Not only does
Sir Lucan
Marquis de Lafayette
-
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The Order: 1886 |OT| Gears of Yore
- Thread starter Skux
- Start date
Not only does
Death also isn't an inevitability for the knights like it is for the average person. They live for hundreds of years and even in battle have the blackwater to rely on. The death of a knight probably comes as a bigger shock to them. I don't think they see themselves as being human much anymore due to their life spans. The death of a regular person is coming sooner or later, especially given life expectency during the time, so those probably mean little to the knights. The death of one of their own is a rare occurence.
The lord commander mentioned it several times as well.
Andronicus
Banned
i need to know what the blackwater is, vampire blood? (the lord chancellor "men were never meant to live this life" near the ending, is he a vampire too?)
Freezasaurus
Member
I know. I evacuated in a slightly different manner.
With the airship on the ground in a flaming heap. 
flipswitch
Member
I didn't realise you had to press a button to activate blacksight, I thought it kicks in automatically when the bar is full. Missed so many opportunities to use it and now I'm right near the end of the game..
WordsintheWater
Member
Did anyone else half expect
a flashback scene when Galahad picks up the crossbow and says something like "this takes me back" would have been cool if they had a scene with him in another time period right there.
Good point. I guess Galahad's reaction to his death is indeed well explained. I failed to see that till all this debating happened
The Xtortionist
Member
A liquid generated by the holy grail
When people become knights of the Order, they drink pure blackwater from the grail. After that, they refill their vials with their blood (which is now infused with blackwater).
When people become knights of the Order, they drink pure blackwater from the grail. After that, they refill their vials with their blood (which is now infused with blackwater).
I agree. I'm just speculating but Galahad probably
had friends who weren't knights (and as a result had normal life spans) who he's outlived over and over again so he's probably hardened to that, but losing his close friend & mentor who has been with him for centuries hit him hard. Knights are expected to live for a long time so when one of them dies it's not like Galahad is just going to shake it off and move on.
Byron Bluth
Banned
Yup. I don't know why people are having a hard time figuring it out.
We have a breakthrough
Andronicus
Banned
family_guy
Member
Ever seen Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade?
0.1.1.2.3.5.8.13.21.34.55
Banned
Yep, the materials look incredibly real/beautiful... When i first walked into the hospital and saw the wall tile reflecting the glow of light coming through the windows, my jaw dropped.Love how the light reacts to different types of material.
bananafactory
Banned
Did Viveks score just jump from a :'( to a ?
?Love how the light reacts to different types of material.
Game has that CG look at times.
Yeah, the attention to detail and lighting is incredible. I think it has the CG look a lot of times.
I am almost done (I take forever to complete games.... took me two weeks for inFAMOUS: SS). Sometimes it feels strange controlling a character through a scene that looks so good - visuals usually reserved for cutscenes in other games - and even then the quality isn't this high.
I've been through several stealth parts and so far they've felt good. I haven't died, killed all of the guards I could, etc. I think it's handled far better here than in other games I've played. I understand some people just detest stealth sequences in general. I know I'm not a big fan of them. But the criticism of them in this game seems harsh. Maybe I've just gotten lucky.
My favorite part so far:
I've been through several stealth parts and so far they've felt good. I haven't died, killed all of the guards I could, etc. I think it's handled far better here than in other games I've played. I understand some people just detest stealth sequences in general. I know I'm not a big fan of them. But the criticism of them in this game seems harsh. Maybe I've just gotten lucky.
My favorite part so far:
the entire airship chapter. It was glorious and really fun. The acting by the VA for Galahad is top notch. And kudos to the animators responsible for bringing him to life. This is next level shit.
I feel like your scores are very fair. Personally I would give The Order the same score of 7.5, but would definitely give Dying Light a 8.5 for the sheer amount of "good" content. The side quests are very well designed. I feel like Techland can tweak the formula a little and potentially give us something as good as fallout in the future.
