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[Stat!]

I'd probably ask their name and pronouns first and go from there.

For me, socially, it seems odd to start with that before saying "Hey/hello", no?

Its odd since they know what I look like, I know what they look like. Why pretend I guess that I don't know his (or the preferred pro-noun's) name? Seems kinda rude in a way but I would never want to overstep a line or make someone feel bad.

 

[Ketkat]

For me, socially, it seems odd to start with that before saying "Hey/hello", no?

Its odd since they know what I look like, I know what they look like. Why pretend I guess that I don't know his (or the preferred pro-noun's) name? Seems kinda rude in a way but I would never want to overstep a line or make someone feel bad.

I mean, if you know his name and that he transitioned, what's the issue? Just treat him like you would any other guy that you haven't seen in years. You make that awkward small talk and then you go your separate ways and hope you don't bump into any other random people from high school while grocery shopping

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

You would be hard-pressed to find a trans person who would be uninterested in dating a cis person. The same is not true of a cis person uninterested in dating trans people. That's where the inherent bigotry comes in.

Is it bigotry though?

I harbour no hate for any trans people. But me not wanting to date them is me being a bigot?

Maybe I'm reading it wrong.

 

[Butterfly Witch]

For me, socially, it seems odd to start with that before saying "Hey/hello", no?

Its odd since they know what I look like, I know what they look like. Why pretend I guess that I don't know his (or the preferred pro-noun's) name? Seems kinda rude in a way but I would never want to overstep a line or make someone feel bad.

Because you shouldn't make assumptions. How do you know they prefer male pronouns just because they look male?

It's not that complicated to go like "Hey remember me from high school? Long time no see! May I ask you your name and pronouns?"

Adapt it to match the situation better as needed. Simple, no?

Is it bigotry though?

I harbour no hate for any trans people. But me not wanting to date them is me being a bigot?

Maybe I'm reading it wrong.

If you won't date a trans woman because she's not cis then yeah, it's bigotry.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Is it bigotry though?

I harbour no hate for any trans people. But me not wanting to date them is me being a bigot?

Maybe I'm reading it wrong.

Bigotry isn't hate

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

Bigotry isn't hate

Definition of bigot
: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

?


I don't treat trans folks with hate or intolerance. I dont think I'm a bigot because I wouldnt date a trans woman. How is that any different than any other sexual preference like not being into fat girls or red heads or any other thing?

Im honestly just trying to understand here.

 

[A Link to the Past]

?


I don't treat trans folks with hate or intolerance. I dont think I'm a bigot because I wouldnt date a trans woman. How is that any different than any other sexual preference like not being into fat girls or red heads or any other thing?

Im honestly just trying to understand here.

Bigotry can be hate yes, but it is not inherently hate. I would however argue that not wanting to date a trans person is intolerance.

 

[Misha]

?


I don't treat trans folks with hate or intolerance. I dont think I'm a bigot because I wouldnt date a trans woman. How is that any different than any other sexual preference like not being into fat girls or red heads or any other thing?

Im honestly just trying to understand here.

There isn't a hard divide between trans women and cis women. To say you won't date trans women as a whole is to say you don't care if they look attractive to you, you just refuse to date that person on account of being trans

 

[Butterfly Witch]

?


I don't treat trans folks with hate or intolerance. I dont think I'm a bigot because I wouldnt date a trans woman. How is that any different than any other sexual preference like not being into fat girls or red heads or any other thing?

Im honestly just trying to understand here.

Trans women are women, if your sexual orientation is towards female partners and you exclude trans women from that group then you are inherently discriminating against trans women.

 

[CSJ]

Trans women are women, if your sexual orientation is towards female partners and you exclude trans women from that group then you are inherently discriminating against trans women.

I'm so fucking out of touch with all of this.

Trans women are women, I understand that.
What's the right way of saying pre/post op? Can one be a trans women without having done so? Knowing is half the battle, I actually want to learn so I can make an informed response.

 

[Butterfly Witch]

I'm so fucking out of touch with all of this.

Trans women are women, I understand that.
What's the right way of saying pre/post op? Can one be a trans women without having done so? Knowing is half the battle, I actually want to learn so I can make an informed response.

I'm probably going to get a lot of mileage out of this link so I should keep this handy...

