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[Zoe]

20 years is way beyond the pale. What a draconian place the south is turning into.

That's a greater travesty than the original "crime" by far.

20 years is the MAX. It's very unlikely she will get anywhere near that, assuming she'll get any jail time at all.

 

[marrec]

20 years is way beyond the pale. What a draconian place the south is turning into.

That's a greater travesty than the original "crime" by far.

You must have not read the part where it explains that 20 years is the maximum jail time for a class 2 felony, not that 20 years is the minimum amount required for any teacher fucking a student.

You're travesty is imagined my friend.

 

[Ghost_Protocol]

This thread is a great reminder of how stupidly liberal the OT has gotten lately.

 

[Oppo]

You must have not read the part where it explains that 20 years is the maximum jail time for a class 2 felony, not that 20 years is the minimum amount required for any teacher fucking a student.

You're travesty is imagined my friend.

you're right, I was hasty. although you can maybe forgive me a little considering the proliferation of mandatory minimums in the US.

jail time.... strikes me as harsh, and I think your point about the "special relationship" of high school teachers is ephemeral, but considering the potential for abuse, and the vulnerability of kids, I can understand the origin of such a law. buti hope they don't just destroy her life. in the end these were two adults, that is the reality. the rest is context.

 

[marrec]

This thread is a great reminder of how stupidly liberal the OT has gotten lately.

I'm confused.

Is the Texas (A decidedly conservative state) law liberal?

Are the people who agree with the Texas law liberal?

Or are you just throwing out an insulting political term with no actual connection to what's being discussed in this thread.

you're right, I was hasty. although you can maybe forgive me a little considering the proliferation of mandatory minimums in the US.

Mandatory minimum sentences should be illegal, they're terrible for our justice system and especially for minorities.

 

[Kong Fisso]

There is an amount of influence in the teacher/student relationship that makes non-coerced sex an impossibility. The Texas state legislature recognizes this.

and so, a student fucking his teacher is being raped.

I imagine I'd take serious issue with that leap of logic if I had been raped.

 

[marrec]

and so, a student fucking his teacher is being raped.

I'd take serious issue with that leap of logic if I had been raped.

Though it seems you haven't been, so there is no serious issue to take.

I'm glad we left the discussion amicably.

 

[NathanMcMahon]

Lol, it's rape now?

What. the. fuck.

It was rape sense Devolution went off half-cocked yesterday spouting that incoherent bullshit.

 

[KHarvey16]

I cannot help but think that if the teacher were a man and the student a woman the opinions in opposition to this law would be softened if not necessarily reversed.

 

[NathanMcMahon]

I cannot help but think that if the teacher were a man and the student a woman the opinions in opposition to this law would be softened if not necessarily reversed.

you'd be wrong.

 

[Kong Fisso]

Though it seems you haven't been, so there is no serious issue to take.

I'm glad we left the discussion amicably.

Yes, great job. We needlessly watered out the definition of "rape" and made a bunch of new people rapists. We also demonized the teacher further with the implication that she physically forced her student to have sex, because you couldn't imagine him wanting to.

 

[marrec]

Yes, great job. We needlessly watered out the definition of "rape" and made a bunch of new people rapists. We also demonized the teacher further with the implication that she physically forced her student to have sex, because you couldn't imagine him wanting to.

You think rape has to involve physical force?

How cute.

Oh wait, that's not cute.

It's dangerously naive.

 

[Kong Fisso]

You think rape has to involve physical force?

How cute.

No, I don't. But calling someone a rapist conjures that connotation. As I said.

Of course, she can mentally force him to rape her.... Wait a minute, we just went over this - yes, I remember. She coerced, or raped him, because you couldn't imagine otherwise. Now that's a great argument.

 

[marrec]

No, I don't. But calling someone a rapist conjures that connotation. As I said.

Of course, she can mentally force him to rape her.... Wait a minute, we just went over this - yes, I remember. She coerced, or raped him, because you couldn't imagine otherwise. Now that's a great argument.

So in your world a teacher has zero influence on a student? If they have sex it's because they're both just super horny and that's the end of it, no deeper significance or consequence comes out of it?

