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[Freeza Under The Shower]

that was no commsat, it was a solarpanel/mirror thingie for the fooddomes and it looked like it was collateral damage while firing at the drones

"I can't believe what I'm seeing" combined with a shot earlier of someone waving at Bobbie from inside one of those kidney-domes, and the creature at the end, leads me to believe there was / is another sample of the proto-molecule in play on Ganymede and it got out. The UN marines were shooting at it while running from it, not charging the Martians. Meaning they had no idea it was there either, even if the wave from the dome was probably a wave for help or warning. The UN ships may have mistaken that for a Martian attack (the drone was unknown and may also have been jamming the UN troops) and opened fire. Or something like that.

I have to say this wasn't very clear looking at the sequence itself, but knowing story beats, I'd say you were supposed to see wave > firing > "charge" > space stuff blowing up with that line of the commander > dead martians + creature, unknown drone charging something.
The preview for next week makes this look intentional though, with that being the 'the fuck just happened' episode.

edit: turns out the line is "I can't believe we're doing this", not what I previously wrote.

Also, the proto-molecule is a type of (alien) technology (transforming Eros into a ship), for those who don't appreciate why that Epstien drive segment was in there. I thought that was a neat way of doing both theme and explaining how the hell ships move around so fast in this world (the actual distance from Mars to Saturn -phoebe base- is in excess of 18 months in the real world with realistic technology, the Martian ship did it in days). Those small scenes were sorely needed to lay down some ground rules for the diegesis that had not been dealt with yet, along with explaining why g-force death is a thing, compared to Miller not feeling anything as Eros sped up.

Also, we have no idea where the prisoner was getting his feed from. It seemed 'live' and not a recording. Less voices in the stream too.

I liked this episode, even if I understand it's hard to go from 'logical season end' to 'new season' halfway into one. I don't mind that though, since that a result of being an adaptation.

 

[jerry113]

This show looks so crisp on amazon prime's HD videos.

The visuals are just gorgeous. Those peeps walking on the surface of Ganymede with Jupiter in the background is just breathtaking.

edit: spoilers

Spoiler

Holy shit, amazing space battle out of nowhere. What was that solar panel looking thing breaking up in orbit? And what the hell was that creature?

I'm getting noticeable Halo vibes from these space marines and Martian ships. Reminds me of the Pillar of Autumn.

 

[El Daniel]

What exactly happened at the end?

 

[Cornballer]

- Sneak peek from next week's episode (please spoiler tag any discussion)

 

[Zoe]

What exactly happened at the end?

Doesn't look like we'll get an explanation until next week.

 

[Morts]

I got lost at the end there. Why exactly did a fight break out? The UN side instigated it? There was a big silver octagon?

 

[Dubbedinenglish]

I got lost at the end there. Why exactly did a fight break out? The UN side instigated it? There was a big silver octagon?

Something was going on in the UN domes with the protomolecule. There was the bit of foreshadowing with someone signaling for help on the UN side, the the gunfire from the UN side with UN marines shooting at something retreating towards the Martian line. Then it looked like either stealth ships or UN ships mistaking the surface incident for Martian attacks attacking the Martian frigate. In the fighting the solar array was destroyed and the debris crashed down to the surface killing everyone.

 

[Cornballer]

My understanding of what happened, note that I'm not a book reader so it's possible I've misinterpreted a few things... The UN troops and the Martians are patrolling on either side of some sort of a DMZ on Ganymede. Ganymede is where a lot of the crops are grown. Bobbie sees the UN troops walking towards them and then she notices the triangular drone. The drone flies away and then there is seemingly some explosions or gunshots on the UN side of the DMZ. The Martians get jammed and assume the UN are doing it. The UN soldiers start running towards the Martians, though note that they're shooting behind them at something, the implication being that they're running away from something.

A space battle breaks out, and the HUGE mirror satellite that's used to bring sunlight to the crops is shot up by someone. Pieces of that mirror start falling and destroy the ship that Bobbie was on in orbit and kill her CO. (Or that could've been the other ships.) More mirrors and debris fall onto the planet surface and take out Bobbie and her team. When she wakes up, she sees the drone from before and also whatever alien thing that was peering into her visor.

