Keep practicing and form your own mnemonics for each character.
Also, I have been recommended Lang-8 as a good tool for practicing Japanese. They have native speakers that can help correct your writings.
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The Big Ass Superior Thread of Learning Japanese
- Thread starter RevenantKioku
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Keep practicing and form your own mnemonics for each character.
Also, I have been recommended Lang-8 as a good tool for practicing Japanese. They have native speakers that can help correct your writings.
Does anyone here use Wanikani (from the guy who runs tofogu)? I use it and it's helped me learn quite a number of Kanji though I'm just at level 3 just now.
You know, funnily enough, I knew very little Hiragana when I started Wanikani but during learning the readings for the Kanji (with help from a hiragana chart), I ended up picking up and retaining my hira quite well. I'd say I can recognize most hiragana when I see it now.
I also learned Katakana while playing games like Xillia 2 and more recently Digimon Adventure, surprisingly easy to retain it now XD.
@Above, Lang-8 is pretty good. You correct peoples English on there as well. Great for people learning any language.
You know, funnily enough, I knew very little Hiragana when I started Wanikani but during learning the readings for the Kanji (with help from a hiragana chart), I ended up picking up and retaining my hira quite well. I'd say I can recognize most hiragana when I see it now.
I also learned Katakana while playing games like Xillia 2 and more recently Digimon Adventure, surprisingly easy to retain it now XD.
@Above, Lang-8 is pretty good. You correct peoples English on there as well. Great for people learning any language.
bigmit3737
Member
少し前、ソウルサクリファイスの体験版が出たと言ってましたが、どうでした？
I have a question with the above sentence.
言ってました　in this case means exactly what?
I thought it meant something along the lines of "I heard...as I heard the demo for Soul Sacrifice just came out recently".
I have a question with the above sentence.
言ってました　in this case means exactly what?
I thought it meant something along the lines of "I heard...as I heard the demo for Soul Sacrifice just came out recently".
Was saying.
"A little earlier, (you) were saying that Soul Sacrifice Demo Edition was released, how was (your experience with) it?"
bigmit3737
Member
Ahh, I guess the thing that's confusing me is my penpal never talked about the release of the demo. He's the one who corrected my Japanese, and I originally just wrote, "出ました　instead of "出たと言ってました", the latter which is what he corrected it to.
So I assumed there was another meaning because 言ってました。
I just assumed you because of the follow up question. It could some other person/source, I would use 聞く or そう if I was talking about what I have heard, but I guess 言う could make sense in the right situation, but I don't know the conversation.
vas_a_morir
Banned
Hey guys.
Pleased to report I passed JLPT N2. I was soooo sure I failed by a pretty solid margin, and if you saw my scores, you'd understand why I thought that, lol!
Anyway, it feels good man. Good luck to the rest of you who took the test!
Pleased to report I passed JLPT N2. I was soooo sure I failed by a pretty solid margin, and if you saw my scores, you'd understand why I thought that, lol!
Anyway, it feels good man. Good luck to the rest of you who took the test!
HisshouBuraiKen
Member
N1 = pwned. Celebratory sushi this weekend. My resume is now fully padded.
Lord Ghirahim
Member
おめでとう! They've made N1 and N2 harder the past couple of years, haven't they? I passed N1 in 2006 but I took it again for fun in 2010 and I was taken aback by the 読解/reading section's length.
vas_a_morir
Banned
I think I'd have to live and work in Japan in order to pass JLPT1, though. I'd like to try to get back there this year, actually. I don't know how to go about it, however. Maybe next time, I'll actually pay for the books you are supposed to get. That would help tremendously.
Congrats, Hisshou! You smoked that JLPT 1 test, son.
HisshouBuraiKen
Member
Hey man, congrats yourself, N2 is nothing to sneeze at either. Novels are your secret weapon for N1. Just buy anything and read it cover to cover.
Not sure if it's been mentioned, but the StickyStudy Japanese flashcard app on iOS is great for learning Kanji. Only $8 too.
I've been reading your comments about Heisig, and since I'm using it as a first step I'll explain my reasoning.
It is simply a tool to memorize the (written) drawings, and a keyword to associate it. I have fuzzy memory: I have never been able to memorize a sentence, or meaning and repeat it the same way (not only for languages, in general). I have to comprehend it and then I never forget it. I guess that's why I am great with physics, engineering stuff, but I'm terrible at some social studies, and languages (to some extent).
For me, Heisig is perfect. The visual stories help me memorize a visual-personal story of how the kanji is drawn, associated to a keyword, not easy to forget.
