I thought part of their defense was that the back gate was busted and that's where the killer could have come in, which I believe is past the kitchen from the staircase.
That's a secondary front entrance under the stoop. I don't think they explained how the killer would get from the basement to the main stairs without going past nasir though
First half is great stuff. Solid direction, great cast, very promising premise. Second half is the writing tumbling down the hill. I'm not expecting much out of the finale, but the cast and production are still top notch.
I caught up today, after watching 3 episodes consecutively. I still like the show quite a bit and can't wait for the finale. John Turturro is awesome.
There are issues, though, and they've been pointed out. Naz's strange and fast character change while in prison, his decisions (tattoos, etc.) and how different he's become from his starting character.
I applaud them for changing things up by showing that he's not the aloof and innocent teen we thought he was at first, but they've gone too far in some ways.
Also, the Duane Reed thing. Surely he'll be in the finale.
It's great. First four episodes are probably some of the best TV I've ever seen. Last three episodes have been a bit too procedural-heavy and too reliant on the expected tropes but if you ignore the lame investigation stuff, it's still pretty good.
So Naz has anger issues and assaulted two kids at school because they were being racist. Ok, i understand that. But why the sudden change in character now in prison? The tattoos and acting like a thug. And that emotionless stare in court when the pictures of the murder scene were shown, that doesn't help his case at all. I think Naz just gave up; something snapped. He thinks he doesn't have any chance to get out of this. But they failed to make that believable for the viewer. Also i don't believe how his mom is now suddenly convinced he murdered that girl. They showed the pictures and she stormed out of the room. What kind of a mother is she? Not very good writing imho.
So Naz has anger issues and assaulted two kids at school because they were being racist. Ok, i understand that. But why the sudden change in character now in prison? The tattoos and acting like a thug. And that emotionless stare in court when the pictures of the murder scene were shown, that doesn't help his case at all. I think Naz just gave up; something snapped. He thinks he doesn't have any chance to get out of this. But they failed to make that believable for the viewer. Also i don't believe how his mom is now suddenly convinced he murdered that girl. They showed the pictures and she stormed out of the room. What kind of a mother is she? Not very good writing imho.
So Naz has anger issues and assaulted two kids at school because they were being racist. Ok, i understand that. But why the sudden change in character now in prison? The tattoos and acting like a thug. And that emotionless stare in court when the pictures of the murder scene were shown, that doesn't help his case at all. I think Naz just gave up; something snapped. He thinks he doesn't have any chance to get out of this. But they failed to make that believable for the viewer. Also i don't believe how his mom is now suddenly convinced he murdered that girl. They showed the pictures and she stormed out of the room. What kind of a mother is she? Not very good writing imho.
The tattoos and "acting like a thug" are Naz's alternative to getting burned alive in his bed at night or catch acid to the face. Naz's attitude change is annoying to me (though as someone mentioned above, maybe it's not so much a change as it is peeling back the layers we're presented with in the beginning) but more so because he's less likable to me now than he was at the start. But at the same time I understand doing what he's doing in order to stay afloat and keep himself under the protection of the only guy who has genuinely protected him so far.
He was instructed to keep that kind of emotionally blank stare while in the courtroom.
And I think his mom is just overwhelmed with the "mountain of evidence" being presented against her son, with the pictures of Andrea's body being the straw that broke the camel's back. I don't know if she is necessarily 100% convinced her son is a murderer, but I think it's also hard to listen to the prosecution's case, all the evidence stacking up against her son, hear things she probably had no idea about before (taking drugs, selling Adderall, etc.), see the victim's brutalized body and not begin to have a moment of doubt.
I'm surprised everyone is turning on this show so quickly. :lol I've had to stay out of this thread til now because I've been constantly 1-2 episodes behind, but I'm still really enjoying it and find it pretty compelling. And yeah, Naz makes a lot of infuriating dumb mistakes that don't help him at all, but he's hardly the first kid accused of murder who has hurt his case through his own self-inflicted dumb decisions.
