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[DJ Demon J]

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040825/ap_on_hi_te/computer_crime_18


Snippet:

Justice Dept. Cracks Down Internet Crime

28 minutes ago Add Technology - AP to My Yahoo!


By CURT ANDERSON, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - Federal agents seized computers and software Wednesday as part of an investigation targeting an Internet network used to illegally share copyrighted music, movies, software and games, Attorney General John Ashcroft (news - web sites) said.



And, the text of the USDOJ Press Release soon to be on their website:


ATTORNEY GENERAL ASHCROFT ANNOUNCES FIRST CRIMINAL ENFORCEMENT ACTION AGAINST PEER-TO-PEER COPYRIGHT PIRACY

WASHINGTON, D.C. – Attorney General John Ashcroft, Assistant Attorney General Christopher A. Wray, and U.S. Attorney for the District of Columbia Kenneth L. Wainstein today announced the first federal enforcement action taken against criminal copyright piracy on peer-to-peer networks. Early this morning, federal agents executed six search warrants at five residences and one Internet service provider in Texas, New York, and Wisconsin, as part of an investigation into the illegal distribution of copyrighted movies, software, games, and music over peer-to-peer networks. Agents seized computers, software, and computer-related equipment in the searches.

“Today’s actions send an important message to those who steal over the Internet. When online thieves illegally distribute copyrighted programs and products, they put the livelihoods of millions of hard-working Americans at risk and damage our economy,” said Attorney General John Ashcroft. “The execution of today’s warrants disrupted an extensive peer-to-peer network suspected of enabling users to traffic illegally in music, films, software and published works. The Department of Justice is committed to enforcing intellectual property laws, and we will pursue those who steal copyrighted materials even when they try to hide behind the false anonymity of peer-to-peer networks.”

“Today’s enforcement action is the latest step in our ongoing effort to combat piracy occurring on the Internet,” said Christopher A. Wray, Assistant Attorney General for the Criminal Division. “This is the first federal law enforcement action against criminal copyright infringement using peer-to-peer networks and shows that we are committed to combating piracy, regardless of the medium used to commit these illegal acts.”

“Today we are sending a clear message that federal law enforcement takes piracy seriously,” said U.S. Attorney Kenneth L. Wainstein. “It is illegal to trade in copyright-protected materials on the Internet. This is theft, plain and simple. If you are engaged in this behavior, you are on notice that you are not as anonymous as you may think.”

The search warrants executed today are the result of Operation Digital Gridlock, a joint investigation conducted by the FBI, the Office of the U.S. Attorney for the District of Columbia, and the Justice Department’s Computer Crime and Intellectual Property Section. This operation targeted illegal file sharing of copyrighted materials over five Direct Connect peer-to-peer networks that belonged to a group known as The Underground Network. According to search warrant affidavits unsealed today, these networks required users to share a minimum of one to 100 gigabytes of computer files with other users on the network. Upon becoming a member of one of these peer-to-peer networks, each user could then download shared files from the hard drives of all other members on the network. Theft through the illegal reproduction and distribution of movies, software, games, and music is estimated to cost U.S. industries $19 billion worldwide each year.

The maximum penalty for criminal copyright infringement in violation of Title 17, United States Code, Section 506 and Title 18, United States Code, Section 2319, for a first-time offender is five years incarceration and a fine of $250,000. Title 17, United States Code, Section 506, also provides for the forfeiture and destruction of infringing copies and all equipment—including the computer equipment—used in the manufacture of the pirated materials.

The investigation in this case is ongoing.

 

[explodet]

Reggie Fils-Aime unavailable for questioning.

 

[IJoel]

Wrong forum?

 

[PhatSaqs]

"It begins"

 

[DJ Demon J]

Wrong forum?

The investigation focused on game piracy (as well as movie/music/software piracy). I included the anime reference as a joke (unfortunately, there is no anime trade association--I've often received pleas for assistance from anime publishers in taking down sites/users offering unlicensed anime).

