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Star Wars: The Force Awakens Final Trailer

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You talking about Episode IV? Doesn't the guy pull a gun?

He shoves Luke, Ben pulls his lightsaber, only then does he pull a blaster. When you drawn a weapon in a bar, it escalates. Obi-Wan would not even have let it come to drawing weapons. It was unnecessary violence to establish Jedi authority.. it's the one scene in ANH that really sucks bad IMO.
 
Lol concerning all the spoilers and red herrings about Kylo Ren and so on...

I would go insane in the cinema if close to the ending of the damn movie Kylo Ren takes his mask off jsut to reveal that he is Luke Skywalker yelling: It was me a ll along you stupid f****rs...
 
Blackwater has only been around for 18 years and are a small group with no strong affiliation. Just a PMC.

Jedis were keeping order for thousands of years and were in charge of the forces. Clearly a major military force.

Sure, but in the same way we don't hear much about Blackwater, even though they're not a secret, maybe the public doesn't hear that much about Jedi?

If they're on the news busting perps every night and speaking to the press... ok ok, there's a problem here. But maybe they're a like a rather out-of-mind special ops force? Or a secret police? Or an intelligence agency?

The line "Jedi business, go back to your drinks" makes me question that, though..... argh.

There is the effort of a great many people in the OT that made it so damn good. Lucas was apparently not one of them, and his PT work shows. Obi-Wan's reaction at the Tattooine cantina is totally unwarranted and absolutely character breaking after all the rhetoric about Jedi and peace - it's actually the kind of thing you would have expected Anakin to pull off at the top of his arrogance. You can almost tell that he wanted to make Jedi unaccountable badass supercops of some sort.. and then he went on to make that happen in the PT.

I liked that moment. About as much as I liked Han shooting Greedo under the table. Moments like those probably sold me on the series as much as anything.

It doesn't clash with my understanding of the Jedi. They're spiritually attuned, but they will defend if necessary. Like idealized samurai, basically.

It's more "Bushido" spirituality than "turn the other cheek" spirituality.
 
You can hold them while...you know.

latest
 
He shoves Luke, Ben pulls his lightsaber, only then does he pull a blaster. When you drawn a weapon in a bar, it escalates. Obi-Wan would not even have let it come to drawing weapons. It was unnecessary violence to establish Jedi authority.. it's the one scene in ANH that really sucks bad IMO.
man, what a great feeling that must be when you know better how something must be then what is actually established from the movie.

And yes, he wanted to deescalte, he wanted to buy the guy a drink so that he calms down, but he "shoves" (better say throw) Luke through the room. The other guy had it coming. That he alsl pulled a blaster cost him the arm in the end.
 
Retcon alert.

No, I don't buy - and I don't want to buy (because it ruins the whole series) - the insinuation that Obiwan, Yoda or Luke were "special" Jedis who really "got it", and most Jedis were actually corrupted jerks.

If the Jedi were corrupted, even in their pre-clone war state, the OT doesn't make sense. It means Luke shouldn't have wanted to revive the Jedi.

No this is all retcon nonsense to justify Lucas' unthinking portrayal of the Jedi. He sleepwalked into making them republic police because he didn't understand how that would ruin the view of them in the OT as a people with a better and more spiritually attuned way of life.
I don't think you really get the whole fan "theory" at all tbh. Why the hell would any of that stuff effect what the the OT characters do?
 
I don't think you really get the whole fan "theory" at all tbh. Why the hell would any of that stuff effect what the the OT characters do?

Because if Luke is trying to resurrect a failed, corrupted organization, he's a fool?
 
Lol concerning all the spoilers and red herrings about Kylo Ren and so on...

I would go insane in the cinema if close to the ending of the damn movie Kylo Ren takes his mask off jsut to reveal that he is Luke Skywalker yelling: It was me a ll along you stupid f****rs...



It stills baffles me how anyone would think that after watching the trailer and this:

https://33.media.tumblr.com/e8bb80a9c5362f3ed1417a20fb766b3c/tumblr_nntg17ccnI1qiaxzfo1_r1_500.gif
 
He shoves Luke, Ben pulls his lightsaber, only then does he pull a blaster. When you drawn a weapon in a bar, it escalates. Obi-Wan would not even have let it come to drawing weapons. It was unnecessary violence to establish Jedi authority.. it's the one scene in ANH that really sucks bad IMO.

