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[duckroll]

You know, I was just thinking about how obviously influenced Cold Steel was by popular anime and videogame stuff at the time, and I went looking at the dates and it's pretty hilarious.

Ao came out in 2011, and Sen came out in 2013. So that means they worked on it throughout 2012 and 2013 mostly.

- Final Fantasy Type-0 is released October 2011
- Persona 4 The Animation starts airing October 2011
- Fate/Zero starts airing October 2011
- Persona 4 Golden is released on Vita June 2012
- Fate/Stay Night Realta Nua is released on Vita November 2012

And if we take into account that they have probably been planning the game since before Zero and Ao were made...

- Fate/Stay Night was released in 2004
- The first Fate/Stay Night anime aired in 2006
- Final Fantasy Agito XIII was announced in 2006
- Fate/Zero novels first came out in 2006
- Persona 3 was first released in 2006

Trails of Cold Steel really is the Animu JRPG Zeitgeist of the 00s.

 

[Nyoro SF]

Not to mention Code Geass and probably a few other big anime series I'm forgetting at the moment.

EDIT: Hell, even the school uniforms in Code Geass are reminiscent.

 

[Aters]

You know, I was just thinking about how obviously influenced Cold Steel was by popular anime and videogame stuff at the time, and I went looking at the dates and it's pretty hilarious.

Ao came out in 2011, and Sen came out in 2013. So that means they worked on it throughout 2012 and 2013 mostly.

- Final Fantasy Type-0 is released October 2011
- Persona 4 The Animation starts airing October 2011
- Fate/Zero starts airing October 2011
- Persona 4 Golden is released on Vita June 2012
- Fate/Stay Night Realta Nua is released on Vita November 2012

And if we take into account that they have probably been planning the game since before Zero and Ao were made...

- Fate/Stay Night was released in 2004
- The first Fate/Stay Night anime aired in 2006
- Final Fantasy Agito XIII was announced in 2006
- Fate/Zero novels first came out in 2006
- Persona 3 was first released in 2006

Trails of Cold Steel really is the Animu JRPG Zeitgeist of the 00s.

You are forgetting a bizillion light novel adaptation anime series set in "military high school" at the time. We still get loads of shit like that in 2016.

 

[SephLuis]

So, I finally finished Trails in the Azure. What a ride.

Overall, it's my second favorite game in the series, trailing behind Zero. I should start CS1 soon. So far, my list should be something like:

1. Zero
2. Azure
3/4. SC = 3rd
5. FC

I got a few questions about the end that I just want to make sure:

Spoiler

1. So Mariabelle has joined Ouroboros. And by the last picture I assume that the Jaegers squad also joined them. Is that right ?

2. Erebonia has invaded Crossbell and took control of the country. When did this happen ? I read mention of 2 years but I couldn't read fast enough in the cutscene >.>
So I am not sure if Crossbell was invaded two years later or if two years have passed since the Erebonia invasion

3. Seems the SSS are working into freeing Crossbell from Erebonia. Really hope we can see this in CS2 or CS3 (still haven't played CS2 yet)

 

[Scrooge McDuck]

You are forgetting a bizillion light novel adaptation anime series set in "military high school" at the time. We still get loads of shit like that in 2016.

Wow, Final Fantasy VIII is truly ahead of its time.

 

[duckroll]

So can anyone explain why everyone knew the song Class VII sang at the end of Cold Steel in the encore? Is it something that was introduced in another game?

 

[Young Magus]

Listened to the Zero OST in full........
I

Spoiler

re

founded my next game after p5 in seems.

So can anyone explain why everyone knew the song Class VII sang at the end of Cold Steel in the encore? Is it something that was introduced in another game?

Spoiler

Its the ending song for Sky SC

 

[Scrooge McDuck]

So can anyone explain why everyone knew the song Class VII sang at the end of Cold Steel in the encore? Is it something that was introduced in another game?

Yea, what Young Magus said. I still believe that it's originally intended to be

Spoiler

"Whereabouts of Light". Everything pointed to that, from it being a folk song everybody is supposed to know in Erebonia to it being a callback fanservice tune. Then maybe they were unable to do it due to some stupid budgetary reasons.

 

[duckroll]

Oh, that's pretty disappointing.

