEX, though.

And on a related note, what about DC versions of SFEX2 and SFEX3? Both released during the time Capcom was being a big DC supporter, after all. And yet SFEX was Sony-exclusive, and Megaman Legends mostly was (the PC and N64 ports of the first game excepted).
Don't know about Mega Man, but Sega did get SF3 as an exclusive. Maybe Capcom decided EX was for Sony and SF3 was for Sega, so neither system would suffer from a saturation?
 

Gyrian

Member
I've been enjoying my Framemeister with my Mega Drive so much that I never looked into hooking it up to anything else all this time.
That's about to change, finally ordered RGB cables for my Saturn!

To celebrate, I also grabbed a copy of Outrun and Salamander DX. I never looked much into arcade-perfect Saturn conversions, but there is an itch building... Any recommendations aside from all the fantastic stuff Capcom put out?
 
I've been enjoying my Framemeister with my Mega Drive so much that I never looked into hooking it up to anything else all this time.
That's about to change, finally ordered RGB cables for my Saturn!

To celebrate, I also grabbed a copy of Outrun and Salamander DX. I never looked much into arcade-perfect Saturn conversions, but there is an itch building... Any recommendations aside from all the fantastic stuff Capcom put out?

There are so many darn cool Arcade ports on Saturn! Sticking to the "reasonably-priced tier", I got mad love for Layer Section, Darius Gaiden, and Sokyugurentai.

Salamander DX is better on PS1. With Saturn you're stuck with either incorrect aspect ratio, or ugly non-integer scaling of the graphics.
 

jerry1594

Member
Don't know about Mega Man, but Sega did get SF3 as an exclusive. Maybe Capcom decided EX was for Sony and SF3 was for Sega, so neither system would suffer from a saturation?
PS1 can't handle cps3 games (it can, but they look and play poorly). Otherwise I don't think Capcom would've passed up putting it's not so successful flagship game on the Playstation.
 

oneida

Cock Strain, Lifetime Warranty
Tell me about Framemeister. if I have component cables for PS2, am I in business? how about VGA for dreamcast / model 3?
 

Bar81

Member
Tell me about Framemeister. if I have component cables for PS2, am I in business? how about VGA for dreamcast / model 3?

You just need a component to D-terminal adapter cable like here:

http://solarisjapan.com/collections/micomsoft/products/d-terminal-to-component-adapter-cable-female

For VGA you might try using something like this to convert to HDMI but no idea about the lag:

http://www.monoprice.com/Product?c_id=101&cp_id=10114&cs_id=1011404&p_id=6191&seq=1&format=2
 
I was playing Spider-Man: the Movie on my PS2 last night, and I have to admit, it scaled the 480p (or is it 480i?) signal to 720p better than I'd feared it would (given that 480 does not divide evenly into 720).

Also that game hasn't aged well, but that's another topic for another time.
 

Gyrian

Member
There are so many darn cool Arcade ports on Saturn! Sticking to the "reasonably-priced tier", I got mad love for Layer Section, Darius Gaiden, and Sokyugurentai.

Salamander DX is better on PS1. With Saturn you're stuck with either incorrect aspect ratio, or ugly non-integer scaling of the graphics.

Thanks! I'm going to keep my eyes peeled.
I am really finding a lot of love for these titles from the late 80s to early 90s, the vast majority are still brand new to me.

Disappointing to hear about Salamander, but I am not yet deterred! Hope it's not the same issue with the rest of Konami's catalog, though. I'm thinking of looking up one of the three Parodius (Parodii?).
 

MikeMyers

Member
Should I get X-Men Vs. SF or Alpha 2?

PS1 can't handle cps3 games (it can, but they look and play poorly). Otherwise I don't think Capcom would've passed up putting it's not so successful flagship game on the Playstation.
Yeah, that's true. Somewhat off-topic, but I always wondered why Capcom didn't put SF Alpha on N64, when Saturn and PSX did. Alpha 2 was on SNES, so I doubt they had burned bridges or something.
 

Coda

Member
Should I get X-Men Vs. SF or Alpha 2?


Yeah, that's true. Somewhat off-topic, but I always wondered why Capcom didn't put SF Alpha on N64, when Saturn and PSX did. Alpha 2 was on SNES, so I doubt they had burned bridges or something.

I think the fact that the Nintendo 64 controller is kinda bonkers for fighters and that the system as a whole had barely any fighters made it not a big contender for a lot of fighter ports, regardless of processing power. Plus Nintendo has always been about family fun and games for everyone and fighters just don't fit that bill. KI 2 was the only real good 2D 1v1 fighter on the system.
 
Yeah, that's true. Somewhat off-topic, but I always wondered why Capcom didn't put SF Alpha on N64, when Saturn and PSX did. Alpha 2 was on SNES, so I doubt they had burned bridges or something.
Yeah, I've said plenty of times how disappointing Capcom's refusal to support the N64 at all for years, and to release barely anything once they finally did support it, was. Alpha 2 for N64 instead of, or in addition to, the SNES, PS1, and Saturn versions in late '96 would have been fantastic! It'd be so great to have an actual good classic 2d fighter on the N64, it doesn't have any. And maybe the N64 could have gotten more 2d fighters after that too...

