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[Vanillalite]

NPR

Catholic bishops and other representatives of the world's more than 1 billion Roman Catholics are meeting in Rome on Sunday for the start of the Synod on the Family. This meeting will guide Church teaching on issues like marriage, divorce and contraception.

Lively and contentious debate is expected. The 279 bishops, from 120 countries, will tackle questions of marriage, divorce and homosexuality — hot-button issues in the U.S. and world at large. They could fundamentally alter more than 2,000 years of Catholic understanding — "going all the way back to the Hebrews and the law of Moses," according to the National Catholic Register.

 

[Fj0823]

Look I'm Catholic, but this seems like a case of "We've looked into ourselves and found nothing wrong"

All priests around me are confident nothing will change. Shame.

 

[Dicer]

The world has changed and "God" isn't exactly speaking to anyone anymore, so maybe they will use this as a turning point...

Probably not, but there is always hope.

 

[i_am_ben]

Time to bring back Iconoclasm.

 

[EndcatOmega]

Catharism about to make a comeback.

 

[Wellscha]

Maybe they'll let the clergy marry?

 

[NoblesseOblige]

Are there really 1 billion Catholics?

 

[ClosingADoor]

Are there really 1 billion Catholics?

More actually. South America and Africa are large places.

 

[Tertullian]

Most articles in the regular press about this synod are dreadful (even more dreadful than religious reporting usually is).


These things are not even really on the table at this synod:

• A change in Church teaching on contraception
• A change in Church teaching on gay sex
• A change in Church teaching on the nature of marriage
• A change in Church teaching on the indissolubility of marriage
• Really, any change in actual Church teaching
• A change in the Latin Church's discipline of only ordaining unmarried men

These things are potentially on the table:

• Telling remarried divorcees that they can receive the Eucharist without permanently abstaining from sex
• Changes in language/expression on issues relating to gay people, same-sex civil marriage, etc.
• Further changes to the annulment process

 

[mcrommert]

All you need to know
http://theweek.com/articles/581178/...r-god-synod-family-fracturing-catholic-church

 

[Ganzlinger]

The Synod and the College of Whispers are too busy guarding secrets to bother to teach. Skyrim was not J'zargo's first choice, but Winterhold is removed from politics, dedicated to study. This is the place for J'zargo to become great.

 

[mcrommert]

Maybe they'll let the clergy marry?

Not in the purview of the synod. There is no doctrinal issue with clergy (ie priests) being able to marry. This was implemented because of abuses in the clergy before their was a strict implementation of celibacy. For example right now there are many Anglican priests who have converted to Catholicism who are married with families.

This differs from having woman becoming priests which is something that cannot change. The explanation for this is even more complex

 

[old manatee]

The world has changed and "God" isn't exactly speaking to anyone anymore, so maybe they will use this as a turning point...

Probably not, but there is always hope.

I heard they are going to turn the churches into reasonably priced Laundromats and actually help the poor for once.

 

[rhandino]

Nothing will change or at the very least nothing of importance will change because it seems that most people that attend the church don't want those changes in the first place

Spoiler

except in matters of divorce and birth control =P

 

[Mariolee]

Most articles in the regular press about this synod are dreadful (even more dreadful than religious reporting usually is).


These things are not even really on the table at this synod:

• A change in Church teaching on contraception
• A change in Church teaching on gay sex
• A change in Church teaching on the nature of marriage
• A change in Church teaching on the indissolubility of marriage
• Really, any change in actual Church teaching
• A change in the Latin Church's discipline of only ordaining unmarried men

These things are potentially on the table:

• Telling remarried divorcees that they can receive the Eucharist without permanently abstaining from sex
• Changes in language/expression on issues relating to gay people, same-sex civil marriage, etc.
• Further changes to the annulment process

Sounds about what I expected.

 

[Arkos]

Look I'm Catholic, but this seems like a case of "We've looked into ourselves and found nothing wrong"

All priests around me are confident nothing will change. Shame.

How can people say, "Look, I'm Catholic, I just disagree with a large number of official, papally sanctioned, Catholic teachings." Doesn't that make you, you know, not Catholic? There's not anything wrong with being not Catholic. It's okay, really.

 

[Scarecrow]

This pope has been mostly pretty cool so far. But I don't expect a huge change in the ship's direction. Real change takes time.

 

[Mariolee]

How can people say, "Look, I'm Catholic, I just disagree with a large number of official, papally sanctioned, Catholic teachings." Doesn't that make you, you know, not Catholic? There's not anything wrong with being not Catholic. It's okay, really.

Because perhaps he agrees far more with what he disagrees with, and what he disagrees with isn't irreconciliable with what he agrees with.

 

[keuja]

How can people say, "Look, I'm Catholic, I just disagree with a large number of official, papally sanctioned, Catholic teachings." Doesn't that make you, you know, not Catholic? There's not anything wrong with being not Catholic. It's okay, really.

It's not because you don't agree to all the teachings that you stop being of whatever religion you want to be. Some muslims drink alcohol and don't pray 5 times a day. They still are Muslim and still identify as such. It's also okay.

 

[Arkos]

Because perhaps he agrees far more with what he disagrees with, and what he disagrees with isn't irreconciliable with what he agrees with.

Yeah, I mean that's cool and I understand it, but doesn't it make you not Catholic? It's not like you're born in Germany so you're a German. Isn't being Catholic solely constituted of believing in and adhering to Catholic teachings? What the hell does it mean to be Catholic if not?

Edit: sorry not trying to derail I'll stop. I hope Francis makes some changes to go with his talk, he seems like a good guy and I like him.

 

[Skellig Gra]

Look I'm Catholic, but this seems like a case of "We've looked into ourselves and found nothing wrong"

All priests around me are confident nothing will change. Shame.

