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Square's Future

ronito said:
Fact is they haven't been able to put out an important US game in years, and same could be argued in Japan.
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What's your definition of important? I'd say Kingdom Hearts is one of the most important titles they've ever put out given the amount of wide appeal that has with both Disney and Square characters.
 
SolidSnakex said:
What's your definition of important? I'd say Kingdom Hearts is one of the most important titles they've ever put out given the amount of wide appeal that has with both Disney and Square characters.
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Kingdom hearts was important yes. It was also published in the US 3 years ago, meaning it will be about 4 years before the time it was released and the time we get a sequel. 4 years between games does not a gaming empire make.
 
ronito said:
Fact is they haven't been able to put out an important US game in years, and same could be argued in Japan.
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Worse than that, Square's been unable to create a lasting, bankable new IP since the Super Famicom days.


ronito said:
Oh and the loss of monolith and brownie brown I'd mourn if they put out anything of value.
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Baten Kaitos, Namco X Capcom and Magical Vacation were all almost universally praised. These companies only seem to flub it when they make "me too" products derivative of their Square efforts (Sword of Mana, Xenosaga).
 
ronito said:
Kingdom hearts was important yes. It was also published in the US 3 years ago, meaning it will be about 4 years before the time it was released and the time we get a sequel. 4 years between games does not a gaming empire make.
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KH in 2002, KH:CoM in 2004 and KH2 in 2005. Doesn't seem too bad to me. Would you prefer them to put out yearly updates of the console version so that its dead by the time next gen starts like some franchises?
 
Square have done nothing good for the last two years. Its taken them so long to get FFXII and KH2 out and the current release dates will probably get pushed back even more. Im usually patient with square though, KH and FFX were really great games, so if thier sequels will be just as good I dont mind.
 
SolidSnakex said:
KH in 2001, KH:CoM in 2004 and KH2 in 2005. Doesn't seem too bad to me. Would you prefer them to put out yearly updates of it so that its dead by the time next gen starts like some franchises?
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CoM isn't the big important game like KH. I guess that's arguable, but everyone's played KH, I don't know who's played CoM, but CoM was mainly filler until KH2. Not yearly updates, but more franchises. Where's my Chrono Trigger sequel? PE 3? Vagrant Story 2? Final Fantasy Tactics Advanced 2? A new Mana game, Front Mission 4...oh wait...And for goodness sakes, don't take so long with the big games. How long has FFXII been in development, that can't be good for the development costs. It seems that more and more Square's betting on the big games, and there's nothing wrong with that but when you take so long between big games that can't be good for business.
 
I really liked parasite eve on PS1.. was always hoping for a PS2 version but I guess its too late for that. The battle system was fun kind of like a turn based (well actually I guess it was more active timer now that I think about it) resident evil or something.

I hope they resurect this series for PS3.. same goes for vagrant story, I really liked the gameplay.. but the dungeouns looked like utter shit.. literly like someone smeared shit all over the blocky walls.

Damn I might have to go home and play some PE if I can still find my old disc^^

edit: and hell yeah make a new FFT for PSP!
 
Square and the future is like oil and water: they just don't mix.

Its shocking and saddening to see how far they have fallen off this generation. I expect them to be almost irrelevant by next gen's end. I think Enix got screwed personally since their shit seems to be holding up a hell of a lot better than Square's.
 
Where's JackFrost when you need him!?!?

Screw the Vagrant Story haters. Square themselves have relied on the Final Fantasy brand since the NES days and you could bet your arse you'd see one announced right after the other gets pumped out.

As far as schedules and the like are concerned, it's all Enix's doing. Quite a lot of talent has left Square a bit before as well as after the merger and they have their reasons for doing so. I don't want to delve too deep into the pile of shit that is Square Enix but if JackFrost shows up, he can enlighten everyone.
 
Just to round up their future console/handheld game releases...

