The original Tomb Raider games were something truly special weren't they

JokerMM

Gay porn is where it's at.
i Just finished my replay to the original trilogy on PS1 and I have to say, the level design in them is utterly fucking insane. So much verticality and returns to the same hub rooms after unlocking the next path, and at the same time every single room/area is a hard challenge in itself. The difficulty level in the last couple of maps in every single one is also crazy, borderlining to unfair in some places. i gotta wonder how the fuck did my 12 yo self ever finish them without any guides?

goddamn did the new trilogy sucked monkey balls in in comparison
 
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Yep the atmosphere and level design are top notch. Combat always feel semi terrible but luckily most levels barely feature any.

Dat Nevada desert tr3 level. Just nice quiet, snakes, the flowing rivers, and the occasional passing jet. So good. Of course the prison level right after kinda sucks balls but it is what it is.
 
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i Just finished my replay to the original trilogy on PS1 and I have to say, the level design in them is utterly fucking insane. So much verticality and returns to the same hub rooms after unlocking the next path, and at the same time every single room/area is a hard challenge in itself. The difficulty level in the last couple of maps in every single one is also crazy, borderlining to unfair in some places. i gotta wonder how the fuck did my 12 yo self ever finish them without any guides?

goddamn did the new trilogy sucked monkey balls in in comparison
Agree wholeheartedly. The latest Tomb Raider games tried too hard to be a poor mans cross between Uncharted and TLOU. The thing that made Tomb Raider so great was the foreboding sense of isolation in a forbidden place, with environmental puzzles at the forefront.
 
The platforming itself was actually the challenge and satisfying. Most games after that didn't realise doing the actual platforming should be interesting, not basically automated, like most games afterwards.

For some reason it became the consensus that tomb raider's intricate platforming controls were bad design, rather than the point and what made it good.

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Yep the atmosphere and level design are top notch. Combat always feel semi terrible but luckily most levels barely feature any.

Dat Nevada desert tr3 level. Just nice quiet, snakes, the flowing rivers, and the occasional passing jet. So good. Of course the prison level right after kinda sucks balls but it is what it is.
my favorite gotta be Atlantis from TR1
what a beautiful abomination that was. straight up horror game
 
Yep, I recently played through the original trilogy myself and they were quite amazing. Memorable levels that actually made you think, platforming that puts the player in control and a main character that was one hell of a badass.

It's a shame what the series has become, not only did they remove all the gameplay elements that made Tomb Raider into Tomb Raider, but they also turned Lara into Generic White Woman #47.
 
i Just finished my replay to the original trilogy on PS1 and I have to say, the level design in them is utterly fucking insane. So much verticality and returns to the same hub rooms after unlocking the next path, and at the same time every single room/area is a hard challenge in itself. The difficulty level in the last couple of maps in every single one is also crazy, borderlining to unfair in some places. i gotta wonder how the fuck did my 12 yo self ever finish them without any guides?

goddamn did the new trilogy sucked monkey balls in in comparison
Not all games age well unfortunately. RE series is another one. At the time TR series was quite brilliant but it was limited to the hardware specs and the controller limitations of such era. That's why today are not appreciate how deserve.
 
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I really like the first game, not so much the sequels.

There are many memorable moments in the first game, but the one that left the strongest impression on me is the Sphinx level, when you drop into the water. I had never seen anything like this before, and overall, Tomb Raider was my first 3D Adventure game, so it was a first on many aspects. Played it on Saturn, replayed it last year, loved it. Timeless game.
 
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The original Tomb Raider is probably one of the few games I wish I could go back in time to re-experience.
Truly magical experience.
 
It always amuses me how in a time "feminism" is so talked about, they managed to turn her into the most generic character ever.

Her attitude during those first 5 games was so damn badass.

Somehow they thought dressing her in clothes from head to toe and reducing her boobs would be enough. A shame that her personality was forgotten.

Her one liners were actually funny. Like a female James Bond. Hopefully they don't forget this in the future.
 
You've yet to play the best then, The Last Revelation, which took the improvements from 2 and 3 but brought back the actual Tomb Raider part of 1.


Although I do wish they never had added that slow ass climbing and crouching movement stuff from 3.
 
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You've yet to play the best then, The Last Revelation, which took the improvements from 2 and 3 but brought back the actual Tomb Raider part of 1.
Yeah everyone talking about the "trilogy" when The Last Revelation is the best one from the Core Design days.

In fact the team that created tomb raider 2 went on to create 4. A second team was assembled to do 3 which was basically a worse more difficult tomb raider 2. A few extra graphical enhancements here and there but nothing special.
 
The original was my first 3D platformer so it definitely blew my mind, more so than Mario 64. Mario came out 6 months later here.
 
