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[Geki-D]

Um, no.

So seeing as you know them, why are you even asking me to list them? As to how.... By making positive videos about it??? At a time people like MundaneMatt, Sargon of Akkad & Internet Aristocrat only made videos about GG. I don't even get what angle you're trying to pull.

Trying to point out that GAF is right-wing dominant, due to a series of unrelated factors and a giant exodus, over five years later, is a pretty poor way to link the right wing to GamerGate.

Luckily I never did that.

 

[Airola]

The unnatural attention games like Depression Quest and Gone Home got for their progressive message, and for fitting the mould journalists envisioned for the medium, was a clear sign of the great push happening way before GG. Sarkeesian's first video was released in 2013, a year before GG kicked off. We all know how that was handled by the media: Anyone who disagreed with her was deemed a sexist harasser. No publication was interested in picking apart her arguments, instead stating her criticism was important, and agreeing with it every step of the way. The Dragon's Crown controversy, where a journalist criticized the game's artstyle for being sexist and pandering to pedophiles, had already happened a year before GG was a thing. There's probably numerous other examples.

This push was already happening, and IMO was a factor in the forming of GG.

I don't think it was really that big of a push. There had always been some people talking about inappropriate things in video games and criticizing them. OG Lara Croft's boobs were also criticized and questioned. But back then people just didn't care that much if their games were bashed by someone who doesn't know shit about the subject.

I still hold the opinion that people started to take their hobby too seriously. People started to look for "art" in their games. 2D games had "artistic" silhouette levels, "serious" storytelling and cinematic cutscenes were appreciated increasingly more and both symphonic music in games and video game tunes played by symphonic orchestras seemed to show the "undeniable truth" that games should be treated with more respect and gamers should be treated as more adults, so to speak. It was sort of a paradox that this type of change in appreciation was expected while at the same time in both internet forums and game chats it wouldn't take long to encounter the same old juvenile wild west with impatient people shouting obscenities that had been there since there has been the possibility to write on discussion forums and chat inside games.

Sarkeesian was just another feminist barking about insignificant and trivial things, but now suddenly people cared about someone going against their hobby.

Everything escalated into a vicious circle of overreactions from both the side of gamers and "anti-gamers" and things got ugly.


I mean, the seriousness of gamers and gaming in early 2010's is perfectly encapsulated in this picture:

When that is the level for unironic seriousness, it kinda is no wonder overreactions will happen when that seriousness is questioned.

 

[Helios]

Also I never derailed the thread. I commented on something written in the article, relating directly to GG. However you decided to bring this down the "But GAF isn't all right wing!" path which does indeed have nothing to do with what I said or the topic at hand.

NuGAF is a good example of this. So many triggered right wing snowflakes on here melting at the news of what a game will have in it. Taught by the right winger YouTubers to say "But it's not coz X, it's coz it's pushing politics!" Of course ask them how then a game can have these things in them without it coming across as politics and they squirm and choke. It's actually hilarious to watch them want to say "It's impossible, no gays in games" but try -and fail- to put it into words that don't come across as that because they know it's an abhorrent views to hold. Of course some don't even hide it, go to any Last of US Part 2 thread on GAF and count the number of lesbian jokes and people who say the trailer's "content" makes them sick (hint it ain't the violence).

Gaming forums weren't like this before, not on this level. GG had good intentions but it was dragged down to hell.

You came in here with the claim that neogaf is soo right-wing because some people made lesbian jokes. Than you go on and on about how the political compass thread is wrong because of your anecdotal evidence of seeing someone you don't disagree which translates to them being alt-right. And now you claim someone else is at fault for the derail. Fuck right off.

 

[Geki-D]

You came in here with the claim that neogaf is soo right-wing because some people made lesbian jokes. Than you go on and on about how the political compass thread is wrong because of your anecdotal evidence of seeing someone you don't disagree which translates to them being alt-right. And now you claim someone else is at fault for the derail. Fuck right off.

What is NuGAF a good example of, buddy? You see that part of my post ties into another point but I guess that flew right over your head. Truck harder, though. Friend.

 

[Helios]

What is NuGAF a good example of, buddy?

I wouldn't know. Apparently I'm alt-right because I laughed at one of Neogaf's jokes about lesbians. I couldn't judge the forum in good faith the same way a moral superior like you would, right?!

You see that part of my post ties into another point but I guess that flew right over your head

Yesss, a point that was proven wrong time and time and time again and yet you keep making it because, again, of your anecdotal evidence at which point it doesn't really have anything to do with GG, right? Unless your point is that people like you keep misunderstanding how a political compass works and this is present in the GG fiasco too. In which case you would be perfectly right !

 

[Geki-D]

I wouldn't know. Apparently I'm alt-right because I laughed at one of Neogaf's jokes about lesbians. I couldn't judge the forum in good faith the same way a moral superior like you would, right?!

Yesss, a point that was proven wrong time and time and time again and yet you keep making it because, again, of your anecdotal evidence at which point it doesn't really have anything to do with GG, right? Unless your point is that people like you keep misunderstanding how a political compass works and this is present in the GG fiasco too. In which case you would be perfectly right !

And again, nothing to respond to, nothing of value said. Keep doing you, though. Buddy.

 

[GHG]

What is NuGAF a good example of, buddy? You see that part of my post ties into another point but I guess that flew right over your head. Truck harder, though. Friend.

It's a videogames forum where people are free to discuss games and make jokes without the fear of offending anyone or going against the grain. It's open and as such you can't put it into a box. I don't agree with everything everyone says here but frankly, it doesn't matter, that's what you encounter in adult life. I engage in the topics I want to discuss and ignore the ones that I don't want to get involved in.

What it is not is an echochamber. If it were then you would have already been removed from this thread or at worse banned. Thankfully we are free to have different view points and can discuss them. Personally I'll take that over what this place was before, warts and all.

 

[Geki-D]

It's a videogames forum where people are free to discuss games and make jokes without the fear of offending anyone or going against the grain. It's open and as such you can't put it into a box. I don't agree with everything everyone says here but frankly, it doesn't matter, that's what you encounter in adult life. I engage in the topics I want to discuss and ignore the ones that I don't want to get involved in.

What it is not is an echochamber. If it were then you would have already been removed from this thread or at worse banned. Thankfully we are free to have different view points and can discuss them. Personally I'll take that over what this place was before, warts and all.

I agree and nothing here goes against what I said.

 

[Harlock]

If you strip to the basics, was the first SJW vs No-SJW battle. Is very much what later happen to comics, movies, tech.

 

[FreeThinker1990]

I don't agree with everything everyone says here but frankly, it doesn't matter, that's what you encounter in adult life.

This is a great point - I'm glad that the forum can reflect "real life," with jokes at others' expense, not worrying about anyone else's feelings, etc. It's boring having to think about others.

 

[Dr. Claus]

This is literally meaningless when you can go straight to the politics board here and just scroll down the page. Nearly everything is leaning right. Also when people lose their shit at some dumb non-canon ending to MK11, and very thread about TLOU2 turns into a shitshow of lesbian jokes and SJW conspiracy, you're hardly dealing with left leaning people.

The politics board has nothing to do with the gaming board. This is a gaming forum first and, as has been proven time and again, the majority of the left-leaning folks interact with gaming. Most of us have no interest in politics and ignore it. Also, just because someone criticizes MK11's endings or jokes about Naughty Dog does not make them right-leaning. I have done both and I am very much left-leaning. The fact that his has to be stated is absolutely baffling.

