• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

TITANFALL 2 |G2.1| "Whatever The Fuck That Means"

They are banned because they waste time and because of disconnects.

No USB hub, unless something is VERY wrong, will ads Xms of input lag. Seriously.

Here's a source I'm happy with: http://www.totalphase.com/support/a...atency-Calculation-using-Beagle-5000-Analyzer

Edit: I don't know how accurate this is, but their website says:

I can't comment on it being zero lag etc. But if anything, the necessity of a hub for the pass-through isn't causing any issues.

As for the FGC, SFV has a bunch of lag anyway, so there's that.

Much of the above doesn't make sense.

The reason tools like the beagle analyser exist and measure latency added by a hub in milliseconds is because they can add latency, measurable in milliseconds. At my University I run an electroencephalography lab where we require near-absolute synchronous between the inputs on a computer screen and the triggers received by another computer, there are plenty ways in which to test the this syncrhony with software and hardware with seemingly similar intentions to the one that you linked. This is the one that we were using in our lab http://www.blackboxtoolkit.com/inputlag.html. In either case, the link you provided doesn't demonstrate that USB hubs can't add additional input lag, measurable in milliseconds, if anything, it suggests the opposite. Whether the something is very wrong with a USB hub that does create any meaningful latency is up to your own interpretation, but the fact that it can happen makes it better to avoid using one unless you really have to (in this case you don't, you can use a Brook rather than ChronusMax).

The Chronusmax is banned, mainly because of the ability to add macros. Time itself isn't a big issue, wireless dual shock 4's are allowed which take more time (since they have to be manually removed from the system every single time one is used). You can install macros for combos and whatnot, which obviously, really significantly effect the competitive validity of the hardware and would be quite difficult to detect because normal hand movements can often look like correct execution. The prospect of needing to reauthenticate is also a problem, as this would pause the game and require TO intervention.

http://cronusmax.com/front-page-news/mortal-kombat-x-*****-pack-4-gamepack-released/

As for what Cronusmax say regarding latency, it's possibly untrue, but hard to say. I believe Brook would say, or perhaps already do say the same things about their devices, but when tested, they do add a little lag.

As for Street Fighter and its built in input delay, all games have a certain amount of lag built into them, the input does not occur on the next frame in any game, so the 8 frames of lag in SFV isn't especially unusual. In the most responsive fighting games games it's usually around 4, but in either case the 'base' input lag of the video game is an overhead, processed after the system actually receives the input. It doesn't change the significance of reducing the input latency caused by your hardware.

In either case though, this really isn't worth further discussion. This is a TF2 thread and while I do care about input latency of my controllers and whatnot, I do not care this much.
 

Donos

Member
Haven't used it yet but the Devotion seems even more op than Hemlock. I'm fine getting outgunned from G2s but that Devotion gun is something else. After regeneration with Hemlock i'm going to try it (probably around the time when a patch rerolls everything).
 

SwolBro

Banned
http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/JaegerDice/video/25155345


LOL, when in doubt, spaz around with the Smart Pistol.
Devotion+amped wall+smart pistol boost

you deserve a plaque of some kind.

Haven't used it yet but the Devotion seems even more op than Hemlock. I'm fine getting outgunned from G2s but that Devotion gun is something else. After regeneration with Hemlock i'm going to try it (probably around the time when a patch rerolls everything).
G2/hemlok/devotion all need immediate adjustments. it should be the first thing Respawn looks at when they come back to work
 

Arrrammis

Member
Devotion+amped wall+smart pistol boost

you deserve a plaque of some kind.

G2/hemlok/devotion all need immediate adjustments. it should be the first thing Respawn looks at when they come back to work

I'd debate on the G2, it takes 4 body shots to kill at longer ranges (3 at close to mid range), and has a longer time to kill than almost every other weapon that I've played with. It's rightfully one of the most effective at longer ranges, because it's a semi auto gun, it should be able to outshoot all of the full auto weapons at longer range.
 

SwolBro

Banned
I'd debate on the G2, it takes 4 body shots to kill at longer ranges (3 at close to mid range), and has a longer time to kill than almost every other weapon that I've played with. It's rightfully one of the most effective at longer ranges, because it's a semi auto gun, it should be able to outshoot all of the full auto weapons at longer range.

yeah, i kind of agree but the thing is it's so batshit powerful at long ranges there's no escaping it. In CTF and on maps like backwater it's broken. i'd like them to make it a bit harder to aim, that'd balance it out more.
 