Anyway, back on topic. I really want a sequel to the Order. It has so much potential and the devs clearly want another crack at it. Let's hope that the sales figures are good enough for Sony to greenlight a sequel. However, many feel like the issue with The Order is the amount of content... and since so much work (3 years) went into the visuals, I wonder how can they improve the next game without a big hit on visual fidelity.
0.1.1.2.3.5.8.13.21.34.55
Banned
Where was the lycan fight scene under the train track, from the first reveal footage?
Did Viveks score just jump from a :'( to a
Lol. It was always
I had a lot of unanswered questions with the story, but my criticism was hardly about it until I decided to debate it today. There haven't been many games that have even gone this far in terms of story telling
DirtyLarry
Member
Finished it yesterday, my wife was awesome this weekend and let me play whenever I wanted, and what a crock of funding bullshit that this game is getting such negative reviews. Just bullshit.
It is like people are purposely giving it low scores simply because it has the best graphics ever on a console, and this is pretty much indisputibal, screenshots do not do it justice, but it does not have the gameplay to match the graphics.
Yes. The gameplay is simplistic and very traditional in its approach. But it is solid as fuck. The guns are fun as hell to use. Really solid shooting. Yeah yeah, it's short, okay that is a fact, but that makes it a horrible game? I generally don't like cut scenes either, and had zero issues with them in this game. And the QTE's are brief and tightly woven.
Just cannot believe the backlash. It's crazy.
And let's just state it again. It's the best looking game on consoles thus far, and truth be told this engine is capable of visuals that challenges all other engines, despite platform and yep, that also means PC. clearly PC games are capable of more technically, but from on overall visual perspective, this game holds its own despite platform. It is beautiful.
It is like people are purposely giving it low scores simply because it has the best graphics ever on a console, and this is pretty much indisputibal, screenshots do not do it justice, but it does not have the gameplay to match the graphics.
Yes. The gameplay is simplistic and very traditional in its approach. But it is solid as fuck. The guns are fun as hell to use. Really solid shooting. Yeah yeah, it's short, okay that is a fact, but that makes it a horrible game? I generally don't like cut scenes either, and had zero issues with them in this game. And the QTE's are brief and tightly woven.
Just cannot believe the backlash. It's crazy.
And let's just state it again. It's the best looking game on consoles thus far, and truth be told this engine is capable of visuals that challenges all other engines, despite platform and yep, that also means PC. clearly PC games are capable of more technically, but from on overall visual perspective, this game holds its own despite platform. It is beautiful.
Actually, it's like people are purposefully giving it low scores because it's $60 and 5-10 hours with no replay value. I personally think that's bullshit too.
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
Just beat the game.
Absolutely loved it, despite the obvious flaws. My favorite single player campaign so far this gen, easily. Gave me tons of Uncharted 1 vibes throughout and I really can't wait for the sequel because the theme for this game is extremely appealing to me.
Most surprising thing to me was how PHENOMENAL the gunplay was. It's seriously BEST IN CLASS stuff for the third person genre (much better than TLOU/Gears IMHO). I was a little worried that the game would be a little too slow and clunky for my liking based on what I saw, but actually playing it is sublime -- it's extremely quick, responsive, and aggressive. The weapons pack a punch, and the attention to detail regarding the sound & animation really gives you a great sense of feedback.
Can't say enough about the visuals either -- this is the first game since KZ2 that seems to have designed the entire engine around a specific look and artstyle -- huge focus on mitigating jaggies (this game hardly had any) and presenting a rather clean aesthetic combined with superb lighting and meticulous attention to detail. The post processing of the game further gives it a 'CG' look to the point where it's very difficult to find flaws with the game's visuals. Naughty Dog has their work cut out for them.
The ending was fantastic too -- it closed up certain loose ends while also leaving you intrigued for what's to come. I got Batman Begins ending vibes from this. Really well done.
