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[HiredN00bs]

Here's an enlightening conversation I had this morning. I did a search but didn't see any directly related posts or threads. I reside in the state of Maryland, btw.

Alan (4/4/2017, 9:57:54 AM): Hello, My name is Alan how may I assist you today?
Me (4/4/2017, 9:58:18 AM): Good Morning, Alan. I'd like to cancel a pre-order I recently made for a game that has not yet released.
Alan (4/4/2017, 9:59:03 AM): Hello Richard, I will be more than glad to help you with this cancellation you want to make, may I know what is the game and reason of the cancellation ?
Me (4/4/2017, 10:00:05 AM): The game is Destiny 2, the transaction ID is [redacted], and the reason I no longer wish to purchase this version of the game.
Alan (4/4/2017, 10:01:13 AM): I understand, in this case you want to get another version of this same game ?
Me (4/4/2017, 10:01:45 AM): I will be purchasing the game on a different PSN account.
Alan (4/4/2017, 10:02:06 AM): For documentation purposes and to update your profile information, would you please provide me your phone number?
Me (4/4/2017, 10:02:12 AM): [redacted]
Alan (4/4/2017, 10:03:23 AM): Thank you so much for waiting, I was reviewing your account to see what options we have to help you, but because of the restrictions outlined in the PlayStation Terms of Service, all sales are final and we are unable to process a refund in this situation. Believe me that I tried my best to see if an exception can be made however we are unable to process a refund in this case.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:04:48 AM): I'm not sure why considering the product hasn't been delivered; the game hasn't even been published.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:05:12 AM): In other territories where Sony is legally required to offer a refund, they do so.
Alan (4/4/2017, 10:05:29 AM): I am so sorry for any inconveniences this may cause, I wish I could help you better. I was researching in my system what other options we have to try to help you, but I was unable to do more. Because of the restrictions outlined in the PlayStation Terms of Service, all purchases made on the PS store are final. My most sincere apologies for this.
Alan (4/4/2017, 10:05:35 AM): Besides this, Besides this, is there anything else I can try to assist you with today?
Me (4/4/2017, 10:06:16 AM): People can get refunds for games they have purchased and downloaded but I can't get a refund for a game that isn't even available until September?
Alan (4/4/2017, 10:06:44 AM): I truly understand your concern, but Due to the restrictions outlined in the PlayStation Terms of Service, all sales are final upon completion. I really wish I could help you with your request, however a refund is not eligible in this case. You may find more information about our terms and conditions by checking this website, section: “WALLET”:
https://www.playstation.com/en-us/network/legal/terms-of-service/
Me (4/4/2017, 10:07:06 AM): Can I get the amount refunded in PlayStation Store credit?
Me (4/4/2017, 10:08:00 AM): Refunded to my PSN account in store credit?
Alan (4/4/2017, 10:08:14 AM): Believe me that my intention is to help you as much as I can, and I do place myself in your position, unfortunately as per PlayStation Network terms of service we are unable to proceed with a refund in this case as all sales made are final. I am afraid my hands are tied in this case, I have checked what other options we have but we have exhausted them, as per policies a refund can’t be granted.
Alan (4/4/2017, 10:08:19 AM): With this information said, besides this please tell me, is there any other question, or anything else I can try to assist you with today?
Me (4/4/2017, 10:09:06 AM): Yes, could you please put me in touch with your direct or indirect management person?
Alan (4/4/2017, 10:09:49 AM): Keep in mind that we all follow standard procedures Richard, but please allow me a moment while I transfer you.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:10:12 AM): Thank you for your help, I understand you are limited in the solutions you can provide and I appreciate your time and efforts.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:10:40 AM): Hello, My name is Wendy how may I assist you today?
Me (4/4/2017, 10:11:06 AM): Good Morning, Wendy. How are you this morning?
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:11:07 AM): Hello Richard, nice to meet you. I am Alan'S Supervisor.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:11:22 AM): Thank you so much for bringing your case to my attention. Kindly allow me a minute or two to review your account and get back to you, I need to check the account information and get updated with your case, I will be back with you.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:11:49 AM): Sure, let me know when you're ready.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:11:58 AM): And thanks for your time and attention on this.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:13:07 AM): Thank you so much for waiting, we understand the value of your time.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:14:01 AM): We don’t like to see our customers upset and inconvenienced. We always strive to create a positive gaming experience, I am deeply sorry to know you are seeking for a refund under this transaction. I was actually checking the information you have received from Alan and it seems to be correct to be honest with you.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:14:58 AM): We truly understand your concern, but due to the restrictions outlined in the PlayStation Terms of Service, all sales are final upon completion. I really wish I could help you with your request, however a refund is not eligible in this case. You may find more information about our terms and conditions by checking this website, section: “WALLET”:
https://www.playstation.com/en-us/network/legal/terms-of-service/
Me (4/4/2017, 10:15:44 AM): I understand that may be in the terms of service, but I don't think it was unreasonable to think a pre-order, paid in full more than 5 months before the product will be delivered was ineligible to be cancelled and receive a refund.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:15:58 AM): I just made the pre-order less than 48 hours ago.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:16:53 AM): We do understand how you feel about not being able to receive a refund for this transaction that was just made a few hours ago, your satisfaction is a great compliment for us and believe me, if there was a way to complete your request today, we'll love to do it right way, that's why we have this channel, to communicate with you and assist you further with all your request.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:17:13 AM): You have reached the correct department that handles your type of inquiry but I am afraid that due to the reasons we have explained previously we won’t be able to fulfill your request.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:17:33 AM): You know, we are always seeking new ways to improve customer service and the best way to do that is to ask the experts… you, thank you so much for sharing your feedback and experience with us today, Richard.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:17:36 AM): Please let me know if I can provide any other additional support besides this one.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:17:41 AM): I'm just wondering if an exception can be made in this one instance as I am now aware that preorder sales are final, whereas this was not clearly communicated.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:18:03 AM): And refunds for preorders are available in other regions, as well.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:18:34 AM): So basically, Sony is saying they won't provide a service that other regions recongize is a good consumer practice, enough to make it law, unless it forced to legally.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:18:46 AM): That's not a very good look.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:19:30 AM): I take issue with the policy because I find it to be unreasonable and not good service to consumers.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:19:30 AM): Believe me that my intention is to help you as much as I can, and I do place myself in your position, unfortunately as per PlayStation Network terms of service we are unable to proceed with a refund in this case as all sales made are final. I am afraid my hands are tied in this case, I have checked what other options we have but we have exhausted them, as per policies a refund can’t be granted.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:19:52 AM): Is there any other question you may have today?
Me (4/4/2017, 10:20:14 AM): Yes, is there anyone that has the authority to make an exception in this instance that I can speak with?
Me (4/4/2017, 10:20:41 AM): Otherwise, I'll be taking my concerns to a consumer group and to the press.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:20:53 AM): I think this story is worthy of spotlighting.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:21:27 AM): I am the supervisor in charge at this moment, the one who handles you case right now, as mentioned before you have reached the correct department that handles your type of inquiry but I am afraid that due to the reasons we have explained previously we won’t be able to fulfill your request due to the reasons we have shared with you before.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:21:55 AM): I am thankful for sharing your experience with us today, be sure that it will help us grow even more, unfortunately for this specific case we cannot fulfill your request, be sure that there will be other hundreds matters that we would be able to help you with right away. Sadly there is not a different answer or outcome for this case but I would like to know if before ending this session is there anything else I could do for you?
Me (4/4/2017, 10:22:14 AM): And it's ridiculous to not try and help me considering 1) I'm going to purchase the game on a different PSN account and 2) I tried to meet halfway and get store credit, which isn't even really a refund.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:22:47 AM): The product has not been yet delivered.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:22:56 AM): The game isn't even completed yet.
Me (4/4/2017, 10:23:15 AM): But I can't get a refund on a product that hasn't been delivered and won't be delivered for over 5 months?
Me (4/4/2017, 10:23:20 AM): What kind of sense does that make?
Me (4/4/2017, 10:23:35 AM): If that's in the terms of service, then the terms of service are terrible.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:24:15 AM): I am deeply sorry that your request could not be completed today, I'd love to be able to offer you a different outcome but that won't be possible due to the reasons we have explained previously. I apologize, but we cannot process a refund for this content. I understand your situation, but according to the PlayStation Terms of Service all sales are final. We are not able to make an exception in this case.
Wendy (4/4/2017, 10:24:38 AM): Even with this outcome, was totally my pleasure to work with you today. Please feel free to contact us anytime round the clock if further assistance is needed, we are here for you any time. Thank you for chatting with us today! We hope you have a great day!

If anyone has any advice about how to actually get a refund in this instance, please let me know.