It's been well demonstrated I can't trust my memory in this thread so I watched the scene again to confirm to myself how it happens.

He THROWS Luke, then reaches for his blaster, THEN Ben pulls his light saber. Sorry.

http://youtu.be/g6PDcBhODqo
 
Because if Luke is trying to resurrect a failed, corrupted organization, he's a fool?
And he knows this how? He can't change them why? Hasn't he just learned about the spiritual and monk aspects by the end of Jedi?
Is what a Jedi should be not hammered home enough in the OT? Is what Luke wants not in direct conflict with what that is multiple times (mainly concerning his friends and family) already?
 
And he knows this how? He can't change them why? Hasn't he just learned about the spiritual and monk aspects by the end of Jedi?
Is what a Jedi should be not hammered home enough in the OT? Is what Luke wants not in direct conflict with what that is multiple times (mainly concerning his friends and family) already?

The story of Luke reforming a corrupted Jedi could be told.

But it wasn't. Nothing was said on screen about this element.

The OT shows Luke clearly reviving the good order that was the Jedi. If the PT was meant to say "gotcha! The Jedi sucked!" it did not communicate it clearly at any point during the films.
 
The story of Luke reforming a corrupted Jedi could be told.

But it wasn't. Nothing was said on screen about this element.

The OT shows Luke clearly reviving the good order that was the Jedi. If the PT was meant to say "gotcha! The Jedi sucked!" it did not communicate it clearly at any point during the films.

I don't believe Lucas really understood what he was doing but whether he meant to or not, the Jedi he showed us in the PT were mostly arrogant dicks. Given that Luke was taught by the two that weren't complete twats, it's not that hard to believe his vision of the Jedi is more idealistic than what they actually were at the end of the Republic.

The fact that the Jedi in the PT were so dumb, so cold, and were wiped out with ease, makes it easy for me to accept that they had lost their way. It might be headcanon but it works for me.
 
Lol concerning all the spoilers and red herrings about Kylo Ren and so on...

I would go insane in the cinema if close to the ending of the damn movie Kylo Ren takes his mask off jsut to reveal that he is Luke Skywalker yelling: It was me a ll along you stupid f****rs...

The only stupid ones are those that keep bringing up this stupid idea.
There are no spoilers and no red herrings, only idiots.
 
I don't believe Lucas really understood what he was doing but whether he meant to or not, the Jedi he showed us in the PT were mostly arrogant dicks. Given that Luke was taught by the two that weren't complete twats, it's not that hard to believe his vision of the Jedi is more idealistic than what they actually were at the end of the Republic.

The fact that the Jedi in the PT were so dumb, so cold, and were wiped out with ease, makes it easy for me to accept that they had lost their way. It might be headcanon but it works for me.

Yeah well said. I don't think this was planned, but now the Jedi are baffoons.

I'm just saying this fucks up the overall tale if you think about it. Luke's accomplishments should not be that diminished.

Disney/Lucasfilm will surely ignore this shit.
 
The story of Luke reforming a corrupted Jedi could be told.

But it wasn't. Nothing was said on screen about this element.

The OT shows Luke clearly reviving the good order that was the Jedi. If the PT was meant to say "gotcha! The Jedi sucked!" it did not communicate it clearly at any point during the films.
I never said either of those things were true. Just don't see how it ruins anything when the main character doesn't know about that possible (it is just a fan theory that probably has no real creator intent behind it) aspect of Jedi culture, and already rejects a few of the aspects of Jedi culture he does know about.
 
I think it looks like Vader's actually:

49b728b41b98c_74061n.jpg

That is actually one of Luke's stunt sabers from Empire re-purposed for some of the duel scenes in Jedi. The bolts are to keep the blade in place. Vader's "hero" saber from all 3 films was an MPP flash handle with a few greeblies attached.

Here is a picture of it from an exhibition.

pCrTSQ8.jpg


Luke's Jedi saber was a stunt Obi-Wan saber from Episode 4. They re-used, altered and re-purposed many props throughout the original trilogy.

It speaks volumes that for Episode 7 they recreated the original props using the same found parts; Luke's saber, as held by Finn in the trailer, is built from a vintage Graflex flash gun as the original was. They could have easily (and probably more cheaply) fabricated idealised versions, which was the approach taken for the Episode 3 versions of the OT sabers.
 
