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[bsp]

Pipe hitters doing work. Majority of those killed were via air strikes in Syria.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...isis-operatives-linked-to-europe-attacks.html

Delta Force and Navy SEALs have crippled the group’s ability to recruit foreign fighters and put pressure on the network responsible for striking Europe and Africa.
As the self-proclaimed Islamic State trumpets its global terrorist campaign, U.S. special operations forces have quietly killed more than three dozen key ISIS operatives blamed for plotting deadly attacks in Europe and beyond.
Defense officials tell The Daily Beast that U.S. special operators have killed 40 “external operations leaders, planners, and facilitators” blamed for instigating, plotting, or funding ISIS’s attacks from Brussels and Paris to Egypt and Africa.
That’s less than half the overall number of ISIS targets that special operators have taken off the battlefield, one official explained, including top leaders like purported ISIS second-in-command Haji Imam, killed in March.
The previously unpublished number provides a rare glimpse into the U.S. counterterrorist mission that is woven into overall coalition efforts to defeat ISIS, and which is credited with crippling ISIS efforts to recruit foreign fighters and carry out more plots like the deadly assault on Paris that killed 130 last fall.

As proof of the campaign’s overall success, Pentagon officials this week said the overall size of ISIS from a high estimate of 33,000 a year ago to between 19,000 to 25,000 fighters, and that the influx of foreign fighters into Iraq and Syria had dropped from up to 2,000 a month last year to just 200. Secretary of Defense Ash Carter was more cautious about that figure in testimony Thursday morning, saying it is “hard to be accurate” estimating foreign fighter flow, but that the numbers generally are falling. That’s set against the warning by Director of National Intelligence Jim Clapper this week that ISIS cells are likely already in place across Europe.

Statistic on civilian deaths:

It’s not clear how many civilians may have been caught in the special operations-related strikes. The U.S. has admitted to accidentally killing 41 civilians in the 20 months since coalition strikes began.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

The US is really good at Whac-a-Mole

 

[Any Questions]

Cheers lads. Less nutters prepared to strap or brainwash folks to wear bombs/ shoot folks the better.

 

[davepoobond]

The US is really good at Whac-a-Mole

At least this time we got enough tickets for a prize.

 

[jchap]

Awesome!

 

[Soyongdori]

DEVGRU, aka CIA attack dogs are really good at going for their prey's jugular compared to any other countries.

 

[Vilix]

Cheers! Hope they get them all.

 

[BlackGoku03]

Hope they find further success with fewer civilian casualties.

 

[JinjoUnchained]

The families of the civilians killed will replace the terrorists killed. That's how we get terrorists in the first place. That's why I believe the only way to stop the cycle is to end involvement in the Middle East altogether.

 

[bsp]

The families of the civilians killed will replace the terrorists killed. That's how we get terrorists in the first place. That's why I believe the only way to stop the cycle is to end involvement in the Middle East altogether.

This isn't an entirely true narrative. At some point their infrastructure collapses and their efforts must greatly diminish or waste away altogether. As was in my OP, foreign fighters leaving to join ISIS has dropped by 90% over the past year according to the Pentagon.

 

[Kin5290]

The families of the civilians killed will replace the terrorists killed. That's how we get terrorists in the first place. That's why I believe the only way to stop the cycle is to end involvement in the Middle East altogether.

I'm guessing that the families of the over 2000 civilians killed in Russian airstrikes, as well as the countless civilians killed by the Syrian government, would be just as susceptible to radicalization.

 

[davepoobond]

The families of the civilians killed will replace the terrorists killed. That's how we get terrorists in the first place. That's why I believe the only way to stop the cycle is to end involvement in the Middle East altogether.

It isn't that simple. Also where are all the bombing runs in Europe that are turning people in those countries radical?

 

[commedieu]

Cheers! Hope they get them all.

Bombs will surely rid the world of terrorism.

 

[Famassu]

The US is really good at Whac-a-Mole

They're really not. Unless you think who-knows-how-many (hundreds? thousands?) innocent civilians being killed in all of the drone & other strikes vs. a few dozen actual terrorists being killed here and there is good.

 

[JinjoUnchained]

This isn't an entirely true narrative. At some point their infrastructure collapses and their efforts must greatly diminish or waste away altogether. As was in my OP, foreign fighters leaving to join ISIS has dropped by 90% over the past year according to the Pentagon.