Literally in the article in the OP. Again, how many pro GG famous Youtubers can you name who aren't right wing out of the ones who were actually active during GG?

I can also point to the article and point out that not even a quarter of those names are alt-right. Do better. List more, show that they the alt-right took over GG. You made the claim, the burden of proof is on you.

PSA Sitch, really? You actually ever seen this guy's YT? All he does is defend the right and attack the left. He is not a good example of a right wing commentator jumping on GG. Not familiar with the other 2, pretty sure they aren't considered big players during when GG went down.

Learn to read. I literally stated that those three's continued work "...further shit on your concept that GG was "taken over" by the alt-right." I am specifically asking you to show evidence that GG was taken over by the alt-right. Not asking if there are general right-leaning folks who were a part of it - which we already know to be the case (despite, as shown, they were a minority within the movement).

This isn't quite true. the FBI wasn't even looking for connections to the alt-right firstly. Secondly, they interviewed people who confessed to sending harassment, they just didn't charge anyone. So they, by sheer definition, did find connections to harassment.

You really should re-read the FBI's findings. I am beginning to think you have an issue with reading comprehension.

Now, stop moving goalposts, stop misdirecting, and stop with the disingenuous ignorance that you seem to love to put on display in this thread and answer the damn question.

 

[EviLore]

When it's constant left attacking and right defending, that sort of speaks for itself.


Just to be clear, gay bashing and ethno politics aren't right wing positions, they're alt-right positions. Sorry bud but plenty of people on here have serious issues with gay people, trans people and none white people. Yeah, they're alt-right.


lol Where? You tacitly agreed that right-wing is more vocal. So you're arguing that there are more left wing people but they all just sit silent whilst the right leaning people post? Yeah, talk about laughable points. Also this is all just pointless because my original point was never that all of GAF was right wing but that there was a raise after GG and the people who bemoan the SJW conspiracy are brainwashed by the GG backing right wing Youtubers. Be that 5%, 50% or 100% of GAF, I never said. This "But most aren't right wing" is a massive red herring.

GAF is not remotely alt-right.

 

[Dane]

What shocks me is how the journos went on to defend someone who was buying out positive reviews with sex (with that, cheating her BF), that was the starting point of the Clown World. And blaming the ones who criticized her act in the first place.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

This is literally meaningless when you can go straight to the politics board here and just scroll down the page. Nearly everything is leaning right. Also when people lose their shit at some dumb non-canon ending to MK11, and very thread about TLOU2 turns into a shitshow of lesbian jokes and SJW conspiracy, you're hardly dealing with left leaning people.

Criticizing the left does not make someone right-wing or alt-right. Check out the political compass thread for reference.

PSA Sitch, really? You actually ever seen this guy's YT? All he does is defend the right and attack the left. He is not a good example of a right wing commentator jumping on GG. Not familiar with the other 2, pretty sure they aren't considered big players during when GG went down.

Ad hominem fallacy. If you are more concerned about what political wing he defends or attacks than the actual points he's making, then you are not making a sound argument, let alone actually making one.

 

[Guileless]

I don't understand why discussion of the Zoe Post was shut down in the first place and this article doesn't go into that aspect of it.

 

[ROMhack]

I really don't like Ian Miles Cheong.

 

[Vol5]

Didn't follow Gamergate so I don't know the real context, but didn't Candace Owens out Zoe Quinn as the harasser? I'm fairly sure that's what Candace mentions in an interview with Dave Rubin.

.

Yep - From the start she explains it. Basically the media believed Candace had the technology to un-mark online bullies and they shat themselves.

 

[SlashBringingHasher]

problem is that gamergate attracted sexist males. even tho the goal was right it attracted the wrong group of people behind them.

it all went to shit when it turned to feminism vs sexists. as far as I know I never really followed any of this too much but basically game reviewers at a specific website (kotaku) were basically fucking a girl because they were giving her a job or something like that. am not entirely sure. and the reviews were not genuine to games. among other things it involved game devs and other websites too

 

[Chittagong]

I couldn’t be arsed to follow gamer gate when it happened, those threads were just confusing and fast moving and I had no motivation to try to figure out what people where screeching about.

So good to finally get a concise summary.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

I think it's funny how discussing the topic itself is probably being screencapped to show that "GAF is alt-right". Gamergate is one of those hollow boogeymen where any discussion about the origins of the movement and what was really going on during that time is forbidden. Merely by not immediately condeming Gamergate wholesale, you have become guilty of being a Gamergate sympathizer, and therefore you're a misogynistic, bigoted, etc. Open discussion on the topic was immediately branded as sexism and eventually Gamergate was being compared to the alt-right:

What Gamergate should have taught us about the 'alt-right'

The 2014 online hate-storm presaged the tactics of the Trump-loving far right movement. Prominent critics of the president elect should take note

www.theguardian.com

If you want an example of why some people do not want "politics in videogames", this would be a very good specimen. "Alt Right" is a political alightment, of course, and has nothing to do with videogames. One of Gamergate's earliest sentiments was that it wanted "politics out of videogames". So when the narrative eventually became that Gamergate was a political movement and so were all of its members, I couldn't believe my eyes. I laughed. It was such a blatant lie, and such a confirmation of the corruption going on right now in videogame journalism.

The whole situation is a weird parallel to how certain politicians brand no-no topics as racist, sexist, etc to scare people away from digging into the evidence themselves... Guardian was on to something when they claimed Gamergate ended up having political influence.

 

[SLoWMoTIoN]

I thought gamer gate was about that waman crying about sexism?

No it was about fighting the people that were keeping anime tiddies down

They failed

 

[alabtrosMyster]

NuGAF is a good example of this. So many triggered right wing snowflakes on here melting at the news of what a game will have in it. Taught by the right winger YouTubers to say "But it's not coz X, it's coz it's pushing politics!" Of course ask them how then a game can have these things in them without it coming across as politics and they squirm and choke. It's actually hilarious to watch them want to say "It's impossible, no gays in games" but try -and fail- to put it into words that don't come across as that because they know it's an abhorrent views to hold. Of course some don't even hide it, go to any Last of US Part 2 thread on GAF and count the number of lesbian jokes and people who say the trailer's "content" makes them sick (hint it ain't the violence).

This is true, and it only shows that people on both extreme of this "debate" take quick mental shortcuts, you have people screaming cultural appropriation when they see white people breathing (not as exaggerated as it sounds), amd they will invariably say the same thing with any movie or game that dares having a male (or worse white male) protagonist, so obviously some who were told that this is a simple and stupid stance to apply systematically will just take whatever the polar opposite of the stance (only white dudes), you know you have seen it, there is plenty of blame to go around.

More importantly, by assuming that one group of identitarian is better than the other, you are lying to yourself, the outcome is the same: people from different ethnic groups can't be together in any meaningful way, because cultural appropriation, black face, And whatever the name of the rule that prevents you to discuss it when someone say they have been wronged in some way, especially if they are from an opressed group because you don't share a common humanity anymore.

The woke left (some parts of it anyway) is also against mixed race couples, because fetishism of the women (because of her origins), the power discrepancy between the person in the opressed group and the other partner will be too great, or again cultural appropriation.

Also, the anti GG gangs are so toxic in their language, they did like they are uninged and unstable, willing to call anyone who is not exactly in line one aspect of the movement (just try to argue that maybe not all.white characters ought to be removed for a minute, you'll be called out as tge grand master of some white supremacist group).