Spoiler

I don't really care for the vocal songs in Trails, kinda generic. I guess that was meant to be a lame fan-insert moment where the audience for the concert were Japanese Trails fans playing the game too since I suppose the songs are more popular there.

I don't think it was ever meant to be Whereabouts of Light though. They already used it on Trista radio (GREAT scene), and it's been established that it's a song that's pretty old and probably not super popular these days. I was hoping it was some new popular song from Crossbell or something. Meh.

 

[Bebpo]

So, I finally finished Trails in the Azure. What a ride.

Overall, it's my second favorite game in the series, trailing behind Zero. I should start CS1 soon. So far, my list should be something like:

1. Zero
2. Azure
3/4. SC = 3rd
5. FC

I got a few questions about the end that I just want to make sure:

Spoiler

1. So Mariabelle has joined Ouroboros. And by the last picture I assume that the Jaegers squad also joined them. Is that right ?

2. Erebonia has invaded Crossbell and took control of the country. When did this happen ? I read mention of 2 years but I couldn't read fast enough in the cutscene >.>
So I am not sure if Crossbell was invaded two years later or if two years have passed since the Erebonia invasion

3. Seems the SSS are working into freeing Crossbell from Erebonia. Really hope we can see this in CS2 or CS3 (still haven't played CS2 yet)

Interesting. I agree that Zero's a better overall game. I thought so too. It's a well packaged game from start to finish. Perfection of what an FC game should be. Otoh, Ao has so much more satisfying highs, truly epic stuff, great characters, great gameplay, but it's kind of messy, especially in the end and leaves a bit too much unresolved for Sen/Cold Steel to finish up instead of completing in its own chapter.

To answer your questions:

Spoiler

1. Mariabelle replaced Wiseman as a main pillar. I don't remember about the second part, but it's implied at least Shirley joined as an enforcer/agent. Which is annoying because she totally should have been written out of the story after that ending, but she's a cute psycho girl for otaku to latch onto so I guess they want to keep her around.

2. This happened after the end of gameplay Ao. Lloyd knew this was going to happen and the tree was the only thing that could've stopped them but they did the good thing and defeated it anyhow leaving Crossbell open to invasion. This invasion lasted 2 years until like the epilogue says Crossbell is finally freed.

Separate spoiler tag for you for #3 Minor timeline spoiler if you want to know:

Spoiler

CS2 ends about where the epilogue in Ao starts (a few months maybe further). CS3 most likely will take place during the 2 year epilogue period and maybe goes past it.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

I mean, the Sky series of games is very anime too, just of a different

Spoiler

better

era.

 

[SephLuis]

Interesting. I agree that Zero's a better overall game. I thought so too. It's a well packaged game from start to finish. Perfection of what an FC game should be. Otoh, Ao has so much more satisfying highs, truly epic stuff, great characters, great gameplay, but it's kind of messy, especially in the end and leaves a bit too much unresolved for Sen/Cold Steel to finish up instead of completing in its own chapter.

Agreed. I also liked Zero a lot because of what happened on with a few story lines that began on The 3rd.

Ao just suffers from some pacing. Some moments you cannot put the game down because of everything that's happening and other moments you ask yourself when it's going to end. I started this game in march and there were parts that took me a few days and others that took me months to finish.

I'm just divided in regards of gameplay. They put a lot of new mechanics, which I appreciate, but oh boy, it's broken. I only had issues with one boss in particular (

Spoiler

the white gundam and his attack that nulls three physical and three magical attacks

) while the rest were mostly easily topped by specials + burst. I didn't even had to use master arts.

To answer your questions:

Spoiler

1. Mariabelle replaced Wiseman as a main pillar. I don't remember about the second part, but it's implied at least Shirley joined as an enforcer/agent. Which is annoying because she totally should have been written out of the story after that ending, but she's a cute psycho girl for otaku to latch onto so I guess they want to keep her around.

Spoiler

I also thought it strange they got Shirley since I appreciated how they ended her story along with Lisa and Randy. Guess they will keep her as sexual harrasment character + war lord.

Spoiler

2. This happened after the end of gameplay Ao. Lloyd knew this was going to happen and the tree was the only thing that could've stopped them but they did the good thing and defeated it anyhow leaving Crossbell open to invasion. This invasion lasted 2 years until like the epilogue says Crossbell is finally freed.

