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Sonic Mania |OT| Dreams Come True

J

Jofamo

Member
Berordn said:
You can probably assume that
Metallic Madness was brought back to production in order to assist in the creation of TM, which you directly proceed to after fighting Egg-Gacha
. At this point the only mystery is why
we go from Stardust Speedway on Little Planet back to Hydrocity on Angel Island, and later from Oil Ocean back to Lava Reef, again on Angel Island.
Aside from those there's enough hints to link the rest together.
Click to expand...

There's a suspicious lack of transitions in the later half of the game, and some unused assets that I think were meant to be used in them.

It looks like
Eggman somehow tethered Little Planet to Angel Island. In Lava Reef, you can see Little Planet through the holes/craters in the ceiling BG (where you'd see the Death Egg in S3K). There's also a new construction/production city in lava Reef, with a big rocket in the BG that looks the same as the platform you fight Heavy Rider on. So I guess you'd have rode the rocket to Little Planet from there? There's also an unused cliff edge you can debug to after that fight. Knuckles actually has a transition in this level, in that he rides the old Sky Sanctuary teleported.

Transition wise, I guess it's;

Angel Island -> Green Hill
Phantom Ruby Warp

Green Hill -> Chemical Plant
Phantom Ruby Warp

Chemical Plant -> Studiopolis
Zoom Pipe

Studiopolis -> Flying Battery
They jump onto it ala S3K

Flying Battery -> Press Garden
This one, I guess Flying Battery docks at Eggmans press factory?

Press Garden -> Stardust Speedway
Phantom Ruby Warp. Eggman wants Metal Sonic back, and I guess starts his plans to use Little Planet again.

Stardust Speedway -> Hydrocity
Fuck if I know. If we assume Eggman has tethered Little Planet to Angel Island, then somehow Sonic and Co get knocked off the planet?

Hydrocity -> Mirage Saloon
I guess we have to assume Mirage Saloon is located in a desert on Angel Island? A transition here would be nice, but this is also seems like a little time skip, as Sonic and Co group back up and recover the Tornado.

Mirage Saloon --> Oil Ocean
Sonic and Co use the Gun gimmick to shoot over there. I guess this Oil Ocean isn't the same one from Sonic 2, but a new one Eggman has created on Angel Island to fuel his growth on Little Planet.

Oil Ocean -> Lava Reef
Easier to explain, Sonic and Co somehow end up underground from Oil Ocean, back into Lava Reef.

Lava Reef -> Metallic Madness
Sonic and Tails use a rocket from Lava Reef, Knuckles uses a Hidden Palace teleporter. They end up back on Little Planet.

Metallic Madess -> Titanic Monarch
Sonic and Co. travel to the giant Eggrobo being built on Little Planet. Enter it, travel up it and face the final battle.
 
I

IronicSonic

Member
Psyrgery ES said:
Finally got all the gold medals today!

Feelsgood.gif

Man that last stage with the 4 balls qnd 15 rings was a bitch to complete, how did you manage to beat it?
Click to expand...

At the start hit one of those white spheres to move backward and use a yellow sphere to jump backwards to the last line of four ring before you get the final blue sphere. At the fourth ring, push forward and do the path normally
 
J

jman2050

Member
Sixfortyfive said:
UX7EdcZ.png
Click to expand...

Okay so a bunch of people I've seen did the special stage this way but I'm almost positive the intended solution is to enter one of the sphere/ring pairs backwards. Once you collect the sphere, just press forward and it's an easy perfect.

That's how I did it anyway.
 
S

Shaanyboi

Banned
Man I am just not feeling this...

Like it is more fun than anything with Sonic's name in god knows how long (maybe ever considering I never really liked Sonic), but there's still this stuff that never clicked with me in those games.

Like the game still has these sections that, while fun to look at, just take control away from you in such a way that I'm not learning anything. I'm not learning the map, I'm not learning how certain areas connect to one another and where secret stuff might be. Like I'll just kinda end up at the end of a level without thinking "yay I beat it" and instead just feeling like I missed a bunch of stuff and wound up here without intention because I got bounced off the wrong thing.