 

[Saruhashi]

NuGAF is a good example of this. So many triggered right wing snowflakes on here melting at the news of what a game will have in it. Taught by the right winger YouTubers to say "But it's not coz X, it's coz it's pushing politics!" Of course ask them how then a game can have these things in them without it coming across as politics and they squirm and choke. It's actually hilarious to watch them want to say "It's impossible, no gays in games" but try -and fail- to put it into words that don't come across as that because they know it's an abhorrent views to hold. Of course some don't even hide it, go to any Last of US Part 2 thread on GAF and count the number of lesbian jokes and people who say the trailer's "content" makes them sick (hint it ain't the violence).

I think this section of your post and the highlighted bits are pretty much the perfect demonstration of why GG blew up in the way it did.

Why are you lying? Why are you misrepresenting the actual situation in this extreme fashion?

Do you just think that the other posters here are fucking stupid and will nod along and say "oh he is making valid points"? Do you really have that little respect for the people that you are trying to engage in discussion here?

"I can sell these fucking clowns anything and they'll buy it after all who isn't going to be against *gasp* lesbian jokes",

Fucksakes. Sure, there are some over the top posters and some people with quite irrational views sometimes but so what?
Honestly if I read someone in a thread saying "it's impossible no gays in games" or "lesbians kissing makes me feel sick" then I just think that person is a bit of an idiot. For sure it is only a small number of posters though. Fuck them. I don't give their posts any weight but also they are entitled to whatever shitty opinions they have.

Fundamentally, I trust the moderators here to take care of outright irrational hatred and bigotry. There are plenty of examples to back that up and so the trust is well earned.

Which brings me back to this idea that you think you can misrepresent the forum or hold up some of the more extremist views as a "good example" of what the forum is about. You think people don't see that you are bullshitting? You maybe think your fellow posters are too fucking thick notice you are absolutely reeking of dishonesty?

You are so transparent, mate. Almost everyone sees it. So why bother? Why not just dial it back and try to have an honest perspective? You surely know you are doing it?

So that's how it went with GG too. People lying and talking absolute shite all over the industry.
It was a wide open goal for anyone who just wanted to come in and tell the truth about the whole thing.
Then, what did brave warriors like yourself do when that happened? Started screeching about right wing this and alt-right that etc etc.
It's idiotic.

Did someone like Milo Y have an agenda? Of course. Definitely. I don't know that some of them even bothered to hide it.
Here is the thing though they were able to point to a situation where SO MANY people had an absolute zero tolerance policy on the fucking truth that it seemed like actually places like Breitbart (despite their blatant bias) were the only places that actually had respect for people.

What I am saying is if you lie to my fucking face and then try to shut me down when I try to tell the truth then how the hell can you ever be trusted? It doesn't really matter what the "right wing" are and and are not doing at that point because the anti-GG people were doing enough bad stuff on their own. I might not go to their side but I sure as fuck won't be on your side either.

At the very best case scenario one would come to the conclusion that both sides are acting like arseholes and shouldn't be listened to but guess what? Your anti-GG buddies already have a zero tolerance policy on even pointing out that "both sides" are up to no good. So a neutral observer is basically fucked. You literally can't even say "I disagree" on any points regarding GG. They just won't tolerate it.

If people want to complain that games have "too much politics" or if people are annoyed that Game X is getting rid of sexy costumes and Game Y is an on the nose, pandering, cringfest then good. Let them have that opinion and let others challenge it. Let them fight it out.

That's what should have happened with GG. Journalists should have reported the facts and people should have been allowed to go back and forth with their different opinions. Let them fight and let the rest of us enter the fray or sit on the sidelines and make our own minds up.

That sounds WAY better to me than reeeee'ing about "triggered right wing snowflakes on here melting" and throwing a tantrum when you are challenged.

Sometimes I see things on here that make me feel a bit bad. Posters who seem to be routinely rounded on and who end up dealing with 4 or 5 other posters coming at them and demanding clarifications and answers. Sometimes I think it's like borderline bullying and then I realize that, no, they are bringing it on themselves with blatant dishonest and disingenuous bullshit. They must know they are doing it so maybe they really want to provoke those reactions.

If you are going to come to a community with what is basically a bunch of lies and then try to pass it off as truth and then double down when you get called out, then I would say that's a shitty thing to do. Of course people are going to say "fuck this" and pile on until they are satisfied that the liar has been exposed.

This is more or less how GG went but on a larger scale. Yet here we are years later with mainstream media outlets STILL trying to sell this lie to the public.

 

[Kharnivore2099]

I wasn't a "part" of GG but just watched the internet meltdown from the side. It seemed pretty obvious to me that it was being used as scapegoat for many with questionable integrity, and the opposition to it was often weak and reductive as hell. Child-like reasoning to paint it as something it was not, by people that were apprently grown adults. It was/is all very weird....given some journos are still trying to perpetuate it despite all the facts we have available.

Not to say there weren't some undesirables on the GG side, as there definitely was some awful offenders, but most were genuinely concerned about just how incestuous the indistry was/is.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

I think this section of your post and the highlighted bits are pretty much the perfect demonstration of why GG blew up in the way it did.

Why are you lying? Why are you misrepresenting the actual situation in this extreme fashion?

Do you just think that the other posters here are fucking stupid and will nod along and say "oh he is making valid points"? Do you really have that little respect for the people that you are trying to engage in discussion here?

"I can sell these fucking clowns anything and they'll buy it after all who isn't going to be against *gasp* lesbian jokes",

Fucksakes. Sure, there are some over the top posters and some people with quite irrational views sometimes but so what?
Honestly if I read someone in a thread saying "it's impossible no gays in games" or "lesbians kissing makes me feel sick" then I just think that person is a bit of an idiot. For sure it is only a small number of posters though. Fuck them. I don't give their posts any weight but also they are entitled to whatever shitty opinions they have.

Fundamentally, I trust the moderators here to take care of outright irrational hatred and bigotry. There are plenty of examples to back that up and so the trust is well earned.

Which brings me back to this idea that you think you can misrepresent the forum or hold up some of the more extremist views as a "good example" of what the forum is about. You think people don't see that you are bullshitting? You maybe think your fellow posters are too fucking thick notice you are absolutely reeking of dishonesty?

You are so transparent, mate. Almost everyone sees it. So why bother? Why not just dial it back and try to have an honest perspective? You surely know you are doing it?

So that's how it went with GG too. People lying and talking absolute shite all over the industry.
It was a wide open goal for anyone who just wanted to come in and tell the truth about the whole thing.
Then, what did brave warriors like yourself do when that happened? Started screeching about right wing this and alt-right that etc etc.
It's idiotic.

Did someone like Milo Y have an agenda? Of course. Definitely. I don't know that some of them even bothered to hide it.
Here is the thing though they were able to point to a situation where SO MANY people had an absolute zero tolerance policy on the fucking truth that it seemed like actually places like Breitbart (despite their blatant bias) were the only places that actually had respect for people.

What I am saying is if you lie to my fucking face and then try to shut me down when I try to tell the truth then how the hell can you ever be trusted? It doesn't really matter what the "right wing" are and and are not doing at that point because the anti-GG people were doing enough bad stuff on their own. I might not go to their side but I sure as fuck won't be on your side either.

At the very best case scenario one would come to the conclusion that both sides are acting like arseholes and shouldn't be listened to but guess what? Your anti-GG buddies already have a zero tolerance policy on even pointing out that "both sides" are up to no good. So a neutral observer is basically fucked. You literally can't even say "I disagree" on any points regarding GG. They just won't tolerate it.