Also, the podcast is worth a listen this week. They talk a fair bit about the episode. They note that they wanted to include the Epstein drive sequence sometime this season as a short allegory that big leaps in technology have consequences (in this case, taking Epstein's life) to put a human face on the price of progress. They felt like it fit well in this episode. Also, they explained their reasoning behind not showing what happened to Bobbie in Ganymede explicitly: (minor spoilers)

Spoiler

Apparently she gets PTSD from the incident, and a large part of it is because she can't remember exactly what happened. So they spend some time with her trying to piece everything together and questioning herself. If they showed exactly what happened there, they felt like it wouldn't work as well narratively speaking. There's also a lot going on between Earth and Mars based on the incident, and the fact that no one really knows what happened heightens the tension during discussions/negotiations.

I don't doubt that they're also aware of their budget and having another big firefight in this episode might have been difficult for them, though they don't mention this. We've already seen a lot of effects this season.

 

[El Daniel]

Doesn't look like we'll get an explanation until next week.

Alright, I thought I missed something.

 

[Backlogger]

I got lost at the end there. Why exactly did a fight break out? The UN side instigated it? There was a big silver octagon?

Yeah, even having read the books, I was a bit confused about what was going on. I knew, but it was still pretty confusing, esp. the bits that occurred in space. I couldn't see what was happening at all.

It feels intentional, like we should have been as confused as the Martians. I am sure there will be more clarity added in the next episode.

 

[Cornballer]

- Wired: Let's Do the Physics of Knocking an Asteroid Into the Sun

 

[lt519]

- Wired: Let's Do the Physics of Knocking an Asteroid Into the Sun

Was the plan in the show that the Nauvoo's collision would knock it into the Sun or that they'd use it to drive it into the Sun. I guess slightly different? Based on the cinematics I'm guessing the former but based on the article that wouldn't work and maybe they'd have better luck using whatever technology they used to spin it up to actually drive it into the sun instead.

 

[nOoblet16]

The whole Epstein thing is a breakthrough because they only had fusion drives and were limited by that speed. So I think they pretty much went as far as Mars for colonizing, due to how long it took for travel.

With the drive, it allowed them to reach the belt, the outer planets, etc.

Yea ofc, but I don't see the relevance of the flashback here.

 

[danthefan]

Only on Ep.3 here, they introduced Bobbie without the (book spoiler)

Spoiler

crazy protomolecule monster

, bit disappointed by that!

And I'll also just mention is there not a massive disconnect between how Holden reacts to

Spoiler

Miller killing Dresden, and how he reacts to Amos doing, well, basically anything?

 

[Dominican Power]

Only on Ep.3 here, they introduced Bobbie without the (book spoiler)

Spoiler

crazy protomolecule monster

, bit disappointed by that!

And I'll also just mention is there not a massive disconnect between how Holden reacts to

Spoiler

Miller killing Dreden, and how he reacts to Amos doing, well, basically anything?

Holden recognizes that Amos is a sociopath.

 

[DevilDog]

What exactly happened at the end?

https://i.imgur.com/LBAxNPt.gifv

 

[Crispy75]

I said goddamn.

This just keeps getting better and better.

 

[Cornballer]

- Inside the Expanse: Season 2, Episode 6 (some spoilers)

 

[jerry113]

The Expanse nominated for Saturn Awards:

http://variety.com/2017/film/awards...tions-2017-rogue-one-walking-dead-1202000833/

Best Science Fiction Television Series:
The 100 (The CW)
Colony (USA)
The Expanse (SyFy)
Falling Water (USA)
Incorporated (SyFy)
Timeless (NBC)
Westworld (HBO)

 

[danthefan]

Holden recognizes that Amos is a sociopath.

I know but I just don't really find that satisfactory. You can't be as holier-than-thou as he is with that crazy person on your crew, I can't buy that. I find it to be poor writing tbh, that's just me though.

 

[Paganmoon]

I know but I just don't really find that satisfactory. You can't be as holier-than-thou as he is with that crazy person on your crew, I can't buy that. I find it to be poor writing tbh, that's just me though.