Lmao, played a full team (all Gen 8 or 10s). We lost 103-475. They weren't that good, I was beating them in my fights, but my team just couldn't keep up. By the end only three of us stayed. I honestly don’t see the point of quitting in this game. You lose your merits and you still get the loss. I mean it’s not like it matter unless you really care about your k/d or something. Hopefully they come out with a ranked mode later like they did with the first.
 

Izuna

Banned
Much of the above doesn't make sense.

The reason tools like the beagle analyser exist and measure latency added by a hub in milliseconds is because they can add latency, measurable in milliseconds. At my University I run an electroencephalography lab where we require near-absolute synchronous between the inputs on a computer screen and the triggers received by another computer, there are plenty ways in which to test the this syncrhony with software and hardware with seemingly similar intentions to the one that you linked. This is the one that we were using in our lab http://www.blackboxtoolkit.com/inputlag.html. In either case, the link you provided doesn't demonstrate that USB hubs can't add additional input lag, measurable in milliseconds, if anything, it suggests the opposite. Whether the something is very wrong with a USB hub that does create any meaningful latency is up to your own interpretation, but the fact that it can happen makes it better to avoid using one unless you really have to (in this case you don't, you can use a Brook rather than ChronusMax).

The Chronusmax is banned, mainly because of the ability to add macros. Time itself isn't a big issue, wireless dual shock 4's are allowed which take more time (since they have to be manually removed from the system every single time one is used). You can install macros for combos and whatnot, which obviously, really significantly effect the competitive validity of the hardware and would be quite difficult to detect because normal hand movements can often look like correct execution. The prospect of needing to reauthenticate is also a problem, as this would pause the game and require TO intervention.

http://cronusmax.com/front-page-news/mortal-kombat-x-*****-pack-4-gamepack-released/

As for what Cronusmax say regarding latency, it's possibly untrue, but hard to say. I believe Brook would say, or perhaps already do say the same things about their devices, but when tested, they do add a little lag.

As for Street Fighter and its built in input delay, all games have a certain amount of lag built into them, the input does not occur on the next frame in any game, so the 8 frames of lag in SFV isn't especially unusual. In the most responsive fighting games games it's usually around 4, but in either case the 'base' input lag of the video game is an overhead, processed after the system actually receives the input. It doesn't change the significance of reducing the input latency caused by your hardware.

In either case though, this really isn't worth further discussion. This is a TF2 thread and while I do care about input latency of my controllers and whatnot, I do not care this much.

I'm not really trying to debate with you for argument's sake, which for some reason you appear to be doing ~~ instead, I'm trying to be helpful.

Bombarding someone with a shit ton of words that essentially say "but you can't deduce that from that one article..." ~~

That is to say, whether you are worried about the ChronusMax requiring a USB Hub for its perfect passthrough for PS4 or not; I myself who used one to play USF4, others who play Rocksmith or use MIDI controllers, and finally the rest of the internet will say that a USB Hub is not adding any practical input latency whatsoever.

In that article, the hub(s) tested showed .5ms of added "measurable" latency (or up to 500us).

The delta time between these indices is 178ns, which is the hub latency.

FWIW, who knows if the Brook adapter is or isn't better ChronusMax (with a hub).

The only worthwhile thing to take away here is that it's not fair to conclude Brook > ChronusMax because one requires a hub with regard to input latency ~~ and the many, MANY people who use such devices will tell you that the negligible latency added by these devices are far better than buying third-party monstrosities for the PS4 over the Elite Controller.

As for competitions, it's not that I'll know the reasoning for now, but back when USFIV was moving to PS4 there was a lot of talk on converters. Wireless got banned at some point (you can find EVO clips of the disconnects in action), and macro aside, there's no reason why a tournament couldn't provide their own converters (which is what I imagine they did with the CoD tournament).

There's nothing wrong talking about input latency in controllers in a Titanfall 2 thread.

EDIT: (forgot to address this) The point I was making was that SFV has more input lag than SF4 on PC and Xbox (and Arcade). Despite that, people just "get used it". If you're playing an online game regardless, input latency in converters is very negligible.

