Support NeoGAF

[Bruno_Arrais85]

almost done with the main missions. I can't give a crap about the side characters and NPCs. I'm skipping all the dialogue that is not tied to the main story.

 

[RJMacready73]

The coastal areas are just class, finished the mission where you have to make your way up to the top of a skyscraper and then glide down, fucking hell it looked incredible, constantly stopping to look around me and take in the views, open world games sure as hell have come a long way, the amount of detail and variety they pack into this and that blazing fast loading makes zipping around the massive map with fast travel and absolute joy to use

 

[Humdinger]

almost done with the main missions. I can't give a crap about the side characters and NPCs. I'm skipping all the dialogue that is not tied to the main story.

There are some good, in-depth side missions in this game -- much better than in the original. Don't skip those (unless you really just want to blaze through the main story and that's it).

 

[Humdinger]

Finished my second run through the game. I enjoyed it better the second time around, for reasons mentioned above.

I just have a few remaining questions:

1. Why does Aloy's hair flip up in the back when she stands up after advancing time? Is this some time-dilation effect specific to her hair?

2. Why do people who use spears as their main weapon have armor with exposed abdomens?

3. On the same note, why do some armors have large spikes jutting straight up from the lower half, just below the abdomen. If that person were to sit down, he would impale himself on his own armor. This seems impractical at best.

4. Why are there so many lesbians in the post-apocalypse?

Also, I just want to comment on a piece of music I heard during the Tallneck quest near Landfall. It was really good -- a rousing bit of music that added a lot to the excitement of the quest. I only remember hearing it once, and I wish they would've used it more. Very effective.

 

[semiconscious]

4. Why are there so many lesbians in the post-apocalypse?...

not sure , but it does explain why there're so few children...
& why are there so few older people? & why is everyone so goddamn clean & well coiffed/dressed? & so goddamn literate, when you never see a single book?...

 

[Kupfer]

4. Why are there so many lesbians in the post-apocalypse?

Just out of curiosity, I haven't played that far, but are there any gay men in the game around later on?

 

[Humdinger]

& why are there so few older people? & why is everyone so goddamn clean & well coiffed/dressed? & so goddamn literate, when you never see a single book?...

Good point about the lack of old folks. There were only two senior citizens I remember. One was a murderer, and the other had dementia. Ageism!

Just out of curiosity, I haven't played that far, but are there any gay men in the game around later on?

There is one sidequest late in the game where that is implied, though not clearly stated.

 

[Interfectum]

Horizon FW is the first game in my 40 year history of playing games where I actually started skipping all cutscenes and button mashing through dialogue to get through to the end. I seriously NEVER do that but I was determined to see the credits roll and I didn't give a FUCK about the story towards the end.

 

[Kupfer]

There is one sidequest late in the game where that is implied, though not clearly stated.

Basically, I don't care about the sexuality of my fellow human beings, and I know just as many homosexuals who don't show their sexuality as homosexuals who fulfill the typical clichés.
That's why I don't think it's necessary to shed much light on the sexuality of protagonists, unless it's relevant to the story or the character.
But I find it strange when such a one-sided picture is drawn of a world populated by lesbian women, in which at the same time gay men play no role at all - especially when the game is not really about the sexuality of characters at all. If that were a core theme and the game openly wanted to empower and encourage lesbian women, that would be different, but as it is, it seems to me that lesbians are simply better accepted by society and thus generate more profit than gay men.
I find this somehow strange and in some ways also hypocritical.

 

[EverydayBeast]

Horizon is Sony giving killzone a break.

 

[Kupfer]

Horizon is Sony giving killzone a break.

Since CoD is no longer secured on the Playstation, there is probably some panic at Sony regarding an in-house replacement. If they had taken better care of Killzone back then, they would at least have a nice alternative now, since KZ2 and KZ3 definitely had the potential to offer a single player campaign and a fun, competitive multiplayer part with a solid fanbase.
But now that Horizon is one of Sonys bandwagons, I doubt that GG will release a real KZ again, and if they do, I doubt it would still have the gritty and brutal charm it had back then because if it wouldn't fit today's trends.
Sony hasn't shown any courage or self-confidence in this regard for a long time, they play it boring safe today.

 

[Humdinger]

...That's why I don't think it's necessary to shed much light on the sexuality of protagonists, unless it's relevant to the story or the character.
But I find it strange when such a one-sided picture is drawn of a world populated by lesbian women, in which at the same time gay men play no role at all - especially when the game is not really about the sexuality of characters at all.