 

[DNAbro]

you are a bit behind on this. It even says they won't refund your money when you preorder unless required by law.

 

[whatever6352]

It clearly does state when you're purchasing a game that all sales are final.

 

[Horohoro]

you are a bit behind on this. It even says they won't refund your money when you preorder unless required by law.

What are the states its required by law in anyway?

 

[Zombie James]

This has been known for a long while and it's been a major problem since the beginning. One of the many reasons going all-digital still has a long way to go.

 

[dubq]

Yea, and any time I have had an issue they've always given me a refund. I think they give a boiler-plate policy response but will consider things case by case.

 

[Interfectum]

Don't pre-order?

 

[Linkark07]

Thought this was well known. One of the (many) reasons going all digital with Sony isn't a good idea.

 

[Deleted member 752119]

I've gotten a couple refunded before release, but the rep was clear in stating they were making a "one-time exception." So it's just luck of the draw with the rep you get and them breaking policy.

I've just entirely stopped preordering now though. My internet is fast enough that not having preload isn't a big deal, I can wait for reviews and if it's a big download just buy in the morning before work and have it ready to play when I get home (I was never playing at midnight on release anyway).

I've also gotten away from buying digitally for the most part anyway. GCU/Prime and resell after beating is just too good for someone who doesn't collect or replay things.

 

[TheSpoiler]

Never preorder from any vendor where you can't get your money back if there's an issue.

 

[DNAbro]

What are the states its required by law in anyway?

I don't think it is a state by state basis it's a there is a legal issue basis.

 

[family_guy]

If they change the date, you can get a refund. Otherwise it's clearly stated that all sales are final.

 

[ryan13ts]

Exactly why I don't pre-order digitally.

 

[Kitsune86]

Sad they wouldn't refund you - When Life is Strange Episode 1 came out I accidently pre-ordered the entire season on the wrong console and a quick call to Sony later they processed a PSN wallet refund so I could get it on PS4 instead of PS3. Seeing as that was also a pre-order for a game that at the time wasn't complete.. just weird

 

[ShadowKingpin]

It clearly states it. Easily why I no longer preorder digital games.

 

[Hoje0308]

It clearly does state when you're purchasing a game that all sales are final.

.

 

[Tonyx]

Don't pre-order?

Agree. Especially when going digital.. pre-order doesn't make too much sense. I understand wanting to preload.. but usually you'll have reviews out a little before the game so you are still on time to pre-order and pre-load.

 

[Z_Y]

You were transferred to a manager in 28 seconds??? I think that is the real story here.


edit: And it's a shitty policy. Just because the fine print says it doesn't make it any less shitty. More people need to complain about this so that shitty policies like this are changed.

 

[Rellik]

Sounds more like an issue with your laws.

Sony have to refund me here.

 

[slit]

I don't even know why you need to pre-order with digital.

 

[Transistor]

It clearly does state when you're purchasing a game that all sales are final.

Yep

I don't even know why you need to pre-order with digital.

I sometimes do just for pre-loading, but I only pre-order it a day or two before release. Never way in advance, it's absolutely pointless. I mean, it's not like they're gonna run out of digital licenses for PSN games.

 

[Interfectum]

I don't even know why you need to pre-order with digital.

You could 'pre-order' the day before the game comes out and still get all the pre-order perks and whatnot.

The only places I'd even consider pre-ordering would be Steam (digital) and Amazon (physical) otherwise good luck.

 

[sixteen-bit]

Don't pre-order?

the best advice

 

[Dante316]

You need to call them and talk to them, there has been more successful​ than online chat.

 

[Einhandr]

Maybe it's about time we started a Twitter campaign for this. It's worked before in the past right? Who can we as a collective reach out to that might be able to get this anti-consumer policy changed?

 

[RecRoulette]

Don't pre-order?

Especially digital games. At least not until you can preload them.

 

[jbug617]

I wonder why Sony wouldn't refund a preorder? MS does it.

 

[Neuromancer]

You just have to get lucky. I have been able to sweet talk a game refund and two subscription cancellations/refunds over the phone with Playstation CS. Maybe over the phone is better than online chatting.

In the future be very careful about what you preorder, until things change. I wish Sony would allow cancellations at any time, but it is what it is.

 

[Syrus]

Microsoft is so much better. Took me 5 minutes online chat or less.

