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[bigtroyjon]

Isn't this move by the NPD going to start lending some more credibility to that other sales site? Publishers already pull "data" from that website. I would suspect it will get stronger now that NPD is on lock down.

That site lost all their credibility a few years back when they were a million off on Wii sales one December, then stubbornly argued that NPD was wrong and they were right. Nintendo's next quarterly report came out and that certain cite all of sudden had to adjust their numbers by a million units( roughly 50 percent.)

NPD get's millions of dollars in revenue a year for their data, if people actually thought that other site was even remotely credible, NPD wouldn't have a business.

 

[PSGames]

"Nintendo, meanwhile, sold 403,000 of its handheld DS systems in the U.S., and 254,000 Wii consoles. Sony would not disclose how many PlayStations it sold during the month."


Just as I figured. Sony is the only one too embarressed to release sales figures. I highly doubt we'll ever get concrete move sales. Oh well.

 

[TheRipDizz]

Isn't this move by the NPD going to start lending some more credibility to that other sales site? Publishers already pull "data" from that website. I would suspect it will get stronger now that NPD is on lock down.

Someone just needs to start leaking their info. Of course we'd have to read it somewhere else, but still......

Industry insiders reading GAF. Do it.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

That site lost all their credibility a few years back when they were a million off on Wii sales one December, then stubbornly argued that NPD was wrong and they were right. Nintendo's next quarterly report came out and that certain cite all of sudden had to adjust their numbers by a million units( roughly 50 percent.)

NPD get's millions of dollars in revenue a year for their data, if people actually thought that other site was even remotely credible, NPD wouldn't have a business.

It'd be kind of funny if someone at the NPD had a financial interest in that other site.

 

[Femmeworth]

It's good to see Other M and Birth By Sleep chart, though numbers would be nice. :\

 

[Psychotext]

That site lost all their credibility a few years back when they were a million off on Wii sales one December, then stubbornly argued that NPD was wrong and they were right. Nintendo's next quarterly report came out and that certain cite all of sudden had to adjust their numbers by a million units( roughly 50 percent.)

Sadly whilst what you say is true, since then they've had their data used by some very respectable news agencies (BBC, New York Times, Reuters, Forbes... and more).

 

[sixteen-bit]

those are some Halo3 numbers reach is doing
i'm kind of impressed

 

[thcsquad]

Their numbers never made sense though. That's what's letting this scenario play on a little more in my mind than it should. What are YTDs for the US and Japan combined this year? US has got to be about 2 million 9 months in. Japan maybe 1.5? Does this fiscal year include last christmas season? Dunno, but even so, where the hell do 11 million PS3's get sold at if the majority is not in the US and Japan? Europe? C'mon. Not even when the Wii was at its hottest was it doing those kinds of numbers anywhere.

They met their 'unreachable' 13 million in a fiscal year that had several months pre-Slim and price cut. I don't have the quarter-by-quarter numbers handy, but they're available for public viewing.

Three things you're not taking into account:
1. NPD numbers don't include everything. Isn't Amazon still not on the NPDs?
2. To hardware manufacturers, it only matters what they ship. So they'll likely ship more than gets sold through to customers
3. Sales skyrocket in the holiday season. The last three months of the year do more for YTD sales than you think.

 

[bigtroyjon]

Sadly whilst what you say is true, since then they've had their data used by some very respectable news agencies (BBC, New York Times, Reuters, Forbes... and more).

The New York Times also employed writers who totally fabricated their stories.

 

[bigtroyjon]

They met their 'unreachable' 13 million in a fiscal year that had several months pre-Slim and price cut. I don't have the quarter-by-quarter numbers handy, but they're available for public viewing.

Three things you're not taking into account:
1. NPD numbers don't include everything. Isn't Amazon still not on the NPDs?
2. To hardware manufacturers, it only matters what they ship. So they'll likely ship more than gets sold through to customers
3. Sales skyrocket in the holiday season. The last three months of the year do more for YTD sales than you think.

NPD is an overview of all sales, not just the retailers they get data from. And to answer your question, they have had Amazon data for years now.

