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[ShadowRed]

^^^^


Go Mike it's your birthday. We gonna party like it's your birthday.


:lol

 

[Flynn]

This discussion reminds me of an excellent episode of Frontline called The Merchants of Cool.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/cool/

The basic conceit is this: Marketing or all kinds takes cues from the street, presents it in a hyper-real form only to have the audience consume and reflect it back, in a cultural feedback loop.

The glorification of violence, crime and other antisocial behaviors is one way that many genres or music, not rap exclusively, are sold.

I'm not saying that this sales technique is a good or bad thing, just that within the myriad of distinctions between artform, product, image, and real-world behavior the force and influence of marketing shouldn't be discounted.

 

[Flynn]

This doesn't happen in any other music industry/sect, or at least not nearly on this broad a scale.

How about the blues?

The culture that spawned Blues was a world of violence.There were several noted Blues singers that were convicted of murder, there were even more Bluesmen that were themselves murdered. This week on Blues Before Sunrise we’ll be listening to records by candidates from this second group. Robert Johnson, Buster Pickens, Eddie Mapp, Frank Melrose and Scrapper Blackwell were among Blues singers who’s careers were ended by murder. Henry Strong, Sam Cooke, and Lee Jackson were among the Blues singers murdered in Chicago. We’ll listen to records by those listed above and go to work finding more. Their lives were cut short but their work lives on. Blues From The Murderer’s Home - only on BBS!

From: Blues Before Sunrise

 

[karasu]

Marvin Gaye was killed by his father. Selina was killed by a crazed fan.

So Tupac, Notorious BIG, Mac Dre, Freaky Tah, Soulja Slim, Seagram Miller, Big L, Jam Master Jay were all gunned down. I have a sneaking suspicion that at least one or two of those murders may have been connected with another rapper or rap label. Just a hunch!

And while some of these referenced, like Lisa Lopez, aren't constructive to the current debate at hand, I did find this through Google;


This doesn't happen in any other music industry/sect, or at least not nearly on this broad a scale.

This is retarded. For one most of those guys are unknown , and the only thing that list proves is that rap is from the fuckin ghetto. That has nothing to do with awards shows or black people not knowing how to act when they get together, and it has NOTHING to do with rapper vs rapper. There is absolutely nothing surprising about gang violences' effect on black youth. Rap is from the streets. You didn't know that? Something like 80 percent of every rap recorded reminds you of that fact.

 

[karasu]

And her eyou go Mike, a rock list. 21 murders with 2 rappers on the list. Let's blindly assume that it was a case of rock stars killing rock stars!

http://www.av1611.org/rockdead.html

 

[Master Z]

I used to be a big hip hop fan back in the day, but had to walk away when it became nothing more than anger and hatred directed at groups, and even at amongst each other. And people wonder why rappers get such a bad rap?

Some say that you can't blame the bad apples, but considering that much or rap is based upon image, I really don't see too many of these esteemed "artists" (and I use that term very loosely) doing much to change the negative stereotype and keep order in their house.

First of all you're listening to the wrong artists man. Secondly, there are lots of emcees who make positive and creative music, it's the labels and their execs that continually sign and push "artists" who glorify that gangsta/pimp shit. Pay no mind to the mainstream and check out artists like Talib Kweli, Mos Def, Slum Village, Aceylone, Jedi Mind Tricks, Blackalicious, Buck 65... the list goes on...

 

[Mike Works]

How about the blues?

That's quite interesting, I didn't know that. One could evidently add the Blues industry (of yore?) to coincide, if not at a lower level, than the Rap industry.

This is retarded. For one most of those guys are unknown , and the only thing that list proves is that rap is from the fuckin ghetto. That has nothing to do with awards shows or black people not knowing how to act when they get together, and it has NOTHING to do with rapper vs rapper.

First, Tupac and BIG had NOTHING to do with rapper vs rapper? Really?

Second, you harp that most of the guys are unknown, as if that makes any difference whatsoever to the conversation at hand, and then, in your very next post, you cite;

Mia Zapata, Peter Tosh, James Sheppard, Bobby Ramirez, John 'Jaco' Pastorius, Felix Pappalardi, Don Myrick, Al Jackson, Bobby Fuller, Rhett Forrester, King Curtis, and Sam Cooke??