Separate spoiler tag for you for #3 Minor timeline spoiler if you want to know:

Spoiler

CS2 ends about where the epilogue in Ao starts (a few months maybe further). CS3 most likely will take place during the 2 year epilogue period and maybe goes past it.

Spoiler

I am really happy to hear that Crossbell is freed after two years. This was probably my favorite aspect of Ao story in the sense that there was not an absolute enemy, but that different parties had different opinions on the future of Crossbell.

While I was happy for Lloyd and especially for Kiya (what a great character, really), I also knew what would come after because Crossbell would be left without a defense.

 

[Bebpo]

Seph, please edit your post. You missed a spoiler tag!

 

[SolVanderlyn]

I had a dream I was playing a localized Crossbell game.

I haven't had a video game dream since I was in elementary school.

This series has gripped me.

 

[SephLuis]

Seph, please edit your post. You missed a spoiler tag!

Thank You for the warning. Didn't even realized that a spoiler tag missed.

Hopefully no one read it yet

 

[duckroll]

Lucky for you, I'm illiterate!

 

[Aters]

Wow, Final Fantasy VIII is truly ahead of its time.

Yes it is. Back then you didn't have a new anime series set in a military high school every season (there are at least 14 of them in recent 3 years). Now that shit is everywhere. Games like Type-0 didn't start a trope, they were simply following a bigger trend that spans through game, anime, manga and light novel. Cold Steel is an example. Valkyrie Chronicles 2 is another example.

 

[Menthuss]

Just started SC the other day and holy hell, this is way harder than Cold Steel was. I'm still in the prologue and it took me like 5 attempts to get past the first boss! I failed to kill

Spoiler

the Jaeger that jumps through the window

(couldn't even get him to half health) and am now up against

Spoiler

the spear-wielding Jaeger.

and am getting my ass kicked. If the rest of the game is going to be this hard I might have to start over on normal...

 

[duckroll]

First of all, SC on Hard is just bullshit. Nightmare is impossible. Secondly, the prologue of SC is the hardest part of the entire game, so on Hard it is double bullshit. Lol.

 

[Bebpo]

The games are all the toughest early on when you don't have many build options.

 

[coredecepts]

Yeah, there are a handful of reasons the intro of SC is really hard, but it's not an indication of the difficulty of the rest of the game.

 

[preta]

First of all, SC on Hard is just bullshit. Nightmare is impossible. Secondly, the prologue of SC is the hardest part of the entire game, so on Hard it is double bullshit. Lol.

If you think SC's hard, just wait until you play 3rd.

 

[Menthuss]

Welp, I'm starting over on normal. It's literally impossible to beat the

Spoiler

3rd Jaeger

on hard. He can two-hit anyone and frequently gets double and sometimes even triple turns. At best I get him down to half health and then he just outpaces my feeble attempts to heal the damage he does. Did some reading up and people are saying hard is balanced for NG+. Pretty shitty of the game to not mention this. Gives me a pretty poor early impression :/

 

[Neoweee]

First of all, SC on Hard is just bullshit. Nightmare is impossible. Secondly, the prologue of SC is the hardest part of the entire game, so on Hard it is double bullshit. Lol.

So Hard is not recommended in SC, at all? I did FC and and CS1 on Hard, and CS2 at Nightmare. Is SC Normal already comparable to those settings?

Welp, I'm starting over on normal. It's literally impossible to beat the

Spoiler

3rd Jaeger

on hard. He can two-hit anyone and frequently gets double and sometimes even triple turns. At best I get him down to half health and then he just outpaces my feeble attempts to heal the damage he does. Did some reading up and people are saying hard is balanced for NG+.Pretty shitty of the game to not mention this. Gives me a pretty poor early impression :/

CS2 tells you that Nightmare is balanced for NG+, but that is a straight-up lie. Difficulty descriptions (or the lack there of) are a mess in RPGs.

 

[coopolon]

Can someone explain the rule about not having the same kind of quartz in a line in TitS FC?

The guest character in chapter 3 won't let me install defense and poison/petrify in the same line saying "Can't have same quartz" even though they're not right next to each other.

But Estelle can have defense and poison/petrify literally right next to each other in the same line?

 

[King_Moc]

First of all, SC on Hard is just bullshit. Nightmare is impossible. Secondly, the prologue of SC is the hardest part of the entire game, so on Hard it is double bullshit. Lol.