This scene takes place before the Clone Wars even started. It implies that Jedi were actually cops all along. "Jedi business, go back to your drinks" and everyone goes back to their business as if some vigilante cop just warned them to look away or else..

It's terrible, terrible, terrible.

The PT is just simply incredibly terrible.

But then, Lucas did make Obi-Wan chop off some dude's arm in another bar scene like a vigilante cop just because he was being a bully instead of using a Jedi Mind Trick to make him walk away.. I think Disney buying the rights from Lucas is the best thing that happened to Star Wars.

If you're talking about the scene in the original movie, that guy wasn't "being a bully," he pulled a blaster and was going to murder Luke and Obi-wan.
 
Anyone who says that the PT Jedi weren't made to be terrible on purpose is ignoring The Clone Wars, which is canon, and which stems directly from Lucas, and which makes it even more obvious.

It's not an error that the PT Jedi are corrupt space cops who aren't doing what the Jedi should actually be doing. It's part of the plot. It's silly to assume that Lucas somehow didn't understand this when it's integral to the fall of the Jedi Order and serves to further enhance Luke's victory. Even Obi-Wan and Yoda were wrong in the OT about how a Jedi should behave. Luke is the only one who understood. The fact that you built up in your head what you thought the old Jedi Order must have been like and it turned out to be wrong does not mean that Lucas botched it.
 
That is actually one of Luke's stunt sabers from Empire re-purposed for some of the duel scenes in Jedi. The bolts are to keep the blade in place. Vader's "hero" saber from all 3 films was an MPP flash handle with a few greeblies attached.

Here is a picture of it from an exhibition.

pCrTSQ8.jpg


Luke's Jedi saber was a stunt Obi-Wan saber from Episode 4. They re-used, altered and re-purposed many props throughout the original trilogy.

It speaks volumes that for Episode 7 they recreated the original props using the same found parts; Luke's saber, as held by Finn in the trailer, is built from a vintage Graflex flash gun as the original was. They could have easily (and probably more cheaply) fabricated idealised versions, which was the approach taken for the Episode 3 versions of the OT sabers.
Where did you see that they were doing this?That's really great to hear.
 
Anyone who says that the PT Jedi weren't made to be terrible on purpose is ignoring The Clone Wars, which is canon, and which stems directly from Lucas, and which makes it even more obvious.

It's not an error that the PT Jedi are corrupt space cops who aren't doing what the Jedi should actually be doing. It's part of the plot. It's silly to assume that Lucas somehow didn't understand this when it's integral to the fall of the Jedi Order and serves to further enhance Luke's victory. Even Obi-Wan and Yoda were wrong in the OT about how a Jedi should behave. Luke is the only one who understood. The fact that you built up in your head what you thought the old Jedi Order must have been like and it turned out to be wrong does not mean that Lucas botched it.

Yeah Lucas is a genius and had it all planned since 1977. He didn't refine his ideas over time or anything.
 
Anyone who says that the PT Jedi weren't made to be terrible on purpose is ignoring The Clone Wars, which is canon, and which stems directly from Lucas, and which makes it even more obvious.

It's not an error that the PT Jedi are corrupt space cops who aren't doing what the Jedi should actually be doing. It's part of the plot. It's silly to assume that Lucas somehow didn't understand this when it's integral to the fall of the Jedi Order and serves to further enhance Luke's victory. Even Obi-Wan and Yoda were wrong in the OT about how a Jedi should behave. Luke is the only one who understood. The fact that you built up in your head what you thought the old Jedi Order must have been like and it turned out to be wrong does not mean that Lucas botched it.

By Clone Wars we have Lucas working off the story he's already made. Was it explicitly in the show? Neat, because it was not explicitly in the prequel movies, and that's telling. "Clouded by the dark side", but little else. He showed them as good guys, and didn't communicate that they were supposed to be fallen. But they looked bad anyway.

It's retcon.

Regardless of the intention of this angle (which is barely there imo), it does ruin the OT. If it were intended, it's a sabotage of the main appeal of the OT. It's not cool.
 
The latest Collider Jedi Council just massively spoiled the first series of Rebels before I had the chance to watch it. I'm so bummed I don't feel like watching any of the rest of them again, not even a warning :(
 
By Clone Wars we have Lucas working off the story he's already made. Was it explicitly in the show? Neat, because it was not explicitly in the prequel movies, and that's telling. "Clouded by the dark side", but little else. He showed them as good guys, and didn't communicate that they were supposed to be fallen. But they looked bad anyway.

