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[RMI]

can't help but think of Bulls on Parade whenever I see military spending

Weapons not food, not homes, not shoes
Not need, just feed the war cannibal animal
I walk the corner to the rubble that used to be a library
Line up to the mind cemetery now
What we don't know keeps the contracts alive and movin'
They don't gotta burn the books they just remove 'em
While arms warehouses fill as quick as the cells
Rally round tha family
Pockets full of shells

just as relevant now as it was 20 years ago.

too bad American first can't mean spending money to take care of your citizens at home and providing them with the healthcare and education they need. gotta murder people overseas!

 

[Fallout-NL]

End homelessness? End hunger? End narcotics addiction?

Naaah... let's dump $700,000,000,000 into the Banksters' Global Hegemony's Protection Force.

Gotta keep killing those 3rd world brown people, and starve our own homeless to death. Yup. Murika - Land of the Free-Reign Sociopath Billionaires.

This. It's fucking nuts. Everyone who voted for this is insane, evil or both.

 

[le.phat]

This. It's fucking nuts. Everyone who voted for this is insane and evil.

Or just dumb.

 

[Tony Redgrave]

This is... wow.

That graphic sure puts things in perspective.

 

[ApharmdX]

Elisabeth Warren, Kamala Harris, Corey Booker, and so many other self-professed liberals voted Yes on this.

I'm very disappointed in Warren and Harris. And all the Dems who voted for this. The last thing we need is more military spending.

 

[teh_pwn]

This is one of those rare times that Paul and Sanders are in agreement.

 

[smisk]

I don't get why single payer would be so hugely expensive in the US. It costs 120bn to give every one free healthcare in the UK we have a population of 60m so lets factor that up to the size of the US population 323 million so 323/60 is 5.3 x the population. So 120bn x 5.3 is 636bn. What are you guys doing with the 900bn your spending now???

Hmm I'll look into the UKs cost. I did the same calculation using Canada's healthcare cost per person and came out with 2.2 trillion for the US. Currently we spend something like 3.2 trillion when you combine public and private healthcare spending.

 

[buttery fistful]

massive income inequality, large division among the struggling middle class, cuts to education, massive military spending increase....


i don't like this trend

 

[PBY]

Why the fuck would any Dem vote for this.

This is just evil.

 

[JettDash]

This is... wow.

That graphic sure puts things in perspective.

The graphic is misleading. That's just discretionary spending, not the entire budget. The mandatory budget is over twice as big and includes over a trillion dollars for health care alone. Plus social security and other things.

 

[Parmadillo Marshmallow]

$700 billion divided by 350 million people equals $2,000 each.

Yeah obviously doesnt work out like that in the end but still crazy to think about.

 

[kirblar]

Why the fuck would any Dem vote for this.

This is just evil.

Because Limes graph is misleading.

 

[CyclopsRock]

You're right. All this money and yet I always hear news if military branches "downsizing" so who is telling the truth? Where did the money go?

Whilst the man power still makes up a big chunk of the budget, it gets smaller every year as a percentage. Wages for soldiers, sailors and airmen doesn't go up by that much, but the next generation of fighter jet costs a bum-fuck load more than the last. The costs can seem to runaway sometimes, usually because the contractors who are designing and developing these things get asked to do things which have never been done before (that's what make them next generation) and they can't realistically budget accurately for something that's never been done by anyone, anywhere, before. As costs increase, sometimes these projects get shut down (eg Comanche), sometimes they don't (eg JSF) Ditto bombs, ditto drones, ditto surface vessels, ditto basically everything. Furthermore the US has enormous and growing obligations around the world - fighting piracy in East Africa, leading NATO operations, satellite data etc. All this stuff costs more and more money today than it did yesterday.

As such, it's entirely possible that the branches can be downsizing and it costs more money.

 

[AntraxSuicide]

There's gotta be a better solution to that than to just shrug our shoulders and keep poring money into it indefinitely, while we lose wars being fought on new digital fronts.

Honestly, no. You'll never win a federal election campaigning on cutting anything from the military. The better option is to continue to pour money into the military but use it on things that you loosely define as related to national defense. Eisenhower built the interstates by bullshitting that we needed them in case of domestic invasion, which is obviously insane. He really just wanted better infrastructure.

Do that instead. Fix up our healthcare, internet, infrastructure, etc... by just finding excuses to call it defense spending.