You should read this and ask any questions you may have afterwards. It's not perfect or 100% complete but should give you a solid idea.

https://www.pflag.org/sites/default/files/Our Trans Loved Ones.pdf

Please understand that most trans women don't ever have SRS because of it's cost and limited availability. Think $25k to $45k when everything is said and done as SRS has extensive downtime measured in months where you may not be able to work but bills still have to be paid.

Even then, some trans women simply don't want SRS and that's okay. Pre or Post OP status does not and should not matter.

A vagina does not make a trans woman a woman. Being a woman makes a trans woman a woman.

Same applies to trans men, with the added caveat that SRS for trans men is stupidly more dangerous.

 

[Elandyll]

Great OP, with just one thing I might disagree on.

I do not see how you could define accidental (as in really not knowing) mis-gendering (like with a pronoun) of a non transitionned person you do not happen to know as "unintentional Transphobic".

It's just lack of knowledge of that person's identification in that case, no?

 

[CSJ]

A vagina does not make a trans woman a woman. Being a woman makes a trans woman a woman.

Same applies to trans men, with the added caveat that SRS for trans men is stupidly more dangerous.

Thanks for that, I better understand it now.

It's crude, but I wouldn't date this hypothetical person based on sexual compatibility.
That's my every right as a person, it's also not a choice, I can't help that I don't like it.

 

[Weiss]

I mean, if a woman has a penis or a man has a vagina (not in a "oh so they're fake haha comedy" thing the way TV still runs with but, like, the acknowledgement that your bits aren't more important to someone's gender identity than how they identify) is it really this grand act of bigotry to be unattracted? Can you not acknowledge someone's fundamental human rights and correctly identify them with their true gender, and also not be attracted to them?

Great OP, with just one thing I might disagree on.

I do not see how you could define accidental (as in really not knowing) mis-gendering (like with a pronoun) of a non transitionned person you do not happen to know as "unintentional Transphobic".

It's just lack of knowledge of that person's identification in that case, no?

I mean, at the end of the day it's still misgendering.

It certainly isn't, like, a horrible mortal sin. It's just a mistake to apologize for.

I did it, I was corrected, and then I apologized. And then I went on hating him for being a raging douchebag who's impossible to work with.

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

Bigotry can be hate yes, but it is not inherently hate. I would however argue that not wanting to date a trans person is intolerance.

There isn't a hard divide between trans women and cis women. To say you won't date trans women as a whole is to say you don't care if they look attractive to you, you just refuse to date that person on account of being trans

Trans women are women, if your sexual orientation is towards female partners and you exclude trans women from that group then you are inherently discriminating against trans women.

I take all these points.

But I guess it's ingrained. I try to treat everyone with tolerance and respect.

I was told on tinder by a girl that she was trans. As soon as I heard that I had no Interest in her anymore. I politely said sorry but I'm mot interested. At that point she went on a tirade of calling me transphobic among other things.

From these replies I feel like I'm being made to be a bigot when I genuinely don't feel that way. I cant help who I find sexually attractive and who I don't. I also don't feel as though I should be labelled a bigot because of my attractions, or anyone should for that matter.

If I recognise a trans woman as a woman, but don't find them sexually attractive, is that me contradicting myself? Or is it simply my sexual tastes at play.

 

[Ketkat]

I take all these points.

But I guess it's ingrained. I try to treat everyone with tolerance and respect.

I was told on tinder by a girl that she was trans. As soon as I heard that I had no Interest in her anymore. I politely said sorry but I'm mot interested. At that point she went on a tirade of calling me transphobic among other things.

From these replies I feel like I'm being made to be a bigot when I genuinely don't feel that way. I cant help who I find sexually attractive and who I don't. I also don't feel as though I should be labelled a bigot because of my attractions, or anyone should for that matter.

If I recognise a trans woman as a woman, but don't find them sexually attractive, is that me contradicting myself? Or is it simply my sexual tastes at play.

So, you had no idea what was in her pants? You entirely discarded her because she was trans and no other reason? How is it you can possibly justify that as not being transphobic?

 

[Izayoi]

A vagina does not make a trans woman a woman. Being a woman makes a trans woman a woman.

Same applies to trans men, with the added caveat that SRS for trans men is stupidly more dangerous.

In terms of sexual compatibility, would it still make someone transphobic if they didn't want to date a trans woman because they have a penis?

Earlier you said it would, but I'm not sure if I agree with that.

