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So uhhh there's been no good Spiderman film since 2004 huh?

So I got on rewatching the Raimi trilogy and then it goaded me to just say fuck it and rewatch all of Spiderman on film just to see what I think. My opinion were potentially outdated as it had been YEARS since I had actually sat down to watch them all and not just see clips on YouTube or whatever. I feel like that happens a lot with media and art. Games, movies, books, music, tv. You get older and some stuff you like less some stuff you like more etc

For context I'd say im a light fan of the character. Batman has definitely 100% been my guy since I entered adulthood but I still like Spiderman alright I guess. I was a huuuuge fan as a kid growing up so there's some childhood bias

Anyways I really loved 1 and 2 and got to 3 and holy fuck its way worse than I remembered. Ive always been a 3 defender saying its not that bad but jokes on me its that bad and then some. The cringe is unbearable. The movie is a mess and edited like shit. Poor Raimi. the studio interference is palpable from every frame. Then we get to the Andrew Garfield movie and the first one is alright. Just, fine. TASM2 I think is slightly over-hated. I don't think its like Catwoman/Batman and Robin level bad. My issue with it is again, its edited so poorly you can tell there's copious studio interference and it leaves the movie just feeling like a husk. The dialogue is also pretty awful. Not that Spiderman movies sport Tarantino level dialogue I guess but its especially bad here. Barley even functional. All in all TASM2 whether it was Webbs vision or not is rendered a pretty bad film thanks to Sony.

We arrive at the mcu and homecoming is probably the best since Raimi's Spiderman 2 but is held back by just being a disposable mcu product. Ya know, it doesn't have any umpth of panache what so ever and the ""director"" is you typical MCU *insert name here* director who can be a stand in facade for the VFX artist and executives who really direct the mcu movies. Speaking of CGI we've arrived at a level of soulless where we can't even have a real practical spider suit anymore so in every shot its cgi'd over despite having filmed it for real. (I counted a total of 2 shots in all of FFH where Tom is actually in the suit, and About 3-5 in all of NWH) In fact all the cgi in the holland movies are pretty awful generally speaking so it all feels non tactile and you can't connect to any of it. Especially NWH.

In fact, I realized Far From Home and No Way Home are actually kind of dogshit. I never really liked them in the first place but the rewatch here as im older clenched it for me. These, to me, are terrible movies. These are the most base, lowest common denominator visionless corporate products. Designed to appeal to the most simple of normies and casuals. These feel truly just... empty? Not even like incompetently bad like Superman 4 or something, because Disney and Sony know what they're doing, they know they don't put in effort. These movies are the poster boy of the generic modern blockbuster. Completely bereft of even an iota of artistry or even effort. And I love plenty of "product" movies like fast and furious 5 and 7, transformers 1 and 3. But these don't even succeed at being entertaining. I mean how could they be? They seem like they're aimed at an audience no older than 10, and are filled with all the usual terribly unfunny elementary school jokes and made in post production cgi weightless action. They are truly awful films to me.

So there we have it, after Tobeys second movie we have 3 which is laughably bad, TASM1 which is merely okay, TASM2 which is bad, homecoming which is passable but mediocre, and then FFH and NWH which are complete slop for the masses. Am I tripping? Perhaps I'm alone on this but maybe some of you out there feel similar. I like Spiderman and actually wish he had better live action exposure like my boy Batman. Also disclaimer, if any of you love these movies and are offended this is all merely my subjective opinion


TLDR: Spiderman movies majorly kind of suck post Spider-Man 2 2004, anyone else agree?
 
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FunkMiller

Gold Member
Being part of the MCU may have made Sony a lot of money off Spidey, but I think it's done nothing but damage the character. He's meant to be the crown jewel in Marvel's line up - the same way Batman is for DC - but the MCU has positioned him as one of the B team, most of the time. Pete should be a leader, but he's just come across as Tony Stark's sidekick. By now, we should have an Avengers movie with Pete front and centre.
 

Trunx81

Member
Probably the best Spider-Man MCU movie is Infinity War.
No way home is a nostalgia-fest, with a lot of leodicapriopointing.jpg memes.

Spiderman 2 from Raimi is still the best one, having the perfect balance between superhero-action and drama. Peter feels believable, more mature than in the first movie but still allowed to make mistakes. It helps that Toby gives his character some gravitas, something that Holland is not able (?) to.

The Garfield movies where a mistake, though.
 