I cancelled my south park pre order because release date has changed twice.

your request, your order placed on Tuesday, August 16, 2016 has been refunded. You should see $59.99 credited to your account soon

 

[Pandora012]

I thought that it says that they will only refund where it is legally required. I think in the UK you can get refunds, but that states don't.

 

[Blastoise]

This has been known for a very long time.

Its not like Sony hides this fact.

 

[Mass Effect]

Yeah, this has been well known...

which is exactly why I don't pre-order from PSN (or at all really).

Curious: What are Microsoft and Nintendo's stance on this? Same?

 

[Gator86]

Don't pre-order?

Yup, I only pre-order right before a game comes out after it has reviews up and tons of feedback out. The last things I pre-ordered off PSN were Horizon and P5 which were known quantities. Never pre-order games and fuck Sony for being utter assholes about it. I look forward to them being forced to allow cancellations or refunds at some point.

 

[WascallyWabbit]

Yea, and any time I have had an issue they've always given me a refund. I think they give a boiler-plate policy response but will consider things case by case.

yeah I got my refund for my mass effect pre-order after chatting them up, looks like you just had some unfortunate luck, OP
I do think they look at your account and see if you spend a lot of money on there or not and take that into account, but heck it could be just dumb luck and getting the right rep

 

[SexyFish]

Very much known. They only refund preorders where it is required by law.

You could cancel the charge on your card but then your account would be banned, so good luck.

 

[TacosNSalsa]

Keep trying ..I got one before (NJ) . It really depends on the rep you get some will definitely go out of their way to help and others will just quote policy and do nothing ..Also I found actually calling to be more effective ..

 

[Kaiser Swayze]

Pre-Orders

You may cancel a pre-order of digital content at any time before the release date. If the release date has passed, you can still change your mind and request a refund up to 14 days after payment was taken for the pre-order, provided that you have not started downloading or streaming the content to your device. See more information about cancelling a pre-order here.

 

[Sparrowhawk]

Taking it "to the press"? Dude, it says it right there, clear as day, before you complete your transaction.

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

Why the fuck would you ever preorder digitally to begin with? Especially this far out? If you want to preload just wait until the preload starts to preorder.

 

[Golden_Pigeon]

Yeah, this has been well known...

which is exactly why I don't pre-order from PSN (or at all really).

Curious: What are Microsoft and Nintendo's stance on this? Same?

I bought a game, didn't worked well on my PC and Microsoft staff gave me a refund in one hour. I don't think they have the same policy at all.

 

[Interfectum]

Pre-Orders

You may cancel a pre-order of digital content at any time before the release date. If the release date has passed, you can still change your mind and request a refund up to 14 days after payment was taken for the pre-order, provided that you have not started downloading or streaming the content to your device. See more information about cancelling a pre-order here.

That's not US.

 

[RichiRamjag]

This has always been the case.

 

[Samus4145]

Pre-Orders

You may cancel a pre-order of digital content at any time before the release date. If the release date has passed, you can still change your mind and request a refund up to 14 days after payment was taken for the pre-order, provided that you have not started downloading or streaming the content to your device. See more information about cancelling a pre-order here.

That's not something in US sadly.

 

[DOWN]

Hasn't this been the rule for purchasing anything digital in America for all time (Steam's fairly young return policy being an exception)?

It says right on every item on PSN that sales are final and pre-orders can't be cancelled so be sure

 

[LambdaTeos]

Very much known. They only refund preorders where it is required by law.

You could cancel the charge on your card but then your account would be banned, so good luck.

"very much know" doesn't make it right

honestly, why people keep pre ordering on playstation? they pretty much suck with these cases, Microsoft allows you to cancel and returns your money

Curious: What are Microsoft and Nintendo's stance on this? Same?

Microsoft gives you the refund if required, no reason to not give it to you, I mean, it's digital content, the license can be returned

 

[Kaiser Swayze]

That's not something in US sadly.

Well that sucks. Caveat emptor, US folks.

 

[YuriLowell]

Don't pre-order?

.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

Good thing you preordered that digital copy of Destiny 2 before they ran out.

 

[HiredN00bs]

Taking it "to the press"? Dude, it says it right there, clear as day, before you complete your transaction.

I'm fairly in-the-know and I wasn't aware of the policy. It's a bad policy that exists for no good reason. People ought to be made aware of it, especially when they're making a big push on the digital storefront.

 

[Jawmuncher]

Still think all Console Makers should honor a once a year refund with no questions asked.