PlayStation 2
-Ambrosia Odyssey (Enix)
-Code Age: Commanders (Square)
-Dirge of Cerebrus: Final Fantasy VII (Square)
-Dragon Quest VIII: Journey of the Cursed King (Enix/Level 5)
-Drakegard II (Enix/Cavia)
-Final Fantasy XII (Square)
-Front Mission 5 (Square)
-Front Mission Online (Square)
-FullMetal Alchemist 2: Curse of the Crimson Elixer (Enix/Racjin)
-FullMetal Alchemist 3 (Enix/Racjin)
-Grandia III (Enix/Game Arts)
-Heavy Metal Thunder (Enix/MediaVision)
-Radiata Stories (Enix/tri-Ace)
-Romancing SaGa: Minstrel Song (Square)

Nintendo DS
-Dragon Quest Monsters series (Enix/TOSE)
-Final Fantasy III (Square)
-Final Fantasy: Crystal Chronicles series (Square)
-FullMetal Alchemist: Dual Symphony (Enix/Bandai)
-Secret of Mana series (Square)
-Slime Morimori Dragon Quest 2 (Enix/TOSE)

PSP
-Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VIII (Square)

PlayStation 3
-Final Fantasy series (Square)

Revolution
-Final Fantasy: Crystal Chronicles series (Square)

Xbox 360
-Final Fantasy XI: Online (Square)


...did I miss anything?
 
I don't know if it's been mentioned, but Final Fantasy III is still mentioned in the latest issue of Nintendo Power, if that says anything. It's one of the few (two; Dragon Quest VIII) Square Enix games I'm looking forward to...
 
Kobun Heat said:
What lasting, bankable new IP did they create on the Super Famicom? Am I spacing, or...
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Front Mission and Chrono Trigger, though really Square's mismanaged both into niche status or commercial obscurity by this point. Same for Seiken Densetsu and SaGa, both of which were million selling brands at their heights.
 
jarrod said:
Front Mission and Chrono Trigger, though really Square's mismanaged both into niche status or commercial obscurity by this point. Same for Seiken Densetsu and SaGa, both of which were million selling brands at their heights.
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But what about Kingdom Hearts? That's doing amazingly well.
 
jarrod said:
PlayStation 2
-Code Age: Commanders (Square)
-Dirge of Cerebrus: Final Fantasy VII (Square)
-Final Fantasy XII (Square)
-Front Mission 5 (Square)
-Front Mission Online (Square)
-Romancing SaGa: Minstrel Song (Square)

Nintendo DS
-Final Fantasy III (Square)
-Final Fantasy: Crystal Chronicles series (Square)
-Secret of Mana series (Square)

PSP
-Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VIII (Square)

PlayStation 3
-Final Fantasy series (Square)

Revolution
-Final Fantasy: Crystal Chronicles series (Square)

Xbox 360
-Final Fantasy XI: Online (Square)
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I removed the Enix titles from the list, and bolded all the Square titles with involvement from Kawazu. It should be noted that Kawazu is the only Square developer on the Square Enix board of directors as far as I recall, so it's no surprise that he's the only one on the Square side allowed to come up with new quirky shit. :)
 
duckroll said:
But what about Kingdom Hearts? That's doing amazingly well.
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Kingdom Hearts isn't exactly a new IP, it's license dependant (Disney IPs) and stuffed with familiar Square IPs too. I wouldn't call Mario Golf or Smash Bros new IPs either.
 
Front Mission! That's the one I forgot.

I'm not giving you Chrono Trigger though. To be "lasting" they'd have had to actually, you know, make it last. The sequel fizzled and the franchise seems totally abandoned at this point.
 
duckroll said:
it's no surprise that he's the only one on the Square side allowed to come up with new quirky shit. :)
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If by "new quirky shit" you mean "remakes of his old quirky shit that nobody liked in the first place" then ok.
 
SolidSnakex said:
B00004SPW9.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg
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loved that game, though never finished it. i remember boss fights to be a chore... i always wished there'd be a remake of Vagrant Story for the current gen systems :(
 
Kobun Heat said:
I'm not giving you Chrono Trigger though. To be "lasting" they'd have had to actually, you know, make it last. The sequel fizzled and the franchise seems totally abandoned at this point.
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True, true. If Squeenix was smart, they'd hand the IP over to Division 9 (Dragon Quest) and get Hori and Toriyama to craft a "real" sequel.
 
One of the problems with Chrono is that all the major players have left, which means they'd have to coordinate between all sorts of freelancers and companies to have any semblance of the original team. Horii and Toriyama have always been freelance, Masato Kato is with Monolith, Sakaguchi's gone, Mitsuda is freelance...
 