They ship to retailers, those retailers don't keep ordering more than they can sell just to fill up warehouses.

 

[Psychotext]

The New York Times also employed writers who totally fabricated their stories.

Ok... but that's still missing the point somewhat. The world in general things the numbers are on the level.

 

[Adam Blade]

Boo-urns. Boring NPD is boring.

 

[Chrange]

Sadly whilst what you say is true, since then they've had their data used by some very respectable news agencies (BBC, New York Times, Reuters, Forbes... and more).

They've had their data used by people who don't know better? So what.

Nothing wrong with VG's old numbers though. Once adjusted to match reality after the NPD numbers are in, someone using them is really just using NPD's numbers from a different source.

It'll be interesting to see what VG does now that they get no numbers to adjust their wild guesses.

 

[mj1108]

"Nintendo, meanwhile, sold 403,000 of its handheld DS systems in the U.S., and 254,000 Wii consoles. Sony would not disclose how many PlayStations it sold during the month."


Just as I figured. Sony is the only one too embarressed to release sales figures. I highly doubt we'll ever get concrete move sales. Oh well.

If I remember right, the last time this happened everything pointed to Sony being the one that didn't want numbers released.

Guess they don't want to mention Move sales..... maybe not selling as much as they would like? I would think that if it was a huge hit for them, they would be shouting the numbers from the rooftops.

 

[les papillons sexuels]

That site lost all their credibility a few years back when they were a million off on Wii sales one December, then stubbornly argued that NPD was wrong and they were right. Nintendo's next quarterly report came out and that certain cite all of sudden had to adjust their numbers by a million units( roughly 50 percent.)

NPD get's millions of dollars in revenue a year for their data, if people actually thought that other site was even remotely credible, NPD wouldn't have a business.

technically, NDP numbers are also completely fabricated as they don't have tracking from either amazon or walmart (as well as several other sources).

Truth is, for the limited resources VGC has, their numbers are fairly impressive, and I'd argue accurate enough.

 

[Segata Sanshiro]

technically, NDP numbers are also completely fabricated as they don't have tracking from either amazon or walmart.

Truth is, for the limited resources VGC has, their numbers are fairly impressive.

Impressive with a qualifier is not sufficient for accuracy. His numbers are way the fuck off from the truth, well outside of statistical acceptability.

 

[tass0]

If I remember right, the last time this happened everything pointed to Sony being the one that didn't want numbers released.

Guess they don't want to mention Move sales..... maybe not selling as much as they would like? I would think that if it was a huge hit for them, they would be shouting the numbers from the rooftops.

Maybe. Apparently it sold a shit load already, though. 1.5 million sold in a month. baffles me...

How high could their expectations be?

 

[itxaka]

Is there any way this can be Kotick's fault? I'm willing to think outside the box on this one.

Otherwise I blame the PSP Go. Not Sony, the Go itself. It sold so badly NPD felt releasing hardware sales data was giving the poor thing a complex, and took pity.

I'm with you. This was kotick or the PSPLol

Maybe. Apparently it sold a shit load already, though. 1.5 million sold in a month. baffles me...

How high could their expectations be?

US only? wow.

 

[les papillons sexuels]

Impressive with a qualifier is not sufficient for accuracy. His numbers are way the fuck off from the truth, well outside of statistical acceptability.

you're free to start up your own tracking website if you believe you can do a better job.

Otherwise I'd say that beggars can't be choosers.

 

[Lightning]

If I remember right, the last time this happened everything pointed to Sony being the one that didn't want numbers released.

Guess they don't want to mention Move sales..... maybe not selling as much as they would like? I would think that if it was a huge hit for them, they would be shouting the numbers from the rooftops.

Yeah, weird this from Sony.

I would think that Sony would want as many developers developing for Move as possible and what better way to convince them then with great sales. I hope Sony do provide some sales data for Move since I ain't jumping on it until I know it will be successful and supported properly.

 

[Psychotext]

Nothing wrong with VG's old numbers though.

EMEA

 

[tass0]

US only? wow.

