Nah, the original interpretation was more accurate.
TYFC indiegogo campaign supposedly hacked
- Thread starter blitzcloud
- Start date
Nah, the original interpretation was more accurate.
I don't see the resemblance. Maybe if I had a side by side comparison but off the top of my head, she doesn't look like an anime version of anyone.
KuroPyonyo
Banned
Who is dodger?
I see her as a redhead version of the watamote protag.
And she is quite likeable.
Dodger is a Youtuber, co-hosts a podcast with TB and works for Polaris, a Youtube gaming channel. You can google her to find tons of photos but here's one as an example:
I've no idea who they based Vivian on, if they based it on her it wouldn't surprise me at all though.
KuroPyonyo
Banned
Ah, thank you very much (all I saw on google images was baseball), I don't really watch gaming content on youtube so i have no idea.
Well whatever it is based on, I like it.
People are attacking Zoe again saying she was behind the TYFC hack, they have no evidences and it doesn't make any sense.
It's ridicolous and, as a gamer, I feel ashamed by that but I also feel offended by these tweets:
https://twitter.com/TheQuinnspiracy/status/503640990670798848
Those people doesn't represent gamers, we don't even know who they are.
I am also concerned about ethics in game journalism and this is not an issue which could be dismissed lika that: comparing critics to crackers/terrorists
Also I don't understand why she isn't supporting the TYFC. Same for Anita as far as I know.
It's ridicolous and, as a gamer, I feel ashamed by that but I also feel offended by these tweets:
https://twitter.com/TheQuinnspiracy/status/503640990670798848
Those people doesn't represent gamers, we don't even know who they are.
I am also concerned about ethics in game journalism and this is not an issue which could be dismissed lika that: comparing critics to crackers/terrorists
Also I don't understand why she isn't supporting the TYFC. Same for Anita as far as I know.
The whole reason TFYC gained popularity was because people discovered Zoe had opposed TFYC back when it started. The point of the project was to get a woman to give an idea for a videogame to promote women in game development; they'd develop the game with that idea in mind, she would get 8% of the profits and the other 92% would be donated to charity. Zoe didn't accept the idea that the woman got such a small part of the profits and opposed them (proof here and here).
That alone explains why she isn't supporting TFYC. Now, this next thing hasn't been proven and is a mere allegation, but they accuse Zoe of doxxing them and ruining their production (their explanation here). Her game jam did, in fact, get quite a bit of coverage afterwards despite having no real information detailed even now.
PairOfFilthySocks
Member
People are attacking Zoe again saying she was behind the TYFC hack, they have no evidences and it doesn't make any sense.
It's ridicolous and, as a gamer, I feel ashamed by that but I also feel offended by these tweets:
https://twitter.com/TheQuinnspiracy/status/503640990670798848
Those people doesn't represent gamers, we don't even know who they are.
I am also concerned about ethics in game journalism and this is not an issue which could be dismissed lika that: comparing critics to crackers/terrorists
Also I don't understand why she isn't supporting the TYFC. Same for Anita as far as I know.
The most important thing for these folks is that they have a nice and clearly defined target to channel the anger of their supporters. Flippant acceptance of the idea that /v/ as a community(which is a pretty reaching concept in and of itself) is behind a bomb threat just serves to push their narrative that an entire group of people who play games are scum.
Sarkeesian's outrage at TFYC accepting the /v/ donations is a prime example. Acknowledging that /v/ isn't 100% filled with women haters doesn't suit her, since she needs a target for her fans to rally against.
This whole situation has expanded remarkably. The whole origin of this all(the concentration on Zoe Quinn's personal life instead of the cushy relationships of the steadily more apparent clique-iness of the indie/media scene) was a prime example of rotten attitudes from certain people who play games(I don't consider a concept of an all-encompassing "gaming community" to be a thing since it's a stupid concept) bubbling to the surface. However, the shit-flinging that has ensued is absolutely coming from both "sides" of this internet clusterfuck.
I happen to be watching one of her videos and just made that connection. She's the only Youtube personality that I actually watch.
Because....Zoe went to say that TFYC is Misogynistic and transphobic. one of her tweets about it even though the maker has stated again and again why it isn't.
This doesn't make any sense.
The game is being developed by women and the contest is made for women who aren't game developers.
I wouldn't be ethic to give the money to the woman who won the contest without any guarantee it will be spent in charity because the girls who developed the game would have worked almost for free.
Also the money is going to charity c'mon.
spindoctor
Member
I'm inclined to believe this too. Speaking out against an event for charity and castigating the organizers for accepting donations from '4chan misogynists' as if it's one singular entity... yea, there are no good 'sides' in this shitstorm.
skullmuffins
Banned
Re: the doxxing incident, he posted this explanation on reddit:
The comment was deleted from the thread so I can't link it directly but it's still in his comment history.