Kobun Heat said:
One of the problems with Chrono is that all the major players have left, which means they'd have to coordinate between all sorts of freelancers and companies to have any semblance of the original team. Horii and Toriyama have always been freelance, Masato Kato is with Monolith, Sakaguchi's gone, Mitsuda is freelance...
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Don't want to come off sounding like it was better back in the day, but we had it good back then. Their passion has been eroding for a long time now.
 
Square-Enix - the new Rare.
Except the release pure crap OFTEN instead of RARELY
And they make crappy anime.
And they make crappy movies.
And they take good IPs and kill them, raping their ideas and failing to use them
(Ogre Battle raped and morphed into Final Fantasy Tactshits. FUCK. I want OGRE BATTLE)

Fuck.

I hate 99.99% of game companies, especially ones taht are praised for making CRAP.

Fuck Silicon Knights
Fuck RETRO (MP was Good, MP2 was shit, Matt Cassamassina from IGNCube is the world's biggest DINGLEBERRY. He fucking said MP looked better than RE4. Fuckign shit. FUCKIGN SHIT)

Fuck everybody.

Fuck em.
 
Kobun Heat said:
One of the problems with Chrono is that all the major players have left, which means they'd have to coordinate between all sorts of freelancers and companies to have any semblance of the original team. Horii and Toriyama have always been freelance, Masato Kato is with Monolith, Sakaguchi's gone, Mitsuda is freelance...
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Well, they could probably snag 3 out 5... that ain't too bad. Basically have the people who make Dragon Quest craft a new Chorno Trigger. It can't come out any worse than Chrono Cross really.
 
There's no future for square after Dragon Warrior 8 and Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles DS come out. Amazing that two of the best rpg companies combined have no future, but thats how it is.

unless FFVII remake/sequel is announced. make it happen Square! I'll buy it.

edit: forgot about kingdom hearts 2
 
Senretsu said:
There's no future for square after Dragon Warrior 8 and Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles DS come out. Amazing that two of the best rpg companies combined have no future, but thats how it is.
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What the hell? You can't be serious. So you think they're never going to make another DQ or FF after those games are released?
 
Square just doesn't seem to be making as many games as they used to. At least ones that I want.

Last gen:

FF7
FF8
FF9
FFTactics
Chrono Cross
Vagrant Story
Xenogears

This gen:
FFX
Kingdom Hearts
Kingdom Hearts 2
FFXII


Less games and they've got Enix with them now. They need to make more games!
 
I was never a big Chrono fan, so honestly I think Square Enix is doing fine except for the constant FF12 delays. We're getting DQ8 soon and that should tide most people over in terms of the "big Square Enix RPG release" until FF12 next year.
Square's input has gone down, but so has the input of most companies, especially the ones who just want to make blockbuster titles instead of quick cheap games (ala Konami).
 
You guys are nuts.

FFXII will come out and sell millions
KHII will come out and sell millions
FF7AC is gonna sell quite a lot
Even the stupid DMC FFVII game will probably sell a lot because it's FFVII
Grandia III will sell well
DQVI remake will sell millions
FFVII CC will sell well

then FFXIII and DQ9 will be announced for next-gen. Both will sell millions.


SE is pretty slow at putting out big titles, but they sell so many copies and are such a major force in mindshare that they have no scary uncertain future ahead. They don't need to go multiplatform and they don't need to release games faster; they'll do fine just doing the same thing as they do now.
 
Oh yeah, anyone who likes Xenogears is a moron and anyone who dislikes Vagrant Story is a moron.

Maybe Square is making all of these crappy games because of the signals you give them with Xenogears popularity.
 
mdm said:
Oh yeah, anyone who likes Xenogears is a moron and anyone who dislikes Vagrant Story is a moron.

Maybe Square is making all of these crappy games because of the signals you give them with Xenogears popularity.
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Yay for elitism!
 
Bebpo said:
You guys are nuts.

FFXII will come out and sell millions
KHII will come out and sell millions
FF7AC is gonna sell quite a lot
Even the stupid DMC FFVII game will probably sell a lot because it's FFVII
Grandia III will sell well
DQVI remake will sell millions
FFVII CC will sell well

then FFXIII and DQ9 will be announced for next-gen. Both will sell millions.