*gasp* Holden is a hypocrite?

 

[CSJ]

Was the plan in the show that the Nauvoo's collision would knock it into the Sun or that they'd use it to drive it into the Sun. I guess slightly different? Based on the cinematics I'm guessing the former but based on the article that wouldn't work and maybe they'd have better luck using whatever technology they used to spin it up to actually drive it into the sun instead.

Pretty sure the nukes were there to help it as well and that it all had to be timed right.
It wasn't just a collision, which the article left out. Not that it'd still actually work, but if someone's going to nitpick they should probably nitpick with all the info

 

[tearsintherain]

I enjoyed that episode but I think that might have been a tad bit too confusing, especially trying to bridge it to the next episode. The "cliffhanger" didn't really work for me, while I am 100% sure it'll all make way more sense after next weeks episode it kinda feels like they might have done this a little better, maybe move some stuff from this episode to next week and given more time to Bobby's story so its not so disjointed.

Also while Avasarala is one of my favorite characters, her speech this week was a bit over the top and I cringed a little bit as she was giving it. She sounded like a homeless street preacher, not to mention her (the actress's) way of talking - like a zen master almost - does not really lend itself to this kind of fire & brimstone speech. Her outfit was insanely cool though, looked like some sort of mix between a sari and an evening dress.

All in all I'd rate this episode the weakest of the season so far, but that just moves it from an average 9.0 to an 8.0.

 

[Jag]

Also while Avasarala is one of my favorite characters, her speech this week was a bit over the top and I cringed a little bit as she was giving it. She sounded like a homeless street preacher, not to mention her (the actress's) way of talking - like a zen master almost - does not really lend itself to this kind of fire & brimstone speech. Her outfit was insanely cool though, looked like some sort of mix between a sari and an evening dress.

I love Avasarala in the books. She's foul mouthed and sharp witted. The actress does a great job with her own interpretation, but it is subtlety different from how she was written.

 

[adamsapple]

What exactly happened at the end?

Spoiler

They saw 6 dots for the 6 marines charging, then if you notice, a 7th dot appears and it seems like some of the marines are shooting towards it.

So that Proto molecule monster was chasing those marines which is why it seemed like they were charging towards the martian crew, they were just running away from that thing. All the martian crew suits are physically ripped or shredded, so that thing probably reached and decimated them all.

 

[jerry113]

Not sure if anyone ever posted this, but here's a panel with the cast, writers, producers of the show alongside with Caltech astrophysics professors at a panel at Caltech. Funny and informative: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6CeDizcyC4

 

[The Sum of Zero]

I believe someone earlier brought up the idea of a separate OT for the books? I'm thinking that maybe be a good idea, especially considering Persepolis Rising should be out later this year.

 

[Cornballer]

I believe someone earlier brought up the idea of a separate OT for the books? I'm thinking that maybe be a good idea, especially considering Persepolis Rising should be out later this year.

You're welcome to make one if you'd like.

 

[The Sum of Zero]

You're welcome to make one if you'd like.

Alright, I'll give it a shot. It'll be my first OT so no one crucify me if it sucks heh.

 

[diaspora]

I got lost at the end there. Why exactly did a fight break out? The UN side instigated it? There was a big silver octagon?

A mirror array used to reflect and focus sunlight for agricultural development on Ganymede.

 

[Alucrid]

i just started to watch season 1 and was wondering if anyone can comment on the characterization differences between the books and tv. one example being

Spoiler

chrisjen torturing the belter in the second episode. maybe it's just me but i never got that from her. sure, politically savvy and sly as fuck, willing to destroy careers and not care, but not cruel enough to be nonchalant about torture.

maybe that's just me but it kinda put me off of the series for now

 

[tearsintherain]

I think you are wildly misreading Avasarala. I mean, in the first few episodes she completely betrays a man who she has known since childhood and was her fathers best friend in order to "bait" her ally into revealing things she didn't know. It destroyed him politically, destroyed his retirement and dreams, and ultimately killed him and she wasn't all that broken up about it.