Well, I was being a little facetious in my comment above. Yes, there are plenty of lesbians in HFW, particularly in the inner circle

Spoiler

Tilda, Elisabet, Alva, Petra

, but it's not an "in your face" thing. For instance, there are no make-out sessions or even flirtatious banter. Heck, Mass Effect had more lesbian action than HFW does. Their sexual orientation is sometimes a part of the story, not just tacked on for the heck of it. It's not a big deal. I was just goofing around.

 

[FalsettoVibe]

Horizon FW is the first game in my 40 year history of playing games where I actually started skipping all cutscenes and button mashing through dialogue to get through to the end. I seriously NEVER do that but I was determined to see the credits roll and I didn't give a FUCK about the story towards the end.

Kinda agree with this. At times there was just waaaay too much dialog.

 

[Interfectum]

Kinda agree with this. At times there was just waaaay too much dialog.

They wouldn't shut the fuck up and what they were saying wasn't interesting at all.

 

[Grildon Tundy]

Kinda agree with this. At times there was just waaaay too much dialog.

They wouldn't shut the fuck up and what they were saying wasn't interesting at all.

I button-mashed through every primitive tribe's quest cutscenes and dialog where possible but I thought the future-tech people's storyline and the stuff with

Spoiler

Elisabet's other clone

was interesting and well-done.

But, yeah, couldn't be arsed with hearing about how some tribe worships a robot dinosaur as a god because it poops out fertilizer or whatever for what felt like the 10th time

 

[BackBackPunch]

The writing is this game is insane (in the bad way). There's dialog at some point where a Tenakth says "bag em and tag em" in regards to dead soldiers. How does that make any sense in the context of this storyline? Are Tenakth sitting around watching old crime dramas on TV?

 

[hyperbertha]

The stories in these games are kinda throwaways anyway. The first game's plot was entirely ripped of from the first mass effect. Just change a few names here and there.

 

[adamsapple]

The writing is this game is insane (in the bad way). There's dialog at some point where a Tenakth says "bag em and tag em" in regards to dead soldiers. How does that make any sense in the context of this storyline? Are Tenakth sitting around watching old crime dramas on TV?

Forbidden West really did come and go like a wet fart, completely forgettable and it makes sense that almost no one talks about it anymore and that it's not even a serious contender for GoTY discussion.

The more I look back on it, the more it becomes a disappointing sequel to the potential of Zero Dawn.

 

[remember_spinal]

Forbidden West really did come and go like a wet fart, completely forgettable and it makes sense that almost no one talks about it anymore and that it's not even a serious contender for GoTY discussion.

The more I look back on it, the more it becomes a disappointing sequel to the potential of Zero Dawn.

Come and go, nominated for GOTY

Already won multiple awards, and probably outsold a lot of your favorite games already lol

 

[Tiamat2san]

HFW is a bloated, insipid game.
Most of the charm of the first game completely vanished for me.
I Hope you didn’t like God of war 2018 because you will feel the same while playing ragnarok.

 

[Swift_Star]

I found it boring compared to the first game...

 

[rofif]

HFW is a bloated, insipid game.
Most of the charm of the first game completely vanished for me.
I Hope you didn’t like God of war 2018 because you will feel the same while playing ragnarok.

While horizon expands on ALL ideas... good and bad.
Ragnarok expands 75% on good ideas and 25% on worse ones like too much leveling and weird gear systems

 

[Humdinger]

OP here. In retrospect, I was overly generous in my assessment of HFW. I've had more time to think about it. I went back and revised my OP to reflect my updated opinion. Here it is in a nutshell: Guerilla took my favorite game on PS4 and screwed it up. 7/10.

 

[Bumblebeetuna]

Incredible graphics, still probably the best looking game I have ever played.

Amazing animations and enemies.

Gameplay loop that is just interesting enough to keep you entertained.


Everything else was meh imho. Meh quests, NPCs are doodoo again, laughably bad story and dialogue, game does carry on too long. Combat is still very limited and easy.

Got the plat, I would rate it 7/10. A solid title.

 

[diffusionx]

OP here. In retrospect, I was overly generous in my assessment of HFW. I've had more time to think about it. I went back and revised my OP to reflect my updated opinion. Here it is in a nutshell: Guerilla took my favorite game on PS4 and screwed it up. 7/10.

A year on, it also seems clear that they really don't understand this and continue to think this series is something it is not. HFW is a really bad sequel to an amazing game but it looks like they are going to double down, as evidenced by Burning Shores.

