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Spotify CEO pleads for iPhone users to stop paying through Apple's App Store
- Thread starter Dalek
- Start date
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They all charge 30% more, I think that's his point.
Yea you are right, every sub service that offer IAP costs 30% more and other services just refuse to offer it.
I can buy kindle books on Android at market rate, i can sub to netflix on android at market rate. Ios user either get Apple at market rate or pay 30% more. How does that benefit ios users at all?
How is Netflix not the market rate on iOS?
I get iTunes cards for 20-25% off, so Netflix can be below market rate for me.
Um, pretty sure Apple doesn't charge the consumer an extra 30%. Spotify itself decided to charge the consumer an extra 30% (or whatever it is) to make up for the money they'd be missing out on. Most (if not all) other subscription services charge the same rate they normally do on iOS.
I love Apple haters
mrmisterwaa
Neo Member
I would be stupid to think that it isn't worth 30% now. When you have such a fan-base - you are paying 30% for exposure to millions of users.
The only thing I don't agree with for Apple is their exposure is forced by their ecosystem. You literally have no alternatives - you have to buy applications with Apple as the "reseller".
You do not need to buy things from Valve to play the games the developers & publishers provide.
None of the music services do though.
Sir Abacus
Member
Ironically enough, 30% is Spotify's cut of their revenue.
liliththepale
Banned
Yeah, but Valve doesn't build the hardware they run on either.
hardcastlemccormick
Banned
Um, pretty sure Apple doesn't charge the consumer an extra 30%. Spotify itself decided to charge the consumer an extra 30% (or whatever it is) to make up for the money they'd be missing out on. Most (if not all) other subscription services charge the same rate they normally do on iOS.
I love Apple haters
It's not Apple hating to point out this negatively impacts app developers and subscription models. What's bad for app developers is bad for the consumer, generally. If you've got a subscription plan where you can take a 30% revenue hit, great for you guys, but for everyone else you need a solution. Supporting IAP in a sucky way is better than not at all, for the diehards or people who want to pay with iTunes giftcards.
I don't know what Apple defenders expect app developers like Spotify to do in this situation.
Ok, go buy a netflix or hulu sub on an iphone or ipad. Tell me how that works out for you.
Um, pretty sure Apple doesn't charge the consumer an extra 30%. Spotify itself decided to charge the consumer an extra 30% (or whatever it is) to make up for the money they'd be missing out on. Most (if not all) other subscription services charge the same rate they normally do on iOS.
I love Apple haters
Can you name one? You can't buy netflix or hulu on ios either (unless you count appletv as ios).
Can you buy any ebook in app on ios at market rate other than apple's? I can use google play store, kindle or any other ecosystem I choose with in app purchases. You get locked into apple and somehow thats a good thing. If I'm a apple hater, you sure are a consumer hater.
Hulu subs work fine.
I guess I was mistaken about Netflix, which I paid through Apple TV with my iTunes credits.
SirMossyBloke
Member
I went through the same issue with Rdio. Paid $12.99 through iTunes, then went to the website and saw it was listed as $9..99. When I contacted them they let me know that Apple upcharges instead of taking off their 30% from the $9.99. They showed me how to cancel and reapply through the web.
I was pissed. Fucking Apple are ripping people off.
Edit: It should also say on the app store that's it's cheaper on the web too, but I bet that's not allowed.
I was pissed. Fucking Apple are ripping people off.
Edit: It should also say on the app store that's it's cheaper on the web too, but I bet that's not allowed.
Rdio set the price, not Apple.
DOWN
Banned
A lot of people here are confused and accusing Apple of the up charge. Apple doesn't set the prices. Most apps, like retail stores do when they set prices, know their costs and set prices accordingly. Spotify is just in a weird situation since they offer their product on and off of third party stores. Just like Target is covering the cost of credit card swipe fees when they sell an item, Spotify chose to price for the store cut and pass it right to the consumer while wording it like it was Apple pricing it to make them sound innocent.
Not only isnt it allowed, they arent allowed to give you a link in the app to sign up, they aren't allowed to let you use your CC to sign up in app. Only option is IAP with +30%.
Music subscribers pay ~70% of the $10 to pubs. The other ~$3 is for their business model. Apple wants all of it and no smart business will bankrupt themselves. 1 user that gives a company a profit is better than a 100 million users that lose the company money.