If people want to complain that games have "too much politics" or if people are annoyed that Game X is getting rid of sexy costumes and Game Y is an on the nose, pandering, cringfest then good. Let them have that opinion and let others challenge it. Let them fight it out.

That's what should have happened with GG. Journalists should have reported the facts and people should have been allowed to go back and forth with their different opinions. Let them fight and let the rest of us enter the fray or sit on the sidelines and make our own minds up.

That sounds WAY better to me than reeeee'ing about "triggered right wing snowflakes on here melting" and throwing a tantrum when you are challenged.

Sometimes I see things on here that make me feel a bit bad. Posters who seem to be routinely rounded on and who end up dealing with 4 or 5 other posters coming at them and demanding clarifications and answers. Sometimes I think it's like borderline bullying and then I realize that, no, they are bringing it on themselves with blatant dishonest and disingenuous bullshit. They must know they are doing it so maybe they really want to provoke those reactions.

If you are going to come to a community with what is basically a bunch of lies and then try to pass it off as truth and then double down when you get called out, then I would say that's a shitty thing to do. Of course people are going to say "fuck this" and pile on until they are satisfied that the liar has been exposed.

This is more or less how GG went but on a larger scale. Yet here we are years later with mainstream media outlets STILL trying to sell this lie to the public.

Exceptional post.

At a certain point, it was more important to propagate the outrage that justified slandering their opponents, unfettered, than to actually discuss the topic and peel away the layers to possibly find new answers. I've noticed in Trump topics, detractors spend half their time talking about Trump supporters, not Trump. In console wars topics, detractors spend half their time attempting dunks on the other console brand, not the console brand itself. In Meta GAF topics, detractors spend half their time talking about "the GAF community is..." instead of calling out specific posters. In Gamergate topics (if it's not immediately shut down, depending on the forum/website), detractors spend half their time talking about how gamergaters are misogynistic, alt-right, etc instead of engaging with the debate. So on and so forth.

This dishonesty is a specific behavior that is not contained to any one topic, and the behavior itself should be called out because it's anti-social. GAF is a community, after all, and if fedora-tipping shitlords want to be anti-social, they could at least make it funny. This brand of super-serious political activism is incredibly boring. It's basically just a cult full of well-conditioned zealots. Evangelical Christians refused to laugh at themselves, too, and remember how fun that was?

It's almost as if people just want to name call and fade out like cowards because it makes them feel better about themselves. Putting up a show of "resistance" is more important than actually conversing and changing minds and bringing about real change. Narcissist stuff.

 

[Saruhashi]

I don't understand why discussion of the Zoe Post was shut down in the first place and this article doesn't go into that aspect of it.

That's an aspect I never really understood also.

At the time she was a known personality across a couple of online communities and her game had been getting publicity too.

So while I do agree that their private relationship stuff should have remained private, and that the guy was a bit of a dick for making that post, I just don't believe that if the partner of some other developers had posted this pretty scandalous material that it wouldn't have made some "waves" across the mainstream outlets.

For example imagine that guy working on Kingdom Come had his partner come out and say that he was a shitty husband and had been cheating on her with all these women in the industry. I reckon not only would it have been talked about but there would have been questions surrounding "abuse of power" etc.

This made BBC news for example: https://www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-49150923
"Nintendo is replacing a voice actor in new game Fire Emblem: Three Houses after he admitted emotionally abusing ex-partners and friends."
"He says he was prompted to write the post after a recent ex-girlfriend detailed the abuse she had experienced during their relationship."
"He wrote personal apologies to two ex-girlfriends, three former friends and two former fans."

So definitely if these things go on in the industry then outlets are definitely reporting on it (and there are a lot of sites that covered this Fire Emblem story). Nothing from the BBC about how this should have been a private matter and how "online trolls" lobbied Nintendo to get rid of this guy.

As far as anyone is concerned there the Fire Emblem guy treated his GF like shit and she posted about it online and The Internet got him fired and removed from the game and that's all totally fine.

Yet, as you point out, discussion on the ZQ things was somehow completely shut down and managed to remain shut down. Kind of worse than that as she managed to transform being an allegedly abusive piece of garbage into being the poster child for "victim of online harassment".

It's really fucking strange and I'd honestly love to know what was going on behind the scenes to bring basically everyone in line and create this massive nebulous boogeyman out of anyone who didn't stay in line.

 

[Geki-D]

The politics board has nothing to do with the gaming board. This is a gaming forum first and, as has been proven time and again, the majority of the left-leaning folks interact with gaming. Most of us have no interest in politics and ignore it.

Dat caveat. I said "GAF", I never said "only gaming" so here you're hand waving a part of the forums because it doesn't sit well with what you're trying to say. Too bad that counts too, though it's nice you tacitly admit that it is mostly right leaning.

Also, just because someone criticizes MK11's endings or jokes about Naughty Dog does not make them right-leaning. I have done both and I am very much left-leaning. The fact that his has to be stated is absolutely baffling.

When you get triggered as fuck at something so stupid and constantly bash LGBT people (and plenty on here do that) then I consider you right leaning.

I can also point to the article and point out that not even a quarter of those names are alt-right. Do better. List more, show that they the alt-right took over GG. You made the claim, the burden of proof is on you.

Okay..

What Gamergate should have taught us about the 'alt-right'

The 2014 online hate-storm presaged the tactics of the Trump-loving far right movement. Prominent critics of the president elect should take note

www.theguardian.com

GamerGate to Trump: How video game culture blew everything up

Backlash to a debate about how video games portray women led to an internet culture that helped sweep Trump into office.

www.cnet.com

The Alt-Right as Counterculture: Memes, Video Games and Violence - Harvard Political Review

A simple look at the Christchurch shooter’s manifesto reveals a collection of ironic statements, tongue-in-cheek in-jokes and other internet memes, a foreign language for some, but classic staples of any internet dialogue.

harvardpolitics.com

SAGE Journals: Your gateway to world-class research journals

Subscription and open access journals from SAGE Publishing, the world's leading independent academic publisher.

journals.sagepub.com

How the U.S. became Troll Nation: From Gamergate to the rise of Trump

Before "MAGA," Gamergaters claimed harassing women online was "about ethics in video game journalism"

www.salon.com

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/ideas/the-dangerous-game-gamergate-and-the-alt-right-1.3874259

And so on and so on. As I said in my original post, public opinion on GG turned it to being alt-right because of the number of alt-right leaning people who associated with it. But hey, mister burden of proof, if you don't accept all those links or a load more I could have added, then the burden of proof is on you to debunk them. Good luck.

It's also funny that you ignore my mentioning "right leaning" and only focus on "alt right" (in my original post I only said "Alt right" twice, the rest of "right leaning or a variant). Because...

Not asking if there are general right-leaning folks who were a part of it - which we already know to be the case (despite, as shown, they were a minority within the movement).

Oh shit, son. You agree with me. Whelp, there you go. Proof they were a minority? That's a positive claim, Mr burden of proof, so please show me the receipts, because it seems there were enough for public opinion to state the whole movement was right wing.

Ad hominem fallacy. If you are more concerned about what political wing he defends or attacks than the actual points he's making, then you are not making a sound argument, let alone actually making one.

This take is a masterpiece. So you're claiming he's the biggest devil's advocate on Earth? That he only attacks the left, always defends the right but actually he's totally left leaning? Well you got me, bro. I can only go off of his content but you're right; I can't look into his heart of hearts and see what he actually believes.