As a result, I don't feel like I'm learning anything of how to play this better. I'm not just charging through the map, but still the game will knock you into areas you don't mean to go at all.
 
O

Opa-Pa

Member
Damn, thanks a lot for clearing that up guys, I'm pretty slow with this stuff.

Anyway, OOZ Act 2 boss' thing where you die instantly if you touch the oil while standing on the platform sucks, but once you avoid that the fight is pretty fair and fun IMO.
 
S

Sixfortyfive

He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
Shaanyboi said:
Man I am just not feeling this...

Like it is more fun than anything with Sonic's name in god knows how long (maybe ever considering I never really liked Sonic), but there's still this stuff that never clicked with me in those games.

Like the game still has these sections that, while fun to look at, just take control away from you in such a way that I'm not learning anything. I'm not learning the map, I'm not learning how certain areas connect to one another and where secret stuff might be. Like I'll just kinda end up at the end of a level without thinking "yay I beat it" and instead just feeling like I missed a bunch of stuff and wound up here without intention because I got bounced off the wrong thing.

As a result, I don't feel like I'm learning anything of how to play this better. I'm not just charging through the map, but still the game will knock you into areas you don't mean to go at all.
Click to expand...

You're overthinking it.

Just go with the flow and deliberately pick a different path on the next playthrough, perhaps even with a different character.

Most of the levels are designed in such a way that you're not even really supposed to see half of it on the first play.
 
R

RagnarokX

Member
Jofamo said:
Whats the deal with being able to damage the
Heavies during the Titanic Monarch Act 2 boss?

On all three of my playthroughs so far, I've just avoided their attacks until you're warped back to Eggman to continue damaging him. I can usually get enough hits in to defeat him after the second warp (Shinboi Heavy).

But you can also damage the heavies during those sections. Heavy Gunner for instance, can be damaged by jumping into the horizontal rockets. Shinobi can be jumped into, as can Magician. Rider is one I've only seen a couple of times, but he takes damage too.

I jumped into the fight in debug mode and spawned a bunch of invincibility boxes, and went ham on Shinobi. Over the course of 2 warps to his area, I must have hit him about 20 times, but nothing happens.

What's the point of being able to do damage to these guys?
Click to expand...

My thoughts are that the 4 Heavies were originally meant to be fought as the bosses of Titanic Monarch Act 2 similar to the Mecha Sonic fights in Sky Sanctuary. Titanic Monarch Act 2 is split into 4 paths, each represented by a Heavy in the stained glass window in the background. Each time you reach the end of a path you are teleported back to the center of the level. I believe that originally you would have had to fight a Heavy rematch at the end of each path. They decided these boss fights were excessive, so they made them sort of like easter eggs in the Eggman fight.

Jofamo said:
There's a suspicious lack of transitions in the later half of the game, and some unused assets that I think were meant to be used in them.

It looks like
Eggman somehow tethered Little Planet to Angel Island. In Lava Reef, you can see Little Planet through the holes/craters in the ceiling BG (where you'd see the Death Egg in S3K). There's also a new construction/production city in lava Reef, with a big rocket in the BG that looks the same as the platform you fight Heavy Rider on. So I guess you'd have rode the rocket to Little Planet from there? There's also an unused cliff edge you can debug to after that fight. Knuckles actually has a transition in this level, in that he rides the old Sky Sanctuary teleported.

Transition wise, I guess it's;

Angel Island -> Green Hill
Phantom Ruby Warp

Green Hill -> Chemical Plant
Phantom Ruby Warp

Chemical Plant -> Studiopolis
Zoom Pipe

Studiopolis -> Flying Battery
They jump onto it ala S3K

Flying Battery -> Press Garden
This one, I guess Flying Battery docks at Eggmans press factory?

Press Garden -> Stardust Speedway
Phantom Ruby Warp. Eggman wants Metal Sonic back, and I guess starts his plans to use Little Planet again.