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Never played first 2 games but 3rd and Last Revelation were amazing. No over the top action, lots of puzzles. For me, as a kid, they really felt challenging. The puzzle where you had to navigate the correct stones over the side of a pyramid without sliding down in the hole would be considered bad game design by todays standarts. Nowadays we got this...

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You've yet to play the best then, The Last Revelation, which took the improvements from 2 and 3 but brought back the actual Tomb Raider part of 1.

is that the one where you start off with young lara and her dad? i vividly remember the first or second level being in egypt if i'am not wrong
i think i finished it at the time
 
dude, it just stroke me

i think the reason i love the souls games so much is because they kinda have that old TR feeling, i don't even know how to describe it

You have large maze-like areas to explore with shortcut doors that can be opened up later on when you find the keys/levers or indeed shortcuts that don't involve doors that allow quicker traversal through levels. As you progress through the game it's like you're actually continuously traversing, something Tomb Raider had in groups of levels rather than the whole game, but the spirit is the same.

You have the feeling of vulnerability, that when you step forward into the unknown of a new level, death is a very real possibility and the only way you're going to learn. In Tomb Raider it's more about the platforming, traps and such, with some tough enemies, whereas in Souls/Bloodborne the focus is on the enemies but even these games have traps and boulders, staples of classic Tomb Raider. A staple of both series is getting lost/not knowing where to go next with branching paths confusing the player and the game not pushing you in one direction or another
 
is that the one where you start off with young lara and her dad? i vividly remember the first or second level being in egypt if i'am not wrong
i think i finished it at the time
It was some kind of greedy mentor of hers. Von Croy if I remember correctly. For some reason the first level of young Lara made it look like the guy died because of his greed but somehow later in the game he's alive and well. I believe the story never really explained it?
 
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At the time they were great games, 1 to 4 were must buy's for me, but a younger generation wouldn't be impressed with them now i imagine, they are from their time.
 
Anniversary is good but its soooooo casualized compared to the original. Still more fun and engaging than the automated platforming in Nu Raider but overall a step down in my opinion. Time trials were the best part.
I am actually torn as i did like the first trilogy very much but i just hated the blocked stuff everywhere. I mean blocks, squares etc
 
People who shit on the controls have no idea what they're talking about. Everything was designed to mimic the thought process that goes into real life environment traversal.

The game teaches you to walk to the edge and judge the distance of the gap, or the depth of a drop. There is a button modifier (L1) that gives you total safety as you approach the edge slowly. As long as you hold this button in, you will not fall, and it becomes second nature to hold it in whenever you see a ledge. Compare and contrast this to modern games like new Tomb Raider, Ass Creed, Prince of Persia, Uncharted etc. They just have you moving the analog stick haphazardly up to the edge until whoops, you fell off, but the character conveniently auto-grabbed the edge so it's all okay. They invented this auto-grab solution to fix a problem (running off the edge) which the old digital controls already solved with the L1 button.

The auto-grab solution is hand-holding too, because it removes the real danger element completely:

Old TR games - gives you the tools to prevent falling, but if you fall off then you are fucked (as it should be)
New games - lets you fall all the time due to having less tools to prevent it, but if you fall off you are always saved (ultimately no danger)

This auto-grab way of doing things is not how people function in real-life. What is more accurate - that a real-life climber would slowly and carefully plan out their next move first, or would they just blast ahead and make the mistake but magically be saved? It doesn't even introduce any excitement into the game because the auto-grab will always just... work. In most new games it's not manually triggered as a last moment thing to avoid death, unless they add some QTE grab mechanic.

The running jump in the old games was also more realistic than what has come after. You can break many jumps in the old TR games down like this (in fact you are even taught this in Lara's gym):

1. Carefully move to the edge. Judge the distance.
2. If you need to, take a step back.
3. Run to the edge and jump over the gap.

Literally everyone in real life will jump over a gap like this unless you are a parkour psychopath. But then 'parkour' seems to be all that modern platforming is to game devs. Every modern fucking game like Uncharted has you running through the jungle at mach speed, not needing to take any run ups or think at all. It's just leaping all over the place like a monkey on speed. No thought, no stakes, practically plays itself.
 
Such deliberate and atmospheric adventures. One of the all-time greats.

I remember playing the reboot years ago, and I was like "What the hell is this?!" I'm not saying it's an awful game - I enjoyed it for what it was, but it was such an unwelcome departure from what I hoped to see from the continuation of this series.
 
Played the demo of the first one on my old Pentium 133mhz. Great times. Child me got nearly a heart attack when Lara stepped on the hand of Midas …
 
People who shit on the controls have no idea what they're talking about. Everything was designed to mimic the thought process that goes into real life environment traversal.