GAF is not remotely alt-right.

It's a good thing I never said it was, then. But really Evilore, you gonna sit here and say that -like I originally claimed in my first post- there aren't a whole load of people with yikesy views that appeared as a result of GG? I never said the mods were complicite, I never said the site was complicite, I never said the mods don't ban them from time to time but they exist.
Shit like this:
(I'm not direct quoting to avoid shaming users)

[Talking about gay representation in media in media]
No it's everywhere. Fuck avengers, fuck gay flags, fuck game of thrones, fuck rainbows, fuck smash bros, and fuck everything else.

[Talking about the Christ Church shooter]
I'm not at all calling the NZ shooter a hero, however I am glad that his actions have further exposed the cancers of Leftism for all to see.

[Talking about Muslims]
Because how else are you going to get to work in France with all the streets covered by homeless terrorists?

[Talking about the TLOU2 trailer, hint: the violence isn't what's "yuck"]
I will be boycotting this game because of the LGBT agenda. The trailer was just yuck.

[General making fun of LGBT rights, the context of this was not a joke]
LGTBIBETAGAMMA

[Some good old "race realism"]
Again, they've tested for over a 100 years, black IQ has only gone up 2 points. From 83 (World War 1 army testing) to 85 (1979 court ruling). Saying they're going to overtake whites in a matter of days when they're 1 standard deviation behind is nonsense.
That's the genetic difference.

[Trans people are just fakes]
yes but just cause you want to have a sex change doesn't change the fact you are still not a real female, you still won't have the sex organs, and still can't give birth. Hence you are not a real female, it doesn't matter what you want to be.

[That old "attack helicopter gender" meme]
And it's so noncommittal, too. I can only know what you are not. Non-binary.......ok, now what? Are you animal, vegetable, or mineral?

[Being trans is a mental illness]
Transgenders have a suicide rate that far exceeds that of any other group. Also a sign of mental illness.

[Lest we forget that at one point a trans Gaffer felt opinions were so toxic she had to distance herself from the boards]
This may be my first and only last post on this forum, as honestly some of the comments under this topic have been pretty upsetting. I've learned over the past few years that trying to convince people of the validity of my existence is more exhausting than it is worth. Many people have already made their minds up on the subject of transgender/transsexual people based on their own personal bias or whatever study coincides with their own view, despite many other studies showing the contrary. There is no one reason that people become transgender or transsexual, and what is the story for a few many be very different from the many. Everyone is welcome and entitled to their own opinion, and I don't want to waste your time trying to change your mind.

But the right wing crown jewel through GG has to be "The Great SJW Conspiracy". The notion that any inclusion of even slightly progressive points or any form of LGBT representation is the "SJW agenda" to brainwash people. Devs putting what they want in games be damned.

Cory Barlog and Neil Cuckman should join Dice and make a ultimate SJW game featuring pink haired lesbians saving the planet from a robotic evil Donald Trump.

-Some devs insert SJW tropes and fantasies in a videogame because they want to be so "progressive".

-People detect those blatant politizations being shoved down their throats and roll their eyes to yet again another attempt to bring SJW, feminism, white guilt and whatever other ideology into their blockbuster videogames.

Dude, the scene of that boy trying to flirt and then the lesbian kiss was so cringey it was straight off from a SJW fantasy (exactly what Neil Druckmann is).

Why do SJWs hate escapism so much? Why do they feel the need to inject politics into everything?

I remember back in the 2000s gaming was such a great escape from the post 9/11, Iraq war, George W Bush days, I guess if games were made then like they are today there'd be endless haranguing about Dubya.

Sure, on occasion a game would get political, which is fine, but it wasn't everything, when even something as goofy as Mortal Kombat is political, you know things have gone too far.

Gone Home is a horrible video game. But it does push a SJW agenda, so it earned high ratings from most outlets.

"AAA" studios these days look like they waste time on SJW politics rather than making good games.

Im a bit worried about the SJW agenda

Playstation brand = SJW infested Station.

Naughty Dog = SJW development Studio
TLOU 2 = SJW agenda the game

I just know that while TLOU2 will be good it'll also be full of SJW bullshit that I know for a fact Ghost of Tsushima won't and I believe Sucker Punch can deliver the GOTY quality.

What is a serious story? The current story is fine. Is serious story code for SJW crap?

Marcus Fenix is on a mission to rescue a persecuted immigrant Glowie.

Glad I never subscribe Netflix. What a shithole of SJW service.

Think SJW media is bad now? Imagine in 10 years when the borders are made open to everyone. The only culture left will be SJW.

We live in an industry where we get frequent reviews by transgender and LGBT reviewers and it seems there's a pretty pro SJW agenda in a big portion of the gaming media, at the very least any company that make games in this day and age should consider the data and views that are being expressed.

The problem isn't just SJW journalists, the real problem are the reviewers. Game reviewers will dock review points for not pushing a radical leftist agenda.

And these are the only examples I can recall and trace back off the top of my head.

So is this all of GAF? Nope. it's not even most, not even half, maybe barely a quarter (though the politics board... oof). But it is there and that was my original point. I don't even want these people to leave but don't tell me they aren't pushing abhorrent views. The idea that I'm saying GAF is this alt-right site is ridiculous (though it's clear why some people would want to make it look like that's what I'm saying; Because outright saying that generally results in a ban).

And I ask you Evilore, you who've been around the block, who has been in the gaming forum biz for longer than anyone; was all this a thing before GG? Had you ever even heard the term "SJW before GG? Of course racism, transphobia and the like has always existed but how prevalent on a gaming forum was it before GG? Because that was my original statement, no matter how many other people want to misconstrue it. That right leaning YT commentators who became famous through GG created a faction of screeching, anti-SJW gamers who play right into the hands of the right wing by labing everything the right hates as "SJW propaganda."

(Bunch of feelz)

I don't see any reason in responding to your fee-fees when you misconstrue what I said so badly. Better luck next time, though.

More importantly, by assuming that one group of identitarian is better than the other, you are lying to yourself, the outcome is the same

I never did that. I just commented on a part of the article that most people tend to ignore (case in point, read through the thread). How bad the left was is an old, already much parroted take. Why would I bang on that dead horse some more? It's amazing how I can defend GG, promote videos about GG and get banned off of old GAF for defending GG but the moment I say something critical about GG and one of it's bad outcomes suddenly GG'ers are all like "AW MAH GAWD MAH SACRED COW!". You're right when you say people "take quick mental shortcuts". Yeesh, from "Right Wing commentators influencing gamers through GG to push their politics" to "GAF is an alt right site", yeah that's an amazing shortcut.

 

[strange headache]

Whelp, there you go. Proof they were a minority? That's a positive claim, Mr burden of proof, so please show me the receipts, because it seems there were enough for public opinion to state the whole movement was right wing.

Right here, GamerGate Survey data by Brad Glasgow.

Had your sources actually bothered asking GG supporters themselves instead of blindly going by the word of their opposition, they would have come to the same conclusion.

 

[Geki-D]

Right here, GamerGate Survey data by Brad Glasgow.

Considering the fact we're talking about the commentators and influencers here, this is proof they weren't mostly right leaning? I ain't too sure on that.

 

[Clear]

The major reason why GamerGate got associated with the alt-right was the way the enthusiast press had become an overtly left-leaning, "progressive" edifice over the preceding few years. And as we all know now, you criticize progressives in any way and you get tarred with the "Nazi" brush.

