Spider-Man 1/2 vs Amazing Spider-Man 1/2
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It could bomb but Marvel still will not get the rights back until Sony itself has fully gone under.
edit: Marvel has more misses than hits anyway, Sony's done a better job with Spider-Man than Marvel has for most properties.
gutter_trash
Banned
a Spdiey movie is only official with JJ
So in the films where there is pretty much no character development you though it was only a bit forced? In ASM they pretty much like each other from the get go making the relationship itself pretty bland.
cuevas. PhD.
Member
Amazing 1 sucks so not bothering with 2.
GuitarAtomik
Member
Raimi and co weren't getting the 4th movie together fast enough for the studio's liking and it would have been pretty expensive to sign everyone again. So they went with the plan b they had which was a reboot script. Everything I've heard about Raimi's SM4 sounded just as bad as SM3 though. As mediocre as ASM was, I'm pretty sure we dodged a bullet.
what? ASM2 may not out-gross Captain America 2. They've turned Iron Man from a c-tier superhero to the biggest Marvel superhero in the world, judging from the box office. They turned fucking Thor into a $600 million movie.Avengers is the third highest grossing film of all time!
I'm talking about quality. Thor for example is shit wall-to-wall. At least ASM 1 and 2 were entertaining.
family_guy
Member
I like Spiderman 2 the best out of all of them but feel that The Amazing Spiderman films have better overall quality. They have much better acting and Spiderman is more the wisecracking Spiderman that I like from the comics. Tobi and Dunst were boring and had no chemistry and Spiderman was too serious in the Raimi films. I will say that the original films had the better villains.
I actually just finished watching TASM2, TASM1, and SP1 in the span it two days. Tomorrow is going to be SP2.
I absolutely loved SP1 and SP2 when they came out and for many years after. Watching them over and over and getting the feels each time.
That being said, the slightly darker tone to TASM1/2, amazing cast and chemistry between the characters, and the less campy tone and way cooler fights make me like TASM1/2 better. I say that because the Garfield/Stone romance in the movie is top-tier and outweighs the other weaknesses in the movies for myself, personally. It's just preference.
Basically, I feel like the strengths of the new movies dwarf their weaknesses, and--personally--also outweigh the well-roundedness of the first ones.
I absolutely loved SP1 and SP2 when they came out and for many years after. Watching them over and over and getting the feels each time.
That being said, the slightly darker tone to TASM1/2, amazing cast and chemistry between the characters, and the less campy tone and way cooler fights make me like TASM1/2 better. I say that because the Garfield/Stone romance in the movie is top-tier and outweighs the other weaknesses in the movies for myself, personally. It's just preference.
Basically, I feel like the strengths of the new movies dwarf their weaknesses, and--personally--also outweigh the well-roundedness of the first ones.
I thought both Thor films were infinitely more fun than both ASM films, especially Thor 2. Hiddleston's Loki is incredible, dude has had far better performances than any of the villains in the Spidey films.
GuitarAtomik
Member
He doesn't want to give it to him because he honestly doesn't know what it will do. For all he knows it will make him worse (surprise! He was right). Not to mention giving him his blood is definitely going to out his identity.
There are deleted scenes of him wrecking Oscorp more. You can see some of it in the trailers. Maybe we could have used a quick shot or two but I don't know why not showing that makes you come to the conclusion that he didn't give a fuck anymore. He also wanted revenge on Spider-Man for leaving him SOL (from his perspective) so it would make sense to eventually head out there to confront him.
In terms of quality I would put the whole MCU over AMS1&2/OGS3.
OGS 2 is top tier though.
I don't hate the ASM films or anything, but I just don't like nowhere near as much as I liked the Raimi films. The counterargument I always see is that the ASM movies are better adaptions from the comics, but I don't think that necessarily makes them better movies to non-hardcore fans.
For example, I just can't relate to Peter in ASM. He skateboards in the hallways, and Gwen just has a crush on him out of nowhere. She even invites him to dinner, IIRC. In the Raimi films, he works his way from the very bottom and (through 2 movies) he finally gets the girl he wants.