Pagusas

Elden Member
You know… you are right. And that is sad. Spider-Man 2 is really the last “rewatchable” Spider-Man. All the rest are just not that fun to rewatch. They were good the first time in theaters, but on every rewatch they get worse, except for 2 (and honestly spiderman 1 has charm that’s hidden behind its age and bad effects).

I will say though that Spiderman 3 is the only truely dog shit/bad one. The rest aren’t bad, just not good either, but Spider-Man 3 is honestly Batman & Robin levels of horrible.
 
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I heard the miles movies are good but for me spiderman is peter parker.
Exactly where I’m at. I put this on Reddit and got a lot of “well actually, the spiderverse movies” and I’m like I ain’t talking bout that miles morales shit.

I’m black and I don’t wanna see his black ass swinging around. Peter Parker is Spider-Man to me like Bruce Wayne is batman and Clark Kent is Superman
 

GymWolf

Gold Member
Exactly where I’m at. I put this on Reddit and got a lot of “well actually, the spiderverse movies” and I’m like I ain’t talking bout that miles morales shit.

I’m black and I don’t wanna see his black ass swinging around. Peter Parker is Spider-Man to me like Bruce Wayne is batman and Clark Kent is Superman
giphy.gif
 

The Skull

Member
No way home was good, as much as people cite muh member berries. Treated Tom Holland as a Spider-Man instead of Iron Boy and gave him some actual character growth. The first Spider Verse movie was great, but the second not so much for me.
 

Billbofet

Member
I have enjoyed the Tom Holland Spider-Man for the most part.
My only concern is Holland has zero range as an actor and, to me, cannot break out of the "gee-whiz golly" Spiderman.
That's been fine up to this point, but a leader he is not, and I just don't see that coming from TH. Like a prior poster mentioned, he's been relegated to being a sidekick.
Even in No Way Home, Toby turned up to be the real leader and show wisdom while we got more goofy high jinx from Ned fucking around with magic and TH making horrible decisions - AGAIN!
 

Pagusas

Elden Member
I have enjoyed the Tom Holland Spider-Man for the most part.
My only concern is Holland has zero range as an actor and, to me, cannot break out of the "gee-whiz golly" Spiderman.
That's been fine up to this point, but a leader he is not, and I just don't see that coming from TH. Like a prior poster mentioned, he's been relegated to being a sidekick.
Even in No Way Home, Toby turned up to be the real leader and show wisdom while we got more goofy high jinx from Ned fucking around with magic and TH making horrible decisions - AGAIN!
Do you think that’s direction/writing of the character or the actor incapable of the range?
 

GymWolf

Gold Member
It's hard to decide what was worse between cringe garfield and modern audience school holland with nerdy indian flash, the obese friend or the annoying and annoyed mary jane.

A battle for the ages.
 

Billbofet

Member
Do you think that’s direction/writing of the character or the actor incapable of the range?
I think it's more on Tom Holland. Like I said, I've enjoyed the movies, I just can't see him maturing like the role should.
He's 27 now but, to me, he still seems like a teenager.
All that said, I like Tom Holland and would love to be proven wrong. It's probably also a terrible idea to replace him.
He always seems like he's apologizing and fumbling vs. how Andrew Garfield nailed the quippy, cocky, almost annoying Spidey.
 

The Cockatrice

Gold Member
I think it's more on Tom Holland. Like I said, I've enjoyed the movies, I just can't see him maturing like the role should.
He's 27 now but, to me, he still seems like a teenager.
All that said, I like Tom Holland and would love to be proven wrong. It's probably also a terrible idea to replace him.
He always seems like he's apologizing and fumbling vs. how Andrew Garfield nailed the quippy, cocky, almost annoying Spidey.

He needs to get more swollololen and act less teen dramatic more cool. Tom Cruise is a tiny ass man and yet he has no trouble acting incredibly superior and mature.
 

kunonabi

Member
As a diehard fan since childhood the only good Spider-Man film is the first ASM as far as I'm concerned. It isn't perfect by any stretch but it's the only one with something actually resembling Peter on screen and doesn't get saddled with loads of bull shit in the second half.
 
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As a diehard fan since childhood the only good Spider-Man film is the first ASM as far as I'm concerned. It isn't perfect by any stretch but it's the only one with something actually resembling Peter on screen and doesn't get saddled with loads of bull shit in the second half.
Interesting take. Yeah I think TASM1 is underrated. Just doesn’t have that filmmaking flair. Marc Webb was relatively inexperienced off of 500 days of summer and I thought his fight scenes and swinging scenes were a little muted. But decent film and I respect your opinion
 

Toons

Member
Being part of the MCU may have made Sony a lot of money off Spidey, but I think it's done nothing but damage the character. He's meant to be the crown jewel in Marvel's line up - the same way Batman is for DC - but the MCU has positioned him as one of the B team, most of the time. Pete should be a leader, but he's just come across as Tony Stark's sidekick. By now, we should have an Avengers movie with Pete front and centre.