 

[Kong Fisso]

So in your world a teacher has zero influence on a student? If they have sex it's because they're both just super horny and that's the end of it, no deeper significance or consequence comes out of it?

Lol, yes. That must be it. Great analytical skills.

Or how about this: She might have coerced him - or they might have just fucked because they both wanted to. I don't see why you're so eager to call her a rapist, and honestly I find that pretty despicable.

 

[IronFistedChampion]

Obligatory:

That pretty much sums it up.

 

[Gaborn]

Lol, yes. That must be it. Great analytical skills.

Or how about this: She might have coerced him - or they might have just fucked because they both wanted to. I don't see why you're so eager to call her a rapist, and honestly I find that pretty despicable.

marrec isn't actually saying she is a rapist. The crime is statutory rape, meaning that it's rape regardless of whether the parties claim to or believe they are "consenting" as in a normal relationship.

Think of it in terms of a guard and a prisoner. It's possible two people in that position could meet and could fall in love and and could enter a voluntary sexual relationship. It's also very possible such a relationship could have heavy elements of coercion or be a ploy used to gain special favoritism on the other end. That's why that would also be statutory rape in all circumstances.

If the only issue was the max sentence in this case I would understand the issue you have with it, but statutory rape doesn't imply what you seem to think it implies.

 

[Vagabundo]

20 years is the MAX. It's very unlikely she will get anywhere near that, assuming she'll get any jail time at all.

Being labelled a Felon is a life sentence in the US. isn't it?

 

[jorma]

20 years is way beyond the pale. What a draconian place the south is turning into.

That's a greater travesty than the original "crime" by far.

Yeah,
what the student did is not wrong and none of our business
what the teacher did is inappropriate and she wronged her school by engaging in sexual activities with the student body
what the state of Texas is about to do is downright evil.

 

[Zoe]

Being labelled a Felon is a life sentence in the US. isn't it?

Will the label follow her around during her job search for the rest of her life? Yes. And it should seeing as how this all happened due to grossly overstepping the bounds of her job.

 

[Tom_Cody]

Little fucking harsh Id say. I could see her getting fired, but jail time? WTF.

Yeah. Fired yes, jail no.

 

[marrec]

Will the label follow her around during her job search for the rest of her life? Yes. And it should seeing as how this all happened due to grossly overstepping the bounds of her job.

There are consequences to our decisions and sometimes those consequences follow us around for the rest of our lives. I am glad that this woman will not get another job near a student and that the justice system works in cases like this.

 

[dinazimmerman]

I'm not a fan of victimless crimes. Can somebody clearly delineate the best argument out there against teacher-student sex when both are adults and neither claims they were forced or manipulated into it?

 

[Omegasquash]

TEXAS.

I don't agree with Texas law, however it is the law. Personally I think she's not a good person for smanging one of her students. IMO: keep her away from teaching jobs, let her try to pick up the pieces of her life.

 

[Vagabundo]

I'm not a fan of victimless crimes. Can somebody clearly delineate the best argument out there against teacher-student sex when both are adults and neither claims they were forced or manipulated into it?

It's suppose to be satire, but I really wonder sometimes.

 

[NathanMcMahon]

It's suppose to be satire, but I really wonder sometimes.

unfortunately, some sheep think a law is okay simply because it's the law. Thank god for rational individuals who question an get them overturned so everyone can maintain some semblance of their freedom even when those sheep don't seem to care. I await the hyperbole charges with trembling anticipation.

 

[marrec]

unfortunately, some sheep think a law is okay simply because it's the law. Thank god for rational individuals who question an get them overturned so everyone can maintain some semblance of their freedom even when those sheep don't seem to care. I await the hyperbole charges with trembling anticipation.

Yes, thank god we have freedom fighters like you who fight for the right of teachers to fuck their students. Without you they'd be forced to suffer in silence!

 

[NathanMcMahon]

Yes, thank god we have freedom fighters like you who fight for the right of teachers to fuck their students. Without you they'd be forced to suffer in silence!

I know, my time in the Marines definitely qualifies me as a freedom fighter. I appreciate the respect that bestows. I didn't get to tremble in anticipation enough.

