Horseticuffs
Full werewolf off the buckle
Wow, if the accusations regarding Mike from Sword & Scale are true on that subreddit that's pretty damning.
I'd feel bad listening in that case.
I'd feel bad listening in that case.
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Serial: Season 01 Discussion - This American Life meets True Detective
- Thread starter Malyse
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What accusations?Wow, if the accusations regarding Mike from Sword & Scale are true on that subreddit that's pretty damnin.
I'd feel bad listening in that case.
Horseticuffs
Full werewolf off the buckle
What accusations?[/QUOTEThere was some talk of Sword and Scale in this thread.
Apparently the host is a complete dick and wants the subreddit shut down. https://www.reddit.com/r/SwordScale/comments/3pl2kt/sword_and_scale_has_asked_me_to_close_this/
Cornballer
Member
- EW: Serial season 2 will air on Pandora
The topic of the second season of Serial, the popular podcast spinoff from This American Life, has yet to be officially announced, but now fans will know where they can hear new episodes once they arrive. Pandora announced Monday that it will stream the series after episodes debut on iTunes, podcast apps, and Serials website.
The premiere date hasnt been announced, but according to Pandora, season 1 will be available starting on Nov. 24.
For people already listening to Serial and This American Life, nothing will change, NPRs Ira Glass said in a statement. But we believe lots of people whod like our shows simply havent heard of them, or havent started listening to podcasts. Serial is the biggest podcast in the world, but only 17 percent of Americans listen to podcasts at all. Thats why its so exciting for us to work with Pandora. Pandora reaches millions of people who never listen to public radio or download podcasts. Thisll get our shows to them.
TheBryanJZX90
Member
Even more than Serial, when is Invisibilia coming back?
MonkeyKing
Member
An interesting but sad story. I'm not totally convinced that he's guilty, but I'd lean that way. To me, the fact that Adnan never tried to contact Hae after the police told him that she was missing is a huge red flag. You would think that he would reach out to her with something like, "hey the police just contacted me, where are you?" Especially considering how close they had been. Maybe he didn't try to call because he already knew where she was. But that's just my own suspicious mind.
| Praxis |
Banned
An interesting but sad story. I'm not totally convinced that he's guilty, but I'd lean that way. To me, the fact that Adnan never tried to contact Hae after the police told him that she was missing is a huge red flag. You would think that he would reach out to her with something like, "hey the police just contacted me, where are you?" Especially considering how close they had been. Maybe he didn't try to call because he already knew where she was. But that's just my own suspicious mind.
That's a massive red flag to me too, but her current boyfriend also didn't try to contact her after the police told him she was missing.
Even more than Serial, when is Invisibilia coming back?
Ugh I hated that show. The hosts voices were very annoying, it was hard to enjoy the content.
Undisclosed is about defeating the case presented by the state, and it accomplishes this by miles. Why there's not already a retrial or he's released is disgusting.
I've always felt that at the very least-even if you think Adnan is guilty, you must admit the trial was a farce and the evidence presented since demands that a retrial must be had.
Fantastical
Death Prophet
I'm definitely suspicious of Adnan but yes I believe there is too much reasonable doubt.
I've always felt that at the very least-even if you think Adnan is guilty, you must admit the trial was a farce and the evidence presented since demands that a retrial must be had.
I probably said "this trial is a shit show" a thousand times in my head when I was listening, and each time it was because there was a new level of shit to the show.
MonkeyKing
Member
That's a massive red flag to me too, but her current boyfriend also didn't try to contact her after the police told him she was missing.
Strange, yeah, but the current boyfriend had an iron alibi for his whereabouts at the time of murder. Adnan stayed in contact with Hae, even giving her his new number the night before. Even though they were not a couple anymore. I'd be alarmed if the police contacted me, I'd have to call her at least once (especially as time moved on and no one heard from her).
Not feeling it.
| Praxis |
Banned
I've always felt that at the very least-even if you think Adnan is guilty, you must admit the trial was a farce and the evidence presented since demands that a retrial must be had.