Stardust Speedway -> Hydrocity
Fuck if I know. If we assume Eggman has tethered Little Planet to Angel Island, then somehow Sonic and Co get knocked off the planet?

Hydrocity -> Mirage Saloon
I guess we have to assume Mirage Saloon is located in a desert on Angel Island? A transition here would be nice, but this is also seems like a little time skip, as Sonic and Co group back up and recover the Tornado.

Mirage Saloon --> Oil Ocean
Sonic and Co use the Gun gimmick to shoot over there. I guess this Oil Ocean isn't the same one from Sonic 2, but a new one Eggman has created on Angel Island to fuel his growth on Little Planet.

Oil Ocean -> Lava Reef
Easier to explain, Sonic and Co somehow end up underground from Oil Ocean, back into Lava Reef.

Lava Reef -> Metallic Madness
Sonic and Tails use a rocket from Lava Reef, Knuckles uses a Hidden Palace teleporter. They end up back on Little Planet.

Metallic Madess -> Titanic Monarch
Sonic and Co. travel to the giant Eggrobo being built on Little Planet. Enter it, travel up it and face the final battle.
Click to expand...

What's interesting is that
Hydrocity Zone begins with a stage transition; the same one it had in Sonic 3. The end of Stardust Speedway in general is poorly handled. Eggman was looking for Metal Sonic and then doesn't show up at all in Stardust Speedway. It would have been much better if he was controlling the death wall in the final phase of the Metal Sonic fight and then blasted Sonic away when they defeated Metal. Metal shouldn't have been a straightforward fight and should have been more like a race.

I don't like the idea Mirage Saloon and Oil Ocean being on Angel Island and they really need to explain why Sonic and Tails are suddenly with Knuckles and on the Tornado...

Thinking it over... let's see. Okay. They also needed to explain why Angel Island is in the ocean again, but how about this:

Angel Island crashed into the ocean near Oil Ocean Zone. The Sandopolis Desert is near the coast of Angel Island, so Eggman built Mirage Saloon there and connected it to Oil Ocean Zone via railroad. Lava Reef is also near the coast of Angel Island.

Then they were supposed to reach Little Planet once more via the rocket in Lava Reef.
 
N

Neith

Banned
Shaanyboi said:
Man I am just not feeling this...

Like it is more fun than anything with Sonic's name in god knows how long (maybe ever considering I never really liked Sonic), but there's still this stuff that never clicked with me in those games.

Like the game still has these sections that, while fun to look at, just take control away from you in such a way that I'm not learning anything. I'm not learning the map, I'm not learning how certain areas connect to one another and where secret stuff might be. Like I'll just kinda end up at the end of a level without thinking "yay I beat it" and instead just feeling like I missed a bunch of stuff and wound up here without intention because I got bounced off the wrong thing.

As a result, I don't feel like I'm learning anything of how to play this better. I'm not just charging through the map, but still the game will knock you into areas you don't mean to go at all.
Click to expand...

Generations and Transformed are both extremely great games IMO. I don't know how you can miss those.
 
S

Shaanyboi

Banned
Sixfortyfive said:
You're overthinking it.

Just go with the flow and deliberately pick a different path on the next playthrough, perhaps even with a different character.

Most of the levels are designed in such a way that you're not even really supposed to see half of it on the first play.
Click to expand...
I mean it's not even a matter of seeing it on the first play, or even seeing all of it at all. I've played through a good chunk of the levels atleast twice, but like I'll be trying to get up to an area, bump into an enemy, get knocked back and now I'm somewhere completely differe-- oh fuck I just hit a spring and now I'm-- oh fuck now I've got that fire power-up and now burning down this bridge and -- oh shit it's a chaos emerald minigame, I should -- oh fuck the floor collapsed


Like it just keeps going and I'm not sure how I'm supposed to react and think "okay i should not do this" because all this shit is coming at me with zero heads up.
 
S

Sixfortyfive

He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
UncleSporky said:
Where did you get this map? I've been looking around for them but haven't found them online yet. I beat all of them but I was curious how they all looked from a bird's eye view just for fun.
Click to expand...