 

[TenCentCoast]

I take all these points.

But I guess it's ingrained. I try to treat everyone with tolerance and respect.

I was told on tinder by a girl that she was trans. As soon as I heard that I had no Interest in her anymore. I politely said sorry but I'm mot interested. At that point she went on a tirade of calling me transphobic among other things.

From these replies I feel like I'm being made to be a bigot when I genuinely don't feel that way. I cant help who I find sexually attractive and who I don't. I also don't feel as though I should be labelled a bigot because of my attractions, or anyone should for that matter.

If I recognise a trans woman as a woman, but don't find them sexually attractive, is that me contradicting myself? Or is it simply my sexual tastes at play.

Them being trans is what is making you not want to be with them.
So, yeah, you're kinda contradicting yourself. If you genuinely can't tell the difference between a woman who is trans and a cis woman, if they are post GRS, if you would never even know they used to have a penis unless they told you, would you be with them? Because if that's the case, you are definitely being transphobic.

 

[collige]

I take all these points.

But I guess it's ingrained. I try to treat everyone with tolerance and respect.

I was told on tinder by a girl that she was trans. As soon as I heard that I had no Interest in her anymore. I politely said sorry but I'm mot interested. At that point she went on a tirade of calling me transphobic among other things.

From these replies I feel like I'm being made to be a bigot when I genuinely don't feel that way. I cant help who I find sexually attractive and who I don't. I also don't feel as though I should be labelled a bigot because of my attractions, or anyone should for that matter.

If I recognise a trans woman as a woman, but don't find them sexually attractive, is that me contradicting myself? Or is it simply my sexual tastes at play.

But you didn't find the women in question sexually unattractive, you found the idea of her being trans unattractive. Nothing changed physically from your perspective before and after she came out to you, so what caused your change in feelings?

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

So, you had no idea what was in her pants? You entirely discarded her because she was trans and no other reason? How is it you can possibly justify that as not being transphobic?

I was seeing a couple girls at the time and had a few dates lined up. She was pushing for a date with me. She had maybe 3 pictures and were all from the most flattering angles and had filters on them. I.wasnt overly attracted to the girl but said I may be free the following week.

Once she told me, I didn't see the point in going on a date with someone I'm more than likely not going to be attracted to (just based on the brief view of her looks), especially when I already had a full plate and seen little potential in the date in the first place. I didn't see the point in going on a pity date either. I dont think I'm being transphobic by not being attracted to trans women, surely I amn't?

This is obviously a delicate topic but I genuinely am not trying to offend or be a dick.

 

[RDreamer]

I take all these points.

But I guess it's ingrained. I try to treat everyone with tolerance and respect.

I was told on tinder by a girl that she was trans. As soon as I heard that I had no Interest in her anymore. I politely said sorry but I'm mot interested. At that point she went on a tirade of calling me transphobic among other things.

From these replies I feel like I'm being made to be a bigot when I genuinely don't feel that way. I cant help who I find sexually attractive and who I don't. I also don't feel as though I should be labelled a bigot because of my attractions, or anyone should for that matter.

If I recognise a trans woman as a woman, but don't find them sexually attractive, is that me contradicting myself? Or is it simply my sexual tastes at play.

I think situations like these are kind of rough. I think if you're in some sort of hypothetical situation where you're really attracted to someone and compatible in all realms and then find out they're trans and suddenly that's a turn off then there's something there, but I"m talking about like post operation and you've already had sex that sort of thing. It'd be similar to finding out a significant other used to be fat or something where their physical appearance used to be something else an that turned you off.

Why this is all strange is because you're probably like me in that you're not attracted to penises. Sorry, but I don't like 'em. Being attracted to my significant others genitals, as crude as that sounds, is a big deal. Now when you're just trying to start to date someone you can't just out and ask someone about their genitals. That's fucking weird. So when you hear someone is trans there's a lot of possibilities there and I think you, like many others, probably bow out at that.

And unfortunately trans people probably have to out and say they're trans right off the bat because some people can get cruel and turn a complete 180 after finding out, so they want to be on the same page, which hinders things because it also stops attraction before it can start.

I genuinely feel for the trans people that have to wade through things like that through obviously no fault of their own.

So, you had no idea what was in her pants? You entirely discarded her because she was trans and no other reason? How is it you can possibly justify that as not being transphobic?