I agree. I think he's guilty, but if I was on the jury with all of the evidence presented to me I couldn't without reasonable doubt convict him. Not based on the information presented in Serial or the trial. You can't convict somebody to life on a hunch.
Strange, yeah, but the current boyfriend had an iron alibi for his whereabouts at the time of murder. Adnan stayed in contact with Hae, even giving her his new number the night before. Even though they were not a couple anymore. I'd be alarmed if the police contacted me, I'd have to call her at least once (especially as time moved on and no one heard from her).
Not feeling it.
I agree with you. He would have tried to contact her. But this is all opinion, and the fact the other boyfriend didn't provides reasonable doubt.
I still think he's where he belongs, just not under the right circumstances.
Strange, yeah, but the current boyfriend had an iron alibi for his whereabouts at the time of murder. Adnan stayed in contact with Hae, even giving her his new number the night before. Even though they were not a couple anymore. I'd be alarmed if the police contacted me, I'd have to call her at least once (especially as time moved on and no one heard from her).
Not feeling it.
The alibi may have been real, but they didn't bother to verify it, which they easily could have done.
MonkeyKing
Member
IIRC they did confirm the boyfriend was at work all day on that date. Also, I don't believe there was any indication of conflict between the victim and the boyfriend.The alibi may have been real, but they didn't bother to verify it, which they easily could have done.
This case has been a great example of all that bullshit prosecutors get away with. Their assistance in finding an attorney for their star witness I thought was really out of bounds. But I'm not convinced there is enough misconduct to overturn the conviction.
IIRC they did confirm the boyfriend was at work all day on that date. Also, I don't believe there was any indication of conflict between the victim and the boyfriend.
This case has been a great example of all that bullshit prosecutors get away with. Their assistance in finding an attorney for their star witness I thought was really out of bounds. But I'm not convinced there is enough misconduct to overturn the conviction.
He said he worked at a different store. Nobody pursued bothered to verify. There was indication that he had assaulted one of her friends, according to a note from the police.
The initial time card from the company said he didn't work. And you are correct in the bullshit, it was only after the prosecutor called the company was a time card that showed he did work was produced, and also disclosed that his mom was the manager there.
It's all here.
It's even suspicious that he was at work all day for the kind of job he had.
There's a pretty hilarious reddit post about Jay's story as we currently understand it, I highly recommend it.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
You all have been drinking that Kool Aid, Adnan definitely did it. Even sympathetic Sarah couldn't bring herself to say that she thought he was innocent. Don't be distracted by all that hand waving with Don and timecards, there is no other credible suspect than Adnan.
Get outta here, Jay.You all have been drinking that Kool Aid, Adnan definitely did it. Even sympathetic Sarah couldn't bring herself to say that she thought he was innocent. Don't be distracted by all that hand waving with Don and timecards, there is no other credible suspect than Adnan.
Even more than Serial, when is Invisibilia coming back?
Even more than Invisibilia, when is "The Mystery Show" coming back?
Buttonbasher
Member
Even more than Invisibilia, when is "The Mystery Show" coming back?
Aw yeah Mystery Show.
What is this Mystey Show of which you speak.
Mystery Show only has one good episode, the Britney Spears one. All the rest are alright to bland.
What is this Mystey Show of which you speak.
It's like the polar opposite of Serial.
Serial takes a hugely serious story, spends 12 hours on it and leaves it with "eh we don't know anything for sure."
Mystery show takes silly little "mysteries" (like how tall Jake Gyllenhal is) spends 30-50 minutes on it and they have to be resolved.
How could you not like the belt buckle one? Or the Jake Gyllenhal one? I'll give you the license plate and lunch box ones were weak but the rest were pretty solid.Mystery Show only has one good episode, the Britney Spears one. All the rest are alright to bland.
The belt buckle episode is far and away the best episode. I didn't think it was even close.