I just think that the Raimi films had more heart and more serious themes (especially in 2 where he learns the tough responsibility of being a hero) despite some corny and outdated moments. The pizza scene from the beginning of SM2(Whoa, he stole that guy's PIZZAS!), the parade attack from SM1, and even the origin story in SM1.....IMO all those plus more were much better than anything from the 2 ASM movies.
Also, Danny Elfman's score>Horner's>>Zimmer's wub wub and Superman-like music.
For example, I just can't relate to Peter in ASM. He skateboards in the hallways, and Gwen just has a crush on him out of nowhere. She even invites him to dinner, IIRC. In the Raimi films, he works his way from the very bottom and (through 2 movies) he finally gets the girl he wants.
I just think that the Raimi films had more heart and more serious themes (especially in 2 where he learns the tough responsibility of being a hero) despite some corny and outdated moments. The pizza scene from the beginning of SM2(Whoa, he stole that guy's PIZZAS!), the parade attack from SM1, and even the origin story in SM1.....IMO all those plus more were much better than anything from the 2 ASM movies.
Also, Danny Elfman's score>Horner's>>Zimmer's wub wub and Superman-like music.
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Even this?
That isn't in the MCU. :/
Even this?
Not MCU though.
For the record, i loved both Ghost Rider movies, they're AWFUL but both have the benefit of Cage hamming it up to 11.
Really think that anyone calling ASM Parker superior has not watched SM1 recently. The first five minutes alone have more development and insight into the character than the entirety of ASM1. (Peter and the bus sequence) Perfectly sets up his current status in life, his fondness for a girl, and how others view and treat him in his daily life. You unravel bits and pieces more as May/Ben and Harry arrive on scene a few minutes later allowing him to show off his lighter side and humility.
ASM1...he skateboards! He has 'tude! He stands up against bully's and police chief's(even when they weren't even bothering him in the first place!) He is a loner that barely talks to anyone at all! Who is he? What do others think of him? Is he a nerd? A rebel? A loner? I dunno because he treats everyone like utter shit, ignores them completely and mopes, or stammers nervously and shies back away to his hidey hole!!
We at least know he has daddy "gene smarts" for sure because he is ahead of the curve for R&D out of his own bedroom than the entirety of Oscorp!
ASM1...he skateboards! He has 'tude! He stands up against bully's and police chief's(even when they weren't even bothering him in the first place!) He is a loner that barely talks to anyone at all! Who is he? What do others think of him? Is he a nerd? A rebel? A loner? I dunno because he treats everyone like utter shit, ignores them completely and mopes, or stammers nervously and shies back away to his hidey hole!!
We at least know he has daddy "gene smarts" for sure because he is ahead of the curve for R&D out of his own bedroom than the entirety of Oscorp!
Killing_Joke
Member
I don't see anything great about Gwen. Their "chemistry" is nothing memorable. Just typical teenage romantic bullshit. Peter/MJ at least had a more fleshed out story with their relationship. Gwen/Peter get together just because...? Gwen disobeys her dead father wishes because...? Peter put her life at risk because...? They're just together for the sake of the plot of the shitty movie. It was so bad her death had 0 impact on me.
Yeah realized that now derp. 3:15AM stormtrooper is more ditzy than usual.
He just makes anything funny I think.
FullMetalx117
Member
the music is much better in the originals, borderline iconic.
in ASM the music is the most bland, forgettable, uninspiring, "is there even music?" P.O.S. out there
in ASM the music is the most bland, forgettable, uninspiring, "is there even music?" P.O.S. out there
If I remember right Osborn wanted to kill the board of directors at Oscorp because they voted him out of the company. Spider-Man stops him and he decides to try and get Spider-Man to join him because he's the only person standing in his way/able to stop him. Spidey refuses and becomes an enemy/obstacle. Osborn starts going crazier, starts getting suspicious that Peter is Spider-Man etc.