That specific stage just happens to consist of 4 duplicates of a single pattern from the old lock-on game, each of which are mapped out on this site:

https://bsgen-new.neocities.org

That particular Mania stage uses nothing but pattern #5 from that website. In fact, if you click the "Few 4" link in the sample list at the bottom, you'll find the exact same layout. (That's what I print-screened to make the above image.)
 
CampbellzSoup

CampbellzSoup

Member
I'm totally with all of you noticing the glaring lack of transition scenes in later levels...not necessarily s huge deal but they are such a nice touch in Sonic 3
 
R

RagnarokX

Member
CampbellzSoup said:
Mirage saloon is on Angel island?
Click to expand...

Sure, why not. Sonic goes backwards through
Hydrocity to reach Angel Island Zone, which is where they left the Tornado, then as they are flying back to Little Planet over the Sandopolis Desert they are shot down and crash in Mirage Saloon. Angel Island landed in the ocean close to Westside Island and Oil Ocean Zone.
 
F

FeenixRising

Banned
Sonic Mania OST anecdotes from today's Tee Lopes live stream:

The Streets of Rage 2 OST gave birth at least one of the Sonic Mania songs

He names Wave 131 (From 1:15 - 1:30 more specifically) as his inspiration for Metallic Madness Act 2
 
J

JackelZXA

Member
I'd love if we got stage transitions patched. I think that maybe because Press Garden is a snowy level that originally you were gonna drop from flying battery, snowboard on the door, all the way down the snowcaps and crash into Garden Press Act 1. I can wrap my head around oil ocean and mirage saloon being built over sandopolis. The transitions make more sense knowing about that spot behind heavy rider, and I really hope that's something that gets added back in at some point. I'd do a full replay to see all the animations again.
 
R

RagnarokX

Member
JackelZXA said:
I'd love if we got stage transitions patched. I think that maybe because Press Garden is a snowy level that originally you were gonna drop from flying battery, snowboard on the door, all the way down the snowcaps and crash into Garden Press Act 1. I can wrap my head around oil ocean and mirage saloon being built over sandopolis. The transitions make more sense knowing about that spot behind heavy rider, and I really hope that's something that gets added back in at some point. I'd do a full replay to see all the animations again.
Click to expand...
Imagine if between
Lava Reef and Metallic Madness there was going to be a new zone based on Egg Rocket from Sonic Advance but done in a way that wasn't frustrating.

And my idea is Angel Island just landed close enough to Oil Ocean for Eggman to build a railroad bridge to it.
 
J

JackelZXA

Member
RagnarokX said:
Imagine if between
Lava Reef and Metallic Madness there was going to be a new zone based on Egg Rocket from Sonic Advance but done in a way that wasn't frustrating.

And my idea is Angel Island just landed close enough to Oil Ocean for Eggman to build a railroad bridge to it.
Click to expand...

It did just occur to me that oil ocean makes sense to fuel the rocket from lava reef.

Everything before Stardust Speedway Act 2 is before Eggman tethered little planet to angel island, and everything after is the second half of the game. if all this were in the game or gets patched in with the pc version it'll be a a really solid sonic 3&k rivaling storyline.

Maybe angel island sunk and knuckles called tails and sonic to come help him figure it out which is why he's facing towards the left on angel island, maybe he found the ruby and hid it nearby and the egg robos found it? about oil ocean...even if it's the original one or a new one it kind of doesnt matter because oil ocean WAS an installation and not a significant place. It makes sense to also just have eggman build alot of shit over sandopolis, and it'd make sense for lava reef to be underneath a new oil ocean because it was under sandopolis...
 
N

Net_Wrecker

Member
FeenixRising said:
Sonic Mania OST anecdotes from today's Tee Lopes live stream:

The Streets of Rage 2 OST gave birth at least one of the Sonic Mania songs

He names Wave 131 (From 1:15 - 1:30 more specifically) as his inspiration for Metallic Madness Act 2
Click to expand...

Heh, I just remarked that this track and certain other elements on the soundtrack reminded me of SoR2 yesterday.