SC prologue was tough. I'm on chapter 6 now and it's a cakewalk though.

 

[duckroll]

Can someone explain the rule about not having the same kind of quartz in a line in TitS FC?

The guest character in chapter 3 won't let me install defense and poison/petrify in the same line saying "Can't have same quartz" even though they're not right next to each other.

But Estelle can have defense and poison/petrify literally right next to each other in the same line?

Does the guest already have a different type of defense quartz installed? Like, if you have Defense 2, you can't stack another Defense 1 anywhere regardless of line in TitS. They removed this limitation in Cold Steel.

 

[encephalon]

The prologue in SC is hard enough that jumping straight from XSEED's FC to Japanese SC had me go back and play through FC again. Which really made me appreciate FC. FC is great.

 

[coopolon]

Does the guest already have a different type of defense quartz installed? Like, if you have Defense 2, you can't stack another Defense 1 anywhere regardless of line in TitS. They removed this limitation in Cold Steel.

Nope. Character is

Spoiler

Tita

. She currently has EP Cut 2, Blind, Defense 2, Move 2, Range 1, and Impede 2 in that order. Trying to install Poison in the Range 1 slot (so it would be between Move 2 and EPCut2 in her Line 2) gives me the error "Cannot install two of the same type of quartz."

 

[Scrooge McDuck]

Nope. Character is

Spoiler

Tita

. She currently has EP Cut 2, Blind, Defense 2, Move 2, Range 1, and Impede 2 in that order. Trying to install Poison in the Range 1 slot (so it would be between Move 2 and EPCut2 in her Line 2) gives me the error "Cannot install two of the same type of quartz."

I'm pretty sure it's because you have Blind. "The same type of quartz" in this context is "the type that gives status effects to your attacks". If I remember correctly you just can't have two of those period, same line or no.

 

[coopolon]

I'm pretty sure it's because you have Blind. "The same type of quartz" in this context is "the type that gives status effects to your attacks". If I remember correctly you just can't have two of those period, same line or no.

Yep, that was it, thanks to both you and duckroll! Just now trying to understand the lines and optimize arrangements.

 

[Korigama]

The prologue in SC is hard enough that jumping straight from XSEED's FC to Japanese SC had me go back and play through FC again. Which really made me appreciate FC. FC is great.

Having finally gotten into FC now that I've returned to it (just started Chapter 3), I'm enjoying seeing how everything started a good deal.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

So I'm warming up to the EVO games a bit. I still dislike the character portraits, but the voice acting and gameplay updates are very welcome additions. OST is give or take.

I'd kill for a definitive PC EVO mod with the voices, updates, a selectable OST, and old school character portraits.

 

[Young Magus]

So I'm warming up to the EVO games a bit. I still dislike the character portraits, but the voice acting and gameplay updates are very welcome additions. OST is give or take.

I'd kill for a definitive PC EVO mod with the voices, updates, a selectable OST, and old school character portraits.

I'll settle with a patch for Zero/Ao EVO (Falcom or HENkaku) that allows for the old OST. Like what the 3rd evo has.

BTW, what are the gameplay updates/changes? I thought they werent recieved well?

 

[preta]

I'll settle with a patch for Zero/Ao EVO (Falcom or HENkaku) that allows for the old OST. Like what the 3rd evo has.

BTW, what are the gameplay updates/changes? I thought they werent recieved well?

I haven't played any of them, but far as I know, they add in the ability to attack enemies on the field like in Zero and onwards, add more turn bonuses, and at least in the case of 3rd, dramatically increase enemy HP. They weren't received well by most because they completely screw up the balancing, from what I've read.

 

[Nyoro SF]

Zero no Kiseki Chapter 1

I finished up Zero chapter 1 over the past few days and it has been an extremely enjoyable game so far.

Spoiler

Only downside is that I dislike how difficult it is to avoid field monsters. In FC, SC, CS1 and CS2 there was a fairly standard rule that as long as you stuck to the road in the middle of orbal lanterns, you could move forward freely without getting interrupted by monsters. Zero throws this rule right out the window and the monsters are really aggressive. It was only after I managed to buy the necessary quartz that I managed to take control of the field and completely handle this annoyance. Looks like Tio and Ellie have the best field attacks, so it's best to scope with Tio and then shoot with Ellie on the field and to prevent quartz distribution from getting clogged up.