Basically, someone else tweeted a screenshot of things he wrote on his public facebook page and he considered that a dox since his name wasn't on any tfyc webpage and he's pinning it on zoe because reasons.
It started months ago so it cannot be a cashgrab born from the recent events.
btw
You can find on the internet an image containing the tweets from 6 months ago where Zoe attacked them with no respects and insults.
No sure if they are legit so I won't post them but I suggest you to give them a look.
I find weird that the campagin has not resumed yet.
benicillin
Banned
I don't think it's a cashgrab, but I do think it's kind of underhanded and manipulative for them to sort of latch onto all of this drama to get more exposure for whatever it is that they are doing. All of these videos, testimonials against Quinn, etc. It seems like they have made a lot of claims, some of which hold weight but a lot of which appear to be unsubstantiated.
I'd be wary of anyone who wants to raise money off the back of this, honestly.
RicoTheMad
Banned
A lot of the people behind all this drama have Patreons and are making a ton of money from it. Have a look at their Patreon pages. I tend to believe that people wouldn't be so angry about all of this if some of these people weren't profiting from the beliefs they claim to hold. I often wondered how some of these people made money without making games/products that sell so perhaps you also didn't know.
The charity this thread is about is at least not about making money for themselves. I'd say its far worthier a cause than supporting someone to angrily shout from an internet soapbox.
This whole thing is pretty sickening to me honestly. It's been a long time coming though, there's a huge amount of nepotism in the industry visible even from my very limited vantage point. I'm kind of glad to see at least some people want to see it rooted out. It's sad that these same people often get piled into the "ZOMG SHE/HE HAD SEX ETC" bandwagon of people. I blame this mostly on the people who want to make this into a black and white situation where somehow either party is beyond reproach.
It's fairly telling how some of the "pro justice" self titled folks flip flop when a popular internet woman isn't spearheading a social justice cause. There's nothing to really hate about this charity yet all the popular pro women advocates are dissing it for frivolous reasons, at least from what I currently know. Could it be they are against it because "it's not their cause"? Why aren't they flocking to it, or at least in passing, mentioning that it's a worthy cause?
I'm a big proponent of all humans being equal. Why are people hating on this campaign? Why do you doubt, because the supposed icons of women in gaming don't support it? Shouldn't you be using your own mind and moral compass to judge the worthiness of such a cause? Why are so many people blindly following people who are very clearly benefiting from their online personas?
You be a good person without following an online leader. Don't follow in other's footsteps, go and blaze your own trails.
And while I don't frequent or even go to 4chan, I see no reason why them contributing to anything directly means its a bad cause. What, does the website you go to determine your moral character? What is NeoGAF's character then, as an online community? Are we all supposed to have the same thoughts and opinions? When do I get my brainwashing kit in the mail?
I guess I need to be a full member before they send it.
I don't care much about the sex scandal. Sex happens, it's not my problem. What I do have a problem with is the fact that Quinn has journalists giving her money over patreon, that some bigger indie devs and journalists are circling the wagons together and that TFYC's project and story is being totally swept under the rug.
ab.aeterno
Member
Sure it can. How many people now know about and have contributed to TFYC since this while shit show started? It seems crazy that people can believe that people fake being hacked or doxxed for sympathy but not that a group could capitalize on an angry mob to get attention and money. Can't say if that's the case or not.
Not all gamers, eh?
The obvious nepitosm and double standards in gaming journalism as well:
Kotaku's Petricia Hernandez:
http://imgur.com/j5iTlJ9,aIOMYrU#0
RPS' John Walker:
(sadly I don't have a "cleaner" picture):
http://imgur.com/j5iTlJ9,aIOMYrU#1
And everyone who dares to point this out are obviously wearing tin foil hats and deserve to be ridiculed for their insane conspiracy theories that are all pulled straight from our brand new definition of "nowhere" that now includes Twitter and other places.
Flame Lord
Member
I'm pretty sure it wasn't based on anyone in particular.
ActuallyHulk
Banned
On the topic of one if your statements I do find it very strange that Anita has said nothing about this despite people asking her for even just a retweet to show it's existence. You'd think that with who she is and what she does she'd be on board with a campaign to get women into game creation. Literally all she has to do is click the retweet button. I don't know, I'm feeling more and more skeptical about this whole thing every day. Also it's a train wreck that I can't stop looking at.
Another example:
Ben Kuchera gives money for ZQ to develop games, and follows it with favorable articles:
http://imgur.com/kzUgh6l
Ben Kuchera gives money for ZQ to develop games, and follows it with favorable articles:
http://imgur.com/kzUgh6l
What part of Polygon's code of conduct does that violate, exactly? Patreon isn't an investment, it's patronage. By contributing to Zoe Quinn's projects, Ben Kuchera doesn't stand anything to gain other than the successful development of something he's interested in. There is no equity involved in that transaction.