 

[Humdinger]

A year on, it also seems clear that they really don't understand this and continue to think this series is something it is not. HFW is a really bad sequel to an amazing game but it looks like they are going to double down, as evidenced by Burning Shores.

What a disappointment that expansion was.

 

[The_Observer]

The original Horizon was my favorite game of last gen. I loved the combat, the environments, and the story. I enjoyed it so much that I replayed it twice.

I recently got a PS5, bundled with Horizon Forbidden West. HFW was one of my main reasons for picking up a PS5. Here are my thoughts.

Good Things
1. More involved side quests than in the first game.

2. Visually, the game looks better than the first. The first game was already a looker, so that's no mean feat. Environments, textures on clothing, effects, everything looks better.

3. Lip synch and facial animations are improved.

4. They added the ability to tag specific machine parts. That was helpful.

5. They added the ability to reset skill points. That was a nice option.

6. They added a lot of new weapons, armor, and mechanics. While I'm listing this as a plus, it's also a minus (see below). On the plus side, it provides more variety than the first game. And if you enjoy upgrading your gear, you'll have a lot to keep you busy here.

Not So Good Things

1. The game feels bloated -- overstuffed with content. More is less, folks. But no, this game, like a lot of modern games, is a victim of the "more is better" mindset. I mentioned above that there are plenty of new weapons and armors. Yes, but there are so many it is overwhelming, especially when each of them has a labor-intensive upgrade path. I don't have the time to experiment with, upgrade, and become skilled in using all these weapons, guys. That is just one example of the "more more more" overkill. I'll give you some more examples below.

2. The story goes on and on. It is half-decent, I guess, but it doesn't compare to the first game's story at all. This story felt very drawn out and not all that engaging. The "twists" seemed kind of lame. Plus, it's the usual Sony cinematic stuff -- 6 hours of cutscenes for the main story, plus hours more for the sidequests. I've grown increasingly tired of this movie-oriented approach to gaming.

3. There is a flood of things to do -- multitudes of quests, all sorts of new sub-quest types (most of which aren't interesting), new machines, new settlements, new weapons and mechanics, and icons littering the map. Again, folks: more is not necessarily better. I preferred the original's world. It didn't feel empty to me. It felt well-edited, like a good sentence is concise, not overstuffed with verbiage. This feels more like a bloated Ubisoft game. It makes me feel like I have an endless to-do checklist. It's not fun. At a certain point, it dawned on me that I felt more like I "should" play it, because I needed to get X or Y accomplished, rather than actually enjoying the gameplay.

4. They ruined some of the fun parts of HZD. For instance, they nerfed the Tripcaster and other weapons. They also turned Cauldrons into tedious platforming puzzles.

5. They tinkered with the combat, and in my opinion messed it up. In the original game, you could approach combat patiently and strategically. Not so here, because enemy aggressiveness has been turned way up, and enemies close the distance fast. Fights often devolve into close-quarters struggles, with little time to think, just react. It's more action-ey, to be sure, but it's less fun, at least for me. It's more twitch-based, less strategic. This is a shame, because combat in HZD was one of my favorite parts. I still had some fun with combat in Forbidden West, but it didn't come close to the first game.

6. They screwed up Aloy, too. For the first quarter of the game, they turn her into an unlikeable princess: "I don't need nobody. Nobody can save the world except me. Get out of my way boys!" How fucking tiresome. This is a complete change from Aloy's character in the first game, where she was an outcast happy to get help. She had even begun to develop a sense of humor in the Frozen Wilds. But no, in HFW, they turn her into a pain in the neck -- at least for the first quarter of the game. They do it to set up a dopey character arc, so she can realize (big revelation) that "we need friends" (daww). It's very artificial and off-putting. The voice actress also gives her a hard-edged, breathy voice in HFW that I don't like. Oh, and the way Avad, Erend, and Varl all simp for her in the beginning was very cringey. Reel it in, guys. Sheesh. Embarrassing.

7. You get a lot of political messaging here. For instance, you'll see a lot of spindly-armed women in charge of tribes of men. Yes, this was present to some degree in the original, but it was more understandable there; the Nora were a matriarchal society. But here you see it everywhere, in all of the societies -- little woman in charge of burly men. It's completely unrealistic, and it ruins immersion, because it causes me think about the writers' agenda and modern-day politics. I play games for fun and escape, not to get indoctrinated with this nonsense. Societies built on violence and combat would not have women in charge 50% of the time. Occasionally, sure, as an exception to the rule, but gimme a break with the "representation." I can only suspend disbelief so many times before it breaks down. I don't want to be thinking about the feminist agenda of the writers; I want to be immersed in the game world.