I'm not sure I love that show. Starlee Kine can be a bit over the top quirky, but I must say I love hearing her just chat with real people who are total strangers. She's got an incredible knack for getting people to open up. (Not coincidentally, I thought the chat with the ticket agent was one of the highlights of the Britney episode)
I'm not sure I love that show. Starlee Kine can be a bit over the top quirky, but I must say I love hearing her just chat with real people who are total strangers. She's got an incredible knack for getting people to open up. (Not coincidentally, I thought the chat with the ticket agent was one of the highlights of the Britney episode)
That's an interesting way to be wrong.Mystery Show only has one good episode, the Britney Spears one. All the rest are alright to bland.
The belt buckle episode is far and away the best episode. I didn't think it was even close.
I'm not sure I love that show. Starlee Kine can be a bit over the top quirky, but I must say I love hearing her just chat with real people who are total strangers. She's got an incredible knack for getting people to open up. (Not coincidentally, I thought the chat with the ticket agent was one of the highlights of the Britney episode)
yeah that ticket agent chat, I was like "WTF? How did she get this guy to open up to her like that" and she also did it in the video store episode where the tough guy was saying his life was like that Felini film and he's on the beach and it's too late for him.
Wow.
You all have been drinking that Kool Aid, Adnan definitely did it. Even sympathetic Sarah couldn't bring herself to say that she thought he was innocent. Don't be distracted by all that hand waving with Don and timecards, there is no other credible suspect than Adnan.
You only listened to Serial, apparently. There's a reason you think there's only one credible suspect: the cops decided that from the start and ignored anything that would lead away from that.
That's an interesting way to be wrong.
I truly wish I were wrong, but the podcast is alright at best.
WrenchNinja
Member
Huh? Didn't she say in the last episode that despite not knowing whether he was innocent, he wasn't proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt in her eyes based on the evidence.You all have been drinking that Kool Aid, Adnan definitely did it. Even sympathetic Sarah couldn't bring herself to say that she thought he was innocent. Don't be distracted by all that hand waving with Don and timecards, there is no other credible suspect than Adnan.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
Huh? Didn't she say in the last episode that despite not knowing whether he was innocent, he wasn't proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt in her eyes based on the evidence.
I think she says what a lot of people think, that she might not have convicted him with the info she had, but even Sarah couldn't bring herself to call him innocent, and the podcast was basically favorable to him. But we are past that point, he was already declared guilty, and acting like raising reasonable doubt now matters is silly. Even with at least three podcasts basically digging at everything they can to exonerate him, Adnan is still the most likely to have committed that murder. His lies, even on Serial, don't help his case, and the few people who actually look at the documents objectively have come up with explanations for the wild speculation by undisclosed and others. And every time they entice you with something new, they move away and find something new and shiny to distract you. Where is the DNA test? Where is the crime stoppers evidence? Was bilal going to testify for or against Adnan? It's all a mess by design, because at the end of the day there is no credible alternate scenario to the murder.
WrenchNinja
Member
Of course it matters when the evidence isn't convincing.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
Of course it matters when the evidence isn't convincing.
Matters to whom? Not to Syed, who needs more than reasonable doubt to reverse the life sentence. Not to the jury, who convicted him swiftly in a trial where, until recently, we didn't even have the transcripts, and where we still don't have video because the people who are shilling for Adnan won't release it.
Maybe it matters to you, that's fair, but even with all the slanted podcasts, many of the most involved fans, those who post on Reddit, still believe he did it, even if we don't have the full story, as Sarah said in the last episode. It would help if Adnan started telling us the truth.
Mystery Show is great, that Invisibilia one on the other hand...just no.
It's awful. So annoying.
My whole take on it is (and I know it's not popular) is that anyone that listens to the podcast cannot say they honestly feel that Adnand is telling the whole truth. Everyone I know that's listened to it says they agree he's hiding something. And sure he might not be guilty of the murder but why would he hide something that could get him out? That thing would have to be just as bad.
The whole thing is sorta unsettling. I have to agree there probably wasn't enough evidence and there was reasonable doubt. And while that makes him innocent in the eyes of the law, it's still obvious he's hiding something.