The simple reality is that not everyone was onboard the progressive bus, and as a result they were displeased at having political rhetoric constantly thrown in their faces, especially in the context of an escapist medium that many were using as a refuge from an increasingly fractured and fractious political landscape.

So again, the problem was one of their own making. They created a front in the culture wars, and inevitably the other side turned up to challenge them.

There were (and still are) opportunists on both sides, but this cannot ever be admitted because like their culpability in the whole thing blowing up beyond a rather tawdry bit of internet drama. it damages their self image of impregnable, unimpeachable, moral strength and virtue.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Dat caveat. I said "GAF", I never said "only gaming" so here you're hand waving a part of the forums because it doesn't sit well with what you're trying to say. Too bad that counts too, though it's nice you tacitly admit that it is mostly right leaning.

When you get triggered as fuck at something so stupid and constantly bash LGBT people (and plenty on here do that) then I consider you right leaning.

Okay..

What Gamergate should have taught us about the 'alt-right'

The 2014 online hate-storm presaged the tactics of the Trump-loving far right movement. Prominent critics of the president elect should take note

www.theguardian.com

GamerGate to Trump: How video game culture blew everything up

Backlash to a debate about how video games portray women led to an internet culture that helped sweep Trump into office.

www.cnet.com

The Alt-Right as Counterculture: Memes, Video Games and Violence - Harvard Political Review

A simple look at the Christchurch shooter’s manifesto reveals a collection of ironic statements, tongue-in-cheek in-jokes and other internet memes, a foreign language for some, but classic staples of any internet dialogue.

harvardpolitics.com

SAGE Journals: Your gateway to world-class research journals

Subscription and open access journals from SAGE Publishing, the world's leading independent academic publisher.

journals.sagepub.com

How the U.S. became Troll Nation: From Gamergate to the rise of Trump

Before "MAGA," Gamergaters claimed harassing women online was "about ethics in video game journalism"

www.salon.com

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/ideas/the-dangerous-game-gamergate-and-the-alt-right-1.3874259

And so on and so on. As I said in my original post, public opinion on GG turned it to being alt-right because of the number of alt-right leaning people who associated with it. But hey, mister burden of proof, if you don't accept all those links or a load more I could have added, then the burden of proof is on you to debunk them. Good luck.

It's also funny that you ignore my mentioning "right leaning" and only focus on "alt right" (in my original post I only said "Alt right" twice, the rest of "right leaning or a variant). Because...

Oh shit, son. You agree with me. Whelp, there you go. Proof they were a minority? That's a positive claim, Mr burden of proof, so please show me the receipts, because it seems there were enough for public opinion to state the whole movement was right wing.


This take is a masterpiece. So you're claiming he's the biggest devil's advocate on Earth? That he only attacks the left, always defends the right but actually he's totally left leaning? Well you got me, bro. I can only go off of his content but you're right; I can't look into his heart of hearts and see what he actually believes.

It's a good thing I never said it was, then. But really Evilore, you gonna sit here and say that -like I originally claimed in my first post- there aren't a whole load of people with yikesy views that appeared as a result of GG? I never said the mods were complicite, I never said the site was complicite, I never said the mods don't ban them from time to time but they exist.
Shit like this:
(I'm not direct quoting to avoid shaming users)











But the right wing crown jewel through GG has to be "The Great SJW Conspiracy". The notion that any inclusion of even slightly progressive points or any form of LGBT representation is the "SJW agenda" to brainwash people. Devs putting what they want in games be damned.















And these are the only examples I can recall and trace back off the top of my head.

So is this all of GAF? Nope. it's not even most, not even half, maybe barely a quarter (though the politics board... oof). But it is there and that was my original point. I don't even want these people to leave but don't tell me they aren't pushing abhorrent views. The idea that I'm saying GAF is this alt-right site is ridiculous (though it's clear why some people would want to make it look like that's what I'm saying; Because outright saying that generally results in a ban).

And I ask you Evilore, you who've been around the block, who has been in the gaming forum biz for longer than anyone; was all this a thing before GG? Had you ever even heard the term "SJW before GG? Of course racism, transphobia and the like has always existed but how prevalent on a gaming forum was it before GG? Because that was my original statement, no matter how many other people want to misconstrue it. That right leaning YT commentators who became famous through GG created a faction of screeching, anti-SJW gamers who play right into the hands of the right wing by labing everything the right hates as "SJW propaganda."


I don't see any reason in responding to your fee-fees when you misconstrue what I said so badly. Better luck next time, though.

I never did that. I just commented on a part of the article that most people tend to ignore (case in point, read through the thread). How bad the left was is an old, already much parroted take. Why would I bang on that dead horse some more? It's amazing how I can defend GG, promote videos about GG and get banned off of old GAF for defending GG but the moment I say something critical about GG and one of it's bad outcomes suddenly GG'ers are all like "AW MAH GAWD MAH SACRED COW!". You're right when you say people "take quick mental shortcuts". Yeesh, from "Right Wing commentators influencing gamers through GG to push their politics" to "GAF is an alt right site", yeah that's an amazing shortcut.

Damn. This sure is one hell of a post. Good observations.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

And strange headache with the survey spirit bomb charged up for three episodes.

 

[strange headache]

Considering the fact we're talking about the commentators and influencers here, this is proof they weren't mostly right leaning? I ain't too sure on that.

Here's a list of known people who spoke favorably about GG or at least tried to present it in a nuanced manner:

TotalBiscuit
Brad Glasgow
Tim Pool
Liana Kerzner
Nerd^3
Thunderf00t
Erik Kain
David Auerbach
Oliver Campbell
Christina Hoff Sommers
David Packman
Boogie2988
Brad Wardell
Adrian Chmielarz
...

None of these people are alt-right.

 

[ROMhack]

Out of interest, did anybody else just somehow miss the GG thing? I was writing for websites in 2014/2015 and also on some forums but somehow totally missed it.

It only became apparent in maybe 2017 when I started hearing about it a bit more about it as a thing that happened.

 

[EviLore]

Dat caveat. I said "GAF", I never said "only gaming" so here you're hand waving a part of the forums because it doesn't sit well with what you're trying to say. Too bad that counts too, though it's nice you tacitly admit that it is mostly right leaning.

When you get triggered as fuck at something so stupid and constantly bash LGBT people (and plenty on here do that) then I consider you right leaning.

Okay..

What Gamergate should have taught us about the 'alt-right'

The 2014 online hate-storm presaged the tactics of the Trump-loving far right movement. Prominent critics of the president elect should take note

www.theguardian.com

GamerGate to Trump: How video game culture blew everything up

Backlash to a debate about how video games portray women led to an internet culture that helped sweep Trump into office.

www.cnet.com

The Alt-Right as Counterculture: Memes, Video Games and Violence - Harvard Political Review

A simple look at the Christchurch shooter’s manifesto reveals a collection of ironic statements, tongue-in-cheek in-jokes and other internet memes, a foreign language for some, but classic staples of any internet dialogue.

harvardpolitics.com

SAGE Journals: Your gateway to world-class research journals

Subscription and open access journals from SAGE Publishing, the world's leading independent academic publisher.

journals.sagepub.com

How the U.S. became Troll Nation: From Gamergate to the rise of Trump

Before "MAGA," Gamergaters claimed harassing women online was "about ethics in video game journalism"

www.salon.com

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/ideas/the-dangerous-game-gamergate-and-the-alt-right-1.3874259

And so on and so on. As I said in my original post, public opinion on GG turned it to being alt-right because of the number of alt-right leaning people who associated with it. But hey, mister burden of proof, if you don't accept all those links or a load more I could have added, then the burden of proof is on you to debunk them. Good luck.

