UKGAF thread of Politics and Britishness.
- Thread starter Chinner
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scotcheggz
Member
Chinner said:
Oh my golly, they're both mental. I'm just about to tuck into this, I'll do my best to watch it in its entirety. What a massive car crash.
They are currently just praying, before the debate starts...
scotcheggz
Member
Yes indeed!
Nick Griffin just said that the BNP consider Christianity as indigenous? I knew that the BNPs take on indigenous was warped to suit themselves, but wow. They basically just say what they want and twist it to suit what they want to say. I shouldn't really be surprised I suppose.
I would say the pagan religions, before the export of christianity, is just as much deep rooted in out history and culture.. but whatever, I didn't expect to agree with anything in these debates anyway :lol
Nick Griffin just said that the BNP consider Christianity as indigenous? I knew that the BNPs take on indigenous was warped to suit themselves, but wow. They basically just say what they want and twist it to suit what they want to say. I shouldn't really be surprised I suppose.
I would say the pagan religions, before the export of christianity, is just as much deep rooted in out history and culture.. but whatever, I didn't expect to agree with anything in these debates anyway :lol
industrian
will gently cradle you as time slowly ticks away.
scotcheggz said:
Look at the flags of Scotland and England and tell me what you see.
scotcheggz
Member
industrian said:
Look up idigenous in a dictionary and tell me what you see.
The cross of St. George was brought back to England via the crusades. It's another glaring mistake by the BNP, that they consider reasonably old = Indigenous. It doesn't. The word is pretty specific.
this is pretty ironic considering this:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/topics/easter/7547029/Gordon-Brown-issues-Easter-greeting.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/topics/easter/7547029/Gordon-Brown-issues-Easter-greeting.html
need more atheists.
scotcheggz
Member
Chinner said:
I dunno about that. I read Richard Dawkins book "the god delusion" recently and it wasn't pretty. I like the guy and mostly find myself agreeing with him, but seeing such a militant atheist wasn't as pretty as I'd hoped. :lol
Mr. Luchador
Member
Just had my first, and so far only, local MP leaflet through the door. It was from Labour.
scotcheggz
Member
Enosh said:
Oh yeh, i totally agree with that, i was more railing against the use of the word idigenous that the BNP use time and time again, seemingly without any knowledge of what the word stands for. They roll out the old "since the last ice age 10000 years ago" bullshit, but then they skip directly to modern history.
They almost want to believe that Britain was unchanging for the last 10,000 years up until the break up of the empire.
Mr. Luchador
Member
Chinner said:
I think I just threw it straight in the bin >.< It had a picture of the woman and guy (jointly running) standing next to their street sign to show they were local. Hang on, I'll check...
Aye, its in the bin. The missus (Pro-Labour) said they (Labour) wanted to relay the roads, and that was about it. :lol
EDIT:
I googled to find their website:
http://northtynesidelabour.co.uk/index.html
Oh dear :lol :lol
Enosh
Member
examples and comparison of their effect on the UK with historical changes related to christianity like the crusades and englads role in it, church of england etc etcSir Fragula said:
edit: iam not saying there aren't any influences, i am just saying that the influences from christianity are stronger
My school is hosting a debate and question session for sixth form students between the four local candidates. There's our Labour MP, and the candidates for the Conservatives, Lib Dems and Labour. Should be interesting, the Conservative candidate could face tough questions; he was placed as head governor of our school by the council and had the Headteacher fired, and we never got a proper explaination. Our MP is pretty much universally loved by everyone.
Dabookerman
Member
scotcheggz said:
I hate the word "militant" atheist. It suggests to me atheists in military garb waiting to pop some religious heads.
Dawkins isn't really that harsh in God Delusion. He doesn't have to be nice about religion, which is what the problem is these days. It's treated with far too much respect, especially with the controversial issues.