Yeah that makes sense, I use the battery boost with Ronin, can't live without it really. I'll probably stick with Scorch when I start using Dice Roll.

Dice Roll is a scam imo. Sure, you get it at 36%, but you still need to roll over the same amount onwards to get another one. If it were every 36% then sure, but that's not how it works.
 

Izuna

Banned
lmao at frothy wanting a buff for Archer

playing on Console or PC, it's far too easy to get Doomed Titans off guard. But w/e ;p
 
Devotion+amped wall+smart pistol boost

you deserve a plaque of some kind.

G2/hemlok/devotion all need immediate adjustments. it should be the first thing Respawn looks at when they come back to work


Agreed, but it's Crash Site, I gotta do something to make it enjoyable.

I don't think the G2 needs any adjustment personally. Devotion absolutely needs a nerf of some kind.

Also, I'm getting used to the CAR. Still no Volt, tho...
 
Has anyone noticed the save system is completely horrible? If you want to replay a mission (i.e. wanted to show my bro Effect and Cause), it wipes away your campaign progress. You can start at the last unlocked chapter, but that can be a lot of progress lost.
 

Izuna

Banned
Has anyone noticed the save system is completely horrible? If you want to replay a mission (i.e. wanted to show my bro Effect and Cause), it wipes away your campaign progress. You can start at the last unlocked chapter, but that can be a lot of progress lost.

Well, game is short enough that it doesn't super matter ;p
 
My first game playing at 144fps. It might not look so hot, but damn it felt good.

SxAWkIb.jpg
 
Frothy's Tier list[/B]:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-_bu2Znc7s <-- he says Volt is still S-tier.

I remember the day I bought the game I went to youtube and typed in "best guns in Titanfall 2". I saw frothy's first tier video and watched the whole thing to try and get some perspective about this game and its weapons. I'm sure many will disagree with his list but I'll be honest, he's the reason why Tone and Volt are my main Titan and gun.
 

Izuna

Banned
I remember the day I bought the game I went to youtube and typed in "best guns in Titanfall 2". I saw frothy's first tier video and watched the whole thing to try and get some perspective about this game and its weapons. I'm sure many will disagree with his list but I'll be honest, he's the reason why Tone and Volt are my main Titan and gun.

coming from SF4, his idea of a tier-list is interesting lol
 
coming from SF4, his idea of a tier-list is interesting lol

I think his way of ranking weapons and everything else might actually have a connection to Street Fighter. I was watching his stream a few weeks ago and I noticed that he uses the Guile theme whenever he got a donation or sub. So I asked him in the chat if he likes Street Fighter. He said he's a fan and enjoys watching it competitively although he's not that good at playing it.

I didn't ask him if that's why he chose to go with a "tier" list but I wouldn't be surprised if that was the reason why. Not sure how popular "tiers" and using letters like S, A, B, C, etc. is to rank stuff in other type of competitive games are.
 

Izuna

Banned
I think his way of ranking weapons and everything else might actually have a connection to Street Fighter. I was watching his stream a few weeks ago and I noticed that he uses the Guile theme whenever he got a donation or sub. So I asked him in the chat if he likes Street Fighter. He said he's a fan and enjoys watching it competitively although he's not that good at playing it.

I didn't ask him if that's why he chose to go with a "tier" list because of that. But I wouldn't be surprised if that was the reason why. Not sure how popular "tiers" and using letters like S, A, B, C, etc. is to rank stuff in other type of competitive games are.

Well, the thing is, his Titan tier list is strange because he doesn't talk about match-ups (which essentially create SF tier lists). I suppose that's because it's a team game, but I wouldn't rate Northstar that high without talking about how good she is in Bounty Hunt specifically.

But then when he talks about Scorch, he mentions how he loses in 1v1s.
 

Izuna

Banned
Bought the game and currently downloading it on Origin. Is there a way to make it work through steam or nah?

You can put a shortcut via Steam (non-Steam Game)... but it'll always load up Origin. I think you can get Origin to close when the game does?
 

deoee

Member
HAHAHA AT ARCHER AT F-TIER LMAO

Better accuracy for this gun would almost break the game, but okay Frothy!

Well archer is useless for me too.