TEE LOPES THE GOD 2ND COMING OF YUZO KOSHIRO AND DAVID WISE
 
R

RagnarokX

Member
JackelZXA said:
It did just occur to me that oil ocean makes sense to fuel the rocket from lava reef.

Everything before Stardust Speedway Act 2 is before Eggman tethered little planet to angel island, and everything after is the second half of the game. if all this were in the game or gets patched in with the pc version it'll be a a really solid sonic 3&k rivaling storyline.

Maybe angel island sunk and knuckles called tails and sonic to come help him figure it out which is why he's facing towards the left on angel island, maybe he found the ruby and hid it nearby and the egg robos found it? about oil ocean...even if it's the original one or a new one it kind of doesnt matter because oil ocean WAS an installation and not a significant place. It makes sense to also just have eggman build alot of shit over sandopolis, and it'd make sense for lava reef to be underneath a new oil ocean because it was under sandopolis...
Click to expand...

The intro shows that Angel Island is in the ocean again, but that's never explained.
 
J

JackelZXA

Member
RagnarokX said:
The intro shows that Angel Island is in the ocean again, but that's never explained.
Click to expand...

yeah that's why i think it's all like...knuckles is waiting for tails and sonic to arrive because he doesn't know why angel island sank despite the master emerald being where it belongs and they were gonna help out since this is canonically the first time they've been "friends". it's probably just phantom ruby did some bullshit or something

unknown.png
Click to expand...

I think the sandopolis into LRZ thing can be drawn as a similarity to MSZ->OOZ->LRZ thing enough that it could be a second Oil Ocean. I was talking to a friend about it and drew that image.

Oil Ocean was on West Island so I dunno if that'd make much sense or whatever for it to be the same one but anyways it seems you start on Angel Island, get warped to South Island, get warped again to West Island which has had Studiopolis and Press Garden built onto it after Chemical Plant was upgraded. The city in the back of CPZ is likely studiopolis and it's interesting that the two zones that would take place on West Island would be a stage based on television and one based on newspapers. Eggman taking over the media on West Island?

Anyways after that you get warped to Little Planet, then you get sent into Little Planet's Future and it's been chained to Angel Island Zone. Either the Phantom Ruby or the Planet itself are responsible for Angel Island having sunk to sea level again. Knuckles heading to LRZ to check on the Master Emerald makes sense, and it's interesting that it's still there despite the island being sunk. Maybe it's because the Super Emeralds are broken?

Either way Sonic Tails and Knuckles all meet up after falling from Little Planet into Hydro City, they board the Tornado, and fly over Sandopolis towards Little Planet. I think it makes sense for mirage saloon and a new oil ocean to be built over sandopolis to mine oil to use to fuel whatever rocket is in the back of lava reef, and if MSZ and OOZ are close to LRZ then they're both likely Sandopolis because it was also above LRZ and was a desert. LRZ to little planet, and then it'd just be Eggman has built Titanic Monarch onto Metallic Madness.

Yeah everything makes more sense now and I'd be interested to see if they add more cutscenes with a patch (and fix some of the bugs people are finding) I think these explanations people are coming up with all work and I like that this sort of makes sense now. I also like that you warp to all 4 locations from the old games with the Ruby, and I like that the Future Sign can be used to explain Little Planet's tethering.
 
J

JackelZXA

Member
Jofamo said:
Kinda as an aside, but related in the transition talk;

I had no idea CW added a bonus ending scene to his Sonic 2 mobile port, tying the game directly to Sonic 3K. That's awesome.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPVsyR6j_3Y
Click to expand...

A fun easter egg is that ending removes the knuckles eyes from the bush if you beat DEZ as knuckles with all emeralds instead. (If you don't get all emeralds eggman taunts you with them as any character (He does the sonic 1 animation)
 
R

RagnarokX

Member
JackelZXA said:
yeah that's why i think it's all like...knuckles is waiting for tails and sonic to arrive because he doesn't know why angel island sank despite the master emerald being where it belongs and they were gonna help out since this is canonically the first time they've been "friends". it's probably just phantom ruby did some bullshit or something



I think the sandopolis into LRZ thing can be drawn as a similarity to MSZ->OOZ->LRZ thing enough that it could be a second Oil Ocean. I was talking to a friend about it and drew that image.