It's retcon.

Regardless of the intention of this angle (which is barely there imo), it does ruin the OT. If it were intended, it's a sabotage of the main appeal of the OT. It's not cool.

Exactly.
 
By Clone Wars we have Lucas working off the story he's already made. Was it explicitly in the show? Neat, because it was not explicitly in the prequel movies, and that's telling. "Clouded by the dark side", but little else. He showed them as good guys, and didn't communicate that they were supposed to be fallen. But they looked bad anyway.

It's retcon.

Regardless of the intention of this angle (which is barely there imo), it does ruin the OT. If it were intended, it's a sabotage of the main appeal of the OT. It's not cool.

The "main appeal of the OT" is entirely subjective. If you don't like the subversion of the Jedi, sorry, but for many other people including myself it works fine or even makes the story better.

I can't really argue that the PT fails to make it explicitly obvious that the Jedi are corrupt, but the material is certainly there. As with the rest of the PT, Lucas has the ideas but doesn't stick the landing - but even before TCW came out, many people in the fandom had come to the belief that the PT was supposed to show a deconstructed view of the Jedi as hierarchical organization. They're shown being the police for the Republic who are dragged into a war that they're not supposed to be fighting ("We're keepers of the peace, not soldiers"). Qui-Gon butts heads with the Council, going off and doing his own stuff ("Do not defy the council Maser, not again") talking about the Living Force and ends up being the first one to actually achieve life after death because of his unorthodox views. In AotC, Yoda talks about how arrogance is becoming increasingly more common in the Jedi ("A flaw more and more common among Jedi. Too sure of themselves they are. Even the older, more experienced ones."). The very fact that their ability to use the Force is diminishing is indicative of the fact that they aren't in proper communion with it, allowing Palpatine to cloud their vision through the dark side.

The fact that they do not allow relationships or attachment is one of the direct causes of Anakin's fall; we can easily see how Obi-Wan's more strict teachings failed Anakin, whereas someone more understanding like Qui-Gon would have been a better master for him. This particular policy is in complete opposition to what Luke discovers in RotJ, which is that love is what ultimately defeats the dark side. Even in the OT Yoda and Obi-Wan are still harping on how Luke has to be willing to sacrifice his friends to succeed, and that was before the PT ever came out. So the Jedi being aloof and dispassionate isn't some sort of retcon. And honestly, who cares if something is a retcon? This is Star Wars. The biggest twist in the entire franchise is a retcon. Leia's relationship to Luke is a retcon. The whole damn series is based on retcons. Retconning isn't a bad thing if it serves to enhance the storyline.
 
I don't know what it is, but my hype for this movie has died every since the trailer dropped. I am a Star Wars fan, at least as far as the OT goes. The recent trailer did nothing for me. Just an expansion of what we've already seen, while taking itself way too seriously. I'm not feeling the levity that's a part of Star Wars.

EDIT
I hope it's not depression creeping back in
 
I don't know what it is, but my hype for this movie has died every since the trailer dropped. I am a Star Wars fan, at least as far as the OT goes. The recent trailer did nothing for me. Just an expansion of what we've already seen, while taking itself way too seriously. I'm not feeling the levity that's a part of Star Wars.

EDIT
I hope it's not depression creeping back in

The Force is calling to you... Just let it in.

More seriously I think they avoided humor in the trailer to make sure nothing reminds people of Jar Jar Binks and the PT's more silly elements. I'm sure the full film will its fair share of levity. Even ESB had despite being the "darkest" of the original films. Also they got BB-8. How can it ever be "too serious" with BB-8 in it.
 
Something from the prequels I don't want to see in the new films: Jedi superheroes.

I know Lucas says in the OT all we were seeing were old out of pratice Jedi and a new Jedi not properly trained, but hey THAT'S what I want from my Jedi and dark side users. I DO NOT want to see people jumping 200ft high jumps, I DO NOT want to see Jedi deciding, one time only and completely out of nowhere, to run super fast (please NEVER do that again).

I DO NOT want my Jedi to bleat on about not having kids and all that bullshit. They were so boring, so utterly lacking in character whatsoever. Let them be people with conflicts and emotions, not soulless robots.