I guess that's genuinely the question here. What's etiquette with this sort of question? If someone is talking to you on a dating site and says they're trans do you/can you ask about their genitals?

 

[Ketkat]

Once she told me, I didn't see the point in going on a date with someone I'm more than likely not going to be attracted to (just based on the brief view of her looks), especially when I already had a full plate and seen little potential in the date in the first place. I didn't see the point in going on a pity date either. I dont think I'm being transphobic by not being attracted to trans women, surely I amn't?

That's absolutely transphobic. You turned her down because she was trans, you were going to go on a date with her until you found out she was.

 

[Weiss]

In terms of sexual compatibility, would it still make someone transphobic if they didn't want to date a trans woman because they have a penis?

Earlier you said it would, but I'm not sure if I agree with that.

I don't believe so, but then I'm a cis dude. I can see why trans people would see it as unfair.

Though I'm also bi, so if I'm honest, I'm really confused on how I'm "supposed" to feel about that. I'm attracted to men and women, and trans men are men, and trans women are women, but I don't believe I'm attracted to women with penises or men with vaginas, and I don't feel that saying "but I totally support you!" somehow gives me a pass on that, I guess. Does that make a bigot? I don't think so, but then, I'm me.

 

[Izayoi]

I don't believe so, but then I'm a cis dude. I can see why trans people would see it as unfair.

Though I'm also bi, so if I'm honest, I'm really confused on how I'm "supposed" to feel about that. I'm attracted to men and women, and trans men are men, and trans women are women, but I don't believe I'm attracted to women with penises or men with vaginas, and I don't feel that saying "but I totally support you!" somehow gives me a pass on that, I guess. Does that make a bigot? I don't think so, but then, I'm me.

Personally it doesn't bother me one bit (I'm typically pretty fluid in my sexuality, at least) but it is a question that I've been curious about.

 

[Snarfington]

I openly admit that I don't understand this stuff - I just can't imagine it - and sometimes I mess up with regards to my approach to transgender people, but I do sympathise and accept, and indeed welcome it, and threads like these bring me closer and closer to fully understanding and being more mindful. Thanks.

 

[Ketkat]

I don't believe so, but then I'm a cis dude. I can see why trans people would see it as unfair.

Though I'm also bi, so if I'm honest, I'm really confused on how I'm "supposed" to feel about that. I'm attracted to men and women, and trans men are men, and trans women are women, but I don't believe I'm attracted to women with penises or men with vaginas, and I don't feel that saying "but I totally support you!" somehow gives me a pass on that, I guess. Does that make a bigot? I don't think so, but then, I'm me.

So you're attracted to men and women. You're into both sets of genitals as well. But when they're on someone trans, you suddenly have an issue with it and don't want to be with that person. Again, how is it you can rationalize that as not transphobic/bigoted?

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

That's absolutely transphobic. You turned her down because she was trans, you were going to go on a date with her until you found out she was.

I don't know. Even just the implication that this girl might still have a penis was enough to completely sour me on the date and her I guess.

Im probably being unfair to her, but I can't change my feelings. Shitty situation all around. Cant imagine what it's like for trans people trying to date.

 

[Elandyll]

...

I mean, at the end of the day it's still misgendering.

It certainly isn't, like, a horrible mortal sin. It's just a mistake to apologize for.

I did it, I was corrected, and then I apologized. And then I went on hating him for being a raging douchebag who's impossible to work with.

?

I was referring to this in the op

you likely are being unintentionally transphobic. If you misgender someone, you are being transphobic. Especially if it is on purpose.

It seems to me that there's an assumption of Transphobia (even if labelled unintentional) on what could be an honest mistake. #shrug

 

[Weiss]

So you're attracted to men and women. You're into both sets of genitals as well. But when they're on someone trans, you suddenly have an issue with it and don't want to be with that person. Again, how is it you can rationalize that as not transphobic/bigoted?

I don't think I can, to be honest.

And, I mean, I'm attracted to trans women with vaginas and trans men with penises. But that's still transphobic in that I'm putting an addendum on what "allows" me to be attracted to them.

?

I was referring to this in the op


It seems to me that there's an assumption of Transphobia (even if labelled unintentional) on what could be an honest mistake. #shrug

It is an honest mistake. Likewise, it is still transphobic. I don't think it makes you a bad person, but it's still a mistake.