SEQUEL IMPROVEMENTS I'D LIKE TO SEE:
Overall Design / Pacing
- Lessen the focus on QTE's, particularly for important boss battles. They don't need to be removed completely, but they shouldn't be nearly as prominent.
- Take a queue from Uncharted -- do most mundane actions through gameplay. I thought the quick cutscenes every few minutes wasn't really necessary and just seemed to make the game more disjointed than it really needed to be. Cutscenes are important, but they need to be a "reward" for the player, not something that happens quite as regularly as they do in this game.
- Open up the game world a bit. Maybe introduce a hub area in London, perhaps a marketplace that branches to various parts of the city where the individual missions take place, where you can use certain equipment to navigate. I think the series could really stand to look at something like Batman as a good case for "open linear". It doesn't need to be quite as open as that title, but as an example it would have been quite awesome to have the artwork that is regularly shown be the central hub town, where you can path down to various parts of the city that open up through the narrative structure. From there you have a bit more freedom to explore within those sections (Whitechapel, United East India Company, Docks, etc). I think Arkham Asylum is a good core foundation I think they should try and emulate.
- Introduce far more "gameplay systems" -- upgradeable weapons/armor, an inventory system where you can bring out various tools/equipment to progress (I didn't like that this seemed to be so automated for lockpicks/electricity shortages), perhaps an expansion of the abilities (blackwater / blacksight weren't really all that useful, but they could have been with some tweaks), allow additional abilities to have an upgrade path.
Gunplay Mechanics
Already extremely solid. Refine the cover system and replace the QTE nature of roll/dodge/melee with authentic versions. Other than this, I don't have too many areas for improvement, it's already really good. Perhaps add a bloom reticule so you can tell a bit easier if you're about to get a headshot. Sometimes it was difficult to judge if I was going to land a hit with a particular weapon's range.
Combat Encounters
- Need to be opened up dramatically to include combat arenas. The areas in this title were too confined.
- Need to figure out how to make Lycan encounters engaging. This was a big disappointment.
- Add additional enemy types and play up the sci-fi aspect a bit more in order to add combat variety.
- Add MP/Co-op modes. The fantastic mechanics in this game beg for this to be made.
Visuals:
- Add more gibblets to the visuals. They're present, but often very easy to miss. They need to be more prominent.
- Biggest disappointment with the graphics has to be the facial modeling / animation. Still looks to have some remnants of last-gen...and to be fair, these issue haven't been resolved by any next-gen devs thus far. Eyes / teeth can still look awkward at times, and the faces don't realistically match up to what the characters are communicating. This is somewhat nit-picky, as overall The Order does this better than the vast majority of games, but it stands out just because the rest of the package looks so good.
Overall, very pleased with the game and hope a sequel is greenlit. I suggest Sony outright buy RAD and integrate them with the rest of their studios. The scores are not indicative of this team's quality or what they will clearly be capable of now that they've taken the tremendous leap from PSP developers to creating best-in-class next-gen visuals.
Absolutely loved it, despite the obvious flaws. My favorite single player campaign so far this gen, easily. Gave me tons of Uncharted 1 vibes throughout and I really can't wait for the sequel because the theme for this game is extremely appealing to me.
Most surprising thing to me was how PHENOMENAL the gunplay was. It's seriously BEST IN CLASS stuff for the third person genre (much better than TLOU/Gears IMHO). I was a little worried that the game would be a little too slow and clunky for my liking based on what I saw, but actually playing it is sublime -- it's extremely quick, responsive, and aggressive. The weapons pack a punch, and the attention to detail regarding the sound & animation really gives you a great sense of feedback.
Can't say enough about the visuals either -- this is the first game since KZ2 that seems to have designed the entire engine around a specific look and artstyle -- huge focus on mitigating jaggies (this game hardly had any) and presenting a rather clean aesthetic combined with superb lighting and meticulous attention to detail. The post processing of the game further gives it a 'CG' look to the point where it's very difficult to find flaws with the game's visuals. Naughty Dog has their work cut out for them.