We're still waiting for that to happen with Al Qaeda, 15-20 years later. I mean, if we take out ISIS leadership, the next terrorists might rebrand or something, but they'll still view our efforts to take them out as a "crusade" that must be avenged. They won't care that the coalition was responding to being attacked, they'll only care about who blew up their children, not why.

It's really on the people in these regions to change their own culture. Not saying that France and Belgium don't have a right to retaliate to an act of war, but we shouldn't get all excited over news like this. There's too much evidence that these counter terrorist measures are really only glorified Whack-A-Mole.

 

[Randomizer]

Well done guys an almost 50/50 ratio of civilians/terrorists! Maybe one magical day you'll actually manage to kill more terrorists than civilians.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

They're really not. Unless you think who-knows-how-many (hundreds? thousands?) innocent civilians being killed in all of the drone & other strikes vs. a few dozen actual terrorists being killed here and there is good.

whack-a-mole
ˈwakəˌmōl/
nounNORTH AMERICAN
-an arcade game in which players use a mallet to hit toy moles, which appear at random, back into their holes.

​

"next time you are near a kiddie amusement park, go in and play a round of whack-a-mole"
-used with reference to a situation in which attempts to solve a problem are piecemeal or superficial, resulting only in temporary or minor improvement.
"the site's security team has an ongoing battle against spammers, but it's a game of whack-a-mole"

.

 

[bsp]

Well done guys an almost 50/50 ratio of civilians/terrorists! Maybe one magical day you'll actually manage to kill more terrorists than civilians.

I think you misunderstood the civilian casualty report. The article is mainly about the 40 key ISIS members U.S. special operations units have killed very recently, but the civilian death statistic was about our entire bombing campaign against ISIS for the last 20 months. The U.S. government puts the total ISIS KIA due to American/Western bombs at ~26,000.

To repeat, the ~41 civilian deaths were not just from these selective kill/capture missions.

 

[Kenshin001]

Well done guys an almost 50/50 ratio of civilians/terrorists! Maybe one magical day you'll actually manage to kill more terrorists than civilians.

It's not a 50/50 ratio. You are getting confused with key leaders and terrorists. US strikes have killed thousands of IS foot soldiers.

 

[thefro]

We're still waiting for that to happen with Al Qaeda, 15-20 years later. I mean, if we take out ISIS leadership, the next terrorists might rebrand or something, but they'll still view our efforts to take them out as a "crusade" that must be avenged. They won't care that the coalition was responding to being attacked, they'll only care about who blew up their children, not why.

They actually control territory in Iraq/Syria, so it's quite a different situation than with Al Qaeda.

 

[Hexa]

Probably not the best macro strategy, but at a micro level nice work Delta and SEALS. Doing a good job as usual.

 

[Sub_Level]

Fantastic news.

 

[Marz]

Well done guys an almost 50/50 ratio of civilians/terrorists! Maybe one magical day you'll actually manage to kill more terrorists than civilians.

Got reading comprehension problems?

 

[Speevy]

Effective or not, any ISIS deaths are good news. Kill them all.

 

[Monocle]

 

[JinjoUnchained]

They actually control territory in Iraq/Syria, so it's quite a different situation than with Al Qaeda.

Al Qaeda got smaller and scattered about after we took out the Taliban, removing their state sponsor. But despite capturing or killing most of their central leadership, they carried on with new recruits and leadership with no problem. They're mostly back to their pre 911 plan of destabilizing Africa and the Middle East, but they still threaten us too, as seen in the Charlie Hebdo shootings.

So I'm not sure what your point is. We spent billions and lost countless innocent lives to take out Al Qaeda and they still exist because of extremist ideology. New faces simply took up the old cause when we took out the old leaders. Taking out their leaders doesn't destroy that ideology, that has to come from their countrymen.

Unless you're suggesting that ISIS will magically disappear if they don't control any land and lose their caliphate. AKA the neoconservative argument for boots on the ground and or carpet bombing. That's rich, sure they'll go away, right.

 

[Piggus]

Effective or not, any ISIS deaths are good news. Kill them all.

But they're fathers trying to feed their children!

They're really not. Unless you think who-knows-how-many (hundreds? thousands?) innocent civilians being killed in all of the drone & other strikes vs. a few dozen actual terrorists being killed here and there is good.

That's right, we've killed "thousands" of civilians but only "a few dozen" actual terrorists. Totally.