Call me crazy, but something tells me you might not have too many playlists featuring Shep & the Limelights, Edgar Winter's White Trash, or the Bobby Fuller 4.

And her eyou go Mike, a rock list. 21 murders with 2 rappers on the list. Let's blindly assume that it was a case of rock stars killing rock stars!

http://www.av1611.org/rockdead.html

Wow, only 2 rappers to contrast 21 murders on a list entitled; Premature Death of Rock Stars? Inconceivable! Why they put BIG and Tupac on that list to begin with is beyond me.

And sure, we could blindly assume that's the case, but why blindly assume when we can research and discredit! Lets start from the top of your last, shall we?

Mia Zapata

The 1993 killing of Seattle punk-rock singer Mia Zapata, which baffled police and her fans for nearly a decade, appears to have been solved with the arrest of a man in Miami.

Police say they used DNA evidence to tie Jesus Mezquia, 48, to the slaying.

Mezquia was arrested late Friday. He is a Cuban native who lives in the Florida Keys, where police searched his home Saturday, a law-enforcement source told the P-I.

Investigators have no reason to believe Zapata, 27, knew the man -- only that she somehow encountered him on Capitol Hill early July 7, 1993.

Peter Tosh

Shortly after the release of his 1987 album, No Nuclear War, Tosh was murdered at his own home during a burglary. He died on September 11, 1987. Only one of the three men was caught. One of Tosh's personal friends was sentenced to hang following the murder trial.

James Sheppard
In 1970, James Sheppard was robbed then murdered.

(this is all I've been able to find relating to his death, if anyone can find anything else?)

John 'Jaco' Pastorius
Brilliant bassist Jaco Pastorius dies from injuries suffered when he is severely beaten by a bar bouncer.

Felix Pappalardi

Gail Pappalardi collapsed in her lawyer's arms last night as she was told she'd been acquitted of murdering her rock-star husband. She was found guilty of criminally negligent homicide, the least serious felony charge she faced. She is expected to be released today on $5000 bail.

The blonde widow of Felix Pappalardi, one of the top record producers in the Sixties, sobbed with relief when she heard the verdict. A six-man, six-woman jury bought her story that she shot her husband dead during a bizarre bedside firearms lesson with a loaded derringer.

Mrs. Pappalardi came close to being totally exonerated. Until a few minutes before the verdicts were handed down, there were four jurors holding out for acquittal on all counts.

The criminally negligent homicide verdict means Mrs. Pappalardi caused her husbands's death, failing to understand the deadly risk in the situation in which he died. She faces up to four years in prison, but may not be jailed at all.

Don Myrick

(session sax player) Member of Earth, Wind and Fire. Accidentally killed by police.

Bobby Fuller

Coroner ruled his death a suicide, others muse it was at the result of organized crime.

John Lennon

John Lennon was killed by a deranged fan on Dec. 8, 1980, as he returned to his New York apartment from a recording session.

Sam Cooke

Cooke wearing one shoe and a jacket broke into the motel's office where he thought she was hiding. There he found Bertha Franklin the motel's manager who shoot him three times with a .22. Cooke was shoot and killed on December 11, 1964 at the Hacienda motel in Los Angeles. The manager of the motel, Bertha Franklin claimed Cooke had tried to rape a twenty one year old woman Elisa Boyer and then turned on her. The coroner's office ruled the death as justifiable homicide.

As for the people who's info was hard to find, if anyone can find any sources or knows of any sites that lists this stuff in detail, it'd be appreciated.

Al Jackson's info was difficult to track down due to the time of his death and Michael Jackson. Bobby Ramirez was near impossible thanks to another Bobby Ramirez being more popular. Rhett Forrester only has basic info ("shot") regarding him, as most sites that look useful regarding information are in German and Japanese for some God only knows reason. There's no info on King Curtis other than he was stabbed outside his apartment.