In japanese, when you learn a word you have to learn the kanji associated to it (if there is one), the meaning, and the pronunciation. I am not used to learn like this, and when I tried the usual method I was only able to memorize some meanings + pronunciation. Now the kanji is like an anchor, and it is easier for me to memorize vocabulary with kanji. Once you learn a word with that kanji, you can forget the heisig keyword - it does not matter anymore - and if it is a radical or compound, you will keep remembering it no matter what thanks to repetition.
But it is also very time consuming, and you can waste a lot of time and learn "nothing". It is a bit like learning the letters of the alphabet, you don't still know anything. So I agree that it is best for intermediate level, something to consider once you have studied for 6 months or a year, and not like me at 2 months since I started with japanese.
If you are too concerned about the keywords not related to the real meaning, you could also try kanjidamage . It is very similar to heisig, but it also includes pronunciation, and the learning path is more useful (more frequent kanjis first). I could not use it since a lot of the stories are american slang and things like that, and like I said it is difficult for me to memorize sentences "as is", I often change some words.
With that said, I'm into my 1500 kanji today. Let's hope I finish this in one month, I am eager to continue with grammar + vocabulary.
It is simply a tool to memorize the (written) drawings, and a keyword to associate it. I have fuzzy memory: I have never been able to memorize a sentence, or meaning and repeat it the same way (not only for languages, in general). I have to comprehend it and then I never forget it. I guess that's why I am great with physics, engineering stuff, but I'm terrible at some social studies, and languages (to some extent).
For me, Heisig is perfect. The visual stories help me memorize a visual-personal story of how the kanji is drawn, associated to a keyword, not easy to forget.
In japanese, when you learn a word you have to learn the kanji associated to it (if there is one), the meaning, and the pronunciation. I am not used to learn like this, and when I tried the usual method I was only able to memorize some meanings + pronunciation. Now the kanji is like an anchor, and it is easier for me to memorize vocabulary with kanji. Once you learn a word with that kanji, you can forget the heisig keyword - it does not matter anymore - and if it is a radical or compound, you will keep remembering it no matter what thanks to repetition.
But it is also very time consuming, and you can waste a lot of time and learn "nothing". It is a bit like learning the letters of the alphabet, you don't still know anything. So I agree that it is best for intermediate level, something to consider once you have studied for 6 months or a year, and not like me at 2 months since I started with japanese.
If you are too concerned about the keywords not related to the real meaning, you could also try kanjidamage . It is very similar to heisig, but it also includes pronunciation, and the learning path is more useful (more frequent kanjis first). I could not use it since a lot of the stories are american slang and things like that, and like I said it is difficult for me to memorize sentences "as is", I often change some words.
With that said, I'm into my 1500 kanji today. Let's hope I finish this in one month, I am eager to continue with grammar + vocabulary.
marvelharvey
Member
An easy question. Do translators simply rush their subtitles out or does Japanese not have the same depth and flavour that English enjoys?
Whilst watching some American shows on Japanese TV over the weekend, I noticed that the following...
(I noted about 20 more)
... were all translated as "分かった？". Answering the phone is also something that suffers greatly and everything from "Hello" to "Yo! Wat up mudda fukkaaa?" will just become "もしもし". I feel sorry for my girlfriend who's stuck with reading these seemingly awful, watered down, flavourless subtitles. She still enjoys the shows though.
So, as asked above, is this a limitation of the Japanese language or are translators simply wanting to get home by 6pm? Sadly my 日本語 knowledge isn't extensive enough to answer this myself.
Whilst watching some American shows on Japanese TV over the weekend, I noticed that the following...
(I noted about 20 more)
... were all translated as "分かった？". Answering the phone is also something that suffers greatly and everything from "Hello" to "Yo! Wat up mudda fukkaaa?" will just become "もしもし". I feel sorry for my girlfriend who's stuck with reading these seemingly awful, watered down, flavourless subtitles. She still enjoys the shows though.
So, as asked above, is this a limitation of the Japanese language or are translators simply wanting to get home by 6pm? Sadly my 日本語 knowledge isn't extensive enough to answer this myself.
Japanese, especially Japanese TV, just does its characterization via tonality and grammar more than word choice of day-to-day phrases. There's a lot a writer can do if he's trying really, really hard but for run-of-the-mill stuff I actually had to reread your post a couple times to realize you were complaining about Japanese subtitles of those lines being too bland rather than English subtitles of 分かった being too flamboyant.
There's also a strong, strong tradition of translations as gloss rather than work in their own right; until the Restoration by far the biggest source of foreign writing was China, and Chinese texts were usually presented in Chinese with specialized punctuation and annotation.
marvelharvey
Member
Thanks for the information and little bit of history. I've subsequently added some clarity to my post.
vas_a_morir
Banned
Great idea! Any recommendations? I read the Japanese Harry Potter (Prisoner of Azkaban) this English girl gave to me before she left the country. It was a lot of help, but admittedly, I only got about 10 chapters in.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Congrats!