Oil Ocean was on West Island so I dunno if that'd make much sense or whatever for it to be the same one but anyways it seems you start on Angel Island, get warped to South Island, get warped again to West Island which has had Studiopolis and Press Garden built onto it after Chemical Plant was upgraded. The city in the back of CPZ is likely studiopolis and it's interesting that the two zones that would take place on West Island would be a stage based on television and one based on newspapers. Eggman taking over the media on West Island?

Anyways after that you get warped to Little Planet, then you get sent into Little Planet's Future and it's been chained to Angel Island Zone. Either the Phantom Ruby or the Planet itself are responsible for Angel Island having sunk to sea level again. Knuckles heading to LRZ to check on the Master Emerald makes sense, and it's interesting that it's still there despite the island being sunk. Maybe it's because the Super Emeralds are broken?

Either way Sonic Tails and Knuckles all meet up after falling from Little Planet into Hydro City, they board the Tornado, and fly over Sandopolis towards Little Planet. I think it makes sense for mirage saloon and a new oil ocean to be built over sandopolis to mine oil to use to fuel whatever rocket is in the back of lava reef, and if MSZ and OOZ are close to LRZ then they're both likely Sandopolis because it was also above LRZ and was a desert. LRZ to little planet, and then it'd just be Eggman has built Titanic Monarch onto Metallic Madness.

Yeah everything makes more sense now and I'd be interested to see if they add more cutscenes with a patch (and fix some of the bugs people are finding) I think these explanations people are coming up with all work and I like that this sort of makes sense now. I also like that you warp to all 4 locations from the old games with the Ruby, and I like that the Future Sign can be used to explain Little Planet's tethering.
Click to expand...
It makes more sense that Oil Ocean wasn't ON Westside Island but in the ocean near Westside Island. It's a floating oil platform and it's much more evil to that Eggman has polluted the ocean by spilling tons of oil into it. And with Angel Island crashing near Westside Island they can share that same ocean space where Oil Ocean is. It would have been better if the transition to Oil Ocean was Sonic and Tails riding Eggman's train.
 
J

JackelZXA

Member
RagnarokX said:
It makes more sense that Oil Ocean wasn't ON Westside Island but in the ocean near Westside Island. It's a floating oil platform and it's much more evil to that Eggman has polluted the ocean by spilling tons of oil into it. And with Angel Island crashing near Westside Island they can share that same ocean space where Oil Ocean is. It would have been better if the transition to Oil Ocean was Sonic and Tails riding Eggman's train.
Click to expand...

But why would lava reef zone be underneath west island? You don't see any water when you shoot over to OOZ. It being a second oil ocean still makes sense and there's no conflicts with other zones.
 
R

RagnarokX

Member
JackelZXA said:
But why would lava reef zone be underneath west island? You don't see any water when you shoot over to OOZ. It being a second oil ocean still makes sense and there's no conflicts with other zones.
Click to expand...

Why are you assuming Lava Reef is under Oil Ocean Zone? The transition to Lava Reef could have been them hopping on a submarine and sailing into Lava Reef through a seaside cave. You don't see the oil ocean at all in the transition because it's below the horizon created by the plateaus, but it obviously exists.
 
J

JackelZXA

Member
RagnarokX said:
Why are you assuming Lava Reef is under Oil Ocean Zone? The transition to Lava Reef could have been them hopping on a submarine and sailing into Lava Reef through a seaside cave. You don't see the oil ocean at all in the transition because it's below the horizon created by the plateaus, but it obviously exists.
Click to expand...

it could be whatever but oil ocean doesnt have to be anything special either.
 
J

Jofamo

Member
JackelZXA said:
it could be whatever but oil ocean doesnt have to be anything special either.
Click to expand...