8. They screwed up the climbing mechanics, too, which admittedly were not a strength of the first game, but at least they were serviceable. Here, you have a choice between either spamming R3 all the time or else turning cliff markers to "always on," which paints all the mountains with yellow lines. I chose the latter, because constantly scanning for handholds is tedious.

9. There is waaay too much dialog. Man, these people just talk and talk. They will not shut up. I would often end up skipping through dialog sequences, because I was bored. I rarely do that in games. I'm not sure why they thought that putting so much dialog in the game was a good idea. It is not. It was boring. You don't need to endlessly yammer on and on, in order to create a character. You just need a brief portrait. Much of the talk felt like a waste of time. Way overdone.


Overall rating: 7/10.

Edit: I was more generous in the original post, but I have since revised this post to reflect my final thoughts on the game.

Thanks! Point 6 and 7 of not so good things make me glad that I didn’t buy it. One day maybe, real cheap.

 

[Topher]

OP here. In retrospect, I was overly generous in my assessment of HFW. I've had more time to think about it. I went back and revised my OP to reflect my updated opinion. Here it is in a nutshell: Guerilla took my favorite game on PS4 and screwed it up. 7/10.

I love the gameplay, but other than that, the game is highly forgettable. I'm still looking forward to the next game, but I hope it is the last and GG moves on to some new IP.

 

[diffusionx]

I love the gameplay, but other than that, the game is highly forgettable. I'm still looking forward to the next game, but I hope it is the last and GG moves on to some new IP.

I don't even think FW plays as well as the first game. The robots are super aggro and a lot of times it feels like your traps/weapons are impotent. I even remember seeing the bots just, like, clip through your stuff and get through without a scratch. The fights also seemed to go on way longer and just get boring. It just felt frustrating whereas in ZD everything worked extremely well. FW plays the way that people who didn't really "get" ZD thought it played.

 

[Topher]

I don't even think FW plays as well as the first game. The robots are super aggro and a lot of times it feels like your traps/weapons are impotent. I even remember seeing the bots just, like, clip through your stuff and get through without a scratch. The fights also seemed to go on way longer and just get boring. It just felt frustrating whereas in ZD everything worked extremely well. FW plays the way that people who didn't really "get" ZD thought it played.

Oh.....I think you are absolutely right. I didn't "get" ZD, but I did FW so I enjoyed it quite a bit more.

 

[ElCasual]

Was playing this game but I quit, think is kindda boring. Got the platinum of the first. Lets hope (I doubt) that the next and last game of the saga returns to the robots

 

[midnightAI]

I don't even think FW plays as well as the first game. The robots are super aggro and a lot of times it feels like your traps/weapons are impotent. I even remember seeing the bots just, like, clip through your stuff and get through without a scratch. The fights also seemed to go on way longer and just get boring. It just felt frustrating whereas in ZD everything worked extremely well. FW plays the way that people who didn't really "get" ZD thought it played.

Really? I think FW is way easier due to all the new weapons (the spike throwers are OP but so much fun to use) and the new melee

I can take down massive machines in seconds in post game but even running through the main quest line they were easy enough and the fights took no longer than the first game (shorter if anything)

(And no, I didn't play on easy, I played on hard)

It's really weird seeing people say FW is too hard, or boring, it's better in every way over ZD (except, maybe, story, but it's not bad in FW either, it's just a continuation with additional stuff thrown in)

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

I love the gameplay, but other than that, the game is highly forgettable. I'm still looking forward to the next game, but I hope it is the last and GG moves on to some new IP.

I found the main story to be really good Sci Fi stuff. way better than in other Sci Fi games recently

 

[Roxkis_ii]

Man, I think one reason HFW didn't hit like the first game is the lack of mystery in the story. In the first game, finding out what happened in the past had me glued to the game. The gameplay was fun too, but finding what happened was the main driver for me. In HFW, none of the mystery is there. The game looks and plays good, but the story is such a drag.

I really wanted to replay it after the proformance mode came out, but I just couldn't force myself to experience the story again, regardless of how fun the gameplay was.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Man, I think one reason HFW didn't hit like the first game is the lack of mystery in the story. In the first game, finding out what happened in the past had me glued to the game. The gameplay was fun too, but finding what happened was the main driver for me. In HFW, none of the mystery is there. The game looks and plays good, but the story is such a drag.