Seems like Labour really got caught off-balance by the business letter thing. I imagine they raised NI because they have to raise taxes and national insurance doesn't have the word tax in it so it sounds less bad to the electorate in headlines, and thinking they wouldn't get much political trouble for it. Yet for the last few days the news has been all about 'BUSINESS BACKS TORIES' and Labour launches "TAX ON JOBS' which hurts their whole Labour 'investment ' and 'securing the recovery' narrative. Though the tories are being disingenuous on the whole issue as the spent the last year lambasting Labour for being wishy washy with figures and not taking the deficit seriously, and are obviously going to raise taxes in other areas, it is clearly a major win for them.
scotcheggz
Member
Dabookerman said:
I agreed with him about 95% of the book, what I said earlier was more of a throwaway comment since I didn't want to derail. I liked the book mostly and agreed with his issues with religion as an institution. I found it hard to chew when he attacked regular people who have faith.
Dabookerman
Member
scotcheggz said:
I don't really remember him attacking people with faith though, since he doesn't care if people do. (It's been some time since I've read it, so if you could show me a quote or two where he does, would be helpful)
scotcheggz
Member
Dabookerman said:
Chapter 5 - The roots of religion. This is where the book started to turn sour for me. It's the section of the book where he disects religion to a minute scale. Up until then I was nodding my head in agreement completely as he spoke about the dangers of religious institutions etc. But past chapter 5 in the book, he moves away from the institutions and attacks the very idea of faith. I suppose this is integral for his argument, perhaps I'm just too passive.
I also took issue with his teapot theory, that if someone believed in a teapot orbiting jupiter existed you could scientifically prove that it doesn't exist and he feels the same way about god. He skirts the philosophical issue of existence however, that if said person lives his life in accordance to the teapot and holds faith that it is there, does that teapot not exist?
Like I said though, I did agree with him often and felt it was refreshing to hear someone talk openly the institution. Perhaps I'm just too passive to agree with him 100%. Anyway, this is probably all best for another thread.
N
NinjaFridge
Unconfirmed Member
People should start worshipping Dawkins as a God just to see what happens. I'd be up for it, if only to piss him off.
Dark Machine
Member
NinjaFridge said:
South Park made that joke a while ago (it was the episode where Cartman travels thorugh time because he can't wait the Wii to come out) and it DID piss off Dawkins.
Cerebral Assassin
Member
Jibril said:
Oh we will.... 8 years of Tory rule are forthcoming.
I have avoided politics all my life. My current view of politics is that as a country we try and vote in people who won't fuck up the country as the next guy?
Now no matter who wins, they still suck at the end of their term and all we have are false promises that are not fulfilled. I really do feel like we don't have any positive change from one party to the next. Just worse mistakes we have avoided.
So do you lot agree with my opinion or do you believe the party you will vote for will make a real change?
Now no matter who wins, they still suck at the end of their term and all we have are false promises that are not fulfilled. I really do feel like we don't have any positive change from one party to the next. Just worse mistakes we have avoided.
So do you lot agree with my opinion or do you believe the party you will vote for will make a real change?
J Tourettes
Banned
Cerebral Assassin said:
Why 8 years and not ten?
blazinglord
Member
Lib Dems? Don't be ridiculous. Barring a complete Labour meltdown, the Liberals aren't going to make much gains. It makes me laugh how we go through this every election, "this election is going to be the Liberal Democrats' moment". I'm amazed at the amount of coverage the Lib Dems get in the general election when it's obvious that they will never gain enough seats to form a government. They don't even contest all the electoral seats! Having said that, any vote that drains Labour's support is fine by me.Jibril said:
---
Anyway, so Labour's new election campaign poster:
What do we think? Personally, I think the Guardian's spoof poster 'step outside posh boy' was probably more effective than Labour's real one.
Cerebral Assassin
Member
Sh1ner said:
The last 2 governments have had real impact on our country, so whoever gets in will make a change, but unfortunately the system of Government is flawed & unelected officials have too much stroke.
blazinglord said:Lib Dems? Don't be ridiculous. Barring a complete Labour meltdown, the Liberals aren't going to make much gains. It makes me laugh how we go through this every election, "this election is going to be the Liberal Democrats' moment". I'm amazed at the amount of coverage the Lib Dems get in the general election when it's obvious that they will never gain enough seats to form a government. They don't even contest all the electoral seats! Having said that, any vote that drains Labour's support is fine by me.