 

[Netherscourge]

Good.

 

[Chairman Yang]

Al Qaeda got smaller and scattered about after we took out the Taliban, removing their state sponsor. But despite capturing or killing most of their central leadership, they carried on with new recruits and leadership with no problem. They're mostly back to their pre 911 plan of destabilizing Africa and the Middle East, but they still threaten us too, as seen in the Charlie Hebdo shootings.

So I'm not sure what your point is. We spent billions and lost countless innocent lives to take out Al Qaeda and they still exist because of extremist ideology. New faces simply took up the old cause when we took out the old leaders. Taking out their leaders doesn't destroy that ideology, that has to come from their countrymen.

Unless you're suggesting that ISIS will magically disappear if they don't control any land and lose their caliphate. AKA the neoconservative argument for boots on the ground and or carpet bombing. That's rich, sure they'll go away, right.

How do you propose to challenge a state's extremist ideology without using force? The problem is that ISIS territory isn't a free market of ideas. It's not a case of ideologies competing with each other and radical Islam just being more compelling than the rest; it's one ideology crushing all other competition by force, not force of ideas. ISIS controls the media, public assembly, and education. How exactly is a non-radical ideology going to take hold in that environment? To me, it seems as unlikely as democracy springing up in Nazi Germany, or capitalism gradually taking hold in Stalin's USSR.

Challenging ideology is absolutely essential. But it's an accompaniment to military force, not something that can be effective alone. Saying otherwise is like saying that Hitler should've been stopped with peace demonstrations and bombarding Germany with leaflets (which a GAFfer actually proposed in another thread).

 

[Elfforkusu]

But they're fathers trying to feed their children!



That's right, we've killed "thousands" of civilians but only "a few dozen" actual terrorists. Totally.

I guess you haven't read the Intercept's report on the drone papers?

It's fine to be patriotic, and I'm not sad to see us take out ISIS operatives. But considering how we cook the books, it's hard for me to get patriotic over propaganda.

 

[kame-sennin]

This isn't an entirely true narrative. At some point their infrastructure collapses and their efforts must greatly diminish or waste away altogether. As was in my OP, foreign fighters leaving to join ISIS has dropped by 90% over the past year according to the Pentagon.

This is exactly what General Westmorland said before the Tet Offensive.

 

[MisterFalcon]

I guess you haven't read the Intercept's report on the drone papers?

According to those papers there are very few civilian casualties.

 

[TacticalHotdog]

Anyone see the video VICE published that was taken from the GoPro of a dead ISIS fighter? It's interesting because it portrays a side that they don't show in their propaganda that kind of humanizes them in a way through the repeated mistakes and fuck-ups they make in it. It shows that they're not some unyielding beheading machine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aM3ElTvF52I
There's no gore or anything in it. It mainly shows a failed attack against a Peshmerga position that happened back in December 2015
http://spioenkop.blogspot.com.br/2016/04/the-islamic-state-going-diy-inside-diy.html
This is a pretty detailed analysis of the events of the video as seen from both sides

 

[bsp]

This is exactly what General Westmorland said before the Tet Offensive.

One incident of it being wrong does not necessitate it is always wrong. Any war ends when one side has had enough. In Vietnam we evaluated that the cost was no longer worth the goal. Killing terrorist cells will not end all forms of terrorism, but are we otherwise just going to sit and let ISIS capture more land and become a more defined and entrenched state? The answer to ending people who do bad things isn't something we have to offer right now, so we will continue to whack the moles as they come up while continuing to improve our precision. We (along with those we fight side by side with) are winning the offensive against this incarnation, ISIS.

 

[Game-Biz]

Excellent.

 

[LeonSPBR]

Great job Delta and SEALs. Keep the good job.

 

[AmyS]

Awesome!

Yep.

Disturbed - Indestructible (American military tribute)

https://youtu.be/xcsG3wm6uZ0

 

[Burt]

http://spioenkop.blogspot.com.br/2016/04/the-islamic-state-going-diy-inside-diy.html
This is a pretty detailed analysis of the events of the video as seen from both sides

Cheers to that guy for being able to do a write-up on the three stooges without ever breaking his objective, analytical tone.

You could tell he wanted to though.

 

[GhostWriter24]

You may be unknown, but the world is counting on you guys. Much respect.

 

[TacticalHotdog]

Cheers to that guy for being able to do a write-up on the three stooges without ever breaking his objective, analytical tone.