 

[Forward]

It's not all because of rich evil fucks. A lot of them are kept in power by less-rich evil fucks who vote for them.

Thank you. If we eliminate the 1%, the next percentile will do the same.

We need systemic change.

But fuck the 1%. That does not excuse them. It merely points out that there exists more than 1% of humanity who are evil fucks.

Hang the millionaires. And hang the nickel millionaires alongside them.

 

[Oriel]

So usual Gaf overreaction?

Well....it's still a heck of a lot of money. But then, at roughly 4% of GDP, it's the sort of spending that you'd expect from the world's largest superpower. Consider the likes of China rapidly increasing their own spending and catching up with the US.

 

[Matt]

Hang the millionaires. And hang the nickel millionaires alongside them.

Wow.

 

[Taker666]

Some of you seem to be reading this as though it is an increase of $700b when that's what the entire budget is.

The $77b increase is a lot of money, but for the US government, not really. Certainly it couldn't pay for single payer



Given that single payer would cost far more than $77b/year and would garner zero Republicam support, you have no point.

True, it's not enough for single payer....but it would pay for the Bernie Sanders "Free College for All" plan.

 

[Regulus Tera]

The party of small government.
Why have universal healthcare, free college or a robust infrastructure when you can bolster the military industrial complex to shoot brown kids.

Also to PoliGAF, please spare me your apologetic pragmatism about how the Democrats who voted for this are eligible candidates going forward.

The military machine was just as ludicrous over Obama and Clinton. It's how the system works.

 

[God Dayumm]

True, it's not enough for single payer....but it would pay for the Bernie Sanders "Free College for All" plan.

Also the $77 billion increase would not pay for single payer, but a $623 billion decrease might.

 

[Fulminator]

so much for infrastructure

 

[Matt]

Also the $77 billion increase would not pay for single payer, but a $623 billion decrease might.

Well, that's not gonna happen.

If we want to advocate for reduced military spending (and we should), setting actual attainable targets would be a good place to start.

 

[Skellig Gra]

Also the $77 billion increase would not pay for single payer, but a $623 billion decrease might.

That also destroys 2 million + jobs. Good luck with that one.

 

[AntraxSuicide]

I don't get why single payer would be so hugely expensive in the US. It costs 120bn to give every one free healthcare in the UK we have a population of 60m so lets factor that up to the size of the US population 323 million so 323/60 is 5.3 x the population. So 120bn x 5.3 is 636bn. What are you guys doing with the 900bn your spending now???

Hmm I'll look into the UKs cost. I did the same calculation using Canada's healthcare cost per person and came out with 2.2 trillion for the US. Currently we spend something like 3.2 trillion when you combine public and private healthcare spending.

Scale is most certainly a factor as the US and Canada both service very large, rural areas while the UK is smaller than some US states. Places like Wyoming still need access to good care even though such care will be a massive money sink.

Also, you can't just assume it scales linearly. That's definitely an assumption you need to justify.

 

[_RT_]

Remember the DACA discussion between the Dems and Trump?
I'm guessing there were commitments made on this vote.

 

[Vital Tundra]

hat pie chart makes me sad. So much going needlessly towards military.

 

[Bonen no Max'd]

Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed.

This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities. It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population. It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals. It is some fifty miles of concrete pavement. We pay for a single fighter with a half-million bushels of wheat. We pay for a single destroyer with new homes that could have housed more than 8,000 people. This is not a way of life at all, in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron.

.

 

[Oriel]

The graphic is misleading. That's just discretionary spending, not the entire budget. The mandatory budget is over twice as big and includes over a trillion dollars for health care alone. Plus social security and other things.

Yeah. Over half of the federal budget goes on health and social security. Just 15% is allocated to defense. Some here really need to get some perspective on all this.

 

[Angelus Errare]

That also destroys 2 million + jobs. Good luck with that one.

Military personnel don't see much of that money. Most of it goes to paying contractors who get away with charging $600 per screw and washer and other out of control shit

 

[perfectchaos007]

Rand Paul representing like a boss!

 

[BoboBrazil]

Remember the DACA discussion between the Dems and Trump?
I'm guessing there were commitments made on this vote.

Trump wins because he hasn't done shit for daca yet and trusting Trump to follow through is only going to fail them.

 

[Regulus Tera]

Why the fuck would any Dem vote for this.

This is just evil.