I guess it's very subjective.
The Archer shot is so easily avoidable and can be turned into a weapon against you...
 

Izuna

Banned
Well archer is useless for me too.

I guess it's very subjective.
The Archer shot is so easily avoidable and can be turned into a weapon against you...

A lot of my Titan kills are with Archer. If you're a pilot, you are not getting into 1v1s. With Amped and Phase, it's stupidly powerful.

It also one shots a Turret unamped :D
 

SwolBro

Banned
Well archer is useless for me too.

I guess it's very subjective.
The Archer shot is so easily avoidable and can be turned into a weapon against you...

it's a pointless anti-titan weapon to equip vs going with either the charge rifle or mag launcher. there's no need to even try and argue it with someone.
 
A lot of my Titan kills are with Archer. If you're a pilot, you are not getting into 1v1s. With Amped and Phase, it's stupidly powerful.

It also one shots a Turret unamped :D

You can argue that against worse players you can use anything to make them work, doesn't mean a weapon/titan/kit is good on its own term. Any above average player knows how ineffective archer is now and it doesn't even take effort to avoid taking damage from it. Hell the archer a lot of the times will miss on its own simply because the target moved! How can you call a weapon good when you can't even control it?
 

Izuna

Banned
it's a pointless anti-titan weapon to equip vs going with either the charge rifle or mag launcher. there's no need to even try and argue it with someone.

Nowhere near true. Amped Archer is the most oppressive Anti-Titan weapon in the game.

H2t0Y5J.gif


(that's 30% charge for a single shot...)

This scenario is unreactable for the Titan. By that, I mean that the player can't eject in between both Archer shots hitting (two Archer shots hit, the shot that misses is from a Titan).

It does a ~third of Stryder-class health per shot, and requires a Titan to take full notice of the Pilot in order to dodge. It either wastes a Smoke, Phase Dash, regular Dash etc.

Archer isn't super useful when not Amped, but so long as you're hitting 2/3 of shots overall, it's very comparable to the MGL but with much better range. If you're shooting at a Titan who is distracted (which is most of the time, since Titans fight other Titans), it'll give you your own Titan while doing stupid damage with each shot.

The only attacks that one-shot Doom health are Northstar's Fully Charged (on a crit), 5-hits with Tone's Tracker Rockets (if you count that as one-shot), Flame Core and possibley Ion's Laser on a crit. Titans aren't conditioned to eject just because they see the lock, and even if they were, that'd still make the Amped Archer the most oppressive Anti-Titan weapon.

It's also great for taking out Reapers as a Pilot quickly (two shots amped, or two plus one firestar).

Anyone want to try, use Faster Reloads and Gunready.
 

Izuna

Banned
You can argue that against worse players you can use anything to make them work, doesn't mean a weapon/titan/kit is good on its own term. Any above average player knows how ineffective archer is now and it doesn't even take effort to avoid taking damage from it. Hell the archer a lot of the times will miss on its own simply because the target moved! How can you call a weapon good when you can't even control it?

I don't think the Archer missing has anything to do with how good the player is. For some reason, it hits more consistently when I'm on PC.

I just checked and my stats, and while I can't check accuracy, I've done 30% of hits in comparison to the Hemlock (which does a burst). I know I switched to both around the same time, but that's not entirely scientific.

(also, it's incredible at dealing with Bounty Titans.)
 
I don't think the Archer missing has anything to do with how good the player is. For some reason, it hits more consistently when I'm on PC.

I just checked and my stats, and while I can't check accuracy, I've done 30% of hits in comparison to the Hemlock (which does a burst). I know I switched to both around the same time, but that's not entirely scientific.

(also, it's incredible at dealing with Bounty Titans.)

You can't judge everything based on Bounty Hunt.. And did you realize all those "archer magical hits" gifs you posted are when you are high up in the air from an ejection? Against competent players if you lock at them on the ground or a roof it simply doesn't work.
 

Izuna

Banned
You can't judge everything based on Bounty Hunt.. And did you realize all those "archer magical hits" gifs you posted are when you are high up in the air from an ejection? Against competent players if you lock at them on the ground or a roof it simply doesn't work.

Those are just the gifs I have. Most of my hits aren't from ejection (I didn't make that clip to show Archer being powerful, just because it fit the mini montage).