Thanks to someone telling me that only important characters get portraits, I am now deathly scared of every single portrait I come across thinking it's Ouroboros. I'm sure Mr. Pink Hair is actually a supervillain... but real talk, the art in this game is fantastic. It's a shame it's so fuzzy.

The characters get better and better with every chapter. I'm really curious about Ellie's past and why she is afraid of being seen at that mansion in the residential district. The scene where she hides surreptitiously is great. Randy is fantastic as always at the beginning of the chapter raring to find an onee-san nurse, putting the moves on the receptionist nurse and almost getting to first base and then is shot down by the angry head nurse who yells at both of them. Then he gets mad jealous because Lloyd has a childhood friend onee-san sexy nurse Cecile who only cares about Lloyd lmao. Then Lloyd gets mad when they start whispering about Lloyd having a secret relationship. At the bus stop Ellie's like "so all men are like this, huh" and Lloyd's like "don't lump me in with him!" and Tio agrees with her lmao.

Speaking of Randy, don't think I didn't notice that brief moment where Randy was about to do something crazy when they got surrounded by armored dogs, Falcom! What is Randy hiding, eh? Is he actually a demon playboy that came straight from Gehenna just to hit on girls? Speaking of Gehenna, I saw a structure next to the church outside of Crossbell that looked might suspicious... almost like an old schoolhouse...

And how can we forget Renne's appearance (this is like... the third time that I've audibly said "oh shit" while playing this game). It sounds like she's "wandering". Her dialogue is interesting like always. What's up with the "Doll" house though? Having played Cold Steel this isn't the first time I've heard "doll" being used in this series, and seeing Renne in front of that place makes it incredibly suspicious.

I'm not sure why we need a wolf whose name is hard to pronounce (Tsuwaito?). But it's there. And it helped us out by guiding us. And Tio can talk to animals using technology! We have an in-universe explanation for why Tio is wearing cat ears!

And yeah Mr. Arios is definitely incredibly suspicious now. He has a conversation with Renne after we smack down the mafia goons. He knows of the Society, but whether or not he's being manipulated by them is still unknown (all signs point to: yes). Of course the game shows me that he has his heartbreakingly cute blind daughter Shizuku, so it wouldn't surprise me if Arios was promised that he could restore her sight using ancient magic or an artifact and that's his ultimate goal. If the game was beating me over the head that he was a villain before, it's pretty much 99% obvious now. But I'm perfectly OK with obvious villains, plus Arios looks cool.

I find it incredibly amusing that Falcom is using such typical Italian names for the mafia bosses, like they just popped in the most stereotypical Italian mafia film and just wrote that shit down.

Finally I have to say that I'm surprised Randy is so much stronger than Lloyd. Not only does he start with the best craft (20CP, AoE, AT Delay is ridiculously strong in every Kiseki), but his attack power is higher, his base defense is essentially the same, his range is better, Salamander has an 80% chance of burn (And line-crafts are very strong in grid Kiseki), his grenade toss craft has a 100% chance of blind and has incredible range. Lloyd looks super limited compared to him. Maybe if Lloyd hit on girls more he'd get stronger. Lloyd has the signature main character Motivate craft but buffs are just OK in this game as opposed to Steel where they're very strong. Maybe it's just cause Lloyd's a rookie and Randy isn't.

 

[Gu4n]

The wolf's name is Zeit.

Good to hear your impressions being so positive, please keep sharing them!

 

[perorist]

.

Yeah I didn''t like that the field quartz only work on the lead character. I had to waste 2 slots on Ellie just so I could use her up front without rotating every time I wanted to do a field attack.

Spoiler

As for the Mr. Pink Hair, you've already "met" him if you've played the sora trilogy.

Glad you like Randy, he's my favorite zero character. And Lloyd has no problem with the ladies (　・´ｰ・&#65344

 

[Nyoro SF]

The Doll Knight books in SC! How could I forget! I was stewing over this all day wondering where I had heard doll being used before. Time to reread the Doll Knight and see if it applies to anything. Like someone once told me, "books are the only true constants in Kiseki games."

The wolf's name is Zeit.

Good to hear your impressions being so positive, please keep sharing them!

Well! That is WAY easier to pronounce, so thanks.