Europe only, actually.

 

[szaromir]

technically, NDP numbers are also completely fabricated as they don't have tracking from either amazon or walmart (as well as several other sources).

Truth is, for the limited resources VGC has, their numbers are fairly impressive, and I'd argue accurate enough.

NPD has been receiving data from Amazon for quite some time now.

 

[Megadragon15]

US only? wow.

No. Europe: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=410246
Edit: Beaten

 

[TheFLYINGManga_Ka]

If all the skus are meshed together than does that mean Metroid Other M sold more than the Wii-Play/Fit and Mario Kart Wii, etc.?

I would think that's pretty good, although numbers would be nice.

I'm kind of bummed out with this new NPD format. I was really curious to see how Castlevania Lords of Shadow would perform, or Epic Mickey, Donkey Kong Country Returns, Kirby Epic Yarn, Vanquish, etc.

 

[PSGames]

If I remember right, the last time this happened everything pointed to Sony being the one that didn't want numbers released.

Guess they don't want to mention Move sales..... maybe not selling as much as they would like? I would think that if it was a huge hit for them, they would be shouting the numbers from the rooftops.

Definitely.

Maybe. Apparently it sold a shit load already, though. 1.5 million sold in a month. baffles me...

How high could their expectations be?

wut

 

[Little Green Yoda]

Regardless of whether Sony had a hand in NPD's changes, it's not unreasonable to think they withheld numbers in fear of being overshadowed by both MS and Nintendo (no NPD figures mean Sony didn't know how much Nintendo sold at the time of the interview, right?). I don't see why they wouldn't still release a delayed PR statement though. When's the latest a NPD-related PR statement has been released? Official PR typically didn't get posted until many, many pages into the NPD thread but that's probably due to our rabid posting. :lol

 

[PSGames]

No. Europe: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=410246
Edit: Beaten

Is that shipped or sold? Are they combining Move and Navigation numbers?

Nobody knows.

 

[Megadragon15]

Regardless of whether Sony had a hand in NPD's changes, it's not unreasonable to think they withheld numbers in fear of being overshadowed by both MS and Nintendo (no NPD figures mean Sony didn't know how much Nintendo sold at the time of the interview, right?). I don't see why they wouldn't still release a delayed PR statement though. When's the latest a NPD-related PR statement has been released? Official PR typically didn't get posted until many, many pages into the NPD thread but that's probably due to our rabid posting. :lol

Are you dense? Sony has all the hardware sales numbers. How else can Microsoft claim that they were the top selling console in September's NPD?

 

[iammeiam]

Yeah, weird this from Sony.

I would think that Sony would want as many developers developing for Move as possible and what better way to convince them then with great sales. I hope Sony do provide some sales data for Move since I ain't jumping on it until I know it will be successful and supported properly.

Not having the numbers public does allow them a lot of flexibility in how they declare Move a win, though. They can talk about how much it sells in units, or dollars, whichever makes them look better. (ie, if Kinect bombs, MS is probably going to talk about how much in terms of dollars it's pulling in, since it's more expensive than Move. They could move fewer units and still win in terms of money spent. Etc.)

I mean, take the Europe quote. It specifically says 1.5 million "new controllers", which technically could allow for the nunchuck (not sure if they could count the PS Eye , too). Not saying that's what I think the quote actually means, but without NPD coldly stating unit sales, Sony can pick how they relay the truth of their sales.

 

[Segata Sanshiro]

you're free to start up your own tracking website if you believe you can do a better job.

Otherwise I'd say that beggars can't be choosers.

I'll take no information over incorrect information, thanks. And I don't believe I could do a better job. That doesn't change the point. That you would present that, the king of all shitty methods of argument, shows where your standards are.

 

[mj1108]

Is that shipped or sold? Are they combining Move and Navigation numbers?

Nobody knows.

Do you really think at this point we'd ever get a straight answer on that? All they need to do is smile and say "1.5 million sold" and let you figure it out.

 

[HK-47]

you're free to start up your own tracking website if you believe you can do a better job.