The ending was fantastic too -- it closed up certain loose ends while also leaving you intrigued for what's to come. I got Batman Begins ending vibes from this. Really well done.
SEQUEL IMPROVEMENTS I'D LIKE TO SEE:
Overall Design / Pacing
- Lessen the focus on QTE's, particularly for important boss battles. They don't need to be removed completely, but they shouldn't be nearly as prominent.
- Take a queue from Uncharted -- do most mundane actions through gameplay. I thought the quick cutscenes every few minutes wasn't really necessary and just seemed to make the game more disjointed than it really needed to be. Cutscenes are important, but they need to be a "reward" for the player, not something that happens quite as regularly as they do in this game.
- Open up the game world a bit. Maybe introduce a hub area in London, perhaps a marketplace that branches to various parts of the city where the individual missions take place, where you can use certain equipment to navigate. I think the series could really stand to look at something like Batman as a good case for "open linear". It doesn't need to be quite as open as that title, but as an example it would have been quite awesome to have the artwork that is regularly shown be the central hub town, where you can path down to various parts of the city that open up through the narrative structure. From there you have a bit more freedom to explore within those sections (Whitechapel, United East India Company, Docks, etc). I think Arkham Asylum is a good core foundation I think they should try and emulate.
- Introduce far more "gameplay systems" -- upgradeable weapons/armor, an inventory system where you can bring out various tools/equipment to progress (I didn't like that this seemed to be so automated for lockpicks/electricity shortages), perhaps an expansion of the abilities (blackwater / blacksight weren't really all that useful, but they could have been with some tweaks), allow additional abilities to have an upgrade path.
Gunplay Mechanics
Already extremely solid. Refine the cover system and replace the QTE nature of roll/dodge/melee with authentic versions. Other than this, I don't have too many areas for improvement, it's already really good. Perhaps add a bloom reticule so you can tell a bit easier if you're about to get a headshot. Sometimes it was difficult to judge if I was going to land a hit with a particular weapon's range.
Combat Encounters
- Need to be opened up dramatically to include combat arenas. The areas in this title were too confined.
- Need to figure out how to make Lycan encounters engaging. This was a big disappointment.
- Add additional enemy types and play up the sci-fi aspect a bit more in order to add combat variety.
- Add MP/Co-op modes. The fantastic mechanics in this game beg for this to be made.
Visuals:
- Add more gibblets to the visuals. They're present, but often very easy to miss. They need to be more prominent.
- Biggest disappointment with the graphics has to be the facial modeling / animation. Still looks to have some remnants of last-gen...and to be fair, these issue haven't been resolved by any next-gen devs thus far. Eyes / teeth can still look awkward at times, and the faces don't realistically match up to what the characters are communicating. This is somewhat nit-picky, as overall The Order does this better than the vast majority of games, but it stands out just because the rest of the package looks so good.
Overall, very pleased with the game and hope a sequel is greenlit. I suggest Sony outright buy RAD and integrate them with the rest of their studios. The scores are not indicative of this team's quality or what they will clearly be capable of now that they've taken the tremendous leap from PSP developers to creating best-in-class next-gen visuals.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Finished the game. It might be because of the sentiments I read here, but I didn't feel like the game wrapped up that poorly. The overall package came across as a well told prologue that will set the stage for (hopeful) sequels in this universe.
I already posted my sentiments earlier, but I really can't say I enjoyed the interactive bits of the game very much. Loved the world, characters, visuals, sound design, plot (despite some possibly illogical bits), dialogue, and voice acting, etc. but the 'gameplay' part was middling to frustrating for me.
The shooting against human enemies was fine for the most part. Bog-standard shooting gallery for everything but the final two encounters or so where they just flood the room with enemies and force you to actually move around. The amount of enemies made that more chaotic and frustrating than exciting, though.
The Lycan encounters were garbage and ridiculously exploitable if you use the time slow-down thing. Am I wrong or did they seriously design just
? This kind of recycling really made it feel like they didn't put much thought into the actual combat part of the game.