Also, Anne Hatheway as Black Cat and John Malkovich as Vulture sounds soo sick. Especially after Burn After Reading
He finds out, for sure, that it will not cure him. He finds this out from his dad on the computer. It seems like it's the whole point of that scene-oh hey, look, Spidey knows that this will harm Harry, now he can tell him why he can't do this. But instead he just doesn't tell him. He knows damn well that it will hurt him, and doesn't choose to tell him that.
Those scenes would've helped, yes. And yes, Spidey did leave him SOL, I will agree. But it doesn't make sense that he didn't seem to do much while Spidey was actually fighing Electro. But, again, it's the previous thing-that Spidey actively knew that the venom would harm Harry, and didn't inform him that he was certain that it would-that bugs me more. It basically makes Spidey a bad guy in my eyes, knowing that he could have possibly prevented this whole thing, but didn't.
Bland, but not really forced. Two attractive people being attracted to each other that both happen to share an interest in science isn't really a stretch. What is a stretch is them breaking up and getting back together again in ASM2. But what I was talking about originally was that their chemistry is better than Tobey and Kirsten in the Raimi trilogy. Doesn't mean that how their relationship plays out is better than them, but I think their chemistry is.
That isn't why it was rebooted though. They already had Raimi and the returning cast. Tobey was being paid $50 million for 4&5 being filmed back to back. The problem was Raimi wanted a lot of money to make Spider-Man 4, and he never got a script he liked. I assume he was under pressure considering how much crap Spider-Man 3 got, despite the amount of money it made. So he backed out with Tobey and Kirsten. Sony didn't really have much of a choice.
To be fair, the things pitched for SM4 were also all being turned down. Felicia Hardy wasn't going to be Vulturess though (which was a big rumor), Raimi said that she would have been Black Cat. There were rumors that she would have been a love interest for Peter after MJ dumped him.
I like the new ones. Perhaps a bit better than the old ones overall, but Spider-man 2 is actually a great movie.
I do wonder what people would think of ASM1/2 if they were the first modern big screen adaptations (i.e Raimi's Spider-mna movies didn't exist).
It's tough though, because the new ones seem to rip-off a lot of stuff from the first, or at least ape a few things.
I do wonder what people would think of ASM1/2 if they were the first modern big screen adaptations (i.e Raimi's Spider-mna movies didn't exist).
It's tough though, because the new ones seem to rip-off a lot of stuff from the first, or at least ape a few things.
GuitarAtomik
Member
Thank that through though. How would he relay that info to Harry?
Peter: "Hey I found a video of my dad that says the venom would only work on people in his bloodline. So don't take it!"
Harry: "So Spider-Man has to be related to your father. Aren't you related to your father?"
Peter: "Shit!"
Keep in mind Peter is of the understanding that the only thing left of the venom is in his blood (which is why Harry is asking for it) so he wouldn't know to warn him to not take any because none of them knew more still existed.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
Pure enjoyment:
Begins > Rises >/= Returns >>> TDK >/= 89
Quality:
TDK > Begins > Rises > Returns > 89
Pharaoh 117
Member
Raimi's, no contest.
The train scene in 2 still is the most heroic scene in any superhero movie IMO.
The train scene in 2 still is the most heroic scene in any superhero movie IMO.
Incendiary
Banned
I think this is the only casting that would actually make me happy and have a chance at beating J.K. Simmons.
lol Raimi's are vastly vastly superior. McGuire is a way better Peter Parker, I like the Mary Jane character better than Gwen, they had the more appropriate balance of humor and drama, the villians were way better/more well-done, better casting, more visually pleasing, better more memorable an epic music, etc.
It's really no contest. And I think the Amaazing Spiderman movies are pretty good, too.
It's really no contest. And I think the Amaazing Spiderman movies are pretty good, too.
Elwood Blues
Member
The rain drops keep fallin' on my head sequence in spiderman 2 is the greatest sequence in any superhero movie ever. If you can't respect that, then I can't respect you.
Who knows what could be said for ASM films.
Product placement music.
The moment it plays this is what I think.
They give Webb a checklist of songs he has to choose from, lol.