What's the cut off for passing?
It really depends. In many cases, there will be a ton of different ways to say a word or expression in Japanese, but your options will be limited in English.
But yeah, a lot of those things you listed should probably not have been translated simply as "分かった" unless the idea was to only convey the core meaning rather than any of the characterization and nuance.
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Japanese is very limited in identical ways of expression. English is not. I actually default to Japanese for a lot of mundane daily things for that exact reason.
Synth_floyd
Banned
I think Japanese subtitles just tend to be bland. If you watch a subbed vs. dubbed live action movie in Japanese the dubbed version will have the more natural and interesting Japanese but the subs will be streamlined and bland.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Wow, I couldn't disagree more. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're saying, but I don't think Japanese is limited when it comes to expression at all.
Yeah, I think it is very expressive, it just does it in a different way than English. Nothing wrong with that, that's part of the charm.
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Maybe you are? I meant ways. Then I said I preferred that. As an above poster noted, there are a million ways to say the same shit in English. Add in the insane amount of slang English has (in comparison, Japanese slang is far less numerous) and you get even more variances and degrees for the same basic message. If you're arguing Japanese has the same level of expressive ability when it comes to actual vocabulary available, you'd be objectively wrong. If you're saying Japanese has a much higher level of interpretation needed to understand the nuance, yes, but anyone into languages knows the difference between high/low context languages.
edit: you know what, I worded it dumb, take out varying degrees. just go with "ways"
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
I think it really depends on what you're saying, though. Depending on the expression, there may be more "ways" to say something in Japanese than in English or any other language.
Also, where are you getting your numbers for "available vocabulary"? I've always heard it's the opposite, but I don't have any data on hand.
When it comes to pure text, in particular, I feel that Japanese can often be way more expressive than English. Lots of things in English depend on the speaker's tone, gestures, facial expression, and or word emphasis and those are often challenging to express in text. Japanese tends to depend less on those things, as well as using lots of onomatopoeia in common expressions, making it much easier to express yourself accurately strictly through text.
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Meh, doesn't matter what I'm tryin to say. J-go rulez, A-go droolz.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
That's not even what I'm saying, though.
I think both languages have their own unique traits and excel in different things. Saying that one is more expressive than the other is true both ways, just in different aspects. That's my feeling on the matter at least.
Just so I know where you're coming from, would you mind providing some examples of the following?
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Er, I know that's not what you're tryin to say. That's what I'm sayin. J>E. E is for nerds.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
They aight. The brevity of Japanese is why I gravitate towards it more for the simpler things.
bigmit3737
Member
ディアブロ
I'm having trouble typing out the ディ using a regular English/Latin keyboard.
What letters on the keyboard would I need to hit?
I'm having trouble typing out the ディ using a regular English/Latin keyboard.
What letters on the keyboard would I need to hit?
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
I have a question concerning radicals.
So for each one I should be learning the following?
Actual written character
On
Kun
English Definition
Also, some of them have a lot of either On or Kun-yomi.
Is there any purpose at this point in learning like 5 On/Kun-yomi for one radical or should I only learn the first few for each?
So for each one I should be learning the following?
Actual written character
On
Kun
English Definition
Also, some of them have a lot of either On or Kun-yomi.
Is there any purpose at this point in learning like 5 On/Kun-yomi for one radical or should I only learn the first few for each?
deli or dexi
I did this in about 20 days of intense concentration.
Slime Forest Adventure is like Heisig but with the most common actual meaning of the kanji. They also made a minimal effort to give the system a game-like shell which is incredibly helpful when you're like me and want to study for hours at a time. The dry, boring, endless white void of Anki cards sucked my soul straight out. Also, you don't need to write the kanji, just recognize them and remember the meaning.
So yeah, with 1000 kanji under my belt, it's amazing how much sense vocabulary makes and how easy it is to remember.
Library =図書館 (map, write, building)
Practice = 練習 (refine, practice)
Animal = 動物 (move, thing)
Unnecessary = 不要 (non-, need)
All of a sudden Japanese feels like a piece of cake. Wish I did this back when I was taking classes.
"dhi"
shanshan310
Member
fantastic. I've been scrolling through the options to get the little イ for years ;.;
It is kind of annoying. I was hoping to take N2 in July, but alas I have to wait till December :/
July would be a much better date than December too. I would have two extra weeks for cramming the vocabulary. December is mostly packed with other things.
Now I just don't have the motivation to start learning the 700 words needed for N4. :/
shanshan310
Member
You can always try to aim for N3 in december instead!