Except Peter has never lead the avengers in anything, even in the comics. Any time he is teamed up with other heroes he takes a backseat.

He doesnt work well with teams and is primarily solo. I'm glad they've stuck to this... I dont want Peter leading a team, hes not that kind of character and wouldn't even be a great leader. He usually is totally self sacrificing in his efforts to save people so anyone else he has to keep track of is a liability.
 

Toons

Member
I have enjoyed the Tom Holland Spider-Man for the most part.
My only concern is Holland has zero range as an actor and, to me, cannot break out of the "gee-whiz golly" Spiderman.
That's been fine up to this point, but a leader he is not, and I just don't see that coming from TH. Like a prior poster mentioned, he's been relegated to being a sidekick.
Even in No Way Home, Toby turned up to be the real leader and show wisdom while we got more goofy high jinx from Ned fucking around with magic and TH making horrible decisions - AGAIN!

I largely agree but I'd go further and say Holland has done a great job with the material he was given and showed a lot of range in the last one he did... especially this scene:

He absolutely held his own with the other guys. Hes my favorite spidey portrayal.

Tobeys was good but too mopey, when he puts the mask on I don't get the classic fun loving feel of spidey. Garfield had that bit of sass to him but I hated how they wrote him as Peter. Material failed the actor there.

Holland has a good mix of innocence but also internal goodness and a sense of wonder that they baked in.

To say we've not gotten a good spidey film since 04 i think is laughable btw
 
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Toons

Member
Exactly where I’m at. I put this on Reddit and got a lot of “well actually, the spiderverse movies” and I’m like I ain’t talking bout that miles morales shit.

I’m black and I don’t wanna see his black ass swinging around. Peter Parker is Spider-Man to me like Bruce Wayne is batman and Clark Kent is Superman

I think you got some internal issues to work out there my guy.

Acting like his existence is a threat to the original or something... nah.

Peter Parker hasn't been the only guy called spider man since 1978 at least. The entire idea behind the story was that it was a random chance, and it could've been anyone. Thats the story of spider man. He wasn't chosen, he wasn't born with it, he was in the right place at the right side and became BURDENED with that great power and with it that responsibility.

That can happen to anyone. Anyone can be spider man.
 
To say we've not gotten a good spidey film since 04 i think is laughable btw
You’re welcome to elaborate and provide alternate perspectives or counters to anything I said.

Particularly the Tom movies because I’m sure those are what you have in mind when you type this
 
I think you got some internal issues to work out there my guy.

Acting like his existence is a threat to the original or something... nah.

Peter Parker hasn't been the only guy called spider man since 1978 at least. The entire idea behind the story was that it was a random chance, and it could've been anyone. Thats the story of spider man. He wasn't chosen, he wasn't born with it, he was in the right place at the right side and became BURDENED with that great power and with it that responsibility.

That can happen to anyone. Anyone can be spider man.
Not at all! I just don’t like legacy characters rearing their ugly heads in taking the spotlight. Jon Kent Superman. Hate it. Night wing/Jim Gordon/Damian Wayne subbing in as Batman. Hate it. It’s not my thing at all.

We have a fundamentally different idea of the character of Spider-Man and then of course the alter ego part of the mythology. To me, a hero should exclusively hold their famed title. The character is that hero to me. They can call miles tarantula or some shit I don’t care. But 2 Spider-Man is lame as fuck to me
 
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Toons

Member
You’re welcome to elaborate and provide alternate perspectives or counters to anything I said.

Particularly the Tom movies because I’m sure those are what you have in mind when you type this

Elaborate on what? Its an opinion.

And no, I'm talking about both those and the spider verse movies. You are trying to not count those for some reason despite the fact they very clearly feature Peter Parker as well and are spider man movies.

But yeah I mean if you found nothing enjoyable out of any of the newer spider man films we have very different perspectives on the character.
 

Toons

Member
Not at all! I just don’t like legacy characters rearing their ugly heads in taking the spotlight. Jon Kent Superman. Hate it. Night wing/Jim Gordon/Damian Wayne subbing in as Batman. Hate it. It’s not my thing at all.