She is not a kind grandma who hates hurting anyone. She is a ruthless politician who will do ANYTHING to win. The Mars ambassador she betrays says exactly that basically. She suggests the Deimos station attack even though she knew at that point Mars wasn't involved with the attacks so far.

Fortunately for humanity she has a fairly solid judgement on the greater good, but she will wipe out Mars or the Belters if Earth is on the line. She will die herself if need be, which makes her better than most dictators in human history, but she is not a saint. That speech she gave in the last episode about destroying the entire family of someone who betrays humanity and the power of government is an excellent look at what kind of person she is - powerful, passionate, highly intelligent, articulate, but also vindictive, focused, sociopathic in some ways, and resourceful.

The torture scene you talk about is nearly verbatim from the books by the way. The only real difference between book and TV Avasarala is that she swears a lot more in the books, which of course she can't really do on a network TV show.

 

[The Sum of Zero]

OT for the book series is up: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1350071

If you're only watching the show and do not want to be spoiled, I highly recommend you do not go over there. Publisher blurbs for each book are unmarked in the OP post.

 

[Alucrid]

I think you are wildly misreading Avasarala. I mean, in the first few episodes she completely betrays a man who she has known since childhood and was her fathers best friend in order to "bait" her ally into revealing things she didn't know. It destroyed him politically, destroyed his retirement and dreams, and ultimately killed him and she wasn't all that broken up about it.

She is not a kind grandma who hates hurting anyone. She is a ruthless politician who will do ANYTHING to win. The Mars ambassador she betrays says exactly that basically. She suggests the Deimos station attack even though she knew at that point Mars wasn't involved with the attacks so far.

Fortunately for humanity she has a fairly solid judgement on the greater good, but she will wipe out Mars or the Belters if Earth is on the line. She will die herself if need be, which makes her better than most dictators in human history, but she is not a saint. That speech she gave in the last episode about destroying the entire family of someone who betrays humanity and the power of government is an excellent look at what kind of person she is - powerful, passionate, highly intelligent, articulate, but also vindictive, focused, sociopathic in some ways, and resourceful.

The torture scene you talk about is nearly verbatim from the books by the way. The only real difference between book and TV Avasarala is that she swears a lot more in the books, which of course she can't really do on a network TV show.

bear in mind i've only watched up to s1e2,

Spoiler

but what character are you talking about that she betrays? i don't recall her doing that to anyone who hadn't crossed her first. likewise i also don't remember the torture scene in the books, was that in the second one?

 

[Kyougar]

I think you are wildly misreading Avasarala. I mean, in the first few episodes she completely betrays a man who she has known since childhood and was her fathers best friend in order to "bait" her ally into revealing things she didn't know. It destroyed him politically, destroyed his retirement and dreams, and ultimately killed him and she wasn't all that broken up about it.

She is not a kind grandma who hates hurting anyone. She is a ruthless politician who will do ANYTHING to win. The Mars ambassador she betrays says exactly that basically. She suggests the Deimos station attack even though she knew at that point Mars wasn't involved with the attacks so far.

Fortunately for humanity she has a fairly solid judgement on the greater good, but she will wipe out Mars or the Belters if Earth is on the line. She will die herself if need be, which makes her better than most dictators in human history, but she is not a saint. That speech she gave in the last episode about destroying the entire family of someone who betrays humanity and the power of government is an excellent look at what kind of person she is - powerful, passionate, highly intelligent, articulate, but also vindictive, focused, sociopathic in some ways, and resourceful.

The torture scene you talk about is nearly verbatim from the books by the way. The only real difference between book and TV Avasarala is that she swears a lot more in the books, which of course she can't really do on a network TV show.

She probably didnt care about the lifes lost on Deimos but it wasnt a bloodthirsty decision. She wanted the discussion to end, so she gave them an easy target to let them feel good about themselves, so that they feel they did SOMEHTING. The mood in the room at that point was near war.

 

[tearsintherain]

bear in mind i've only watched up to s1e2]

Yeah you should probably stay out of this thread, season 1 of the show is a combination of book 1 & 2, season 2 finishes book 1 at episode 4 and presumably the rest of the season 2 will be book 2. They also pull in some of the short stories into season 1 & 2.