Along with all the other complaints brought up i can't stand the scenes with the cabbies or the supposed Queens Pakistani community at all. The actors aren't Pakistani, their accent isn't Pakistani, and their depiction is way off.
The problem with it is that the threat is unrealistic.
"I hate how Nasir has swimming trunks on all the time, it's ridiculous"
"What do you mean? The jail is flooded with 4 feet of water to keep the prisoners from fighting because it's really hard to fight in water, of course he has swimming trunks on!"
Richard Price is one of my personal Gods, and this is blasphemy.
Cool aside: the actress playing the defense attorney liked a tweet of mine out of nowhere in which I gave props to the show. Social media isn't *always* garbage.
At this point I'd take the lowest lows of S2 of the Wire over anything in this series the way this series had set up and inflated the tension and scenario and went on to pop and deflate it immediately and continually.
Finally caught up. Almost perfect for me. Don't give a crap about court realism, I want character drama.
Came into this thread expecting people to complain about the cat and Stones feet not "moving the plot forward", and that's exactly what I got! GAF would write characters as deep as Star Wars prequel jedi.
Was wondering why this thread was 26 pages of some show. So I went and watch it, the beginning was really good but mid point it started to feel like a law and order tier series. So unless it really ends strong, I don't see myself giving it higher than a 7.5 overall score. Great production values though.
Srsly? That was the worst scene of the series so far to me. She seemed so awkward and the pacing was terrible. I kept saying out loud "what the fuck is this? why is this happening?"
I thought her acting was good. She sounded tired and like someone running down some script she uses that would have been fresh sounding 20 years ago. I don't know, I just kind of enjoyed watching that part. Maybe it's because I kind of don't like any character other than Stone, so watching her and Katz toying with each other professionally was a bit endearing.
One my bigger issues with the trial is - WTF is Stone doing? Like they build up all season that this guy is the underdog lawyer for this trial and then in the latest few episodes basically has Chandra do all the work and all the talking so far during the trial.
It's terrible - take a character who you have been developing all season and swap them out right before they have their climactic moment, for a boring, undercooked character who KISSES the defendant (for no reason at all). Unbelievably dumb.
I mean I'm sure he'll be back during the finale to drop some kind of defense bomb, but still why did he not present things initially? It's just another weird decision.
Finally caught up. Almost perfect for me. Don't give a crap about court realism, I want character drama.
Came into this thread expecting people to complain about the cat and Stones feet not "moving the plot forward", and that's exactly what I got! GAF would write characters as deep as Star Wars prequel jedi.
I don't give a flying fuck about realism, I watch this show for the characters, but I also care about shit that makes sense, and even breaking bad with how pulpy it is runs better than this show.
Weak character drama, weak plot movement, makes no sense, inexplicable development, dropped threads, etc etc.
You can just waltz in and try to boil down the complaints to "yah but it's character drama"
(The weak set up of the court hurts the character drama and plot, maybe if you re read the complaints you'd see people explaining why)
Finally addressing the inhaler thing..but glossing the fucking fact it's pristine in this pool of blood crime scene. Is this for real?
The prosecution is laughably grasping at straws. Bringing up altercations in high school like it's some smoking gun that this guy is the unleashed monster. Selling his prescription drug and emphasizing how it's a 3000% profit deal like that's supposed to make anyone draw a line from that to being this murderer. Now, if it was a 1500% profit increase i wouldn't have blinked but 3000%?! This guy surely killed her! Such acumen of a mastermind criminal. How does that fit with all the mistakes he did?
Is this really the prosecution's best foot forward getting a conviction? They don't even try to dispute Katz testimony. The DA is just trying to make the jury think he's lying saying what he did like he lied about the praising speech he gave the ME..
This episode highlights the absurdity that this case has gotten so far and into a trial.