It's also funny that you ignore my mentioning "right leaning" and only focus on "alt right" (in my original post I only said "Alt right" twice, the rest of "right leaning or a variant). Because...

Oh shit, son. You agree with me. Whelp, there you go. Proof they were a minority? That's a positive claim, Mr burden of proof, so please show me the receipts, because it seems there were enough for public opinion to state the whole movement was right wing.


This take is a masterpiece. So you're claiming he's the biggest devil's advocate on Earth? That he only attacks the left, always defends the right but actually he's totally left leaning? Well you got me, bro. I can only go off of his content but you're right; I can't look into his heart of hearts and see what he actually believes.

It's a good thing I never said it was, then. But really Evilore, you gonna sit here and say that -like I originally claimed in my first post- there aren't a whole load of people with yikesy views that appeared as a result of GG? I never said the mods were complicite, I never said the site was complicite, I never said the mods don't ban them from time to time but they exist.
Shit like this:
(I'm not direct quoting to avoid shaming users)











But the right wing crown jewel through GG has to be "The Great SJW Conspiracy". The notion that any inclusion of even slightly progressive points or any form of LGBT representation is the "SJW agenda" to brainwash people. Devs putting what they want in games be damned.















And these are the only examples I can recall and trace back off the top of my head.

So is this all of GAF? Nope. it's not even most, not even half, maybe barely a quarter (though the politics board... oof). But it is there and that was my original point. I don't even want these people to leave but don't tell me they aren't pushing abhorrent views. The idea that I'm saying GAF is this alt-right site is ridiculous (though it's clear why some people would want to make it look like that's what I'm saying; Because outright saying that generally results in a ban).

And I ask you Evilore, you who've been around the block, who has been in the gaming forum biz for longer than anyone; was all this a thing before GG? Had you ever even heard the term "SJW before GG? Of course racism, transphobia and the like has always existed but how prevalent on a gaming forum was it before GG? Because that was my original statement, no matter how many other people want to misconstrue it. That right leaning YT commentators who became famous through GG created a faction of screeching, anti-SJW gamers who play right into the hands of the right wing by labing everything the right hates as "SJW propaganda."


I don't see any reason in responding to your fee-fees when you misconstrue what I said so badly. Better luck next time, though.

I never did that. I just commented on a part of the article that most people tend to ignore (case in point, read through the thread). How bad the left was is an old, already much parroted take. Why would I bang on that dead horse some more? It's amazing how I can defend GG, promote videos about GG and get banned off of old GAF for defending GG but the moment I say something critical about GG and one of it's bad outcomes suddenly GG'ers are all like "AW MAH GAWD MAH SACRED COW!". You're right when you say people "take quick mental shortcuts". Yeesh, from "Right Wing commentators influencing gamers through GG to push their politics" to "GAF is an alt right site", yeah that's an amazing shortcut.

GAF doesn't aim to be an authoritarian thought police regime, so comments you don't agree with will be present. We're a very active forum.

GG was the first time I had heard the term "SJW," yes, but back then internet culture hadn't gone completely off the rails yet. I hadn't taken any sides initially (~2014), other than making fun of people obsessing over Zoe Quinn's sex life, and I ended up bombarded with hostility on Twitter from "#notyourshield" egg accounts clearly brigading, and things continued escalating from there. Adam Baldwin came after me directly and I defend myself and NeoGAF when attacked. There was also a libelous Slate.com hit piece against myself and Moot (who pulled GG talk on 4chan) by an author with ties to Steve Bannon that really didn't help sanity prevail. A ton of people got banned who shouldn't have been banned in our Anita Sarkeesian threads, thanks to ideologically motivated intersectional feminist ex-mods going too far and covering their tracks, but after we were all targeted by GG, battle lines had been drawn. I was stalked relentlessly by obsessive weirdos online thanks to the ensuing culture war, and it seemed people on all sides had a reason to blow up NeoGAF by 2017.

Spare me your grandstanding about "abhorrent views." We take a moderate position and allow for diverse opinions and off-color jokes within reason, as had always been the case before this nonsense divided everyone.

 

[Zaffo]

It peaked in 2016, through mid 2017, when the meltdown would start. I went on hiatus for much of the time, just watching after I caught a ban for the stupidest shit.
Soon as #MeToo started, a series of life changing events occured.

Got myself banned for making a comment about how all RPS articles turned into political garbage at the time, sweet memories.

 

[Dr. Claus]

Right here, GamerGate Survey data by Brad Glasgow.

Had your sources actually bothered asking GG supporters themselves instead of blindly going by the word of their opposition, they would have come to the same conclusion.

Funny as I had literally posted that, but Geki-D and his terrible reading comprehension seems to have completely forgotten that fact and asked me to post it a second time.

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

Geki-D likes Kojima so he's good in my book.

 

[HotPocket69]

I still don't know what the hell "GamerGate" is and I still don't care enough to give a shit. And Ive been playing videogames passionately for over 30 years.

God what a dumb fucking name.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

This take is a masterpiece. So you're claiming he's the biggest devil's advocate on Earth? That he only attacks the left, always defends the right but actually he's totally left leaning? Well you got me, bro. I can only go off of his content but you're right; I can't look into his heart of hearts and see what he actually believes.

An ad hominem fallacy is an ad hominem fallacy. If you care more about a person's characteristics than his points, then you have no point at all.

 

[ROMhack]

The unnatural attention games like Depression Quest and Gone Home got for their progressive message, and for fitting the mould journalists envisioned for the medium, was a clear sign of the great push happening way before GG. Sarkeesian's first video was released in 2013, a year before GG kicked off. We all know how that was handled by the media: Anyone who disagreed with her was deemed a sexist harasser. No publication was interested in picking apart her arguments, instead stating her criticism was important, and agreeing with it every step of the way. The Dragon's Crown controversy, where a journalist criticized the game's artstyle for being sexist and pandering to pedophiles, had already happened a year before GG was a thing. There's probably numerous other examples.

This push was already happening, and IMO was a factor in the forming of GG.

Going back through this thread now and it's funny to me that you mention both Sarkeesian and Gone Home.

In one instance, I wrote a review for a UK publication about Gone Home. I just read the review back and realise I didn't mention anything about politics. At the time it didn't feel that politics was of any importance to the gaming community. In the review, I simply talk about how the game feels like a nostalgic throwback and how it asks us to be in the shoes of somebody small, which I felt was novel considering how most games make us feel super-powered. Fast forward to now and it'd be hard to produce a review with the same mindset.

Second, the Sarkeesian thing. I remember writing a response to her first video for another website. It seemed like a thing to respond to as it had gained some popularity but nowhere did I consider it a politically motivated issue. I recall arguing that she'd cherry-picked examples to suit her argument, which at the time suited my critical mindset as I'd just finished a philosophy degree (hue). Genuinely, I still think there are so many flaws to her points when you aren't looking at it through a political mindset.

This is a bit anecdotal but it's super interesting for me because it shows how gaming has changed. The way everything has become laden with political meaning is crazy. We really need a new generation of writers who actively seek to decrease political thought. It's become such a white elephant in the past five years.