Should writers for other sites not be allowed to back projects on Kickstarter if they cover them? Because that's what you're essentially saying here.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
How is someone accused of rape considered "private life" or compared at all to having an affair?
Can't believe you guys are buying so retarded arguments....
How is it not comparable?
It has nothing to do with the game he developed (which afaik isn't a video game as well), and everything to do with his personal life, things which have no impact on the people who buy his games.
Not to mention, that he was accused, and the accusation was later dropped.
You may say that people wouldn't like to give money to someone who allegedly raped, because they don't condone the act of raping (obviously).
But I can say just the same about ZQ's private life, that I don't want to give money to someone who (allegedly) cheated on her boyfriend, and thus I would like to know if she did so.
You may say that the accusations are of differenet magnitue (a rape is obviously worse) but imo, it shows that private lives can be openly discussed by the game media if it fits their point of view, and censored when it doesn't.
Yeah, that's exactly what I say, once you give someone money you don't want to see that money wasted, you would like to see the person who you financed succeed, you are emotionally invested in their success.
Even if he stands nothing to gain from this financially, it can further enhance his connection with other indie developers, give him good pulication and other favors.
So it is wrong imo, or he should at least mention that he backs her financially in his articles.
Cheating on someone is betraying their trust. It might be grounds for a civil suit depending on the circumstances.
Rape is a heinous violent felony. You can be convicted and go to jail for it.
Private life vs. public safety
I don't think there's was anything nefarious going on with coverage for her game jam, though. Zoe was a participant of a high profile game jam reality show failure, and coverage of her own subsequently announced game jam was just a byproduct of that coverage.
Dang, is there an organization thats supposed to handle these kind of cases or is it completely up to the gaming website to handle it?
Zuhzuhzombie!!
Member
Wasn't this the charity that a handful of Tumblr blogs were accusing of appropriating female labor?
ed
Yes, this seems to be the case.
ed
Yes, this seems to be the case.
According to her own definition, cheating on someone is rape. Anyway, I think the cheating is the least important part of this whole thing.
cm osi
Member
because having a girl saying to you that you raped her 5 years ago without any kind of proof it's kinda different that being really accused of rape. before you run an article be sure to have some material
If it's about public safety, leave it to mainstream media, since it has nothing to do with the game itself.
Also - If she has sex with a lot of men, without getting tested and without telling her bf, he can contact STDs from her, and same for other guys that maybe would like to date her.
Not to mention that if she contacts HIV, she can be dangerous to other people, by giving blood donations, or just by having sex with other guys.
So again - public safety.
Fantastapotamus
Wrong about commas, wrong about everything
It was Phil Fish all along
All right then. Please tell us how often you had sex in your life, list your sex partners and post some pictures of you and your partner/s so we can all be save. When was the last time you got tested? Please post the results here, just to be sure. Any other ailments we should know about?
All right then. Please tell us how often you had sex in your life, list your sex partners and post some pictures of you and your partner/s so we can all be save. When was the last time you got tested? Please post the results here, just to be sure. Any other ailments we should know about?
Steve Youngblood
Member
Firstly, I think there's an argument to be made that it wasn't great reporting to fixate on a rape allegation in the case of Max Temkin, but I'm not sure what that has to do with this thread. Secondly -- not just because this isn't a thread about Zoe Quinn (but that is a factor here) -- I'm really not interested in entertaining the notion that Zoe Quinn's sexual promiscuity presents a relevant topic of conversation as it pertains to general public health and safety. Again, not saying that it was responsible journalism to report on an allegation of rape, but that represents a felony crime. Maybe we shouldn't be as concerned about other people's criminal trespasses, but we are. The fact that John Q. Nobody ran a stop sign and was issued a traffic citation in a small suburban town will get published in the local paper's police blotter section. That John Q. Nobody slept with his girlfriend's best friend while his girlfriend was out of town will not.
But more importantly, let's not argue about this because it's stupid and pointless.
n00bsauce87
Member
*ELI5 Time*
If this project is so misogynistic, why are there women in the gaming industry (the ones on the indie gogo page) willing to risk their damage themselves in associating with them?
I'm of the notion that all money spends the same and the second members of /v/ (good or bad) or whoever else decides the donate their money to this project, they recognize that they money is going to be spend for this project and not for their personal beliefs, even if they so happen to be the exact opposite of the goals of TFYC. Seeing stuff like they shouldn't accept any money from members of /v/ because of what some feelings towards women in gaming isn't good at all.