The fun thing is, Spidy 1 and 2 also had product placement. But it was incorporated into the movie. Amazing gives you the vibe that music and camera was dictated by product placement.
Do they really? Lol. It doesn't feel nearly as imposed as it does in the new movies.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oozQ4yV__Vw
One of the most inappropriate songs used to convey what's happening on screen I've seen in a long time.
One of the most inappropriate songs used to convey what's happening on screen I've seen in a long time.
Dr. Pepper is the one that sticks out the most in my mind. Also in Spider-Man 2 they have an entire scene dedicated to Joe's Pizza, which I assume is a local restaurant in New York. They only serve Dr. Pepper and pizza though.
Blackstarhat
Member
only thing good about spiderman 2 were the action scenes peter losing his powers makes no fucking sense and it ruins the movie for me.
Discotheque
Banned
well they played this during the damn training sequence/where he gets acquainted with his powers.
they're fine songs but such stupid placement.
lazorexplosion
Member
None of them are very good. Spiderman just doesn't have good nemeses.
neurosisxeno
Member
I prefer the ASM Spider-Man because, he's actually Spider-Man. Like, the one from the comic. Andrew Garfield is way closer to the Peter Parker portrayed in the comics. A yound genius who was distant from everyone except his aunt and whatever love interest fit the character arch.
Sam Raimi made the movie Spider-Man into some awkward coming of age story which Spider-Man as a backdrop. The original scene where he passes out and wakes up with powers was originally written to be uncomfortably in your face about likening it to a wet dream. Peter Parker was also supposed to be extremely lanky and surprisingly strong, not short and jacked like Maguire's portrayal of him.
ASM's interpretation of Spider-Man is way closer to the one that has been popular with comic fans for decades. Tobey Maguire was miserable at trying to capture the goofy nature of the character. Every scene where he tried to do something funny he came off as nervous and miserable, compared to Garfield and the ASM Spider-Man who is constantly cracking jokes and palling around people while in costume--and flying under the radar outside of the costume.
Peter and MJ's story was completely fabricated for the original trilogy. They used a pretty generic girl next door trope to make it more believable. They are different characters at their core. Gwen was someone who fell in love with Peter Parker, and begrudginingly accepted that he was Spider-Man, MJ was someone who fell in love with Spider-Man and dealt with the fact that it was Peter Parker under the suit. Gwen and Peter fall in love and become typical high school sweethearts. Did you want to see an hour of them going on dates and awkwardly bumping into each other? Gwen disobeys her fathers wishes because she's a strong independant woman, who doesn't live in the 1930's. Peter didn't put her life in risk. She put her life in risk by following him to fight Electro at the power plant. He webbed her to the hood of a car and took off as fast as possible to keep her safe.
You're just ignoring information that was stated in the film to try and prove your point.
All the Raimi fans keep complaining about not knowing whether ASM2 was an action or a romance film.
Let's remember that the very first piece of dialogue from the Raimi films:
Who am I? You sure you want to know? The story of my life is not for the faint of heart. If somebody told you it was a happy tale, if somebody said I was just your average guy, not a care in the world... somebody lied. But let me assure you, this, like any other story worth telling, is all about a girl. [Cut to first shot of Mary Jane] That girl, The girl next door. Mary Jane Watson. The woman I loved since before I even liked girls.
How bad was that? In that Tobey voice.
But it seems the whole debate is kind of pointless. Both sides are entrenched. But Webb's are better in almost every department.
Let's remember that the very first piece of dialogue from the Raimi films:
Who am I? You sure you want to know? The story of my life is not for the faint of heart. If somebody told you it was a happy tale, if somebody said I was just your average guy, not a care in the world... somebody lied. But let me assure you, this, like any other story worth telling, is all about a girl. [Cut to first shot of Mary Jane] That girl, The girl next door. Mary Jane Watson. The woman I loved since before I even liked girls.
How bad was that? In that Tobey voice.
But it seems the whole debate is kind of pointless. Both sides are entrenched. But Webb's are better in almost every department.
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