I'm sure an N64 version of Alpha 2 would have been very good. It's really, really sad that Nintendo almost totally lost Capcom that generation, I think they would have had some success had they released SF Alpha 2 on N64 in '96, released the N64 port of Mega Man Legends/64 MUCH earlier (such a basic port should never, ever have taken OVER THREE YEARS to release!), released more N64 games after that (N64 SF EX? That'd fit with the everything-needs-to-be-polygonal trend of the times, too), etc. I know that the N64 failed in Japan, but moves like Capcom's were a part of why. We know that Square left Nintendo because of wanting FMV, to get away from Nintendo's controlling ways, and maybe for less first-party competition and lower licensing fees too, and that after that the N64 was probably doomed in Japan, but still, I don't know about Capcom. SFA2 releasing on SNES but not N64 in late '96 really was kind of ridiculous.

I would actually rather use the N64 controller than the SNES controller for a 6-button fighting game.
Yeah, it has six face buttons, so it's got the better layout for sure.

I think the fact that the Nintendo 64 controller is kinda bonkers for fighters and that the system as a whole had barely any fighters made it not a big contender for a lot of fighter ports, regardless of processing power. Plus Nintendo has always been about family fun and games for everyone and fighters just don't fit that bill. KI 2 was the only real good 2D 1v1 fighter on the system.
You do know that Nintendo published KI Gold (and Goldeneye, and Conker), yes? And that in the West N64-era Nintendo saw the company's greatest success among adult 'core' console gamers, thanks to Goldeneye? Sure Nintendo has a family focus, but what you're saying here sound way too much like that old "Nintendo is kiddy" attack line which never has been true. Nintendo makes games for everyone.

As for why the system had no 2d fighters, well, the good 2d fighters came from Capcom and SNK, and both decided to pass on the N64 sadly. The Japanese fighting games the N64 did get are mostly 3d, Rakuga Kids (and SSB) excepted. The system did get Western fighting games, but after KI Gold and MKT in '96 there weren't many more for the N64 to miss out on, most had gone 3d. But that was the era, people expected most games to go 3d, 3d was what gamers wanted, and on a platform with higher licensing and production costs, publishers focused on the kinds of games that would be the most popular -- 3d games, not "lesser" 2d stuff.

Don't know about Mega Man, but Sega did get SF3 as an exclusive. Maybe Capcom decided EX was for Sony and SF3 was for Sega, so neither system would suffer from a saturation?
Maybe, but SF3 for DC released well after the first SFA. For EX2/3 though, they did have those on PS1/PS2, versus other stuff on Saturn -- TechRomancer, Plasma Sword, Project Justice, Spawn. Sony got the bigger-name franchise, but Project Justice is the best one of any of those games, so Sega did win in that respect at least. :)

PS1 can't handle cps3 games (it can, but they look and play poorly). Otherwise I don't think Capcom would've passed up putting it's not so successful flagship game on the Playstation.
Well, they did do that PS1 version of Jojo's Bizarre Adventure... why that and not SF3?
 
Yeah, I've said plenty of times how disappointing Capcom's refusal to support the N64 at all for years, and to release barely anything once they finally did support it, was. Alpha 2 for N64 instead of, or in addition to, the SNES, PS1, and Saturn versions in late '96 would have been fantastic! It'd be so great to have an actual good classic 2d fighter on the N64, it doesn't have any. And maybe the N64 could have gotten more 2d fighters after that too...

I'm sure an N64 version of Alpha 2 would have been very good. It's really, really sad that Nintendo almost totally lost Capcom that generation, I think they would have had some success had they released SF Alpha 2 on N64 in '96, released the N64 port of Mega Man Legends/64 MUCH earlier (such a basic port should never, ever have taken OVER THREE YEARS to release!), released more N64 games after that (N64 SF EX? That'd fit with the everything-needs-to-be-polygonal trend of the times, too), etc. I know that the N64 failed in Japan, but moves like Capcom's were a part of why. We know that Square left Nintendo because of wanting FMV, to get away from Nintendo's controlling ways, and maybe for less first-party competition and lower licensing fees too, and that after that the N64 was probably doomed in Japan, but still, I don't know about Capcom. SFA2 releasing on SNES but not N64 in late '96 really was kind of ridiculous.
Remember that Nintendo's unfair and harsh policies on ordering cartridges and the pricing of them probably sent a lot of developers running to Sega and Sony's cheap CD options.

RE2 and the cancelled RE:0 on N64 seem most likely to be Nintendo persuading Capcom with some financially good terms or exclusive paid deal, rather than Capcom just suddenly feeling like they wanted to release on the N64. Imo.
 