Vox did an excellent video a while back on why it is so difficult for anybody in Congress to vote against promilitary bills, in this case related to fighter jet development: https://youtu.be/ba63OVl1MHw

Tl;dr The military industry is a powerful constituent

 

[And_Gignac]

Bye Kamala. Hello queen Gillibrand.

 

[Matt]

Military personnel don't see much of that money. Most of it goes to paying contractors who get away with charging $600 per screw and washer and other out of control shit

Military personnel costs account for 25% of the budget, the second largest line item after operations/maintenance.

 

[old manatee]

I don't know why some of you are caping for literally any rise in defense spending. We still have 9/11 first responders paying for their own health care. Obviously this wouldn't fund universal health care, but maybe we could at least use this apparent windfall of extra money to circle back around and give them health care. Or I guess we could just give Trump extra toys to take on North Korea with. Sounds like a shitty plan to me but what do I know.

 

[Skellig Gra]

Military personnel don't see much of that money. Most of it goes to paying contractors who get away with charging $600 per screw and washer and other out of control shit

Sure but if you cut the whole budget you cut all those jobs. All I'm really suggesting is some nuance.

 

[PMS341]

The Democrats are not the resistance, and feeding the military industrial complex just gets them horny for profit, with the same idea as their (R) buddies. People be damned.

 

[IamDodongo]

Why not cut the military budget in half and use that money to education, healthcare, housing, social security, environment?

Because people have been tricked into thinking this is okay. It's been happening for so long that Americans don't question military spending. It's not even discussed.

The Democrats are not the resistance

On this front, they certainly are not, and it's a damn shame.

On immigration, healthcare reform, and civil rights they certainly are.

 

[Bishop89]

good to see their priorities are straight

 

[diehard]

good to see their priorities are straight

Defense is one of the few mandatory responsibilities of the federal government, so.. yes?

 

[Fenderputty]

Also the $77 billion increase would not pay for single payer, but a $623 billion decrease might.

No it wouldn't.

 

[kirblar]

good to see their priorities are straight

Yes, it's good that we're spending more on healthcare and social security than on defense.

 

[legacyzero]

This is fuckin bullshit. I hate this country so much some times. Spending so much of our money on perpetual war with no clear end, when so many people are suffering here at home. And the worst part? It's bi-partisan. So many leaders who want to continue blowing up the Middle East, making the problem there worse, all while 45,000 people die annually due to lack of adequate and affordable health care, and infrastructure rated D, places that don't have drinkable water, etc etc.

If we don't turn this shit around in 2018/2020, we're so fucked.

 

[ShadowKingpin]

Fuck all of those Senators who voted 'Yes'. God forbid, we actually use some of those funds for health care, education, housing and science. It's better to blow up families abroad than it is for us to take care of our own.

 

[Fenderputty]

Can a mod please put the total budget pie chart pic in the OP so the purists at least know what they're supposed to be mad about?

 

[kirblar]

Can a mod please put the total budget pie chart pic in the OP so the purists at least know what they're supposed to be mad about?

It already is. Isn't helping.

 

[Fenderputty]

Military personnel costs account for 25% of the budget, the second largest line item after operations/maintenance.

It was a stupid point anyway. The response was to someone wanting to blow up the entire military budget. So yeah ... every job.

It already is. Isn't helping.

This is not helping my opinion of the far left

 

[Skellig Gra]

This is not helping my opinion of the far left

It's cool, only the right are susceptible to disinformation/fake news.

 

[Jest Chillin]

Military personnel don't see much of that money. Most of it goes to paying contractors who get away with charging $600 per screw and washer and other out of control shit

Training, pay, health/vision/dental with zero co-pay (most of the time), housing or housing allowance, cost of moving and travel reimbursement, GI Bill/Post 9-11 bill, Pension (depending on what year they joined up) etc... That's off the top of my head. And that's just active duty. Reserves may have different set ups. There's also the DoD members that support the military on every base.

Yes, there's issues with contractors and the privatization of housing among others but when you start counting the full cost of how fully military personnel are supported, it adds up to quite a bit.

 

[diehard]

Fuck all of those Senators who voted 'Yes'. God forbid, we actually use some of those funds for health care, education, housing and science. It's better to blow up families abroad than it is for us to take care of our own.

You do realize this money doesn't just magically disappear, right? It's all going towards jobs that provide those exact things.