I figure that if the usual suspects of online gaming journalism doesn't want to run the story, then keep finding other outlets. It's the fault of whoever is responsible for media and PR. Coming from someone who had to do a final essay on non-profits in online media (yeah I'm no expert, but it was graduate level research), I find the lack of trying with most of these organizations and crowd-funded projects troubling.
tl;dr - Women support it TFYC, so why the claim they are women haters? Money spends the same way, even if you don't want it for a certain cause, if you donate, how its spent is in the organization's hands now. And too many ways to get TFYC indie gogo to the public. Because Kotaku and the famous others wouldn't run it is a bad excuse. This should have gotten bigger than it has and other people/organizations would have more than likely talked about the indie gogo project.
If this project is so misogynistic, why are there women in the gaming industry (the ones on the indie gogo page) willing to risk their damage themselves in associating with them?
I'm of the notion that all money spends the same and the second members of /v/ (good or bad) or whoever else decides the donate their money to this project, they recognize that they money is going to be spend for this project and not for their personal beliefs, even if they so happen to be the exact opposite of the goals of TFYC. Seeing stuff like they shouldn't accept any money from members of /v/ because of what some feelings towards women in gaming isn't good at all.
I figure that if the usual suspects of online gaming journalism doesn't want to run the story, then keep finding other outlets. It's the fault of whoever is responsible for media and PR. Coming from someone who had to do a final essay on non-profits in online media (yeah I'm no expert, but it was graduate level research), I find the lack of trying with most of these organizations and crowd-funded projects troubling.
tl;dr - Women support it TFYC, so why the claim they are women haters? Money spends the same way, even if you don't want it for a certain cause, if you donate, how its spent is in the organization's hands now. And too many ways to get TFYC indie gogo to the public. Because Kotaku and the famous others wouldn't run it is a bad excuse. This should have gotten bigger than it has and other people/organizations would have more than likely talked about the indie gogo project.
All that i'm saying, is that sometimes, details of someone's private life are okay to discuss, while another times they are not, and I think that it shows a bias in the mainstream media, which is also manifested in the fact that no one talks about this indiegogo, and the subsequent hack.
This is a far better example in my opinion, compared to max temkin's one:
http://kotaku.com/she-was-harassed-by-a-games-reporter-now-shes-speakin-1510714971
The conversation:
http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/19d66708hxa9zpng/original.png
The article itself talks about things that actually matter, such as the treatment of women in gaming, but it uses someone else's private life to do so, while obviously using their name for it.
My last post didn't exist in a vaccum, read the ones before it, I didn't say that sex life isn't private, but I said that allegations of rape are also private, and thus shouldn't be discussed (especially before any type of inquiry) at game journalism sites.
And if you still think rape shouldn't be private life, just read the other article i've just written about.
Relevant since it applies to all of this. even shows her dissing the whole thing. even going to far as to say "Woops we DDOSD it accidentally". This is why they won't touch anything involving Zoe atm including what's happened to TFYC.
RicoTheMad
Banned
It bears mentioning that Patreon is vastly different from KS. Patreon is a *monthly* contribution. It's like paying someone to do "X" every month. Kickstarter is a one-time contribution to a single project you're interested in, and only *if* it meets the goal.
No comment as to whether that's ok or not in this context. I personally feel "yuck" about Patreon and dislike the idea of it. It's giving people carte blanche to get a paycheck for work that isn't guaranteed to be interesting or good. I know there's a historical basis for Patronage, but ... funnily enough, Patronage back in the day meant that person did your bidding and worked on what you wanted them to, not what they wanted to work on.
I dislike the concept in general though. It feels used car salesman-y in some way to me personally.
Zuhzuhzombie!!
Member
The only relevant thing I think in this case, as far as GAF and general human behavior goes, is that GAF may (or may not) have not clamped down on threads about a male developer/"journalists" supposed infidelities at one point and allowed open discussion.
I bring this up because I don't recall where I picked this information up and if anyone could clarify that would be appreciated.
Ugh...she was a lot more aggressive with them than she let on and misrepresented what they were doing. I can see why they're bitter about it.
PsychoSoldier
Banned
They're back up, apparently. Gonna make a statement in a bit.
I have a feeling that the people who did this just used Zoe's name because they have some history with her and in an attempt to stir up shit again.
I have a feeling that the people who did this just used Zoe's name because they have some history with her and in an attempt to stir up shit again.
PairOfFilthySocks
Member
Don't quote me on this, but I would assume it's up to the website. In any case, I think it's safe to say that certain reputations are taking a nosedive despite the possibility of punishment - regardless of anyone's specific opinion on Zoe Quinn and the journalists involved in these cases, I really don't think they're going to come out of this looking like winners.
Well, now it starts to make sense. Who will be the first to report this and not get sued for libel and fired from their place of work?
blitzcloud
Banned
damn the video made me laugh (doctor mario song makes everything funny for me)
i'm sorry about the internet harassing that goes beyond the point of the matter, but I really, really don't like zoe quinn attitude, based on verything I read on the logs, her twitter and more stuff.
Infernal Monkey
Member
Ugh, gross.