Otherwise I'd say that beggars can't be choosers.

Actually they can be choosers. They can choose not to eat shit, so to speak.

 

[Karma]

Maybe. Apparently it sold a shit load already, though. 1.5 million sold in a month. baffles me...

How high could their expectations be?

It is somewhere in the region of 1.5 million units shipped to retail in Europe. We also have no idea what that includes. Very likely it includes starter pack, move controller, Nav controller and Move System bundle.

 

[itxaka]

Europe only, actually.

Ahhh well that was expected. We europeans love our Sony products and gimmick accesories :lol

Edit: Before anyone jumps on me, gimmick as in strange or different, not as in shitty.

 

[TheRipDizz]

Is that shipped or sold? Are they combining Move and Navigation numbers?

Nobody knows.

What do you want. It's Europe. Now also appearing in America.

 

[Little Green Yoda]

Are you dense? Sony has all the hardware sales numbers. How else can Microsoft claim that they were the top selling console in September's NPD?

Fuck, nvm I'm stupid. :[

 

[les papillons sexuels]

I'll take no information over incorrect information, thanks. And I don't believe I could do a better job. That doesn't change the point. That you would present that, the king of all shitty methods of argument, shows where your standards are.

well, once you can prove that it's false I'll take your word on it that it's incorrect.

 

[lockload]

Modern Warfare 2 (X360) sold almost 1 million more than Reach in the same period of time.

I expected more from Reach, but apparently MW2 is absolutely insane.

Same time period?, wasnt MW2 release a week earlier in the month?

 

[theultimo]

Same time period?, wasnt MW2 release a week earlier in the month?

I think it was released 1 week earlier. Some people aren't buying Reach because of ""not realistic enough" reasons.

 

[lockload]

Are you dense? Sony has all the hardware sales numbers. How else can Microsoft claim that they were the top selling console in September's NPD?

They way i see it is any ps3 owner who already has a camera will probably buy one its £25, doesnt mean they will every buy anything else though

 

[Freezie KO]

This... this is sad.

 

[C4Lukins]

well, once you can prove that it's false I'll take your word on it that it's incorrect.

They have been consistently proved false by the NPD. And while the NPD does not have 100% coverage, they do have the numbers from enough outlets to give a decent estimate. Also you should just stop defending that shit hole website for your own sake. Actually keep defending them. I would prefer that.

 

[Segata Sanshiro]

well, once you can prove that it's false I'll take your word on it that it's incorrect.

The numbers have been extremely incorrect in the past. I really don't give a flying fuck whether you take my word on it or not. It's not my responsibility to shield idiots from believing in any old huckster that comes along.

 

[lockload]

Can someone do a gif with a child at xmas opening his present, and all there is is an empty box, the new NPD sucks:lol

 

[bigtroyjon]

technically, NDP numbers are also completely fabricated as they don't have tracking from either amazon or walmart (as well as several other sources).

Truth is, for the limited resources VGC has, their numbers are fairly impressive, and I'd argue accurate enough.

they do have amazon numbers.

Amazing to me how all of a sudden there are a ton of VGC defenders crawling out of the woodwork after this announcement was made.

 

[SCHUEY F1]

Cool to see NHL 11 in the top 10.

 

[Segata Sanshiro]

they do have amazon numbers.

Amazing to me how all of a sudden there are a ton of VGC defenders crawling out of the woodwork after this announcement was made.

Desperation does strange things to people. They need to believe in *something*.

 

[bigtroyjon]

well, once you can prove that it's false I'll take your word on it that it's incorrect.

I already gave an example about how false they are based on shipment numbers that you even quoted.

Did you actually read what you quoted in my post?

 

[C4Lukins]

they do have amazon numbers.

Amazing to me how all of a sudden there are a ton of VGC defenders crawling out of the woodwork after this announcement was made.

I can understand the need to reduce your expectations in the event of losing all hope for real numbers. I think we all want to see something similar to the movie industries daily box office numbers for the video game industry. But if those numbers are randomly generated from the ass of a dead monkey, well.... no.