We have a fundamentally different idea of the character of Spider-Man and then of course the alter ego part of the mythology. To me, a hero should exclusively hold their famed title. The character is that hero to me. They can call miles tarantula or some shit I don’t care. But 2 Spider-Man is lame as fuck to me

Hal Jordan is a legacy character. Barry Allen is a legacy character.

That notion is not a real thing. Its never been. Even classic age heroes often would have others take their place for a time.

Even nightwing when he initially did that was inspired by a previous thing superman was doing for a time. Its a part of the very essence of the genre in many ways.
 
Elaborate on what? Its an opinion.

And no, I'm talking about both those and the spider verse movies. You are trying to not count those for some reason despite the fact they very clearly feature Peter Parker as well and are spider man movies.

But yeah I mean if you found nothing enjoyable out of any of the newer spider man films we have very different perspectives on the character.
Okay so let me draw this out for you, I put out a long detailed premise. You say “that’s laughable”. It’s not exactly an alien concept for one to inquire “wait how?”

And I’m focusing on live action dude. I’m sure the miles movies are perfectly fine. I’ve even seen the first one. It was alright.
 
Hal Jordan is a legacy character. Barry Allen is a legacy character.

That notion is not a real thing. Its never been. Even classic age heroes often would have others take their place for a time.

Even nightwing when he initially did that was inspired by a previous thing superman was doing for a time. Its a part of the very essence of the genre in many ways.
Yeah and I don’t like them either. It cheapens it. Notice how they’re both D list nobodies too.
 

Toons

Member
Okay so let me draw this out for you, I put out a long detailed premise. You say “that’s laughable”. It’s not exactly an alien concept for one to inquire “wait how?”

And I’m focusing on live action dude. I’m sure the miles movies are perfectly fine. I’ve even seen the first one. It was alright.

Well you didn't say that.

But even talking about live action, FFH for example is a solid soider man story. It has great action scenes, a surprisingly accurate version of Mysterio, builds real stakes for the character and establishes the divide between his personal life and his superhero life.

A long time ago I saw a video that put it quite well, its a slightly different take on the mythos but it works becausd while the raini movies had things outside of his control happen to Peter to emphasis this struggle, in the newer movies, Peter is always given the choice to walk away and choose to live a normal life, but doesn't. Because he's spider man and he takes that responsibility upon himself. This is a major factor of his conflict in all 3 of his movies, and each time he suffers as a result but he keeps making the same choice to be spider man because it is the right thing to do.

In Homecoming vulture tells him to stay out of it, let it happen and everything will be fine. If he chooses not to, vulture will go after him and his loved ones. Peter still goes after vulture.

In FFH, Peter is repeatedly given the option to walk away from all of this, and actually makes that choice halfway through the movie which ends up being a mistake. He then has to accept responsibility for what he's unleashed and take on that role again, this ends up getting his identity outed.

In NWH, he is given a choice by dr strange to let these alternate villains die and everything will be ok. But because he is spider man and takes responsibility for their fates, he doesn't do this. It costs him EVERYTHING in the end, but he'd rather that than to let ones on his watch die that he can save.

In civil war he tells Tony that "if you can do the things that i can do and you dont when the bad things happen, they happen because of you".

That is spider man. That is his entire philosophy down to a science snd the movies made sure not to lose that.
 

Toons

Member
Yeah and I don’t like them either. It cheapens it. Notice how they’re both D list nobodies too.
Hal Jordan is the most popular green Lantern by far, and Barry is the second most popular flash. The first id actually the legacy that came AFTER him, wally west who is a fan favorite to many.

What on earth are you talking about lol. Those aren't D listers.

Wildcat is a D lister. Red Tornado is a D lister. Green lantern isn't a d lister.
 
Hal Jordan is the most popular green Lantern by far, and Barry is the second most popular flash. The first id actually the legacy that came AFTER him, wally west who is a fan favorite to many.

What on earth are you talking about lol. Those aren't D listers.

Wildcat is a D lister. Red Tornado is a D lister. Green lantern isn't a d lister.
Bro cmon. We’re comic guys. They’re big to us. I got a stack of Green Lantern and Flash comics the size of the Himalayas at my childhood house and I can still admit they’re D list. Look at their movies box office. Look at their sales for their ongoing comic issues. Ask any normie who “Hal Jordan” or “Barry Allen” are. Name 1 successful solo project in any medium they’ve starred in

The only thing I could think of is that rinky dink CW show is kind of known by casuals I guess.
 
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Well you didn't say that.

But even talking about live action, FFH for example is a solid soider man story. It has great action scenes, a surprisingly accurate version of Mysterio, builds real stakes for the character and establishes the divide between his personal life and his superhero life.