Avasarala and some other characters only make their debut in book 2, they aren't in book 1 at all but they are present in season 1 of the show.

 

[Alucrid]

Yeah you should probably stay out of this thread, season 1 of the show is a combination of book 1 & 2, season 2 finishes book 1 at episode 4 and presumably the rest of the season 2 will be book 2. They also pull in some of the short stories into season 1 & 2.

Avasarala and some other characters only make their debut in book 2, they aren't in book 1 at all but they are present in season 1 of the show.

i'm reading the third book right now and i know that the seasons mix some elements of both books. that's why i was here asking about, what seems to me, a difference of characterization between the two

 

[DrSlek]

Was the plan in the show that the Nauvoo's collision would knock it into the Sun or that they'd use it to drive it into the Sun. I guess slightly different? Based on the cinematics I'm guessing the former but based on the article that wouldn't work and maybe they'd have better luck using whatever technology they used to spin it up to actually drive it into the sun instead.

The plan was to smash the Nauvoo at high speed into Eros. The wired article is correct in pointing out that angle at which they were going to do this would add speed to Eros, and push it away from the sun. But I don't think that's a big deal, as you could argue that they were pushing Eros to intercept a planet to perform a gravity brake and slow it down....at which point it would slowly drop into the sun.

 

[Angelus Errare]

Trying to get back into it. First time I watched it last year it didn't stick but I'm currently on episode 4 right now (might stick this time, I'm genuinely into the show for the time being).

Is there a story reason why mans got a spike through his chest lived? Because it definitely pinned him to the wall so I imagine it should have severed his spine no?

 

[Kyougar]

Trying to get back into it. First time I watched it last year it didn't stick but I'm currently on episode 4 right now (might stick this time, I'm genuinely into the show for the time being).

Is there a story reason why mans got a spike through his chest lived? Because it definitely pinned him to the wall so I imagine it should have severed his spine no?

its the FUTURE.


rest of season1 spoiler and not an answer to your question, just a random tidbit with book 1 spoilers

Spoiler

Damn, I forgot about Havelock. He was mentioned in book1 later but on the show his last appearance is on episode 5.

 

[jem0208]

I just binge watched this over the last few days and I've been loving it... up until the last few episodes.

What the fuck was with the floating blue Julie?

Everything up until this point the plot has been fairly plausible. The Julie thing though was just weird. I can accept the protomolecule can cause some strange ass shit to happen because it's extra solar and we can't understand it. However, this whole thing about Julie controlling it and Miller walking in and making out with here despite never meeting her and she was totally fine with it despite knowing him for all of about one minute thing?

Eh.

It dropped a little bit too far into the realm of fantasy for me there. My only theory which kinds makes sense of it is that the protomolecule somehow knew about Miller's connection with Julie and so made an image of her to stop him detonating the nuke and killing it. However that doesn't really explain why Miller was able to convince the the molecule to change course and hit Venus.

It was all just a bit too weird and I didn't like it. Maybe I just missed the point slightly...

 

[DevilDog]

I just binge watched this over the last few days and I've been loving it... up until the last few episodes.

What the fuck was with the floating blue Julie?

Everything up until this point the plot has been fairly plausible. The Julie thing though was just weird. I can accept the protomolecule can cause some strange ass shit to happen because it's extra solar and we can't understand it. However, this whole thing about Julie controlling it and Miller walking in and making out with here despite never meeting her and she was totally fine with it despite knowing him for all of about one minute thing?

Eh.

It dropped a little bit too far into the realm of fantasy for me there. My only theory which kinds makes sense of it is that the protomolecule somehow knew about Miller's connection with Julie and so made an image of her to stop him detonating the nuke and killing it. However that doesn't really explain why Miller was able to convince the the molecule to change course and hit Venus.

It was all just a bit too weird and I didn't like it. Maybe I just missed the point slightly...

Now there's two of us here.

I didn't like it at all, everything was so out of place, blue spirit birds flying in the air, mage Julie lvl 100, Miller sacrificing everything for her because she madly fell in love with her thrrough pictures that he could easily die for her etc.