The prequels truly did ruin a lot of what makes Star Wars Star Wars. Let it me mystic, let it be spiritual, stop giving us scientific explanations for why someone has the force, as if the battles between force users comes down to your midichlorian stat. FUCK THAT.

I don't care what anyone says but the prequels were fucking shit movies. Phantom Menace was actually the best, the most Star Wars film of the three. It wasn't blighted by shit CGI all over the shop. I mean it seems like 90% of the sets in 2 and 3 had EVERYTHING CGI, even the fucking floor. As a result it does look like nothing more than a computer game cut scene. It has no solidity, no believability to it all. All the scenes in the Jedi temple etc look so fake it is embarrassing, and that shit only gets worse with time.

These were poorly produced films, Rick McCallum and George Lucas was clearly a fucking horrible combination. Seemingly everything was done to be as cheap and quick as possible, even if it hurt the quality of what they caught on (shitty) digital film. Why build a set when we can rely on CGI to fill in EVERYTHING in the background! That is not how you help actors feel part of the world, and that is the part where all this CGI reliance really shows. Actors with no sense of urgency, with literally no reaction to things that should make them flinch (Obi Wan with Grievous unleashing 50 lightsabers from 5 feet away being a prime example). The actors had nothing to work with, and with poor script to deliver and seemingly non existent direction from Lucas too I feel sorry that they're getting most of the flak. I've seen behind the scenes clips of Lucas talking to the actors, it actually terrifies me he was making huge budget films, he simply does not have a way with actors AT ALL. Like a novice father being lumped with directing the kids school play this Xmas... awful.

From this final trailer we see an actually intriguing set up. We have two characters who have been living in obscurity and simply don't know much, if anything about the Jedi, or the dark side. Rey probably knows more than Finn, who has been indoctrinated, radicalised even, by the First Order. There is so much possibility here. Imagine seeing him, for whatever reason it is, to realise he wants out of this. Then seeing him learn the truth, seeing him discover what has gone on, seeing him react the first time he sees the Force being used, or indeed when he uses it himself for the first time. IT's going to be glorious. Getting right back to Star Wars roots. We'll see characters in awe of the Force. That is what Star Wars is to me. The fact that it is Han telling these characters is just perfect. He's seen it all and used to be a cynic, but now he has first hand experience and is the one bringing the news to these new characters. It's beautiful, and already in this one trailer alone exceeds anything and everything the prequels managed.

Doesn't hurt that the film looks absolutely magnificent. Tons of CGI of course, but done with an eye towards realism. Lighting looks real, movement looks real. It is so kinetic. Oh god it's glorious. The tone and look of the film is head and shoulders in a different league to the prequels. It shows what someone passionate about Star Wars, who truly gets it, can achieve.

I love Lucas for the Universe he created, but so much of what makes SW what it is is thanks to many other people collaborating together. With the prequels he took a top down approach and had nothing but Yes men/women at his side agreeing with every crappy idea he had. He wrote terrible scripts single handedly, with seemingly no input from anyone else and that itself is probably the biggest problem. I think his early drafts became the film. In all the previous films the scripts had a lot of flab cut, a lot of important things changed, input from many people, and indeed people like Kasdan taking on writing duties altogether... it really really shows. The new films look to be delivered from people who care about this world, and I love that. I have complete faith, and thank Disney for taking this on and doing it right.

A new, great generation of Star Wars awaits.
 
The "main appeal of the OT" is entirely subjective. If you don't like the subversion of the Jedi, sorry, but for many other people including myself it works fine or even makes the story better.

I can't really argue that the PT fails to make it explicitly obvious that the Jedi are corrupt, but the material is certainly there. As with the rest of the PT, Lucas has the ideas but doesn't stick the landing - but even before TCW came out, many people in the fandom had come to the belief that the PT was supposed to show a deconstructed view of the Jedi as hierarchical organization. They're shown being the police for the Republic who are dragged into a war that they're not supposed to be fighting ("We're keepers of the peace, not soldiers"). Qui-Gon butts heads with the Council, going off and doing his own stuff ("Do not defy the council Maser, not again") talking about the Living Force and ends up being the first one to actually achieve life after death because of his unorthodox views. In AotC, Yoda talks about how arrogance is becoming increasingly more common in the Jedi ("A flaw more and more common among Jedi. Too sure of themselves they are. Even the older, more experienced ones."). The very fact that their ability to use the Force is diminishing is indicative of the fact that they aren't in proper communion with it, allowing Palpatine to cloud their vision through the dark side.