The whole thing is sorta unsettling. I have to agree there probably wasn't enough evidence and there was reasonable doubt. And while that makes him innocent in the eyes of the law, it's still obvious he's hiding something.
Court will reopen post-conviction proceedings: https://twitter.com/serial/status/662762063031222276
BTW, with all the ongoing discussion, I still occasionally peer into Reddit, etc. (and obviously this thread), the thing that I can never really fathom is how Gutierrez never was able to sow doubt around Jay... There's the ever-shifting story, but I've gotta say, if I were Adnan's lawyer I think I would have latched onto his description of himself "the criminal element of Woodlawn" and never let it go.
Maybe I've just watched too much TV, but raising questions about whether his circle of associates is dangerous, and then also his honesty, etc., would seem like a much more effective line of questioning than "stepping out."
You're referring to Invisibilia? Apparently it's a big deal? I haven't listened. Not sure about it (but there's really not much room in my rotation anyway)
BTW, with all the ongoing discussion, I still occasionally peer into Reddit, etc. (and obviously this thread), the thing that I can never really fathom is how Gutierrez never was able to sow doubt around Jay... There's the ever-shifting story, but I've gotta say, if I were Adnan's lawyer I think I would have latched onto his description of himself "the criminal element of Woodlawn" and never let it go.
Maybe I've just watched too much TV, but raising questions about whether his circle of associates is dangerous, and then also his honesty, etc., would seem like a much more effective line of questioning than "stepping out."
It's awful. So annoying.
You're referring to Invisibilia? Apparently it's a big deal? I haven't listened. Not sure about it (but there's really not much room in my rotation anyway)
At the bare minimum, Jay should have faced jail time for assisting in burying a body.
In reality there really isn't enough evidence to convict Adnan beyond "who else could have done it?", which is about as weak of a case as you can possibly construct.
If that means Hae Min Lee's murderer gets away with it, so be it. People get away with shit all the time. Adnan apparently murdered her so freaking cleanly that he didn't leave a single shred of evidence in the car.
It's possible - and highly likely - that he did it, but there's just no proof, no proof that would normally be admissible in court.
In reality there really isn't enough evidence to convict Adnan beyond "who else could have done it?", which is about as weak of a case as you can possibly construct.
If that means Hae Min Lee's murderer gets away with it, so be it. People get away with shit all the time. Adnan apparently murdered her so freaking cleanly that he didn't leave a single shred of evidence in the car.
It's possible - and highly likely - that he did it, but there's just no proof, no proof that would normally be admissible in court.
Fantastical
Death Prophet
My whole take on it is (and I know it's not popular) is that anyone that listens to the podcast cannot say they honestly feel that Adnand is telling the whole truth. Everyone I know that's listened to it says they agree he's hiding something. And sure he might not be guilty of the murder but why would he hide something that could get him out? That thing would have to be just as bad.
The whole thing is sorta unsettling. I have to agree there probably wasn't enough evidence and there was reasonable doubt. And while that makes him innocent in the eyes of the law, it's still obvious he's hiding something.
That's how I feel, and it's what made this podcast very creepy about halfway through. At first Sarah bombards with you with doubt on Adnan... then there's the episode where she details the bits that don't look good for Adnan. It's very scary to think he could just be completely lying.
There are just some things I don't understand, and that goes for Jay and Adnan. It seems to me like they were both more involved than they let on.
WrenchNinja
Member
Matters to whom? Not to Syed, who needs more than reasonable doubt to reverse the life sentence. Not to the jury, who convicted him swiftly in a trial where, until recently, we didn't even have the transcripts, and where we still don't have video because the people who are shilling for Adnan won't release it.
Maybe it matters to you, that's fair, but even with all the slanted podcasts, many of the most involved fans, those who post on Reddit, still believe he did it, even if we don't have the full story, as Sarah said in the last episode. It would help if Adnan started telling us the truth.
Dude, you need to tone it down a little.
Adnan Syed motion to reopen post conviction proceedings granted
Those cell records are gonna get shredded and there goes the state's case.