 

[Wario64]

Is it still illegal to download anime that hasn't been licensed?

 

[doncale]

what about people who download ROMS ? not distribute them, but download ?

 

[DaCocoBrova]

Hey Demon... Since you work with them, could you give us GAFers a 'heads up' on sh!t like this? Finding out in a press release is a wee bit on the 'late' side.

 

[Culex]

The investigation focused on game piracy (as well as movie/music/software piracy). I included the anime reference as a joke (unfortunately, there is no anime trade association--I've often received pleas for assistance from anime publishers in taking down sites/users offering unlicensed anime).

*Breathes sigh of relief*

*continues to download anime*

 

[IJoel]

The investigation focused on game piracy (as well as movie/music/software piracy). I included the anime reference as a joke (unfortunately, there is no anime trade association--I've often received pleas for assistance from anime publishers in taking down sites/users offering unlicensed anime).

That HDLoader thread:

Hey Demon... Since you work with them, could you give us GAFers a 'heads up' on sh!t like this? Finding out in a press release is a wee bit on the 'late' side.

hahahaha

 

[DJ Demon J]

Wario64, doncale: Just downloading something copyrighted illegally without paying for it, while morally wrong, does not break any laws that I'm aware of...

DCB: I'd love to, but I'm under NDA on these sorts of things. If I break street date, I'll be the one going to federal-pound-me-in-the-ass prison....Well, not really, but...

Culex: Just be aware that although there is no anime trade association, the USDOJ and other law enforcement agencies can nail you for anime as well. They'll track down every company who's products have been pirated....while it's easier for them to do when there's a trade association for that particular industry, it doesn't mean they'll just be like "oh, well, we can't get in touch with any anime companies, so we'll have to let Culex go because he only pirated anime."

iJoel: I don't get your joke.

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

why do people use p2p.... noobs *shifty eyes*

 

[FoneBone]

Just curious -- what's your stance on downloading TV episodes (as a substitute for taping or TIVOing them)?

 

[Culex]

Wario64, doncale: Just downloading something copyrighted illegally without paying for it, while morally wrong, does not break any laws that I'm aware of...

DCB: I'd love to, but I'm under NDA on these sorts of things. If I break street date, I'll be the one going to federal-pound-me-in-the-ass prison....Well, not really, but...

Culex: Just be aware that although there is no anime trade association, the USDOJ and other law enforcement agencies can nail you for anime as well. They'll track down every company who's products have been pirated....while it's easier for them to do when there's a trade association for that particular industry, it doesn't mean they'll just be like "oh, well, we can't get in touch with any anime companies, so we'll have to let Culex go because he only pirated anime."

iJoel: I don't get your joke.

I buy the licensed stuff and usually only download new unlicensed anime. You do bring up a good point though.

 

[Meier]

iJoel: I don't get your joke.

The HDloader thread "is a trap."

P.S. I've bought tons and tons of anime and never purchased a single title I didnt watch on fansub prior to it being available on R1. If companies start trying to prevent fansubs of even unlicensed products, I'll simply stop buying their DVDs. Their loss, not mine.

 

[DJ Demon J]

Just curious -- what's your stance on downloading TV episodes (as a substitute for taping or TIVOing them)?

I assume you mean me...

With taping or TiVOing, you've already paid to receive that content through your cable fee. So making a tape/TiVOing the content shouldn't be an issue (although the actual legality of that I'm not 100% sure of--I do know the broadcast TV/movie industry's panties are in a bunch over it, but whether that activity violates copyright law I don't know).

However, just downloading it is definitely a violation because you haven't paid for it, in addition to the material being distributed without the copyright owners' permission. In the case of taping/TiVO, it's personal use. Sitting in #TV-RIPs4U-HORIZON-OWNS-JOO and queueing up Season 7 of Buffy isn't legal.

 

[DJ Demon J]

The HDloader thread "is a trap."

P.S. I've bought tons and tons of anime and never purchased a single title I didnt watch on fansub prior to it being available on R1. If companies start trying to prevent fansubs of even unlicensed products, I'll simply stop buying their DVDs. Their loss, not mine.