The QTE stuff was OK when it wasn't insta-fail, so only the combat encounters. Everything else was just annoying and only worked to kill the tension in a scene because you failed to press the triangle button that suddenly appeared on screen within the 2 second window. OK... let's do it again. Not fun.
The stealth stuff was just awful. Made absolutely no sense why just because the game decides it's "stealth mode" time that guards suddenly gain the ability to kill you in one-shot. It's also hilarious how your melee kill is less powerful in stealth mode (have to time it correctly with the camera centered on the enemy) compared to general combat where you just need to be in close proximity. None of the stealth or stealth sequences added anything to the game, since you always just ended up going guns blazing in the next scene. That kind of stuff worked in Uncharted 2 because it was optional and allowed for you to get through an area without fighting hordes of enemies.
They didn't make it fun to explore the environments either and often punished you for doing so because of the slow walking speed that was forced on you for so much of the game.
After all this, I still walk away with a generally positive impression of the game because of the amazing presentation and really interesting setting, story and characters. If they get the chance to do a sequel, I really hope they either figure out how to inject some fun into the gameplay, or just get rid of it all together and go full Heavy Rain or some other type of adventure game that doesn't rely on shooting arenas to justify being a video game.
I already posted my sentiments earlier, but I really can't say I enjoyed the interactive bits of the game very much. Loved the world, characters, visuals, sound design, plot (despite some possibly illogical bits), dialogue, and voice acting, etc. but the 'gameplay' part was middling to frustrating for me.
The shooting against human enemies was fine for the most part. Bog-standard shooting gallery for everything but the final two encounters or so where they just flood the room with enemies and force you to actually move around. The amount of enemies made that more chaotic and frustrating than exciting, though.
The Lycan encounters were garbage and ridiculously exploitable if you use the time slow-down thing. Am I wrong or did they seriously design just
a single room layout and recycle it for the three Lycan encounters
The QTE stuff was OK when it wasn't insta-fail, so only the combat encounters. Everything else was just annoying and only worked to kill the tension in a scene because you failed to press the triangle button that suddenly appeared on screen within the 2 second window. OK... let's do it again. Not fun.
The stealth stuff was just awful. Made absolutely no sense why just because the game decides it's "stealth mode" time that guards suddenly gain the ability to kill you in one-shot. It's also hilarious how your melee kill is less powerful in stealth mode (have to time it correctly with the camera centered on the enemy) compared to general combat where you just need to be in close proximity. None of the stealth or stealth sequences added anything to the game, since you always just ended up going guns blazing in the next scene. That kind of stuff worked in Uncharted 2 because it was optional and allowed for you to get through an area without fighting hordes of enemies.
They didn't make it fun to explore the environments either and often punished you for doing so because of the slow walking speed that was forced on you for so much of the game.
After all this, I still walk away with a generally positive impression of the game because of the amazing presentation and really interesting setting, story and characters. If they get the chance to do a sequel, I really hope they either figure out how to inject some fun into the gameplay, or just get rid of it all together and go full Heavy Rain or some other type of adventure game that doesn't rely on shooting arenas to justify being a video game.
shinobi602
Member
Yea I agree, I actually quite liked how the game wrapped up. The ending especially was abrupt but, I don't know, it was powerful to me and left an impact and really made me clamor for a sequel so I didn't have a problem with it personally.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
What the fuck.
WHAT THE FUCK.
I started this game being bombarded with unbelievable levels of dejection due in no small part to the 3834728934 threads that are filled with sentiment of disillusion and disappointment only to find...what the fuck?
You get control of your character within minutes and whilst you are tunneled, to some extent, on where you are able to go...the ratio of cut-scenes is heavy but as the transitions are unfathomably slick they matter little.
I'm having just as much fun with this at this point as I was with the original Uncharted and whilst I understand grievances others might have, the game is a blast. I hope to god they get an UC2 chance next time around.