In regards to
Oil Ocean Zone, both in Sonic 2 and Mania;

TBH, in my entire time playing Sonic games, I've never viewed Oil Ocean zone as being located at sea. I don't see how that makes sense, and don't take the name literally.

Rather, I've always viewed it as being set in a desert like environment (like Oil Fields), in part due to the hazy-hot looking BG in Sonic 2. The 'Ocean' part of the name, for me, always simply referred to the amount of oil Eggman was extracting, and creating giant basins of oil around his plant. I don't think the structures of the zone, in the foreground and background, look much like an oil rigging platform at sea at all.

In Sonic 2, you move from Mystic Cave to Oil Ocean to Metropolis. I know transitions never really existed in Sonic 2, but I don't see why or how Sonic would have went out to sea, only to return back to Westside Island.

So I'm calling it that Oil Ocean in Mania is a new Oil Drilling plant located on Angel Island directly, right next to Sandopolis like you said. It makes the most sense to me (the train from Mirage Saloon, and it leading directly to Lava Reef).
 
J

jmartoine

Member
I had no idea people cared about stage transitions so much that they would go on to map and theorycraft the locations of the zones. Colour me impressed!
 
M

Mark1

Member
They need to bring the cutscenes back for later levels. Patch them in or something, as the story is becoming more confusing with all these theories.
 
M

MineralCraver420

Banned
Does (late game spoiler)
Titanic Monarch
Act 2 have anything cool in it? I have been liking the game, but I don't like backtracking through super long levels after game overs, so I haven't bothered to make effort to get to Act 2.
 
R

RagnarokX

Member
Jofamo said:
In regards to
Oil Ocean Zone, both in Sonic 2 and Mania;

TBH, in my entire time playing Sonic games, I've never viewed Oil Ocean zone as being located at sea. I don't see how that makes sense, and don't take the name literally.

Rather, I've always viewed it as being set in a desert like environment (like Oil Fields), in part due to the hazy-hot looking BG in Sonic 2. The 'Ocean' part of the name, for me, always simply referred to the amount of oil Eggman was extracting, and creating giant basins of oil around his plant. I don't think the structures of the zone, in the foreground and background, look much like an oil rigging platform at sea at all.

In Sonic 2, you move from Mystic Cave to Oil Ocean to Metropolis. I know transitions never really existed in Sonic 2, but I don't see why or how Sonic would have went out to sea, only to return back to Westside Island.

So I'm calling it that Oil Ocean in Mania is a new Oil Drilling plant located on Angel Island directly, right next to Sandopolis like you said. It makes the most sense to me (the train from Mirage Saloon, and it leading directly to Lava Reef).
Click to expand...

You're assuming that Metropolis is on land. Metropolis could be an off-shore base.

The rippling sun happens at sea.
https://i.imgur.com/yOKfW4X.jpg http://imgur.com/6Hku38a
Oil derricks burn oil and release lots of heat and smog, which increases the effect. I always felt like Oil Ocean drew inspiration from the Exxon Valdez oil spill in 1989, which made oil spills and pollution a hot topic in the early 90s.
 
J

JackelZXA

Member
MineralCraver420 said:
Does (late game spoiler)
Titanic Monarch
Act 2 have anything cool in it? I have been liking the game, but I don't like backtracking through super long levels after game overs, so I haven't bothered to make effort to get to Act 2.
Click to expand...

That's why sonic games have the alternate routes, so you have something new to see when you replay levels after a gameover! ;p
 
J

JackelZXA

Member
RagnarokX said:
You're assuming that Metropolis is on land. Metropolis could be an off-shore base.

The rippling sun happens at sea.
https://i.imgur.com/yOKfW4X.jpg http://imgur.com/6Hku38a
Oil derricks burn oil and release lots of heat and smog, which increases the effect. I always felt like Oil Ocean drew inspiration from the Exxon Valdez oil spill in 1989, which made oil spills and pollution a hot topic in the early 90s.
Click to expand...