The funniest part is that I bet apple music is $10 on android, no service will be $10 on IOS other than apple music
Are you sure their deal is to give 70% of the $10 to publishers? So when they have people sign up for discounted student rates for $5, that are paying the publishers $7?
I think if they got net revenue of $7, they would give 70% of $7, they would not give 70% of $10 to the music publishers. They charge $5 for student subscriptions and give 70% of that net revenue to publishers, not 70% of $10.
For the free streaming tier, they definitely do not pay publishers 70% of $10, but a portion of the net revenue from the ad revenue they earn on the free tier.
TekGryphon
Banned
Apple uses industry-standard USB and HDMI cords? Apple phones aren't 30%+ less resolution than comparable flagships? They don't have 1/3 the RAM? The 2015 MacBook Pro doesn't use a GPU from 2012 and a last-generation Haswell while costing $2000-$2500?
Whew! That's all really good to hear. Glad Apple has turned themselves around in the last month when I wasn't paying attention.
You didn't think this through did you?
Settings > iTunes & App Store > Apple ID > Subscriptions > set auto renew to off
mrmisterwaa
Neo Member
Stop making sense. We don't want to hear it!
We should pay definitely pay a premium for "perceived" quality and ease of use.
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
I always thought this is the industry standard. What's the cut on Google Play?
liliththepale
Banned
Would you rather watch your favorite movie at 480p or view footage of paint drying at 4K 60fps? Quality is more than just being super high tech.
mrmisterwaa
Neo Member
The help-section and web searches show that you pay a 30% transaction fee when it goes through them directly.
They don't restrict you from using alternate payment methods (compared to Apple).
Quality is definitely more than being super high tech. Apple tend to market that their products are of higher quality than their competitors. (in terms of software or hardware)
When it realistically isn't.
Outrageous!
liliththepale
Banned
You don't like it, which is fine. It's easy to find flaws in things you don't like. And even if it's just a placebo, that quality is still there.
I happen to not like Android's brand of UI and their delegating all of the fungible choices to the user, but that's my taste. I don't go around parading that Android is shit just because I don't like it; I'm able to recognize that it's just not my thing, and that's okay.
You got me, one single streaming service allows IAP at market rate. Thats a real win for IOS consumers since the competing ecosystem allows every streaming service (music and video) and ebooks store to compete at market price.
If it doesn't bother you that there is no competition for apple music at the $10 rate on IOS then I don't know what to tell you.
Google allow alternative methods of payment in app. Spotify will take your CC in app or use paypal. The end result is a $10 sub for Android users.
It's outrageous that google allows alternate in app purchases that doesn't increase the cost for consumers?
What happened with apple'e ebook collusion is outrageous. Colluded with all the publishers to change to an agency model that gave Amazon 30% revenue, then demanded amazon remove all method of buying books in app (which just involved clicking the buy button that charged your existing amazon account), then demanded all 30% of amazon's revenue for IAP. The net result for IOS consumers was that amazon removed anyway to buy books on IOS. iBook just got rid of their biggest competitor, and ebook prices rose until the DOJ intervened. Thats apple for you.
I use PayPal for iTunes. I can also use my credit card. What is this other payment that Google allows but Apple doesn't? I'm curious.
https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202631
The available payment methods vary by country. You can typically use these methods:
Credit cards
Content codes
Store credit, including iTunes Store Gift Cards, Gift Certificates, and Allowances
ClickandBuy
PayEase
PayPal
UnionPay (requires SMS PIN for setup)
https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202631
The available payment methods vary by country. You can typically use these methods:
Credit cards
Content codes
Store credit, including iTunes Store Gift Cards, Gift Certificates, and Allowances
ClickandBuy
PayEase
PayPal
UnionPay (requires SMS PIN for setup)
Google allows you to not use their payment system at all. You can pay for spotify in app with paypal or any credit card. This means no 30% cut and spotify costs $10 on android. They also allow you to link to your website or create an account in app for payment. End result is google allows app devs the flexibility to use google's payment system with 30% fee (which almost every normal app uses) or use a separate payment system (which most subscription services use) to avoid the fee.
IE I use my amazon account to buy books in app with kindle.
https://gigaom.com/2013/08/23/in-eb...e-is-lying-about-how-in-app-purchasing-works/
http://qz.com/118293/the-steve-jobs-email-exchange-that-perfectly-captures-apples-strategy/
http://www.digitalbookworld.com/201...f-ebook-best-sellers-on-a-two-month-tailspin/
http://www.theverge.com/2015/5/4/8540935/apple-labels-spotify-streaming
Good guy Apple.