Like, if you made an insensitive comment about someone's weight, you'd apologize right? Think of it like that.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

I guess that's genuinely the question here. What's etiquette with this sort of question? If someone is talking to you on a dating site and says they're trans do you/can you ask about their genitals?

Think of it this way, if you were talking to a cis woman on Tinder and setting up a date (without the implication of sex - literally just a date), would you throw in a random question about her vagina?

Unless you are arranging a hook up already, it's probably not appropriate to ask any person you haven't actually met yet about their genitals. Trans people shouldn't be treated any differently. A trans woman is a woman no matter what she has between her legs, and I don't think most women appreciate being asked by strangers about their genitals right off the bat like that.

 

[Vincent Grayson]

I openly admit that I don't understand this stuff - I just can't imagine it - and sometimes I mess up with regards to my approach to transgender people, but I do sympathise and accept, and indeed welcome it, and threads like these bring me closer and closer to fully understanding and being more mindful. Thanks.

At the end of the day, I feel like this mindset is very reasonable. If you don't get it, accept it and ask questions and try not to be a dick.

If people flip their shit on you over honest mistakes, that sucks, but I always find it helpful to imagine how many times people have made those same mistakes when talking to/about them, and of course how often they aren't mistakes, but deliberate harassment.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

It's a hard thing to relate to because while we understand that our society as whole is still learning the ropes on this stuff, trans people have been affected by these misconceptions and misunderstandings for most of their lives.

So if they're running out of patience at this point I can't really blame them, so let's do the best we can to properly educate ourselves and be open-minded and willing to take some criticism for mistakes we make along the way.

But you could still run into someone like the banned user before that had an undeserving hatred of ALL cis-people, so at the very least be prepared to defend yourself from some overzealous corrective attitudes.

I can never fully understand what it means to be trans, but I will always be willing to learn and be corrected on the things that I am not able to experience and understand first-gand.

 

[RDreamer]

I can never fully understand what it means to be trans, but I will always be willing to learn and be corrected on the things that I am not able to experience and understand first-gand.

Same here. That's partially why I'm in here asking/musing on what are probably stupid questions willing to expose any ignorance I might have. That's how I got to where I am now and if I retreat to my own prejudices that doesn't help anyone.

Think of it this way, if you were talking to a cis woman on Tinder and setting up a date (without the implication of sex - literally just a date), would you throw in a random question about her vagina?

Unless you are arranging a hook up already, it's probably not appropriate to ask any person you haven't actually met yet about their genitals. Trans people shouldn't be treated any differently. A trans woman is a woman no matter what she has between her legs, and I don't think most women appreciate being asked by strangers about their genitals right off the bat like that.

Right, which is exactly what I'm saying. You can't ask someone about their genitals. That's fucked up.

A date doesn't mean sex right then, but presumably (most) people are dating so that eventually they would hit that plateau. So if you are completely unattracted to penises what do you do?

Not that I'm ever going to get into this situation since I'm getting married soon, but I personally think I would be pretty fine with dating a post operation trans woman. For me it's simply penises are completely unattractive and ruin un-sexual to me outside of my own. Love is funny though and perhaps that would change given a situation, I suppose. But when people are using things like tinder they tend to narrow things down based on concrete, heartless things. "I'm unattracted to a penis" isn't, to me, much worse than swiping away because you're unattracted to someone's nose. The difference being that you obviously can't see or ask about their genitals until it comes time to do something like that.

 

[Viewt]

Just wanna thank everyone here sharing their stories and opinions. As someone with SUPER limited experience hanging out or meeting trans folks (not by decision, but rather just by coincidence), it's been a great way for me to educate myself. I started volunteering recently at an LGBTQ community center here in Chicago, and since it's a big blind spot for me, any new information I can take in to boost my ability to empathetic and respectful is GREATLY appreciated.

 

[Misha]

From these replies I feel like I'm being made to be a bigot when I genuinely don't feel that way.

I just want to address this statement more generally(as in not just this poster). People don't feel transphobic or bigoted. As long as you're a decent human being you won't act the same way when you realize you're being awful to other people. The issue is so many people are ignorant about it and think from a very shallow perspective without experience. They need other people with the necessary experience to help inform them. It's okay to be wrong so long as you're willing to listen to the people who feel hurt by it and you're willing to change. Being told you're wrong is a learning experience, not a lifelong condemnation.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

In terms of sexual compatibility, would it still make someone transphobic if they didn't want to date a trans woman because they have a penis?