Yeah I didn''t like that the field quartz only work on the lead character. I had to waste 2 slots on Ellie just so I could use her up front without rotating every time I wanted to do a field attack.

Spoiler

As for the Mr. Pink Hair, you've already "met" him if you've played the sora trilogy.

Glad you like Randy, he's my favorite zero character. And Lloyd has no problem with the ladies (　・´ｰ・&#65344

I remember the scene with Lloyd and the girl at the bakery and Lloyd accidentally dropping some smooth lines... the SSS was like "is this guy for real?" lmao

 

[Gu4n]

The Doll Knight books in SC! How could I forget! I was stewing over this all day wondering where I had heard doll being used before. Time to reread the Doll Knight and see if it applies to anything. Like someone once told me, "books are the only true constants in Kiseki games."

And in the case of the Doll Knight, even outside the Kiseki games. And yes, there's plenty of relevance in there.

 

[Crimson_Justice]

Newbie to the series here with probably a strange question. Would it be fine to go TitS FC > CS FC? I'm thinking not, but I wanted to ask.

I started TitS FC about a year and a half ago, getting through the Prologue and Chapter 1 before some stuff came up, and now I've finally come back to it. I'll finish it sometime this week, as I'm partway through the final chapter. I don't have the money for SC right now, though (which sucks, cause FC has been amazing and I'd love to roll right into SC). But I do own CS FC for PS3 already.

 

[Aaronrules380]

Newbie to the series here with probably a strange question. Would it be fine to go TitS FC > CS FC? I'm thinking not, but I wanted to ask.

I started TitS FC about a year and a half ago, getting through the Prologue and Chapter 1 before some stuff came up, and now I've finally come back to it. I'll finish it sometime this week, as I'm partway through the final chapter. I don't have the money for SC right now, though (which sucks, cause FC has been amazing and I'd love to roll right into SC). But I do own CS FC for PS3 already.

TiTS SC is the direct followup to TitS FC, so I wouldn't recommend going into anything but SC straight after FC

 

[duckroll]

I'm curious. What books are there in Zero and Ao? Because in CS1 and CS2 so far, there is one new book each and one reprint from FC/SC each. And iirc in FC you could also read an old book from one of the pre-Kiseki LoH games. So what's in Zero and Ao? Just brand new books? No reprint from previous games?

 

[chaosblade]

Zero no Kiseki Chapter 1

I finished up Zero chapter 1 over the past few days and it has been an extremely enjoyable game so far.



Finally I have to say that I'm surprised Randy is so much stronger than Lloyd. Not only does he start with the best craft (20CP, AoE, AT Delay is ridiculously strong in every Kiseki), but his attack power is higher, his base defense is essentially the same, his range is better, Salamander has an 80% chance of burn (And line-crafts are very strong in grid Kiseki), his grenade toss craft has a 100% chance of blind and has incredible range. Lloyd looks super limited compared to him. Maybe if Lloyd hit on girls more he'd get stronger. Lloyd has the signature main character Motivate craft but buffs are just OK in this game as opposed to Steel where they're very strong. Maybe it's just cause Lloyd's a rookie and Randy isn't.

Fan translation out? Is it not completely terrible?

 

[Crimson_Justice]

TiTS SC is the direct followup to TitS FC, so I wouldn't recommend going into anything but SC straight after FC

I figured, I'm just really in the mood for more of the series. I'll wait until I get the money, then. Thanks!

I'll be back with impressions in a few days.

 

[Marche90]

Fan translation out? Is it not completely terrible?

Nah, he's playing the Japanese version.

 

[BassForever]

Honestly I'm scared shitless at the idea of play zero no kiseki with a fan translation since who knows how long it'll take them to finish Ao.

 

[Basileus777]

Honestly I'm scared shitless at the idea of play zero no kiseki with a fan translation since who knows how long it'll take them to finish Ao.

I'd be more scared because it would likely be some terrible machine translation that took all the life out of the series.

 

[Marche90]

Honestly I'm scared shitless at the idea of play zero no kiseki with a fan translation since who knows how long it'll take them to finish Ao.

I'm more scared about the quality of it, tbh. The head of the project is... stubborn and has some crazy ideas, to say the least.

 

[Nightengale]

If the translation is acceptable, just play Zero. It's a very wholesome game on its own, unlike say FC or CS1.