Thanks for reminding me this exists!
Got it and took it for a quick spin - for some reason it's starting with katakana and repeats them a lot, even some I got right several times (odd, considering the default repetition options, which imply it shouldn't be happening much), but then again, it's what I started learning on my own by checking names i knew and decomposing them into their likely Japanese syllables.
I take it over time it moves on to hiragana? I didn't see any option to focus on any of those character sets...
As for the actual "game" part itself, it's walk around the forest for random encounters until you clear either all katakana and/or hiragana, and then move on to the cave for the actual princess quest?
bigmit3737
Member
Thanks guys.
There's an option to skip the kana somewhere before you start a new game.
It seems like the trainer needs you to answer new and recently missed cards a certain number of times correctly in a row, and complete any scheduled review cards, before it will show you new cards. You can change all this junk in the Trainer Tuning menu.
Yeah, the idea is to learn and practice cards and get money on the overworld and then head into the caves to continue the main quest, and those cave slimes will murder you if you're not quick on the draw and have at least five herbs. I think if you advance the story you move on to other areas where slimes teach readings and vocabulary words... or maybe that's only in the full version? I haven't bothered because I want to memorize 2000 kanji ASAP and fighting random encounters in the woods is working great for me.
bigmit3737
Member
こちらはトトリのアトリエをクリアしないまま、
Tokyoジャングルを中古で買ったけど、運任せ＆単調さにすぐ飽きて...
I don't understand what he's trying to say with 運任せ.
Secondly, is using "&" common in written Japanese? I'm assuming it means the same as it does in English.
And another question is the さ　 added to the end of 単調さ. It turns it into a noun, I'm assuming but I'm still confused as to why it's necessary.
Thanks.
Tokyoジャングルを中古で買ったけど、運任せ＆単調さにすぐ飽きて...
I don't understand what he's trying to say with 運任せ.
Secondly, is using "&" common in written Japanese? I'm assuming it means the same as it does in English.
And another question is the さ　 added to the end of 単調さ. It turns it into a noun, I'm assuming but I'm still confused as to why it's necessary.
Thanks.
Lord Ghirahim
Member
He's complaining that the game is based on dumb luck instead of skills.
People use it, yes.
You can say 単調で飽きた (got bored because it's repetitive) or 単調さに飽きた (got bored of its repetitiveness).
bigmit3737
Member
Thank you so much. Especially the 単調さ part - It clears up a lot of things, I hope.
EDIT: Looked over it again, and it certainly does clear up a lot of things. I understand why it was converted into a noun.
Thank you.
Lord Ghirahim
Member
Just think of さ as -ness or -ity. It should work most of the time.
I'm having some trouble with similar verbs. Can anyone help me out? I don't know what situation you'd use each one in. I tried searching online but I keep seeing different answers so I figured I'd ask here. Thanks in advance.
Open: 開ける, 開く.
Close: 閉じる, 閉める, 閉まる.
Open: 開ける, 開く.
Close: 閉じる, 閉める, 閉まる.
Synth_floyd
Banned
I think akeru is the transitive and hiraku is the intransitive version.
"The door opened" - hiraku
"I opened the door" akeru
hiraku can also be used for other things as a transitive verb, according to my dictionary. "I opened the shop today" "I opened the meeting"
shimeru/shimaru are the transitive/intransitive versions of "to close"
not sure about tojiru though. It means the same as shimeru/maru. Probably the usage or connotation is different.
"The door opened" - hiraku
"I opened the door" akeru
hiraku can also be used for other things as a transitive verb, according to my dictionary. "I opened the shop today" "I opened the meeting"
shimeru/shimaru are the transitive/intransitive versions of "to close"
not sure about tojiru though. It means the same as shimeru/maru. Probably the usage or connotation is different.
This is how our Japanese teacher explained it to us in their physical meanings, although sometimes more than one of the verbs can be used as well. 閉める is more of a directional closing, like sliding doors, drawers etc., whereas 閉じる is, well, not the above. Stuff with hinges like Western style doors and windows, gates, closing where you sort of join together two parts of something - eyes, books etc.
開くstill mostly involves pushing or pulling two parts of something to open it (opening your eyes can be used with both this and 開ける though). 開ける seems to be the way more general verb here, taking all the one-directional openings, taking off lids, unwrapping stuff etc.
Outside of the physical meanings, 開く and 閉じる seem to be the ones used more often as beginning or ending something.
LeroyPantwether
Member
Could someone please help in reading this correction. I had my penpal correct my sakubun for my class, and I can't read one of her kanjis. What did she replace chikai n desu with?
thanks
thanks
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