Anyway... It's fine that I can't judge it on Bounty Hunt, but I think it's far better in Attrition. This "Archer misses all the time" isn't true, and it may come from people not giving it enough playtime.

MGL's inability to oppress Doomed Titans is a big flaw in comparison to Archer. If merely locking on forces the Titan to waste a resource, that's perfect.

Frothy put Satchel as "being useful in some cases" despite doing almost the same (or less) damage than an Archer. Showing that it can be dodged means nothing. As a Pilot, you'll mostly fight distracted Titans, and when you do, the Archer is the best for it.

Final note: if it's bad players that get hit by Archer. Where are these "good" players? Do they just not exist or do I never go up against them? If every time is super likely to have these bad players who get hit by Archer, then that still lets it be super useful.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

So I tried a game with Alternator for the first time today...

zIfWn74.png


It's super easy to get high Pilot kill counts when you're using a weapon that lets you move about. I accidentally didn't have Amped Weapons for that round so... Hemlok is stupid but I don't think even on console, it's the best.

I tried the Volt for the first time over the last couple of days. Took a little getting used to but it's pretty good when hipfiring. I think I prefer the CAR though.

I'll try this out when I unlock it again :) don't feel like using credits for a weapon I dunno about yet.

Have you tried 90 FoV?
 

Izuna

Banned
Disagree strongly with Mastiff as F tier. Psh.

I think Frothy is shitting on weapons he just hasn't used much. He did this before in his first tier list.

--

Nn4Y7VM.png


--

I'm now at 2.1 vs Players, 10.2 last ten games.

also, Alternator is stupid for anti-Pilot... Lost any ounce of respect for Gamesager rn
 

deoee

Member
I always face potent Titans when trying the Archer. It's either a one dash to the side or in worst case an Ion who waits with its shield until you fire and kills you.

Also not to speak a bit the times where the shot simply misses by itself because it curves where ever oh also the look on can be wonky and switch between multiple titans and reapers.
 

Izuna

Banned
JIP...

5fWL5MG.png


counts as a loss if I leave... may as well try to win this for my team...

J747OMJ.png


Okay, Alternator is easy mode. Anyone complaining about Hemlok but uses this weapon. Wtf, is it a two shot kill with Amped Weapons?
 

Greddleok

Member
I always face potent Titans when trying the Archer. It's either a one dash to the side or in worst case an Ion who waits with its shield until you fire and kills you.

Also not to speak a bit the times where the shot simply misses by itself because it curves where ever oh also the look on can be wonky and switch between multiple titans and reapers.

Don't shoot them when they know you're there. That's not what the archer is for.

The archer is designed to blast titans who are already engaged, and it excels in that role since you can do it from practically anywhere, unlike the grenade launcher.

I do agree about the wonkiness though. Sometimes it misses for some weird reason that I can't figure out.
 

Izuna

Banned
Amped MGL takes 5 shots to kill a Doomed Titan.

No, y'all need to not sleep on Archer. The weapons aren't comparable.

~~

First loss in a long time...

5hIFdD0.png


How do you play a whole game and get 9 Attrition Points. I wish I could see people's deaths in this game...

That was probably the most Titans I've done in a single game...
 

deoee

Member
For PS4, you should be fine at 90 :)

--

Okay, Alternator is broken. If Volt is supposed to be stronger omfg. Like, speaking of requiring no skill...

What did you use since release?

I constantly switch between the three SMGs (minus r97) to mix things up.
 
The Alternator has always been good. Pretty much my top weapons have been CAR, Volt, and Alternator. Recoil is really a non factor on the PC, so you can pretty much kill with them from any range even though they are "smg."
 

Izuna

Banned
What did you use since release?

I constantly switch between the three SMGs (minus r97) to mix things up.

At release, I used EPG-1 until I heard G2 was super good, then I switched to Hemlok because it became popular.

SMGs are stupid. I can't believe Swolbro was complaining about the Hemlok so much. Like, are you serious...

--

I really don't like Arc Grenades. They can't one-shot Minions and I don't understand why. I've felt this way since the Alpha Tech Test. But, Phase Embark is dope... Hmm... I want Ordnance Expert for my Firestar but I think I can do without. I dunno, haven't decided yet.
 
Top Bottom