It's been 30+ years since they met on these matters. While I wouldn't bet on any changes I think there is a chance.

 

[God Dayumm]

This meeting will allow us to have a Mome within the next 40 years

 

[mcrommert]

It's not because you don't agree to all the teachings that you stop being of whatever religion you want to be. Some muslims drink alcohol and don't pray 5 times a day. They still are Muslim and still identify as such. It's also okay.

Please don't bring identity politics into Catholicism. Religions are easy to form...if you don't like a religion start your own. If you don't believe in unalterable dogma...you aren't a catholic....if you don't attend church weekly as is required by the church...you aren't Catholic. You can self identify as whatever you want but it doesn't mean you are.

 

[Skellig Gra]

Please don't bring identity politics into Catholicism. Religions are easy to form...if you don't like a religion start your own. If you don't believe in unalterable dogma...you aren't a catholic....if you don't attend church weekly as is required by the church...you aren't Catholic. You can self identify as whatever you want but it doesn't mean you are.

People are what they identify as. Almost no one is actually a Jew under your stance here.

 

[vikki]

What exactly and how much are they willing to change?

Are there really 1 billion Catholics?

I was surprised by that number too.

 

[mcrommert]

People are what they identify as. Almost no one is actually a Jew under your stance here.

Jews are an exception...they are both a religion and an ethnic group...and the religion is inextricably tied to the ethnic group

 

[Tertullian]

People are what they identify as. Almost no one is actually a Jew under your stance here.

You can't mean this literally. I mean, if I identify as Chief Justice of the Supreme Court of the United States, that sure as hell doesn't make me Chief Justice of the Supreme Court of the United States. If I identify as a kind and gentle person, but I go around ripping the legs off of stray cats, then I'm not a kind and gentle person regardless of what I think. The Rachel Dolezal affair shows that few people are willing to accept the claim that merely considering oneself black actually makes one black. And so on and so forth. It seems like it's only in a minority of cases where what a person considers himself to be is the only factor in what he actually is.

Or are you only talking about religious identity? Even there it seems like self-description can't be the only factor that matters. What if a man claimed (completely seriously) to be a Catholic, but he was actually a thoroughgoing materialist atheist in every one of his beliefs? Surely at that point his claim to be Catholic becomes spurious.

In the case of Catholicism, though, you're sort of right. There is a sense in which anyone baptized Catholic is considered Catholic by the Church, regardless of what they believe, what they claim to be, etc. This is true in the sense that all baptized Catholics are considered (by the Church) to be bound by canon law, all baptized Catholics can return to the Church via confession without having to be re-initiated or anything, and so forth.

 

[WedgeX]

Please don't bring identity politics into Catholicism. Religions are easy to form...if you don't like a religion start your own. If you don't believe in unalterable dogma...you aren't a catholic....if you don't attend church weekly as is required by the church...you aren't Catholic. You can self identify as whatever you want but it doesn't mean you are.

That's not what the Catholic Church believes. Once baptized the Church believes you are indelibly marked as a Catholic forever unless you outright renounce the Churh or are excommunicated.

 

[mcrommert]

That's not what the Catholic Church believes. Once baptized the Church believes you are indelibly marked as a Catholic forever unless you outright renounce the Churh or are excommunicated.

Understood and agree

I mean more from the perspective of people who are continuously trying to change the church teaching instead of just leaving.

 

[WedgeX]

Understood and agree

I mean more from the perspective of people who are continuously trying to change the church teaching instead of just leaving.

The Church is regularly changing or clarifying it's positions. Granted constantly happens much less regularly over two millenia. Despite the occasional papal bout of infallibility, it's not a concrete, non-interpretive church. But that's why ecumenical councils, various conferences, and synods exist.

 

[Empty Space]

"I do not believe in all the policies that the country I am a of citizen enact and therefore I can be not a citizen of said country" is what some people in this thread are basically saying.

I'm not particularly religious or spiritual, and I'm not really convinced by the Holy Trinity or Jesus' divinity, but I grew up Catholic and went to Catholic school for 10 years. That stuff invariably leaves a mark on you good or bad, and I still consider myself Catholic even if I'm not a practicing one. It's part of my identity and culture.

I get why some people may have a hard time getting that though. People leave behind ideas, hobbies, and habits all the time without continuing to consider that thing a part of themselves anymore. What makes a person who once praticticed Catholisim or doesn't adhere to all its tenants consider themselves to still be one. I can't give an answer to that question. I think in my cases at least, it might be the fact that despite all the wrong that the Church has caused over the centuries and in spite of my own doubts and disagreement with some of its teachings, I still think its an entity for good in the world and I like being part of that even in a small way.

 

[Fj0823]

Because perhaps he agrees far more with what he disagrees with, and what he disagrees with isn't irreconciliable with what he agrees with.

Pretty much,thank you.

 

[jstripes]

Please don't bring identity politics into Catholicism. Religions are easy to form...if you don't like a religion start your own. If you don't believe in unalterable dogma...you aren't a catholic....if you don't attend church weekly as is required by the church...you aren't Catholic. You can self identify as whatever you want but it doesn't mean you are.

So you're saying most Catholics I know aren't Catholic.

 

[d9b]

Please don't bring identity politics into Catholicism. Religions are easy to form...if you don't like a religion start your own. If you don't believe in unalterable dogma...you aren't a catholic....if you don't attend church weekly as is required by the church...you aren't Catholic. You can self identify as whatever you want but it doesn't mean you are.

Tomás de Torquemada is back and he's a GAF member.

 

[Regulus Tera]

Are there really 1 billion Catholics?

It's the world's largest religion for a reason.

 

[Sickboy007]

Mhmm I don't expect too much honestly. If he had the political capital to call a Vatican 3 things could have been different, but he doesn't.