Ah, now I get it. *chuckle*

As well you should on the "stop buying" comment. Instead of bitching about lack of favored anime content coming to the US, consumers should vote 2 ways--first, and most importantly, with their wallets, and second, by contacting the companies directly, respectfully and repeatedly inquiring about their favored material being released in the US.

 

[Wario64]

I don't see how it's any different if you record a show on a DVR and then backing it up on a DVD-R (there are DVR's that let you do this if I remember)

 

[DJ Demon J]

I don't see how it's any different if you record a show on a DVR and then backing it up on a DVD-R (there are DVR's that let you do this if I remember)

That's not the question that was posed to me, the question I was asked was about downloading shows.

 

[snapty00]

It's technically illegal to download anything that's copyrighted (and EVERYTHING is copyrighted, whether it has a notice or not), if you don't have permission and you're not going by other loopholes (such as "fair use," parodies, or expired copyrights).

Technically, it's illegal to copy and paste someone else's messages on the Internet. They are copyrighted, because anything created is copyrighted. Registering it with the government just makes it more formal and easier to defend in court.

Of course, that's all theoretical; if you try suing someone over a copy-and-pasted message, you're not going to win unless the court is some type of joke.

Also, even with the laws in place, you have to decide for yourself, regardless of copyright law, what is ethical and what isn't. There are lots of copyright laws that I break but don't care because I know nobody is getting hurt, except for some tightass lawyer sitting in his parents' basement crying about how I technically broke an unreasonable copyright law.

 

[Kon Tiki]

OH NOS!

I downloaded copyright material onto my PC when viewing this thread.

SOMEONE BAN CACHES!

 

[Ghost]

You guys should start at universities, i doubt if you'll find a single piece of licensed software in the dorms , and they are distribution hubs too (in my experience)

 

[open_mouth_]

wait, is this thread about the PSP or what?

 

[FoneBone]

You guys should start at universities, i doubt if you'll find a single piece of licensed software in the dorms , and they are distribution hubs too (in my experience)

Actually, that reminds me of a headline in this week's Onion: "Photoshop Actually Bought."

 

[DJ Demon J]

It's technically illegal to download anything that's copyrighted (and EVERYTHING is copyrighted, whether it has a notice or not), if you don't have permission and you're not going by other loopholes (such as "fair use," parodies, or expired copyrights).

Technically, it's illegal to copy and paste someone else's messages on the Internet. They are copyrighted, because anything created is copyrighted. Registering it with the government just makes it more formal and easier to defend in court.

Of course, that's all theoretical; if you try suing someone over a copy-and-pasted message, you're not going to win unless the court is some type of joke.

Also, even with the laws in place, you have to decide for yourself, regardless of copyright law, what is ethical and what isn't. There are lots of copyright laws that I break but don't care because I know nobody is getting hurt, except for some tightass lawyer sitting in his parents' basement crying about how I technically broke an unreasonable copyright law.

IANAL, but I don't believe it's illegal to download anything copyrighted. The laws focus on distribution. And not every idea is copyrightable. Saying "I have this idea about this omnipotent being called 'God'" doesn't mean you instantly have the rights to make and sell 'God' b-ball shoes and Hot Topic T-Shirts.

"Decide for yourself what is ethical", that's fine and dandy, but try passing that argument in front of a judge when the laws of the land you live in says otherwise.

Oh, and nice thinly-veiled insult against me. I give it an 8 out of 10.

 

[Kon Tiki]

You guys should start at universities, i doubt if you'll find a single piece of licensed software in the dorms , and they are distribution hubs too (in my experience)

What a brilliant idea. Let's arrest the youth of america. Hey, at least its better than shooting them, right, right?!?

 

[BuddyC]

I'll read the text of this later (in class now)...but this should be interesting. Hope you're in chat later tonight Jason, I've got some questions to pester you with.