You could tell he wanted to though.

Their inept bumbling around reminded me of the movie Four Lions. People are already starting to meme the fuck out of Abu Hajaar

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roROL5KdXlw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jPTrS-7d14

 

[Igo]

41 Civilian deaths? Huh? 42 were killed in one strike alone on that Doctors Without Borders hospital.

 

[MisterFalcon]

Cheers to that guy for being able to do a write-up on the three stooges without ever breaking his objective, analytical tone.
You could tell he wanted to though.

Their weapons and vehicles they used were totally unsuited to attack a fortified position over open terrain defended by Western supplied anti tank missiles. Against anyone lacking such weapons The Three Abus and their armored contraption would be very effective. As noted by Oryx the design of the vehicle is well done, they have plenty of ammo and supplies and with their uniforms and vehicle serial numbers there are many signs of an organized regular army. So dismiss ISIS as a bunch of harmless jokers from this would be like saying the entire US army is useless from that Humvee drop video.

 

[Randomizer]

I think you misunderstood the civilian casualty report. The article is mainly about the 40 key ISIS members U.S. special operations units have killed very recently, but the civilian death statistic was about our entire bombing campaign against ISIS for the last 20 months. The U.S. government puts the total ISIS KIA due to American/Western bombs at ~26,000.

To repeat, the ~41 civilian deaths were not just from these selective kill/capture missions.

Oh I see, yes I definitely misunderstood sorry guys. Although I am still against these strikes and western involvement in the region.

 

[rocketskates]

Their inept bumbling around reminded me of the movie Four Lions. People are already starting to meme the fuck out of Abu Hajaar

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roROL5KdXlw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jPTrS-7d14

Hahaha holy shit

 

[Gemüsepizza]

41 Civilian deaths? Huh? 42 were killed in one strike alone on that Doctors Without Borders hospital.

That's just the number of victims the US government can't deny. The real number is likely much, much higher. Especially if you are considering the tricks the US government usually applies when counting victims, like declaring all males over 15 in a strike zone as enemy combatants. People must be very naive if they think all US attacks in Syria have only resulted in the death of 41 civilians, and that the US government has any interest in investigating or reporting the actual number of victims. But looking at the cheering here, people are happily buying into the propaganda anyway. Pretty sad.

 

[bsp]

That's just the number of victims the US government can't deny. The real number is likely much, much higher. Especially if you are considering the tricks the US government usually applies when counting victims, like declaring all males over 15 in a strike zone as enemy combatants. People must be very naive if they think all US attacks in Syria have only resulted in the death of 41 civilians, and that the US government has any interest in investigating or reporting the actual number of victims. But looking at the cheering here, people are happily buying into the propaganda anyway. Pretty sad.

41 Civilian deaths? Huh? 42 were killed in one strike alone on that Doctors Without Borders hospital.

The MSF fuckup was in Kunduz, Afghanistan in an operation targeting the Taliban and not ISIS. It would not be included in the ISIS air campaign statistics. The point about U.S. reported casualties is a decent one, though. I too doubt the number in Iraq/Syria is as low as 41.

 

[Kenshin001]

41 Civilian deaths? Huh? 42 were killed in one strike alone on that Doctors Without Borders hospital.

It's not relevant to the story. That was in Afghanistan and had nothing to do with IS, it happened during a battle with the Taliban.

Edit: beaten again.

 

[Trojita]

Are you guys having reading comprehension problems? The quoted kill count is SpecOps number of enemy combatants killed linked with planning attacks in Europe and Africa.

The civilian count was for the overall 20 month coalition strikes, which includes everything.

 

[SapientWolf]

The families of the civilians killed will replace the terrorists killed. That's how we get terrorists in the first place. That's why I believe the only way to stop the cycle is to end involvement in the Middle East altogether.

No one wants to be in ISIS right now. Their recruitment stats sucked ever since the West started putting a foot up their asses.

There are more ISIS members being killed than recruited.

 

[MisterFalcon]

The families of the civilians killed will replace the terrorists killed. That's how we get terrorists in the first place. That's why I believe the only way to stop the cycle is to end involvement in the Middle East altogether.

"Hello 40,000 Yezidis stuck on a mountain surrounded by ISIS. I'm sorry but we can't help you, if a single civilian gets killed by our bombs a million new ISIS terrorists will spawn in their base. You'll just have to accept being murdered or made a slave."