SE is pretty slow at putting out big titles, but they sell so many copies and are such a major force in mindshare that they have no scary uncertain future ahead. They don't need to go multiplatform and they don't need to release games faster; they'll do fine just doing the same thing as they do now.
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Radiata Stories will probably bomb in the US, though... Sadly. I haven't seen much hype for this game at all. I wonder how well Minstrel Song will do, summer is usually a good time for RPG sales since the schools are out. Whoever's counting out Square is just silly - they've got probably the most loyal and ardent fanbase this side of Nintendo.
 
Breaking things down by Division....

Square Enix Division 1
-Advent Children: Final Fantasy VII (DVD/UMD)
-Before Crisis: Final Fantasy VII (mbl)
-Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VIII (PSP)
-Dirge of Cerebrus: Final Fantasy VII (PS2)
-Final Fantasy series (PS3)
-Kingdom Hearts II (PS2)

Square Enix Division 2
-Code Age Brawls (mbl)
-Code Age Commanders (PS2)
-Final Fantasy III (DS)
-Final Fantasy: Crystal Chronicles series (DS)
-Final Fantasy: Crystal Chronicles series (Rev)
-Romancing SaGa: Minstrel Song (PS2)

Square Enix Division 3
-Final Fantasy XI: Online (PC/PS2/360)
-new MMORPG (tba)

Square Enix Division 4
-Final Fantasy XII (PS2)

Square Enix Division 5
-Final Fantasy II (mbl)
-Musahi Mobile Samurai II: Episode Zero (mbl)

Square Enix Division 6
-Front Mission 2089 (mbl)
-Front Mission 5 (PS2)
-Front Mission Online (PC/PS2)

Square Enix Division 7
-???

Square Enix Division 8
-Secret of Mana series (DS)
-World of Mana (tba)

Square Enix Division 9
-Dragon Quest VIII: Journey of the Cursed King (PS2) Level 5
-Dragon Quest Monsters series (DS) TOSE Software
-Slime Morimori Dragon Quest 2 (DS) TOSE Software

Square Enix Division 10
-Ambrosia Odyssey (PS2) Rocket Studio
-Drakegard II: Love Red, Ambivalence Black (PS2) Cavia
-Hexcite Fusion (mbl) Gajin
-Fantasy Earth: The Ring of Dominion (PC) MultiTerm Entertainment Factory
-FullMetal Alchemist: Dual Symphony (DS) Bandai
-FullMetal Alchemist 2: Curse of the Crimson Elixer (PS2) Racjin
-FullMetal Alchemist 3: Kami wo Tsugu Shoujo (PS2) Racjin
-Grandia III (PS2) Game Arts Entertainment
-Heavy Metal Thunder (PS2) Media Vision Entertainment
-Radiata Stories (PS2) tri-Ace

...anything missing?
 
mdm said:
Oh yeah, anyone who likes Xenogears is a moron and anyone who dislikes Vagrant Story is a moron.

Maybe Square is making all of these crappy games because of the signals you give them with Xenogears popularity.
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I don't remember Xenogears being that popular. Releasing the same day as Metal Gear Solid didn't help it any. I picked both up at the same time and had a hell of a time choosing which one to play first.
 
Well, that one's already out.
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Not entirely. It depends on who becomes the eventual market leader in the next round. I think it's realistic to say that after the market leader is established, SE will probably go exclusive with them like any other 3rd party.
 
Pellham said:
Not entirely. It depends on who becomes the eventual market leader in the next round. I think it's realistic to say that after the market leader is established, SE will probably go exclusive with them like any other 3rd party.
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Maybe... similar to Enix in the early 32bit days. But I sort of doubt it, Square Enix has been putting more and more emphasis recently on multiplatform R&D and exploring other revenue streams. In fact their online revenue philosophies hinge on PlayOnline being a multiplaform service.

Not to say all their games will see multiplatform release now either... I still see overwhelming PS3 support and most titles staying exclusive there. But I also don't see Square Enix shutting out any potnetial market base these days... if Xbox 360 and Revolution are sucessful platforms, they'll likely receive Square Enix games too.
 
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