 

[Geki-D]

people who spoke favorably about GG or at least tried to present it in a nuanced manner

Okay cool. So how is this related to commentators and influencers? The guys who wrote like one article or did some interviews where they took no position isn't what I mean. Where's the Mundanematt? Where's the Sargon of Akkad? Where's the Milo Yiannopoulos? Where's the Mr Metokur? Where's the Ethan Ralph? The people that were reporting on GG almost daily and built their careers off GG? Some of those people are on that list you linked... But you decided not to put them in despite clearly going through it and hand picking people. Any reason for that? So why did you go for the unbiased & neutral and not the flatout supporters? Odd, that.

GAF doesn't aim to be an authoritarian thought police regime, so comments you don't agree with will be present. We're a very active forum.

Spare me your grandstanding about "abhorrent views." We take a moderate position and allow for diverse opinions and off-color jokes within reason, as had always been the case before this nonsense divided everyone.

Sure and I wouldn't have it any other way. I don't really get why you're even saying this; My point was to say that people who made comments like this exist on the site and nothing more. That you apparently read this as me calling for bans is pretty odd. Say, can you see a person's report history? How many people have I actually reported, if I'm so ban hungry? I even left out names just in case.

As to "grandstanding", they may be diverse opinions, but it doesn't change the fact that they are abhorrent views. Sorry but literally hating trans people, I mean yeah, that's their opinion but it's an abhorrent one. Also, nothing I quoted was said as an "off-color joke". I guess you could say that's just my opinion but I'm pretty sure calling Muslims homeless terrorists, saying you're glad the Christ Church shooter did what he did or saying that gay people are disgusting would get you some odd looks at a social gathering.

GG was the first time I had heard the term "SJW," yes, but back then internet culture hadn't gone completely off the rails yet.

You know that "SJW" was mostly a term coined by GG, right? So the internet culture war, the craziness since then, it all stems from the politics of GG and the left they were fighting. So yeah, everytime someone sees something they don't like, a movie with a black lead, a game with gay characters... And they say it's "SJW agenda", that's a direct result of GG. It wasn't a thing before GG which was my whole point, people on gaming forums didn't do that before GG.

I hadn't taken any sides initially (~2014), other than making fun of people obsessing over Zoe Quinn's sex life, and I ended up bombarded with hostility on Twitter from "#notyourshield" egg accounts clearly brigading, and things continued escalating from there. Adam Baldwin came after me directly and I defend myself and NeoGAF when attacked. There was also a libelous Slate.com hit piece against myself and Moot (who pulled GG talk on 4chan) by an author with ties to Steve Bannon that really didn't help sanity prevail. A ton of people got banned who shouldn't have been banned in our Anita Sarkeesian threads, thanks to ideologically motivated intersectional feminist ex-mods going too far and covering their tracks, but after we were all targeted by GG, battle lines had been drawn. I was stalked relentlessly by obsessive weirdos online thanks to the ensuing culture war, and it seemed people on all sides had a reason to blow up NeoGAF by 2017.

So yeah, you've been burned by both sides. But that's my point; both sides (though it actually seems like GG caused you more harm as it triggered a whole chain of events). Seems so many people here are perfectly willing to call out the bad stuff the left & "SJWs" do, but mention GG in a negative light and oh shit, you just insulted the prophet, you just took the lord's name in vain. No one wants to hear that. My whole point if that GG wasn't all good, it had some negative outcomes, some pretty long lasting, really bad ones. From your own personal experience, it sounds like you wouldn't disagree.

An ad hominem fallacy is an ad hominem fallacy. If you care more about a person's characteristics than his points, then you have no point at all.

What does this even mean? I'm literally basing my opinion off of his content. Literally the points he's making. How am I committing an ad hominem by doing that? What, am I attacking is avatar? Utter nonsense.

 

[VertigoOA]

Alisson rapp, Nintendo and nerds finding out that she was moonlighting as a legitimate prositute was one of the finest moments in Internet history. The lols were appreciated.

The white knight bullshit, the accusations of gamergate... and then the truth. It was glorious

Her nudes were nice. During my darker years I would’ve loved to have hired an escort with a charizard tattoo just to say I did!

 

[The Mad Draklor]

What does this even mean? I'm literally basing my opinion off of his content. Literally the points he's making. How am I committing an ad hominem by doing that? What, am I attacking is avatar? Utter nonsense.

Nope, you are making attack on his character based on who he bashes and not bashes. That is textbook ad hominem fallacy. Utter nonsense describes your comments far more accurately.

 

[Geki-D]

Nope, you are making attack on his character based on who he bashes and not bashes. That is textbook ad hominem fallacy.

But he makes political content and we're talking about political views...

What the hell?

To use Godwin's laws, this like saying that calling Hitler an anti semite is an ad hominem because you're making an attack on his character based on who he bashes and doesn't.

This doesn't make any sense. You can grasp a person's political views based off their political works and actions.

 

[HotPocket69]

I didn't follow anything much about Gamergate, I picked up enough that it was about dodgy journalists and misogynistic gamers or some internet drama l had no time for. My life was busy and I just wanted to read about what games were good.

but...

It did manage to drop one of the best

I've ever seen.

When Alison Rapp was fired from Nintendo and all the journalists blindly rushed to put out articles as fast as they could mash their keybords about how "Evil Gamergate got this woman fired from Nintendo just for having a part time job". Only for the journalists not a couple of hours later ending up with egg on thier faces about the nature of the "Part time job" when it was revealed. Watching them stamp out discussion and censor the real story all the time they must have been sweating about what they defended was hilarious.

Klepek was the one who broke the news of her firing and subsequent outrage back when he was at Cucktaku.

When they truth came out 40 minutes after the article went live I immediately called him out on his bullshit and he blocked me on Twitter

That was a good day

 

[The Mad Draklor]

But he makes political content and we're talking about political views...

*Insert completely irrelevant GIF because I don't know how to make a good argument

-Geki-D*

What the hell?

To use Godwin's laws, this like saying that calling Hitler an anti semite is an ad hominem because you're making an attack on his character based on who he bashes and doesn't.

This doesn't make any sense. You can grasp a person's political views based off their political works and actions.

So just because he makes political content, we should just invoke political views whenever we want?

Not only are your argumentation skills are trash, but your logic is completely trash as well. When someone makes a claim, the onus is on that person is too support that claim with evidence and reasoning. That is what PSA Sitch is doing. However, you are completely obsessed with his political affiliations than the points he is making.

An ad hominem is a fallacy where the claimant's character is attacked rather than his points and arguments. This is fallacy because you are not addressing the things he is saying and only concerned about making cheap shots which you are clearly doing.

 

[Geki-D]

However, you are completely obsessed with his political affiliations than the points he is making.

...So what you're saying is that he actually is right wing but he's right in being right wing? Okay... If that's how you feel, I guess? I don't even see how that's relevant to anything, but whatever.

 

[VertigoOA]

Why would someone be right or wrong if they were right wing or not?

I forget ... communists are the most prejudiced people on the planet.... my bad.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

...So what you're saying is that he actually is right wing but he's right in being right wing? Okay... If that's how you feel, I guess? I don't even see how that's relevant to anything, but whatever.

Strawman fallacy. Good job summarizing an argument that I never made.

The "arguments" that you have been making are irrelevant because they do not address any arguments. They are just personal attacks that serve no purpose.

Not to mention, you haven't fulfilled your burden of proof that PSA Sitch is actually right-wing. After all, you only made a claim and never actually provided evidence for that. So you basically made an ad hominem where that ad hominem isn't even substantiated.