So to sum up, we've got one who was murdered by a 48 year old Cuban man who didn't know who she was, one who was murdered in a burglary of his house by one of his own friends, another who was murdered while being robbed, one who was beaten to death by a bouncer at a bar, one who was accidentally shot by his wife, one who was accidentally killed by police, one who commited suicide (if not taken out by the mafia), one killed by a deranged fan, and one who was shot while trying to rape a woman. Then there are the four who's information I couldn't muster up.

Surprisingly, aside from POTENTIALLY 3 of the 4 that I couldn't find info on, there were no drive by's (and I'd be really surprised if Rhett Forrester was done in like that). I'll accept that the fact that rap has sprouted from the ghetto contributes to the violence, but the industry hasn't exactly capped off that root. Regardless over whether or not the Rap industry is fueled (PARTIALLY) by gun toting thugs from the ghetto, and whether or not it's the ghetto that is responsible, it is still compromised, partially, of these people, and is thus represented by them.

And with that, I'm going to go make myself a sandwhich.

 

[karasu]

Are you shitting me? Okay

Second, you harp that most of the guys are unknown, as if that makes any difference whatsoever to the conversation at hand, and then, in your very next post, you cite;

So you really think it makes sense to both blindly assume that the deaths you posted were cases of artists versus artist violence, AND to use a list of unknown Artist as a gauge of what commonly goes on in the industry?? That makes no sense to me. I'm sure you haven't even heard of most of thos eguys until you googled them, yet your mind was already made up that Rappers are commonly shooting and fighting one another.

Wow, only 2 rappers to contrast 21 murders on a list entitled; Premature Death of Rock Stars? Inconceivable! Why they put BIG and Tupac on that list to begin with is beyond m

Err, I was just pointing out that they had a couple of rappers on the list, so not all of the 21 deaths could be attributed to "Rock Stars".

And sure, we could blindly assume that's the case, but why blindly assume when we can research and discredit! Lets start from the top of your last, shall we?

Ah. I see you missed the sarcasm in that statement. OF COURSE those guys weren't killed by other Rock stars. The point was that it's ridiculous to blindly assume that was the case, as you so wonderfully illustrated with your collection of quotes and bold text. You see, you posted a list of Dead MC's as if it has anything to do with what went on at the Vibe show, and assumed that they were artist versus artist situations. Since when do little known MC's speak fo an industry as a whole?

For example, I'll imitate your post.

An inquest into the death of black musician, Michael Tachie-Menson, (30 when killed), has reached a verdict of unlawful killing. Michael was burnt to death by a gang of racists in Edmonton, North London on 28 January, 1997. The inquest heard that Michael was still alight when police found him semi-naked and dazed wandering along the North Circular Road. He died two weeks later in Billericay Hospital, Essex.

When Michael was in hospital he told a number of people that he had been set alight by four white youths in a racist attack, but police decided not to believe him or even investigate it as a murder. Police decided that he had mental problems and had committed suicide by setting himself alight on a busy road!

The inquest jury found that that police conclusion was rubbish and all the evidence pointed to the fact that Michael had been burnt by racists. The police's failure to take seriously a black man on his death bed has allowed the filthy perpetrators of this hideous crime to go undetected. Police then spent months denying the evidence that it was a murder until just before the inquest began when they finally issued a limited "apology" echoing the sorry after the event tone taken in the Lawrence inquiry - once the police know they have been exposed. Again, as in the Lawrence inquiry, Scotland Yard said that three officers had retired before the inquiry was completed and four junior officers have received "words of advice and constructive discussions with senior officers".

Michael's family attacked the police for failing to interview the victim in hospital. They have have campaigned for the attack to be recognised as racially-motivated and now they intend to push things further by getting the case reopened and taking the police to the European Court of Human Rights. They also want there story to be heard at Part II of the Lawrence inquiry - something the Movement for Justice will be fighting hard for in their support

The South Bay duo plays Arsenio Hall, tours the world and becomes the West Coast equivalent of Pete Rock and CL Smooth. Charizma's hometown, Milpitas, loses its reputation as the Gateway to Fremont, inspiring A&R reps to flood the city and Japanese hip-hop heads to make pilgrimages to Milpitas High to see where Charizma sharpened his battle chops.

And maybe, just maybe, Hicks doesn't take a wrong turn down an East Palo Alto street in December 1993 where he was shot and killed.