D
Deleted member 12837
Unconfirmed Member
If the extra $3 or whatever it shakes out to be really bothers you that much, does it really kill you to take the extra 30 seconds to subscribe or buy via the web instead of through the iOS app?
Also when did Apple stop using HDMI and USB? This is news to me.
Also when did Apple stop using HDMI and USB? This is news to me.
liliththepale
Banned
You've needed a DisplayPort <-> HDMI adapter for several years now on most models. They still use USB, but it has the much faster, reversible Lighting connector on the other side for iPhones and iPads instead of micro USB.
D
Deleted member 12837
Unconfirmed Member
On most models? Isn't it just the Air and the brand new MacBook that are missing it now? MBP, Mac Pro, Mac Mini, Apple TV all have it. Even the iMac (not sure why).
I'm guessing we'll see USB-C for the phones soon enough. I thought he was referring to the computer lines with his comment, though.
Edit: oops, was wrong about the iMac (but not surprised given the computer itself is a screen)
The Faceless Master
Member
seems like business as usual.
music subscription services pay out like 70% of the sub rev to the publishers.
some upcharge the 30% on Apple devices because they aren't allowed to use their own IAP system or link consumers to it in the app or app listing.
Apple launches their own competing service and now the choices are run red by matching the price or point out how to get a competitive price elsewhere.
the price they set didn't matter until Apple undercut them by not having to pay the same Apple fees.
what else could they do?
music subscription services pay out like 70% of the sub rev to the publishers.
some upcharge the 30% on Apple devices because they aren't allowed to use their own IAP system or link consumers to it in the app or app listing.
Apple launches their own competing service and now the choices are run red by matching the price or point out how to get a competitive price elsewhere.
the price they set didn't matter until Apple undercut them by not having to pay the same Apple fees.
what else could they do?
liliththepale
Banned
That's not been my experience handling the Macs around the office, but admittedly I haven't looked at Apple's catalog recently. You're probably right.
SirMossyBloke
Member
Well done for completely missing the point.
D
Deleted member 12837
Unconfirmed Member
Enlighten me then?
I'll give you 3 guesses.
LOL at all the "Don't worry, people won't be buying Spotify in 3 months" posts. After using the disaster that is Apple Music on iTunes, I stopped using the free service and went right back to paying Spotify 4.99 a month. Happily.
As for paying via iTunes, I do with HBO because it's cheaper to buy a bunch of iTunes gift cards for 20 percent off and then pay using that credit.
As for paying via iTunes, I do with HBO because it's cheaper to buy a bunch of iTunes gift cards for 20 percent off and then pay using that credit.
Steam uses the 30% to provide the storefront & all services within that storefront.
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
Is it just me or this thread is tripping balls in mobile?
What I see is:
"*rigin*lly P*s*ed by D*lek <* href="sh*w*hre*d.php?p=171355069#p*s*171355069" rel="n*f*ll*w">
I use P*yP*l f*r i*unes. I c*n *ls* use my credi* c*rd. Wh** is *his **her p*ymen* *h** G**gle *ll*ws bu* *pple d*esn'*? I'm curi*us.
<* href="h**ps://supp*r*.*pple.c*m/en-us/H*202631" **rge*="_bl*nk">h**ps://supp*r*.*pple.c*m/en-us/H*202631
*he *v*il*ble p*ymen* me*h*ds v*ry by c*un*ry. Y*u c*n *ypic*lly use *hese me*h*ds:
Credi* c*rds
C*n*en* c*des
S**re credi*, including i*unes S**re Gif* C*rds, Gif* Cer*ific**es, *nd *ll*w*nces
Click*ndBuy
P*yE*se
P*yP*l
Uni*nP*y (requires SMS PIN f*r se*up)
G**gle *ll*ws y*u ** n** use *heir p*ymen* sys*em ** *ll. Y*u c*n p*y f*r sp**ify in *pp wi*h p*yp*l *r *ny credi* c*rd. *his me*ns n* 30% cu* *nd sp**ify c*s*s $10 *n *ndr*id. *hey *ls* *ll*w y*u ** link ** y*ur websi*e *r cre**e *n *cc*un* in *pp f*r p*ymen*. End resul* is g**gle *ll*ws *pp devs *he flexibili*y ** use g**gle's p*ymen* sys*em wi*h 30% fee (which *lm*s* every n*rm*l *pp uses) *r use * sep*r**e p*ymen* sys*em (which m*s* subscrip*i*n services use) ** *v*id *he fee.