---
Anyway, so Labour's new election campaign poster:
What do we think? Personally, I think the Guardian's spoof poster 'step outside posh boy' was probably more effective than Labour's real one.
Poorly timed. The Quattro combined with Ashes to Ashes being back this week means this will probably win votes for the conservatives.
Cerebral Assassin
Member
J Tourettes said:
Because the Tories(once in) are going to start their infighting far quicker than New Labour did (the old coots still think they are the party of Government) so I suspect Cameron will need the mandate from the public(plus parties are more loyal at election time) to keep his party in check.
Currently the polls are: Tory > Labour > Lib Dem, however the lead the Tories have over Labour isn't much, which will result in a hung parliament. Things could quickly change once the election campaigns start though. If we assume we do get a hung parliament then that would give the Lib Dems a very powerful position.Jibril said:
Probably means nothing. Last time we had a hung parliament the party in power just had another vote until they got the majority :lol .
Depends how you define 'real change'; theres some shit we'd all love but blatantly won't happen shamefully. There has been change though, for example let's talk about What New Labour has done:Sh1ner said:
Significantly improved the NHS
Better equal rights
Minimun wage
War in Iraq and Aghanistan
And other shit. Look at what the Tories did in the eighties, allot of shit changed there in a small period of time.
I know what you mean though, and most people share the same opinion which can be seen in the polls.
Not quite sure if they thought that through lol.blazinglord said:
Mr. Luchador
Member
They've succeeded in 10 minutes what David Cameron has been trying to do for at least the last 6 years - he finally looks 'cool'.
The Conservatives need a 6 point lead to obtain a majority if you count marginal seats who have defected away from Labour - the kind of people who voted Tory until Blair came along, and have gone back now we have the disastrous Brown.
Labour are now fighting for 2nd place. It is entirely possible that they will sink to their historic low of 27% (achieved under Michael Foot) with the Lib Dems overtaking or matching them.
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That poster is a monumental cock-up and own goal by Labour. Gene Hunt is one of the most loved characters on British TV, he's cool, un-PC and gets the job done. I guess the politically correct berks in Labour think he's nasty and thought this poster would be a huge success. Shows how out of touch they are.
Labour HQ, the gift that keeps on giving! Conservatives have already responded with http://i42.tinypic.com/qn3040.png.
--
There will be a lot of opinion polls this evening before the Sunday papers, as this is the last weekend before the election is called. I'll post them later with some info about what they mean.
Labour are now fighting for 2nd place. It is entirely possible that they will sink to their historic low of 27% (achieved under Michael Foot) with the Lib Dems overtaking or matching them.
--
That poster is a monumental cock-up and own goal by Labour. Gene Hunt is one of the most loved characters on British TV, he's cool, un-PC and gets the job done. I guess the politically correct berks in Labour think he's nasty and thought this poster would be a huge success. Shows how out of touch they are.
Labour HQ, the gift that keeps on giving! Conservatives have already responded with http://i42.tinypic.com/qn3040.png.
--
There will be a lot of opinion polls this evening before the Sunday papers, as this is the last weekend before the election is called. I'll post them later with some info about what they mean.
JonathanEx
Member
Can't they just run "CAMERON - COCK." and just be done with it, stop beating about the bush.
J Tourettes
Banned
Chinner said:
Toffs are some of the coolest people I've met in life.
Angus Reid poll conducted for Sunday Express
CONSERVATIVES 38
LABOUR 27
LIB DEMS 20
Likely result: Conservative majority of 60
YouGov poll for the Sunday Times
CONSERVATIVES 39
LABOUR 29
LIB DEMS 20
Likely result: Conservative majority of 56
I'll update this post later, if any more come out. Results are calculated using the Andy Cooke marginals/swingback calculator.
CONSERVATIVES 38
LABOUR 27
LIB DEMS 20
Likely result: Conservative majority of 60
YouGov poll for the Sunday Times
CONSERVATIVES 39
LABOUR 29
LIB DEMS 20
Likely result: Conservative majority of 56
I'll update this post later, if any more come out. Results are calculated using the Andy Cooke marginals/swingback calculator.
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