A long time ago I saw a video that put it quite well, its a slightly different take on the mythos but it works becausd while the raini movies had things outside of his control happen to Peter to emphasis this struggle, in the newer movies, Peter is always given the choice to walk away and choose to live a normal life, but doesn't. Because he's spider man and he takes that responsibility upon himself. This is a major factor of his conflict in all 3 of his movies, and each time he suffers as a result but he keeps making the same choice to be spider man because it is the right thing to do.

In Homecoming vulture tells him to stay out of it, let it happen and everything will be fine. If he chooses not to, vulture will go after him and his loved ones. Peter still goes after vulture.

In FFH, Peter is repeatedly given the option to walk away from all of this, and actually makes that choice halfway through the movie which ends up being a mistake. He then has to accept responsibility for what he's unleashed and take on that role again, this ends up getting his identity outed.

In NWH, he is given a choice by dr strange to let these alternate villains die and everything will be ok. But because he is spider man and takes responsibility for their fates, he doesn't do this. It costs him EVERYTHING in the end, but he'd rather that than to let ones on his watch die that he can save.

In civil war he tells Tony that "if you can do the things that i can do and you dont when the bad things happen, they happen because of you".

That is spider man. That is his entire philosophy down to a science snd the movies made sure not to lose that.
This is a case where I would go through and debate each of these in detail as I disagree somewhat strongly but then the thread would derail to us having a Spider-Man movie debate.

I may just DM you or something because you have interesting thoughts I just think the movies fail to convey what you’re describing in a powerful manner
 
Homecoming was good when Keaton was allowed to ham it up but otherwise it was a mediocre movie like the rest of them. Luckily they keep knocking it out the park with the Spiderverse films.
 

Toons

Member
This is a case where I would go through and debate each of these in detail as I disagree somewhat strongly but then the thread would derail to us having a Spider-Man movie debate.

I may just DM you or something because you have interesting thoughts I just think the movies fail to convey what you’re describing in a powerful manner

I mean you asked me to elaborate so I did lol.

Bro cmon. We’re comic guys. They’re big to us. I got a stack of Green Lantern and Flash comics the size of the Himalayas at my childhood house and I can still admit they’re D list. Look at their movies box office. Look at their sales for their ongoing comic issues. Ask any normie who “Hal Jordan” or “Barry Allen” are. Name 1 successful solo project in any medium they’ve starred in

The only thing I could think of is that rinky dink CW show is kind of known by casuals I guess.

Most normies can name both the flash and Barry Allen. Alove before the 90s knows who hal Jordan is, at least in his green lantern persona.

That flash movie has nothing to do with the character being a relatively well known figure who's had 60 years of publication, multiple TV shows that have lasted collective decades and toys and games. I wouldn't even call flash C list. Hes pretty well known.
 

pachura

Member
Far From Home and Into The Spider-verse were great!
No Way Home was stupid fan service - collecting villains like Pokemon - and Across The Spider-verse was ADHD fever dream
 

Blade2.0

Member
I put my laugh react before you said only live action ones, but I still disagree. Homecoming and no way home are good films. I still think Spider-Man 2 is the best live action comic film, though.

"Exactly where I’m at. I put this on Reddit and got a lot of “well actually, the spiderverse movies” and I’m like I ain’t talking bout that miles morales shit.



I’m black and I don’t wanna see his black ass swinging around. Peter Parker is Spider-Man to me like Bruce Wayne is batman and Clark Kent is Superman"

Ok, but peter parker is in these films and as a major character.
 
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Blade2.0

Member
I have enjoyed the Tom Holland Spider-Man for the most part.
My only concern is Holland has zero range as an actor and, to me, cannot break out of the "gee-whiz golly" Spiderman.
That's been fine up to this point, but a leader he is not, and I just don't see that coming from TH. Like a prior poster mentioned, he's been relegated to being a sidekick.
Even in No Way Home, Toby turned up to be the real leader and show wisdom while we got more goofy high jinx from Ned fucking around with magic and TH making horrible decisions - AGAIN!
Yea, but he's still a high schooler in these movies. Peter becoming a leader is only after his college years and while he was a professor/had already married MJ. Before that he was never one of the top heroes on the list.
 

Billbofet

Member
Yea, but he's still a high schooler in these movies. Peter becoming a leader is only after his college years and while he was a professor/had already married MJ. Before that he was never one of the top heroes on the list.
Right, but I'm just saying I don't see him becoming that character and would love to be wrong. I genuinely like TH.
 
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