IE I use my *m*z*n *cc*un* ** buy b**ks in *pp wi*h kindle.
<* href="h**ps://gig**m.c*m/2013/08/23/in-eb**k-c*se-d*j-cl*ims-*pple-is-lying-*b*u*-h*w-in-*pp-purch*sing-w*rks/" **rge*="_bl*nk">h**ps://gig**m.c*m/2013/08/23/in-eb*...ch*sing-w*rks/
*he feder*l g*vernmen* *u*lined * revised punishmen* f*r *pple in *he eb**k pricing c*se Frid*y. I* *rgued *h** *pple ch*nged i*s in-*pp purch*se rules ** re**li**e *g*ins* *m*z*n. *nd i* w*n*s ** m*ke big ch*nges in *he w*y *pple d*es business in *he i*unes S**re..."
--------------
Clearly a mod accidently banned letters instead of a full word.
What I see is:
"*rigin*lly P*s*ed by D*lek <* href="sh*w*hre*d.php?p=171355069#p*s*171355069" rel="n*f*ll*w">
I use P*yP*l f*r i*unes. I c*n *ls* use my credi* c*rd. Wh** is *his **her p*ymen* *h** G**gle *ll*ws bu* *pple d*esn'*? I'm curi*us.
<* href="h**ps://supp*r*.*pple.c*m/en-us/H*202631" **rge*="_bl*nk">h**ps://supp*r*.*pple.c*m/en-us/H*202631
*he *v*il*ble p*ymen* me*h*ds v*ry by c*un*ry. Y*u c*n *ypic*lly use *hese me*h*ds:
Credi* c*rds
C*n*en* c*des
S**re credi*, including i*unes S**re Gif* C*rds, Gif* Cer*ific**es, *nd *ll*w*nces
Click*ndBuy
P*yE*se
P*yP*l
Uni*nP*y (requires SMS PIN f*r se*up)
G**gle *ll*ws y*u ** n** use *heir p*ymen* sys*em ** *ll. Y*u c*n p*y f*r sp**ify in *pp wi*h p*yp*l *r *ny credi* c*rd. *his me*ns n* 30% cu* *nd sp**ify c*s*s $10 *n *ndr*id. *hey *ls* *ll*w y*u ** link ** y*ur websi*e *r cre**e *n *cc*un* in *pp f*r p*ymen*. End resul* is g**gle *ll*ws *pp devs *he flexibili*y ** use g**gle's p*ymen* sys*em wi*h 30% fee (which *lm*s* every n*rm*l *pp uses) *r use * sep*r**e p*ymen* sys*em (which m*s* subscrip*i*n services use) ** *v*id *he fee.
IE I use my *m*z*n *cc*un* ** buy b**ks in *pp wi*h kindle.
<* href="h**ps://gig**m.c*m/2013/08/23/in-eb**k-c*se-d*j-cl*ims-*pple-is-lying-*b*u*-h*w-in-*pp-purch*sing-w*rks/" **rge*="_bl*nk">h**ps://gig**m.c*m/2013/08/23/in-eb*...ch*sing-w*rks/
*he feder*l g*vernmen* *u*lined * revised punishmen* f*r *pple in *he eb**k pricing c*se Frid*y. I* *rgued *h** *pple ch*nged i*s in-*pp purch*se rules ** re**li**e *g*ins* *m*z*n. *nd i* w*n*s ** m*ke big ch*nges in *he w*y *pple d*es business in *he i*unes S**re..."
--------------
Clearly a mod accidently banned letters instead of a full word.
LumpOfCole
Member
I always considered buying Apple is like buying a luxury car versus a sports car or versus a custom car. The sort of person to buy a luxury car is looking for fast, but not necessarily cares about being fastest; that sort of person also wants a whole lot of innovations and luxuries on top of decent speed and will pay a premium to get that sort of package.
Stallion Dan
Member
1. Click pay
2. Opens web browser
3. Pay through that
4. ???
5. Profit
2. Opens web browser
3. Pay through that
4. ???
5. Profit
liliththepale
Banned
The app wouldn't make it through the approval process. Good idea though.
The Faceless Master
Member
not allowed to do that per iOS developer agreement.
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