The fact that they do not allow relationships or attachment is one of the direct causes of Anakin's fall; we can easily see how Obi-Wan's more strict teachings failed Anakin, whereas someone more understanding like Qui-Gon would have been a better master for him. This particular policy is in complete opposition to what Luke discovers in RotJ, which is that love is what ultimately defeats the dark side. Even in the OT Yoda and Obi-Wan are still harping on how Luke has to be willing to sacrifice his friends to succeed, and that was before the PT ever came out. So the Jedi being aloof and dispassionate isn't some sort of retcon. And honestly, who cares if something is a retcon? This is Star Wars. The biggest twist in the entire franchise is a retcon. Leia's relationship to Luke is a retcon. The whole damn series is based on retcons. Retconning isn't a bad thing if it serves to enhance the storyline.

great post. don't get me wrong, there are a great many things wrong with the PT, but I have to agree that the concept that the Jedi have somewhat lost their way is purposely present there, even if Lucas didn't 'stick the landing'. Losing Qui Gon I think is supposed to be an example of that.

Yeah well said. I don't think this was planned, but now the Jedi are baffoons.

I'm just saying this fucks up the overall tale if you think about it. Luke's accomplishments should not be that diminished.

Disney/Lucasfilm will surely ignore this shit.

I don't really see how it diminishes it. IMO if anything it makes what Luke is trying to accomplish more powerful. He only knows the Jedi as what they were 'supposed' to be, which is what is trying to represent.
 
The prequels did almost everything wrong, but man, I do love Qui-Gon. He is one of the coolest jedis. The way he speaks, the way he reacts to everything... he is like how I imagined all of the jedi would be before the prequels came. Shame he had to go that shitty way.
 
The prequels did almost everything wrong, but man, I do love Qui-Gon. He is one of the coolest jedis. The way he speaks, the way he reacts to everything... he is like how I imagined all of the jedi would be before the prequels came. Shame he had to go that shitty way.

Love/hate Qui-Gon.
He actually "acted" like the Obi-Wan of the OT, cool and collected and wise, which was great...

But he's also a guy who espoused the science of Midichlorians for the first time, scammed and swindled people out of bets, brought Jar-Jar with them for no reason whatsoever, and was the driving force for getting the entire Jedi order exterminated by kidnapping a child from his mother, which may or may not have lead to the deaths of billions.

Sure, Anakin brought balanced to the Force... how many billions of dead later?

Qui-Gon is weird because he has some of the best, and worst, traits of the Jedi in him. The biggest issue, though, is how he just... becomes a Force Ghost, off-screen, through lip-service, with no explanation whatsoever.
 
Qui-Gon is weird because he has some of the best, and worst, traits of the Jedi in him. The biggest issue, though, is how he just... becomes a Force Ghost, off-screen, through lip-service, with no explanation whatsoever.

Surprised Lucas didn't make him a ghost at the end of Jedi.
 
Love/hate Qui-Gon.
He actually "acted" like the Obi-Wan of the OT, cool and collected and wise, which was great...

But he's also a guy who espoused the science of Midichlorians for the first time, scammed and swindled people out of bets, brought Jar-Jar with them for no reason whatsoever, and was the driving force for getting the entire Jedi order exterminated by kidnapping a child from his mother, which may or may not have lead to the deaths of billions.

Sure, Anakin brought balanced to the Force... how many billions of dead later?

Qui-Gon is weird because he has some of the best, and worst, traits of the Jedi in him. The biggest issue, though, is how he just... becomes a Force Ghost, off-screen, through lip-service, with no explanation whatsoever.

Not being a strict hypocrite just makes him cooler to me. Sure he scammed some scumbags, but he was one of the most sensible and compassionate jedi depicted.

Midichlorians... not his fault. It doesn't say anything about who he is as a jedi because it's not like there was the option to NOT spouse midichlorians . That nonsense was in the script, had to work with it. Oh well.

And Anakin being a douchebag was also not his fault. Anakin, Obi-Wan and the council are the culprits here. Besides, billions would die with or without Vader. For all we know, Qui-Gon's actions might have saved billions more since Vader did end up killing the Emperor.

He becoming force ghost first was a neat addition because it cements the idea that he was the closest there was to an ideal jedi.

I have no defense for Jar Jar. Shame on you, Qui-Gon. Still love you, though. :)
 
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