 

[BigDug13]

I'm OK with this... doesn't matter that they were both legally adults she was in a position of authority and shouldn't have done it.

So a boss that sleeps with his subordinate should face 20 years in prison as well then. They are in a position of authority.

 

[gatti-man]

You think rape has to involve physical force?

How cute.

Oh wait, that's not cute.

It's dangerously naive.

you are making so many assumptions left and right it's destroying your own argument. a teacher fucking an 18 year old doesn't necessarily mean coercion. what if the teen just wanted some sex like all teenage boys do? You keep acting like 18 year olds are mentally helpless yet they can choose to smoke or have elective surgery or go off to war on their own in this country. I'm stunned by your lack of understanding of the multitude of possibilities here and just blanket calling it all rape. it's insane.

Yes, thank god we have freedom fighters like you who fight for the right of teachers to fuck their students. Without you they'd be forced to suffer in silence!

He is fighting for due process and rationality.

 

[dinazimmerman]

Yes, thank god we have freedom fighters like you who fight for the right of teachers to fuck their students. Without you they'd be forced to suffer in silence!

Well, this teacher is being forced to suffer in a humiliatingly public way -- she's losing her job, going to jail, her name and photo is in the news, and living a normal life after jail will be practically impossible for her. I'm simply wondering if there is a good moral reason to warrant this, given that she hasn't physically harmed anyone or stolen/damaged anyone's property. It doesn't seem like she has violated anyone's rights, either. The student doesn't claim that he was forced or manipulated into having sex.

 

[gatti-man]

marrec isn't actually saying she is a rapist. The crime is statutory rape, meaning that it's rape regardless of whether the parties claim to or believe they are "consenting" as in a normal relationship.

Think of it in terms of a guard and a prisoner. It's possible two people in that position could meet and could fall in love and and could enter a voluntary sexual relationship. It's also very possible such a relationship could have heavy elements of coercion or be a ploy used to gain special favoritism on the other end. That's why that would also be statutory rape in all circumstances.

If the only issue was the max sentence in this case I would understand the issue you have with it, but statutory rape doesn't imply what you seem to think it implies.

but it isn't statutory rape. a prison guard and prisoner is not an apples to apples comparison at all.

 

[NathanMcMahon]

you are making so many assumptions left and right it's destroying your own argument. a teacher fucking an 18 year old doesn't necessarily mean coercion. what if the teen just wanted some sex like all teenage boys do? You keep acting like 18 year olds are mentally helpless yet they can choose to smoke or have elective surgery or go off to war on their own in this country. I'm stunned by your lack of understanding of the multitude of possibilities here and just blanket calling it all rape. it's insane.




He is fighting for due process and rationality.

Thank you. This law isn't rational. Of course, because I don't support it, the members on here who do, automatically lump me in with someone who thinks what the teacher did is right. It says a lot about your judgement when you jump to those conclusions and reveals a deep flaw in your character that is somewhat frightening. You should analyze that about yourself.

 

[The C-Word]

If the law is supposed to pertain to sexual relationships that are an abuse of power then why does this law apply even when there is no direct evidence of that? I don't see why anyone can really be okay with a law that applies to unethical behavior sometimes, and other times to completely ethical situations.

It was rape sense Devolution went off half-cocked yesterday spouting that incoherent bullshit.

lolol

 

[ConfusingJazz]

If the law is supposed to pertain to sexual relationships that are an abuse of power then why does this law apply even when there is no direct evidence of that? I don't see why anyone can really be okay with a law that applies to unethical behavior sometimes, and other times to completely ethical situations.

That's what a trial and sentencing are for.

 

[marrec]

I know, my time in the Marines definitely qualifies me as a freedom fighter. I appreciate the respect that bestows. I didn't get to tremble in anticipation enough.

Oh wow geez... thanks for your amazing service.

Thank you. This law isn't rational. Of course, because I don't support it, the members on here who do, automatically lump me in with someone who thinks what the teacher did is right. It says a lot about your judgement when you jump to those conclusions and reveals a deep flaw in your character that is somewhat frightening. You should analyze that about yourself.