Remember that Nintendo's unfair and harsh policies on ordering cartridges and the pricing of them probably sent a lot of developers running to Sega and Sony's cheap CD options.
Those policies weren't really unfair on the N64 though, they mostly just reflected the reality that carts are different from CDs. You can't just make a cart in a small run like you can a CD game; minimum orders are by necessity large, and production costs much higher than for disc games. The N64 did have higher licensing fees than the Saturn, which was in turn more expensive to release for than the PS1, but higher production costs and pre-purchasing the number of carts you need are necessities of Masked ROM cartridges. Nintendo had had unfair practices back on the NES, but by the N64 they had changed. Sure though, we do know that for Namco and Square at least one reason they left was because of built-up frustration over Nintendo policies. I don't remember ever hearing details of why Capcom left specifically, though, but it's probably because of the usual combination of factors I mentioned. Nintendo's problem was that they couldn't make the N64 popular enough in Japan on their own to convince third parties to support it well thanks to Sony's surprising success.

On that note, I would say that Sony benefited from that MUCH more than Sega for sure. I mean, the Saturn did get a lot of games, and Capcom supported it well with 2d games, and the system had like twice or more the number of total releases that the N64 got, but many of the biggest-name titles, and most of the sales, were only on the PS1. Just having discs wasn't enough, you need more than just that. Sony had that, while Sega only managed that in Japan and even there only for a few years before it faded because of the onslaught of great PS1 games, RPGs particularly. SNES and NES restrictions hadn't sent most developers "running" over to the Turbo CD and Sega CD, for example! People will put up with restrictions if it benefits them overall. In the US Nintendo had enough success that some major third parties were convinced that supporting the N64 with high-quality titles was a good idea, but in Japan that didn't happen (RPGs being one major reason why I would think), sadly.

RE2 and the cancelled RE:0 on N64 seem most likely to be Nintendo persuading Capcom with some financially good terms or exclusive paid deal, rather than Capcom just suddenly feeling like they wanted to release on the N64. Imo.
Nintendo doesn't do that kind of thing, never has. Nintendo does not pay for exclusives or or ports or such to the best of my knowledge, ever. Also, N64 RE2 was Capcom's second N64 game -- remember that Mickey's Magical Tetris released the year before it, and i doubt Nintendo had anything to do with that one. Searches also find rumors of the N64 version of Mega Man Legends (64) first appearing years before its final release, and RE0 N64 was probably something like either because of interest at Capcom, or the positive reception to N64 RE2.

However, do remember that main development for the N64 version of RE2 was done by Angel Studios, a member of the original N64 "Dream Team" and a studio that also did work for NOA -- the two N64 Ken Griffey Jr. baseball games. So it's entirely probable that NOA helped push for the game. I very highly doubt that there was any kind of financial element to it though, that'd be a VERY un-Nintendo kind of thing to do. Nintendo has always refused to do that kind of thing even when it hurts them.
 

thomasos

Member
Nintendo doesn't do that kind of thing, never has. Nintendo does not pay for exclusives or or ports or such to the best of my knowledge, ever. Also, N64 RE2 was Capcom's second N64 game -- remember that Mickey's Magical Tetris released the year before it, and i doubt Nintendo had anything to do with that one. Searches also find rumors of the N64 version of Mega Man Legends (64) first appearing years before its final release, and RE0 N64 was probably something like either because of interest at Capcom, or the positive reception to N64 RE2.

However, do remember that main development for the N64 version of RE2 was done by Angel Studios, a member of the original N64 "Dream Team" and a studio that also did work for NOA -- the two N64 Ken Griffey Jr. baseball games. So it's entirely probable that NOA helped push for the game. I very highly doubt that there was any kind of financial element to it though, that'd be a VERY un-Nintendo kind of thing to do. Nintendo has always refused to do that kind of thing even when it hurts them.

That's really not true. Remember Q Fund, for example?
 
That's really not true. Remember Q Fund, for example?

Wasn't that meant for original titles Nintendo often published and such though, not ports of multiplatform games?

But sure, yes, you are right that Nintendo does pay developers for games, usually games which Nintendo then publishes. But they don't pay for the kinds of things Sony and MS pay for -- they won't pay a third party to release a version of a game on their console, they won't pay for exclusive DLC or "first on Xbox!" or what have you, etc. Based on Nintendo's track record, I'd be very surprised if they paid Capcom anything for them to make the N64 version of RE2. But they may well have had a hand in connecting Angel Studios and Capcom, given that they were working with the team themselves on other games, perhaps. Or maybe not -- this classic N64 RE2 postmortem from an Angel Studios dev makes no mention of Nintendo involvement for example: http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/131556/postmortem_angel_studios_.php?page=1

More than likely it's the Saturn itself, the cart readers are very finicky with age.

Specifically, the Saturn's cartridge port is the one poorly-built part of the console, and will fail with use. It's best to just plug an Action Replay cart in and leave it there, removing and plugging in carts causes wear a bit like that which kills original-model NES systems' cartridge connectors.
 
I have a tiny little CRT still around in my closet for the express purposes of PS1/SAT lightgun games. Just need to pick up a Stunner really.

So I'm in the market for a new Saturn now since the drive door on mine is kinda fucked up, and the discs don't read (or spin, for that matter) anymore. I had accidentally dropped a book on it (Don't ask), and it hasn't been the same, since.

It was a Model 1 Saturn, so is it worth just seeking out a Model 2 this time around? I'm more worried about compatibility issues more than anything else. (I know OutRun has issues on Model 2's though I was never aware if that was limited to JP models or not.)
 
Top Bottom