Earlier you said it would, but I'm not sure if I agree with that.

If they said it makes one transphobic, they are being ridiculous. Hypothetically (as I'm already in a long-term relationship) I wouldn't ever date a man without a penis, I find female genitals to be unattractive. To call me transphobic because of that is absurd.

So you're attracted to men and women. You're into both sets of genitals as well. But when they're on someone trans, you suddenly have an issue with it and don't want to be with that person. Again, how is it you can rationalize that as not transphobic/bigoted?

What if they are attracted only to large, muscular men and petite women, and would also dismiss short, skinny men or voluptuous women because that's not their preference, despite being bisexual? You're being ridiculous. It's not transphobic to be attracted to, or unattracted by, certain body types.

 

[driggonny]

I don't believe so, but then I'm a cis dude. I can see why trans people would see it as unfair.

Though I'm also bi, so if I'm honest, I'm really confused on how I'm "supposed" to feel about that. I'm attracted to men and women, and trans men are men, and trans women are women, but I don't believe I'm attracted to women with penises or men with vaginas, and I don't feel that saying "but I totally support you!" somehow gives me a pass on that, I guess. Does that make a bigot? I don't think so, but then, I'm me.

tbh I think that's reasonable. On the other hand, explicitly saying that you won't be with someone because the're trans no matter they're genitals? That seems transphobic, but what do I know? :T

 

[excelsiorlef]

If they said it makes one transphobic, they are being ridiculous. Hypothetically (as I'm already in a long-term relationship) I wouldn't ever date a man without a penis, I find female genitals to be unattractive. To call me transphobic because of that is absurd.


What if they are attracted only to large, muscular men and petite women, and would also dismiss short, skinny men or voluptuous women because that's not their preference, despite being bisexual? You're being ridiculous. It's not transphobic to be attracted to, or unattracted by, certain body types.

I mean Trans body types are just as varied as cis folk...

If you think someone is elsewise attractive but all of a sudden that attraction ends because they're trans that's certainly an issue...

Like pre-op is a different scenario that's understandable, as is not dating a trans person if you're looking to have biological children....

But if you would date based on looks and personality and no current concern of having biological kids up until they say I'm trans/ I had GRS... That's 100% an issue and it's frankly insulting to trans folk to see people arguing in a trans 101 thread that it isn't...

Frankly I find it sadly predictable that a trans thread would descend into cis folk looking for trans folk to tell them they're ok for not finding us attractive...

 

[derder]

I've always been curious about Peer-reviewed, scientific research on the cognitive effects of hormonal therapy for people who identify as transgender. Other than a means to affect clinical depression, what other cognitive effects are measured?

 

[Elandyll]

I don't think I can, to be honest.

And, I mean, I'm attracted to trans women with vaginas and trans men with penises. But that's still transphobic in that I'm putting an addendum on what "allows" me to be attracted to them.



It is an honest mistake. Likewise, it is still transphobic. I don't think it makes you a bad person, but it's still a mistake.

Like, if you made an insensitive comment about someone's weight, you'd apologize right? Think of it like that.

When the situation is known, obviously, you would apologize, but No, I don't see how absence of knowledge leading to a mistaken assumption of gender based on appearance is the same as Transphobia, sorry.

It also somewhat trivalizes actual Transphobia, which is awful.

An honest mistake is just that, an honest mistake imo. Now if the person then insists on using pronouns relative to the person's looks rather than preference, then yes, it absolutely is Transphobia.

 

[Weiss]

I mean Trans body types are just as varied as cis folk...

If you think someone is elsewise attractive but all of a sudden that attraction ends because they're trans that's certainly an issue...

Like pre-op is a different scenario that's understandable, as is not dating a trans person if you're looking to have biological children....

But if you would date based on looks and personality and no current concern of having biological kids up until they say I'm trans/ I had GRS... That's 100% an issue and it's frankly insulting to trans folk to see people arguing in a trans 101 thread that it isn't...

Frankly I find it sadly predictable that a trans thread would descend into cis folk looking for trans folk to tell them they're ok for not finding us attractive...

This is the scenario I was referring to. I wasn't saying anything about being unattracted to trans men and women for being trans.