 

[Dilbert]

“Today we are sending a clear message that federal law enforcement takes piracy seriously,” said U.S. Attorney Kenneth L. Wainstein. “It is illegal to trade in copyright-protected materials on the Internet. This is theft, plain and simple. If you are engaged in this behavior, you are on notice that you are not as anonymous as you may think.”

Great...now even "U.S. Attorneys" can't get the f?cking law straight.

On a slightly different topic, does anyone else find it logically inconsistent that downloading TV shows which previously aired on public airwaves would EVER be illegal? The show was shared with people FOR FREE, and since anyone can copy that broadcast for later personal use (record on a VCR, TiVO, etc. and replay at your leisure at some unspecified time in the future)...it is totally ridiculous that downloading the EXACT SAME BROADCAST from some other source would be illegal.

 

[dark10x]

I will continue to download anime that remains unlicensed for US release. If a show is broadcast on a free television channel, I see nothing wrong with downloading that same show over the internet. It isn't as if we could even BUY anything if we wanted to. Thankfully I won't have to do that for much longer.

OF course, what could the US courts even say about downloading something created for public distribution in another country? Many of these shows have NO connection to the US.

 

[Dragona Akehi]

What about the legality of someone paying for the channel, taping and then realising there's a "better quality rip" from the SAME channel they paid for and downloading that for archival purposes?

Television in particular seems like a very grey area.

 

[fennec fox]

Just because something is shared for free (i.e. shown on TV, played at a concert) doesn't mean that the creator throws his rights to sell the product away.

What about the legality of someone paying for the channel, taping and then realising there's a "better quality rip" from the SAME channel they paid for and downloading that for archival purposes?

Yeah, yeah, tell it to the judge!

 

[Dragona Akehi]

This is irrelevant to me simply because I'm not American, and therefore immune to your silly laws.

It's more of a "what if" situation. How DO you tell what's legal with all of these possiblities? It isn't cut and dry in terms of pirating DVDs, Games, or other content that is readily available. Many TV spots aren't even available to buy (as of yet). What about imports when there's a domestic version available? Etc.

The way the USDOJ/MPIAA/RIAA make it sound, eventually you'll be automatically charged for thinking of a "copyrighted work".

 

[isamu]

This is irrelevant to me simply because I'm not American

???

Where are you from?

 

[kiryogi]

I will continue to download anime that remains unlicensed for US release. If a show is broadcast on a free television channel, I see nothing wrong with downloading that same show over the internet. It isn't as if we could even BUY anything if we wanted to. Thankfully I won't have to do that for much longer.

OF course, what could the US courts even say about downloading something created for public distribution in another country? Many of these shows have NO connection to the US.

Well, usually TV Tokyo and similiar aren't free. So in general its a shady area, but pf course getting licensed material is definitely a nono XD

 

[snapty00]

IANAL, but I don't believe it's illegal to download anything copyrighted. The laws focus on distribution. And not every idea is copyrightable. Saying "I have this idea about this omnipotent being called 'God'" doesn't mean you instantly have the rights to make and sell 'God' b-ball shoes and Hot Topic T-Shirts.

"Decide for yourself what is ethical", that's fine and dandy, but try passing that argument in front of a judge when the laws of the land you live in says otherwise.

Oh, and nice thinly-veiled insult against me. I give it an 8 out of 10.

Dude. Stop being so fucking paranoid. I don't even know what the hell you're talking about some "thinly veiled insult" against you. If I wanted to insult you, I'd do it.

 

[Kon Tiki]

Dude. Stop being so fucking paranoid. I don't even know what the hell you're talking about some "thinly veiled insult" against you. If I wanted to insult you, I'd do it.

There are lots of copyright laws that I break but don't care because I know nobody is getting hurt, except for some tightass lawyer sitting in his parents' basement crying about how I technically broke an unreasonable copyright law.

He is the tight-ass lawyer.

 

[DDayton]

I believe the heaviest penalties are tied to distribution of illegally copied materials, but copying/downloading a copywritten work is still illegal.