It was like someone who hated The Expanse for being so grounded, finally took control to "show how things are done".

 

[El Daniel]

Me too. Heard everybody about what an amazing episode 05 was and got some fantasy that felt really out of place instead of the stuff I love about the show. And the worst thing is, is that the best character died!

 

[aku:jiki]

It dropped a little bit too far into the realm of fantasy for me there.

It was like someone who hated The Expanse for being so grounded, finally took control to "show how things are done".

This is hard to say without a vague spoiler, so here's a vague spoiler only the two of you should read and which doesn't actually spoil any specific events:

Spoiler

This is not the hard scifi show you thought it was. There is going to be more fantastical and alien shit and there's only going to be more and more added for each new season. Bail out now if you don't want space opera mixed with some elements of hard scifi and politics.

 

[DevilDog]

This is hard to say without a vague spoiler, so here's a vague spoiler only the two of you should read and which doesn't actually spoil any specific events:

Spoiler

This is not the hard scifi show you thought it was. There is going to be more fantastical and alien shit and there's only going to be more and more added for each new season. Bail out now if you don't want space opera mixed with some elements of hard scifi and politics.

Spoiler

It's ok if it's going to be this way, I will just have to stop treating this like the GOT in space thing I thought it was. Will get into the star wars mindset where magic things happen and I shouldn't think about them I guess.

Me too. Heard everybody about what an amazing episode 05 was and got some fantasy that felt really out of place instead of the stuff I love about the show. And the worst thing is, is that the best character died!

They died together bro caused they loved each other so much, so like, they live in our hearts, and stuff.

And probably are still alive down at the crash site.

 

[GreySquirrel]

With the Epstein drive stuff, I kept expecting it to tie into current events by him bumping into whatever created the protomolecule during the burn. Then they just 180 him, send him on his way and tell him not to speak of it. Or they use him to study by infecting him etc and that was actually him at the end on Ganymede. Judging by book reader reactions though I am wrong or everyone is really good at deflecting spoilers. Like, he was narrating in the past tense as if he survived

 

[The Elite]

With the Epstein drive stuff, I kept expecting it to tie into current events by him bumping into whatever created the protomolecule during the burn. Then they just 180 him, send him on his way and tell him not to speak of it. Or they use him to study by infecting him etc and that was actually him at the end. Judging by book reader reactions though I am wrong or everyone is really good at deflecting spoilers. Like, he was narrating in the past tense as if he survived

This must be important.

 

[spwolf]

Now there's two of us here.

I didn't like it at all, everything was so out of place, blue spirit birds flying in the air, mage Julie lvl 100, Miller sacrificing everything for her because she madly fell in love with her thrrough pictures that he could easily die for her etc.

Miller going crazy about her comes from him being very unhappy and unsatisfied with his life, he literally found a meaning when he started searching for her. I thought his internal struggles were well shown in the show, but I do have books to fall back to.

Basically he was detective-criminal and he tried to change around and do some good with his wasted life.

 

[grendelrt]

Miller going crazy about her comes from him being very unhappy and unsatisfied with his life, he literally found a meaning when he started searching for her. I thought his internal struggles were well shown in the show, but I do have books to fall back to.

Basically he was detective-criminal and he tried to change around and do some good with his wasted life.

When he was tracking her you could tell he was falling for her, he made comments along th way when he saw what type of person she was. It was a little stalkerish lol but the definitely showed his fascination with her.

 

[Carn82]

Everything up until this point the plot has been fairly plausible.
..
It dropped a little bit too far into the realm of fantasy for me there. My only theory which kinds makes sense of it is that the protomolecule somehow knew about Miller's connection with Julie and so made an image of her to stop him detonating the nuke and killing it.

As already posted above; it's not really 'hard scifi', the books are pretty much 'campy' space-opera (but very entertaining, I love them). Everything related to the protomolecule is pretty much 'space magic', altough I do believe you do get to learn a bit more about as the story develops. But even in the latest book it is still shrouded in mysteries. I do have to say that if you ignore protomolecule-related events; it is pretty well done regarding 'realism' (compared to other series).