Oh and, dick.
WHAT THE FUCK.
I started this game being bombarded with unbelievable levels of dejection due in no small part to the 3834728934 threads that are filled with sentiment of disillusion and disappointment only to find...what the fuck?
You get control of your character within minutes and whilst you are tunneled, to some extent, on where you are able to go...the ratio of cut-scenes is heavy but as the transitions are unfathomably slick they matter little.
I'm having just as much fun with this at this point as I was with the original Uncharted and whilst I understand grievances others might have, the game is a blast. I hope to god they get an UC2 chance next time around.
Oh and, dick.
Bornstellar
Member
The Art team on this game has something they should be incredibly proud of.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Is there a spoiler thread to discuss the story?
My problem is that sequel is 3 years away, minimum. The story of The Order feels almost episodic in nature... but it isn't. That's just all there is, for a very long time. And it's certainly not like a sequel is any guarantee at all.
If there is never a sequel, this game's story has to stand up on its own.
And it doesn't.
family_guy
Member
Yeah. I stopped picking stuff up after realizing how worthless it was. It's like they really were trying to pad the game and this was the best they could come up with.
shinobi602
Member
I...wouldn't say that's the case.
I can agree that I'll feel like I'm left hanging if there's no sequel, but I mean that as of this moment having completed it recently, I came away satisfied simply due to (again just how I see it personally) how well a sequel is set up.
Ya, if you compare it to the readable collectables in The Last of Us or Wolfenstein: The New Order, just... yikes. TLoU gives you a reason to press Square to read the fine text. The Order doesn't, even if you could.
There were a few interesting ones here and there, but the vast majority are almost entirely pointless, for sure.
As someone in the thread mentioned previously, those collectables were a massive missed opportunity to expound upon the lore of their vision of Victorian London and The Order itself.
I don't think it's that far away. They've got the engine finished, and I'm sure that took the majority of their time since they had to build it from scratch. If they get the green light to make a sequel I can see it coming out in 2017.
The Xtortionist
Member
My biggest concern for a sequel would be that it might want to tell its own story, leaving many of the dangling threads from 1886 unaddressed. Not that it would be something completely different, just that the main focus of the sequel's narrative could potentially ignore setups made in the first game.
If it picks up like the day after 1886 leaves off, then cool.
VeryGooster
Banned
3 and 9. Chapter 3 is essentially the first test for the player as far as dealing with multiple enemies goes and since the areas are constrained the situation is actually pretty tense. The story starts to turn in 9 and there's lots of fun gunplay but I actually liked Rani quite a bit. If a sequel is greenlit hopefully she's there (and perhaps as a co-op partner).
You better be right about this Shinobi!
No but seriously, I really want the sequel to this game. I get the feeling that because the story has presumably been pre-written to spread over numerous titles (guessing a trilogy), it will feel more cohesive as a whole, and have a bit more to it than is ordinary for these types of games. If the sequel is it's own story and doesn't carry on from The Order 1886, I'll be deeply disappointed.shinobi602
Member
Heh, I wasn't saying that a sequel's already greenlit, but I can tell you it certainly won't take 3 years.
The Xtortionist
Member
I can't imagine the outrage if it didn't.
RAD's still a small studio, no? Maybe if they ramp up, I dunno. Games take a long time to make, these days. Even Call of Duty is on a 3 year cycle...
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Thanks! Posted some questions/comments over there.
NotTheGuyYouKill
Member
This game should have been treated like Season 1 of a TV series.
It isn't.
It isn't.
MegaSackman
Member
Only two years passed from Akham Asylum to Arkham City and there were big changes from one to the other.
For a second there I thought you were implying that there wasn't going to be a sequel.
Damn Shinobi, you had me worried.
The Xtortionist
Member
The Order 2's narrative has the burden of needing to retroactively make the first game's better. Not sure if that's good or bad. RAD has a lot to deliver on to make up for 1886.