I think you're assuming alot. Metropolis out at sea? It's a city! Why would it be out at sea? There's no reason for it at all! You have to assume a WHOLE LOT to come to that conclusion. Oil Ocean (Mania) being in sandopolis next to mirage saloon is very simple and requires nothing to work other than "Oh the desert, and it's right above Lava Reef". It's really simple and the most likely scenario, rather than completely rewriting sonic 2 so that the entire game takes place out in the pacific ocean or whatever.

Sonic_2_Level_Map_Concept_02.png
Click to expand...

Okay so I checked the sonic 2 concept arts that Sega released recently and oil ocean is in the water, but it's more of a....would that be a sea if it's inland and has land on all but one side? Additionally, it is located next to deserts and pyramids, so it is meant to have those aspects to it.

Something I just noticed is it goes: Desert, Oil, Mountain. These 3 correspond to Mirage Saloon, which is based partially on dust hill concept art, Oil Ocean itself, and Lava Reef, which takes place in a mountain.
 
H

Hitlersaurus Christ

Banned
tAxSMUm.jpg

JOVqUOp.jpg

Oil Ocean is in the water and Metropolis Zone is on land in the original concept for Sonic 2, for what it's worth. Oil Ocean was a bad future version of a lake zone.

As for Mania, I figured it was the same Oil Ocean and Mirage Saloon is on Westside Island where Sand Shower Zone (dust hill) would have been.
 
J

JackelZXA

Member
Wondering if those sonic 2 island concepts at all influence a Mania 2 thing? Maybe having sonic cd time periods but where you play through a whole time period of zones, then the next time period of zones, or something like that? I wonder if that original sonic 2 time travel concept would have been fun or not?
 
H

Hitlersaurus Christ

Banned
JackelZXA said:
Wondering if those sonic 2 island concepts at all influence a Mania 2 thing? Maybe having sonic cd time periods but where you play through a whole time period of zones, then the next time period of zones, or something like that? I wonder if that original sonic 2 time travel concept would have been fun or not?
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The maps were revealed well after Mania had started development so I doubt it.
 
R

RagnarokX

Member
JackelZXA said:
I think you're assuming alot. Metropolis out at sea? It's a city! Why would it be out at sea? There's no reason for it at all! You have to assume a WHOLE LOT to come to that conclusion. Oil Ocean (Mania) being in sandopolis next to mirage saloon is very simple and requires nothing to work other than "Oh the desert, and it's right above Lava Reef". It's really simple and the most likely scenario, rather than completely rewriting sonic 2 so that the entire game takes place out in the pacific ocean or whatever.
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I'm not assuming anything. I'm responding to assumptions that Oil Ocean and Metropolis have to be on Westside Island with the possibility that they're not. Oil Ocean definitely has an offshore oil rig theme with the the level being on a floating rig and the enemies consisting of octopi, sea horses, and Eggman attacking in a submarine.

But don't take my word for it. The concept for Oil Ocean was always for it to take place on the ocean in a bay: http://info.sonicretro.org/images/b/b2/Sonic_2_Level_Map_Concept_02.png

Which was to be a ruined polluted version of a non-polluted ocean: http://info.sonicretro.org/images/2/20/Sonic_2_Level_Map_Concept_01.png

JackelZXA said:
Okay so I checked the sonic 2 concept arts that Sega released recently and oil ocean is in the water, but it's more of a....would that be a sea if it's inland and has land on all but one side? Additionally, it is located next to deserts and pyramids, so it is meant to have those aspects to it.[/SPOILER]
Click to expand...

Hitlersaurus Christ said:
tAxSMUm.jpg

JOVqUOp.jpg

Oil Ocean is in the water and Metropolis Zone is on land in the original concept for Sonic 2, for what it's worth. Oil Ocean was a bad future version of a lake zone.

As for Mania, I figured it was the same Oil Ocean and Mirage Saloon is on Westside Island where Sand Shower Zone (dust hill) would have been.
Click to expand...
It's a bay, which is still ocean.

Just like the Red Sea and Persian Gulf are still ocean and have lots of oil rigs.
4SKb5zqm.jpg
 
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