 

[dark10x]

Well, usually TV Tokyo and similiar aren't free. So in general its a shady area, but pf course getting licensed material is definitely a nono XD

Well damn, that kinda sucks.

Any idea if a simple HD firewire tuner will allow me to tune into Japanese stations? You see, I'm not so sure that my apartment in Japan will have a TV when I arrive. It is a pre-furnished apartment (since I'll only be there for a couple years or so), so there is a chance...but I am bringing a laptop with an external tuner for the purpose of playing console games on the LCD. Being able to watch TV would be a nice bonus, but I am unsure as to whether I could actually DO that...

 

[Chrono]

IANAL, but I don't believe it's illegal to download anything copyrighted. The laws focus on distribution.

Ok wait so I can't be arrested for downloading anything? That makes no sense since then everybody can d/l everything and just not distribute... ?

The HDloader thread "is a trap."

P.S. I've bought tons and tons of anime and never purchased a single title I didnt watch on fansub prior to it being available on R1. If companies start trying to prevent fansubs of even unlicensed products, I'll simply stop buying their DVDs. Their loss, not mine.

Yep, the only anime I buy that I have not watched on fansub are the big hits every body talks about like Rahxephon and Kenshin. hell even for those I saw dual-audio DVD rips all over the net and I could’ve EASILY saved myself over 200 dollars. I bought those to support the anime industry but if 20 dollar DVDs are the ONLY way to watch anime then I'll probably only buy 3-4 disks a month. With the risk of getting bad anime and the cost of finishing a whole series (7 disks for a 26 episode one) I'll probably watch A LOT less anime and end up buying less and less DVDs.

Take Samurai Champloo. The first few episodes, with the exception of 1, are SO BAD if I got the DVD I would probably forget about the rest. Right now I'm watching FMA which is licensed. The show is so good I'll definitely get the boxsets. The same with Ghost in the Shell: SAC. Without the fansubs I'd probably only choose one of those two (FMA or Gits) to buy on DVD instead of both.

If the U.S. anime companies want to eliminate fansubs WITHOUT hurting their business, the only way is to start a decent (not like ADV's..ugh) anime network to compete with Cartoon Network's adult swim. OR even better would be an in-demand channel where they have the subs and dubs to offer and unlike ADV's anime network at least offer ALL episodes of a series and not just episode 4 and 16 of a certain one (off-topic: is ADV crazy?). Shows that get licensed early could be subbed/dubbed 3-4 weeks after the Japanese episode airs and we’d pay 1-2 dollars for an episode and watch them on a weekly basis just like on Japanese TV. That would ROCK.


There will also be no more fansub comparison or delays and we'll all hurry up to the official FMA or One Piece threads right after watching the accurate Funimation sub on indemand TV. [/wishful thinking]




EDIT:

Actually what I would do if fansubs are gone is to just RENT anime DVDs. I'll rent a good 10-11 disks a month from rentAnime.com and anime companies will get 0 profit and everything will be 100% legal.

 

[DJ Demon J]

Ok wait so I can't be arrested for downloading anything? That makes no sense since then everybody can d/l everything and just not distribute... ?

Someone has to distribute the files to begin with...

 

[Mooreberg]

I won't feel safe until more 12 year olds are arrested.

 

[Uncle Dukey]

Someone has to distribute the files to begin with...

Also, every bittorrent user is distributing...

 

[Chrono]

Someone has to distribute the files to begin with...

But what if I don't distribute and only d/l? Am I "safe" or something...?

Also, every bittorrent user is distributing...

IRC bots >>> bittorent.

 

[The Faceless Master]

basically, if you receive a copy of something from someone who does not have the legal right to distribute it, then it is an illegal copy... yes, this even includes "unlicensed" anime, videogame titles that have no licensed distributor in your region, etc... downloading is just a civil matter though (e.g. http, ftp, usenet, xdcc, fserve)... but actually distributing it is a criminal matter (e.g. any filesharing client where you upload the file to others as you download, or sharing via one of the other previously mentioned methods)...