I really wanted to replay it after the proformance mode came out, but I just couldn't force myself to experience the story again, regardless of how fun the gameplay was.

Hmmm....I still found HFW had a lot of mystery to its story, very similar to the first, but I felt the enemy characters in HFW were more interesting/compelling

I get the complaints about the side content and world being pretty (but boring), but gameplay and story are its strength

 

[Shake Your Rump]

I genuinely felt Zero Dawn was a near-masterpiece. The story itself could have been a feature film. Fantastic game.

I only got about five hours into Forbidden West. If it wasn’t for Final Fantasy 16, I would nominate Forbidden West for the biggest slog award. They took a great game and added so much bloat in the form of quests, items, map, and dialogue. They also made Aloy completely un-likeable and a borderline psychopath with how easy and numerous her murders of other humans became.

 

[Sushi_Combo]

Zero Dawn was a masterpiece, Forbidden West was just ass, should've left it alone.

 

[Roxkis_ii]

Hmmm....I still found HFW had a lot of mystery to its story, very similar to the first, but I felt the enemy characters in HFW were more interesting/compelling

I get the complaints about the side content and world being pretty (but boring), but gameplay and story are its strength

What was the mystery in HFW?
From what I remember, you had to

Spoiler

get parts of Gaia under control. To stop them from messing up the planet. Then mid way you had to deal with the space people. I guess it was a bit of mystery about who the space people were. but that seems tepid compared to the mystery of the first game.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

What was the mystery in HFW?
From what I remember, you had to

Spoiler

get parts of Gaia under control. To stop them from messing up the planet. Then mid way you had to deal with the space people. I guess it was a bit of mystery about who the space people were. but that seems tepid compared to the mystery of the first game.

The space enemies, their origin (and yours). I found it interesting

 

[DenchDeckard]

I loaded it up on PS plus and my jaw hit the floor at how absolutely amazing it looks.....I played for an hour and turned it off to never return to it. Amazing tech, wizards on that front I just have no interest in the game at all.

 

[Inuteu]

1. The game feels bloated -- overstuffed with content. More is less, folks. But no, this game, like a lot of modern games, is a victim of the "more is better" mindset. I mentioned above that there are plenty of new weapons and armors. Yes, but there are so many it is overwhelming, especially when each of them has a labor-intensive upgrade path. I don't have the time to experiment with, upgrade, and become skilled in using all these weapons, guys. That is just one example of the "more more more" overkill. I'll give you some more examples below.



6. They screwed up Aloy, too. For the first quarter of the game, they turn her into an unlikeable princess: "I don't need nobody. Nobody can save the world except me. Get out of my way boys!" How fucking tiresome. This is a complete change from Aloy's character in the first game, where she was an outcast happy to get help. She had even begun to develop a sense of humor in the Frozen Wilds. But no, in HFW, they turn her into a pain in the neck -- at least for the first quarter of the game. They do it to set up a dopey character arc, so she can realize (big revelation) that "we need friends" (daww). It's very artificial and off-putting. The voice actress also gives her a hard-edged, breathy voice in HFW that I don't like. Oh, and the way Avad, Erend, and Varl all simp for her in the beginning was very cringey. Reel it in, guys. Sheesh. Embarrassing.

agree 100% with this

too many diferent weapons and elemnts

unnecessary


and they made aloy an arrogant bitch

 

[Kupfer]

Edit: I was more generous in the original post, but I have since revised this post to reflect my final thoughts on the game.

Too bad you didn't keep your original post in a spoiler so we can now compare your original post with your matured opinion.

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Forbidden West really did come and go like a wet fart, completely forgettable and it makes sense that almost no one talks about it anymore and that it's not even a serious contender for GoTY discussion.

The more I look back on it, the more it becomes a disappointing sequel to the potential of Zero Dawn.

Besides, Horizon: Zero Dawn is a much, much cooler title than Horizon: Forbidden West.

 

[firegamer273]

for me i got bored from this game after the first hour . it felt like i was playing the same game as first over again .

 

[Humdinger]

Too bad you didn't keep your original post in a spoiler so we can now compare your original post with your matured opinion.

Post #63 and #92 quote my earlier opinion after playing the full game, so you can get a sense of it there. That was a more generous assessment than I have today.

In retrospect, I think I was trying to like the game, trying to give it the benefit of the doubt.

too many diferent weapons and elemnts

Right, I forgot to mention all the different elemental weapon types and elemental resistances. The first game had the right amount. In HFW, it was overkill.