The game teaches you to walk to the edge and judge the distance of the gap, or the depth of a drop. There is a button modifier (L1) that gives you total safety as you approach the edge slowly. As long as you hold this button in, you will not fall, and it becomes second nature to hold it in whenever you see a ledge. Compare and contrast this to modern games like new Tomb Raider, Ass Creed, Prince of Persia, Uncharted etc. They just have you moving the analog stick haphazardly up to the edge until whoops, you fell off, but the character conveniently auto-grabbed the edge so it's all okay. They invented this auto-grab solution to fix a problem (running off the edge) which the old digital controls already solved with the L1 button.

The auto-grab solution is hand-holding too, because it removes the real danger element completely:

Old TR games - gives you the tools to prevent falling, but if you fall off then you are fucked (as it should be)
New games - lets you fall all the time due to having less tools to prevent it, but if you fall off you are always saved (ultimately no danger)

This auto-grab way of doing things is not how people function in real-life. What is more accurate - that a real-life climber would slowly and carefully plan out their next move first, or would they just blast ahead and make the mistake but magically be saved? It doesn't even introduce any excitement into the game because the auto-grab will always just... work. In most new games it's not manually triggered as a last moment thing to avoid death, unless they add some QTE grab mechanic.

The running jump in the old games was also more realistic than what has come after. You can break many jumps in the old TR games down like this (in fact you are even taught this in Lara's gym):

1. Carefully move to the edge. Judge the distance.
2. If you need to, take a step back.
3. Run to the edge and jump over the gap.

Literally everyone in real life will jump over a gap like this unless you are a parkour psychopath. But then 'parkour' seems to be all that modern platforming is to game devs. Every modern fucking game like Uncharted has you running through the jungle at mach speed, not needing to take any run ups or think at all. It's just leaping all over the place like a monkey on speed. No thought, no stakes, practically plays itself.
dangerously based post
 
A staple of both series is getting lost/not knowing where to go next with branching paths confusing the player and the game not pushing you in one direction or another
Something modern AAA is deathly afraid of doing because they know that aspect right there will turn off a good % of casuals and they won't be able to sell a zillion copies to make up for those overinflated budgets.

Instead you get to play games of 'follow the directions' now.
 
Would love to see a new trilogy that is much more puzzle oriented. Maybe not as back-track happy as the originals, not sure if that would fly today, but where the puzzles and tomb exploration were the core of the game and not miss-able side quests. With a lot less third-person shooter action as well. Just a nice linear game with beautiful graphics, and an assortment of tombs/puzzles that were of ever increasing in difficulty.
 
TR1 is one of the best games ever made. There are so many patches out there to make it a lot more presentable & less glitchy too

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The first two games were so so good! It took so long for kid me to figure out I needed to use king midas hand to turn the lead bars gold. 😅
 
It was one of the first 3D games I played on PC, so yeah I remember it fondly. I never really bothered with the sequels, did put some time in Gold I believe.
 
The platforming itself was actually the challenge and satisfying. Most games after that didn't realise doing the actual platforming should be interesting, not basically automated, like most games afterwards.

I absolutely agree. The platforming and the way Lara controls IS the gameplay and a huge part of elements that make these games unique and good. It is awesome gameplay design. The first Tomb Raider games are ALL about the gameplay. They want to be played by the player instead of being (mostly) watched by the player like Uncharted or similar games where the movement and platforming is completely automated. Tomb Raider games are active gameplay experiences while Uncharted and the likes are more passive experiences.

For some reason it became the consensus that tomb raider's intricate platforming controls were bad design, rather than the point and what made it good.

There are people who don't like OG Tomb Raiders controls, and there are also people who don't like OG Resident Evil controls, but I don't believe these two notions have become a consensus. You will always have people who prefer fast-food to real (good) food (you first have to put more effort into preparing).
 
You know this happened to every player at least once.


and was awesome

I absolutely agree. The platforming and the way Lara controls IS the gameplay and a huge part of elements that make these games unique and good. It is awesome gameplay design. The first Tomb Raider games are ALL about the gameplay. They want to be played by the player instead of being (mostly) watched by the player like Uncharted or similar games where the movement and platforming is completely automated. Tomb Raider games are active gameplay experiences while Uncharted and the likes are more passive experiences.



There are people who don't like OG Tomb Raiders controls, and there are also people who don't like OG Resident Evil controls, but I don't believe these two notions have become a consensus. You will always have people who prefer fast-food to real (good) food (you first have to put more effort into preparing).

the whole consensus on the internet thing is so annoying, the original tomb raiders are like the original prince of persias calculated, careful movement, coupled with resource management, just because you can't take 2 seconds to hold the walk button and plan your jump doesn't make it bad. frankly we're fortunate that demon souls/dark souls came along or games having any challenge or penalties for dying would still be treated as a fault by the media.
 
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