But you're still wrong, the law is completely rational and should help discourage despicable acts being done in the future.

Are you drawing some line between the ages of 17 and 18? Is that why the law is irrational?

 

[FStop7]

unfortunately, some sheep think a law is okay simply because it's the law. Thank god for rational individuals who question an get them overturned so everyone can maintain some semblance of their freedom even when those sheep don't seem to care. I await the hyperbole charges with trembling anticipation.

Well, that's our justice system. The police enforce the law. They've done their job successfully.

Now it enters the court system is where hopefully the law will be appropriately interpreted and applied to this case in a fair and just manner.

In other words, we're a long way off from knowing how this plays out.

 

[gatti-man]

That's what a trial and sentencing are for.

correct but if she's convicted of a felony at all the penalty is far too harsh if it was consensual.

 

[marrec]

correct but if she's convicted of a felony at all the penalty is far too harsh if it was consensual.

The idea, gatti-man, is that it was not consensual. That is way it's against the law and no testimony from the boy will change that. The law accepts that a high-school student cannot have consensual sex with a teacher. So there is no question there, the only question is of the actual sex.

 

[NathanMcMahon]

Oh wow geez... thanks for your amazing service.



But you're still wrong, the law is completely rational and should help discourage despicable acts being done in the future.

Are you drawing some line between the ages of 17 and 18? Is that why the law is irrational?

I'm not wrong with my opinion. Get the fuck over yourself.

 

[VelvetMouth]

I remember what its like to be a teenage boy. Its pretty simple actually. 18 year old men arent boys and they do far more damaging stuff on a regular basis than having consentual sex with a teacher.

Edit: If you consider 18 to be childhood sexual developement i would say you are the one without a clue. Ive worked with teenagers for 8 years now. They can handle themselves.

Pro having sex with teenagers under your control and works with teenagers. Hmmm.

 

[marrec]

I'm not wrong with my opinion. Get the fuck over yourself.

I'm a firm believer that opinions can indeed be wrong.

 

[The C-Word]

That's what a trial and sentencing are for.

So then a trial would conclude that there is no evidence of a forced sexual relationship in any way and she would just lose her job.

The idea, gatti-man, is that it was not consensual. That is way it's against the law and no testimony from the boy will change that. The law accepts that a high-school student cannot have consensual sex with a teacher. So there is no question there, the only question is of the actual sex.

So because a high school student of legal age and a teacher "can't have consensual sex" as a legal matter i guess... that means when it does happen she should be treated as a lesser form of a rapist? She fucked up as a professional, and so should lose her professional status. But aside from that all, that there is evidence of is a consensual sexual relationship. If she only affected things in the classroom and school then why do her consequences have to be so far reaching as to jail time?

 

[SnakeswithLasers]

This thread is a great reminder of how stupidly liberal the OT has gotten lately.

As opposed to people wanting a government that doesn't deprive its citizens of liberty by putting new statutes and laws on the books that seek to legislate and legalize all actions?

 

[VelvetMouth]

As opposed to people wanting a government that doesn't deprive its citizens of liberty by putting new statutes and laws on the books that seek to legislate and legalize all actions?

Today they take away an adult in an authority positions right to fuck kids under their control, tomorrow they take away our rights to legally assemble and our guns. I hope the ACLU jumps on this one.

 

[cutmeamango]

Straight from the crib, what a power predator this teacher is.
Meanwhile in Brazil, teen soap opera depicts 50yr old with an 18yr old girl as a love couple.

 

[TheOohChild]

There is an amount of influence in the teacher/student relationship that makes non-coerced sex an impossibility. The Texas state legislature recognizes this.

It is possible that he felt pressure to have a relationship with the lady, but it is also possible that he was just an 18 year old dude trying to get some pussy.

 

[essyouemeight]

fire her. jail-time is stupid

 

[Nevasleep]

It is possible that he felt pressure to have a relationship with the lady, but it is also possible that he was just an 18 year old dude trying to get some pussy.

So as it could be either way, the law errs on the side of caution.

 

[Oppo]

I'd like to know how the court would read this if each person involved was +5 years older, but otherwise the same (former student, practicing teacher).