Finally addressing the inhaler thing..but glossing the fucking fact it's pristine in this pool of blood crime scene. Is this for real?
The prosecution is laughably grasping at straws. Bringing up altercations in high school like it's some smoking gun that this guy is the unleashed monster. Selling his prescription drug and emphasizing how it's a 3000% profit deal like that's supposed to make anyone draw a line from that to being this murderer. Now, if it was a 1500% profit increase i wouldn't have blinked but 3000%?! This guy surely killed her! Such acumen of a mastermind criminal. How does that fit with all the mistakes he did?
Is this really the prosecution's best foot forward getting a conviction? They don't even try to dispute Katz testimony. The DA is just trying to make the jury think he's lying saying what he did like he lied about the praising speech he gave the ME..
This episode highlights the absurdity that this case has gotten so far and into a trial.
The prosecution is laughably grasping at straws. Bringing up altercations in high school like it's some smoking gun that this guy is the unleashed monster.
Yes, but it reeks of desperation when they literally trying to establish Nasir as this monster based only on two occasions of violence in his whole life, which happened at high-school and dealing with the post 9/11 situation. And then trying to inject a grand sinister-ness to selling of the drugs.
It speaks volumes of the flimsiness of the prosecution's case and the actual evidence they have on him. As does the DA having no actual counter argument to all what Katz presented. That the character witness part is what's taking the driver seat shows how crazy it is that the case wasn't shut down before getting to this point. And that's without the additional still unaddressed questions that cast even more doubt on Nasir being the killer.
Yes, but it reeks of desperation when they literally trying to establish Nasir as this monster based only on two occasions of violence in his whole life, which happened at high-school and dealing with the post 9/11 situation. And then trying to inject a grand sinister-ness to selling of the drugs.
It speaks volumes of the flimsiness of the prosecution's case and the actual evidence they have on him. As does the DA having no actual counter argument to all what Katz presented. That the character witness part is what's taking the driver seat shows how crazy it is that the case wasn't shut down before getting to this point. And that's without the additional still unaddressed questions that cast even more doubt on Nasir being the killer.
You seem to be under some illusion that evidence in trials is normally cut and dry. It rarely is. A prosecutor's job is to go to court with what the police provide, and to buttress that with things like character witnesses and circumstantial evidence.
I've marathoned the show this week and I'm still invested, but it has been a downhill slide since the fantastic pilot episode.
The main issue is I can't see a satisfying ending. If it was Naz all along that's dull and I don't think they've handled the switch in perspective on his character well, if it was the step dad or someone else then I don't buy that they can figure that out in one more episode (and it would feel cheap), or if it ends with an ambiguous perspective on whether Naz was guilty or not that also feels lazy.
Looking forward to the finale as well. Really enjoyed this show and while it hasn't been as consistently up to the standards of the pilot, it has still been really captivating and I've looked forward to every episode. Hopefully they'll be able to provide a satisfying conclusion and wrap up the loose ends. The nice thing too is that I didn't know about the show beforehand so watching the pilot was a real nice surprise. I hope HBO continue making limited series like this.
Like people have alluded to before, not enough evidence to convict, Naz is free'd from his jail but is forced to live the life of a person accused of murder regardless, that said, they're gonna play the wild animal card since he already murdered people and he'll probably do some fucked up shit in an epilogue or something since he's already a "bad dude" i guess.
Really looking forward to the finale as well. The show has just been mesmerising and captivating and I'm really looking forward to seeing the conclusion and hopefully a satisfying resolution.
Prediction:
The shady man at the gas station killed Andrea on the orders of the step father. We find out Naz is innocent but the jury finds him guilty and he is still convicted.
I don't think I need to find out who did it to have some satisfaction, but a few weeks ago I would have been against finding out if it got in the way of character stuff, now I'm not sure which aspect I care about most.
The defense really hasn't shown anything to make anyone think twice about Nas not being the murderer. Unless they magically come up with something on tonight's show.