Those cell records are gonna get shredded and there goes the state's case.
Adnan Syed motion to reopen post conviction proceedings granted
Those cell records are gonna get shredded and there goes the state's case.
VanMardigan, please post you're ok.
Coincidental to noticing this thread is alive and well, I just started re-listening to Serial not 30 mins ago.
I've been on a podcast binge and caught up on Undisclosed over the course of a week. I am hyper aware of the show's bias towards Adnan (proceeds going to Free Adnan and all), but I think the show's functional purpose is to show how bullshit the trial was rather than proving Adnan was innocent. It accomplishes raising reasonable doubt time and again, and I'm very interested in that. Personally, I don't trust Adnan or necessarily believe he's 100% innocent, but that conviction was based on incompetence and racism. Those fucking Baltimore cops.
Side note, since I see people talking about Mystery Show, I've been a huge fan of Gimlet since StartUp episode 1. Prior to Serial I didn't regularly follow podcasts, but This American Life has always been one of my favorite works of storytelling. I love Reply All and from the one episode out right now, I think I'm going to like Surprisingly Awesome. I binged through Mystery Show yesterday, and it really grew on me.
I love the whole public radio/ex-NPR family of podcasts so much! Next up: catching up on Invisibilia!
Side side note: some of the topics are interesting but I am not feeling RadioLab. Their style can grate so bad.
I've been on a podcast binge and caught up on Undisclosed over the course of a week. I am hyper aware of the show's bias towards Adnan (proceeds going to Free Adnan and all), but I think the show's functional purpose is to show how bullshit the trial was rather than proving Adnan was innocent. It accomplishes raising reasonable doubt time and again, and I'm very interested in that. Personally, I don't trust Adnan or necessarily believe he's 100% innocent, but that conviction was based on incompetence and racism. Those fucking Baltimore cops.
Side note, since I see people talking about Mystery Show, I've been a huge fan of Gimlet since StartUp episode 1. Prior to Serial I didn't regularly follow podcasts, but This American Life has always been one of my favorite works of storytelling. I love Reply All and from the one episode out right now, I think I'm going to like Surprisingly Awesome. I binged through Mystery Show yesterday, and it really grew on me.
I love the whole public radio/ex-NPR family of podcasts so much! Next up: catching up on Invisibilia!
Side side note: some of the topics are interesting but I am not feeling RadioLab. Their style can grate so bad.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
At the bare minimum, Jay should have faced jail time for assisting in burying a body.
In reality there really isn't enough evidence to convict Adnan beyond "who else could have done it?", which is about as weak of a case as you can possibly construct.
Jay DID face jail time, a judge just didn't sentence him to any. There WAS enough evidence to convict, dude's been in jail for 15 years.
Dude, you need to tone it down a little.
What? Are your serious?
VanMardigan, please post you're ok.
I'm fine, he has served 15 years and if he had done a plea deal he would be getting out on parole around now anyway. Only regret I would have is that he never showed remorse.
Nappuccino
Member
Jay DID face jail time, a judge just didn't sentence him to any. There WAS enough evidence to convict, dude's been in jail for 15 years.
Being convicted and there being enough evidence to be convicted are sadly not the same thing.
BronsonLee
Member
Adnan Syed motion to reopen post conviction proceedings granted
Those cell records are gonna get shredded and there goes the state's case.
So what's the timetable here for a layman like me? How's this proceed?
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
Being convicted and there being enough evidence to be convicted are sadly not the same thing.
Disagreeing with the decision of the jury is all well and good, but you are confusing your opinion of the case with a subjective fact. He was convicted, so the jury felt there was enough to convict. The judge agreed. You don't, you've listened to a few podcasts, that's cool.
Disagreeing with the decision of the jury is all well and good, but you are confusing your opinion of the case with a subjective fact. He was convicted, so the jury felt there was enough to convict. The judge agreed. You don't, you've listened to a few podcasts, that's cool.
Wrongful convictions don't exist In your world, because a trial existed. Got it.
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