More importantly though, I'm sorry that I've contributed to causing pain in this thread. I really should have just kept my goddamn mouth shut.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Like pre-op is a different scenario that's understandable

That IS the situation I was talking about. So we all agree, cool.

 

[driggonny]

This is the scenario I was referring to. I wasn't saying anything about being unattracted to trans men and women for being trans.

More importantly though, I'm sorry that I've contributed to causing pain in this thread. I really should have just kept my goddamn mouth shut.

Don't be sorry <3 I think that other poster is what agitated that discussion. Most people seem to think your view is reasonable.

 

[excelsiorlef]

This is the scenario I was referring to. I wasn't saying anything about being unattracted to trans men and women for being trans.

More importantly though, I'm sorry that I've contributed to causing pain in this thread. I really should have just kept my goddamn mouth shut.

It was more a general concern I was raising. This is just an issue hat happens in every thread like this.

Though it'd be interesting to explore your disconnect a bit because trans folk come in so many different body types and shapes and styles, like some trans women can still be on the butchier side and some trans men on the femmier side...

That IS the situation I was talking about. So we all agree, cool.

I read that last part about body types as more general statement than a specific one... but glad we're on the same page.

 

[Ketkat]

That IS the situation I was talking about. So we all agree, cool.

Then why'd you quote me when the issue in what I was talking about, was clearly not genitals?

 

[BrightLightLava]

I have a question that I'm sure doesn't have just one answer.

How do you feel that trans representation in media is going?

Are there things that handle it particularly well? Are there things that handle it particularly poorly?

I feel like most of the trans characters that I've seen on shows (which there aren't a ton of) tend to be ones in transition. Does that get tiring?

Also, I can't think of a single transmale character off the top of me head, but there must be one, right?

 

[Weiss]

I have a question that I'm sure doesn't have just one answer.

How do you feel that trans representation in media is going?

Are there things that handle it particularly well? Are there things that handle it particularly poorly?

I feel like most of the trans characters that I've seen on shows (which there aren't a ton of) tend to be ones in transition. Does that get tiring?

Also, I can't think of a single transmale character off the top of me head, but there must be one, right?

For trans men in stuff I follow there's the Rock Cocks (strongly NSFW), where the band's new roadie is strongly implied if not outright stated to be a trans guy, and Beckett from The Backstagers (basically Lumberjanes for queer men).

 

[excelsiorlef]

I have a question that I'm sure doesn't have just one answer.

How do you feel that trans representation in media is going?

Are there things that handle it particularly well? Are there things that handle it particularly poorly?

I feel like most of the trans characters that I've seen on shows (which there aren't a ton of) tend to be ones in transition. Does that get tiring?

Also, I can't think of a single transmale character off the top of me head, but there must be one, right?

Trans Men representation is dismal

Our bodies are frequently represented by Cis folk which is annoying.

I think even the people giving us representation are still prone to being just alright on some of the issues (Orange is the New Black creator basically said she didn't think trans writers were all that necessary to write trans characters in response to the Transparent creator who said it was and was making an effort to hire more.

The focus you're right is frequently on transition stories which is how they justify the Jared Leto's and the Eddie Redmayne's an the Jeffrey Tambor's and Tom Wilikinson's and the Felicity Huffman's castings.. because hey we gotta show them transforming...

The stories told are generally relatively stereotypical. Like you don't see many stories of trans women who aren't really into being feminine...

 

[BrightLightLava]

For trans men in stuff I follow there's the Rock Cocks (strongly NSFW), where the band's new roadie is strongly implied if not outright stated to be a trans guy, and Beckett from The Backstagers (basically Lumberjanes for queer men).

Jeez, how did I not think of Beckett.

Actually, I know why. I still haven't forgiven him for being mean to my beautiful Sasha.

There's also Koi Boi in Unbeatable Squirrel Girl.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Then why'd you quote me when the issue in what I was talking about, was clearly not genitals?

Huh? The post I quoted was explicitly about that...

Also, I can't think of a single transmale character off the top of me head, but there must be one, right?

There was the minor character of Tony in Orphan Black. He was played by a ciswoman, but the twist is that he's a clone of other characters who are all biologically female (all played by the same actress). Some have said it was a bad character, but I didn't really mind him.

Edit: I don't actually know what trans people thought of the character, whether they thought it was a lame token, or if they appreciated the representation, or whatnot. All I remember is people in the Orphan Black OT going "WTF", which I thought was weird.