The tragic end of Charles "Charizma" Hicks' life earned a blot on the obituary sheet that rearranged the words "rapper," "gun," "murder" and "streets" from the previous week but didn't fully convey just who Charizma was. The posthumous release of Big Shots fills in the backstory of a promising rapper cut down before his time.

Big Shots is the lost album from Charizma and Peanut Butter Wolf, containing 15 recordings from 1991 to 1993. Hollywood Basic never released the record, viewing the two as anomalies to the gangsta rap explosion. To play catch up, the label tried to toughen the group's image with suggestions right out of CB4. Seeing the fit wasn't right, the duo broke out of its contract and pondered its next move. Hollywood Basic sat on the album and released the single "Red Light/Green Light" on a promo cassette single with a track by the Lifers Group--a rap crew with actual jailed inmates--on the flip.

It's a good thing that PB Wolf and Charizma held on to their down-home personas.

Police have apprehended a suspect in connection with
the murder of underground Harlem MC Big L (Lamont
Coleman). According to New York Police Officer Theresa
Farello, Gerard Woodley, 29, was arrested 10:20 a.m.
Thursday in a Bronx apartment and charged with second-
degree murder. "The suspect had an ongoing dispute with
Coleman's brother," Officer Farello told BLAZE
Online. Gerard, who also is a native of Harlem, is
wanted on a federal warrant for drug trafficking. He will
be arraigned in a Manhattan Criminal Court and held
without bail. As we last reported, Big L, a member of
the Bronx hip hop crew Diggin' in the Crates, (a group
of MCs and producers that include Fat Joe, Lord
Finesse, Diamond D and Showbiz and A.G.), was
gunned down February 15 near his home in Harlem,
NY. An upcoming album by DITC, will posthumously
feature Big L on several songs.

Q-Don (Raeneal Quann) - Died 4-25-2000 - Shot outside a nightclub in Philadelphia during an attempted robbery ( Rap ).

The circumstances surrounding Seagram's death aren't too clear. Apparently Seagram was in an area known as the Twamps. [FYI..There is currently a movie being made about the Twamps]. There were rumors circulating that there were some folks who have long wanted to see him wasted. That wish unfortunately came true.. when an unknown gunman emerged from the darkness and shot at Seagram's partner Gangsta P... Seagram tried to shield P and wound up taken the bullets that mortally wounded him. Gangsta P was taken to the hospital in serious condition

hat was when Pat's album was comin out and he wanted to promote it, he wanted to go back down there. I'm like don't mess with that cat, we got plenty more shows we can do. But he wanted to promote himself, he went down there. And the dude, they were kicking it, he was a flashy dude, liked to flash what he got. Some kinda way he got robbed or something, he thought Fat Pat had something to do with it. He called Pat over to give him some money for comin back and doin the show. Basically, because he thought Fat Pat had something to do with him getting robbed, he shot Pat. He killed him. He gonna get what's comin to him. Pat, that's a real cool dude.

Anthony “Wolf” Jones, was shot after an argument about a woman. A man has been charged with his murder.

From Vallejo, The Mac (Michael Robinson) was killed in a case of mistaken indentity, he released 2 EP's on tape on Strictly Business records, called Enough Of Tis Shit and The Game is Thic

The bassist for "Beat 'Em Up," Lloyd "Mooseman" Roberts, was murdered shortly after work was finished on the album. Pop told Billboard that it was with Roberts that he was able to breathe new life into his band, which also includes brothers Whitey and Alex Kirst on guitar and drums, respectively.

"I wanted to shake them out of all complacency. I didn't want anybody comfortable. So, I said, 'We need a new bass player. And we need something hot.' "

Roberts, Pop says, was the victim of a drive-by shooting last February. Roberts was in the driveway of a friend's South Central Los Angeles house, helping the friend install a car stereo, when he was shot in the back. He was 38 years old.

blah blah and blah. Same ol shit everybody else on earth is murdered for.

 

[Shinobi]

I have to agree there is a lot of Hollywood Liberals, but I don't think I would call them elite, more along the lines of idiots with a lot of money who think they are intellectual leaders or something. I am a liberal guy, but every time Susan Sarandon or Barbra Streisand start talking about politics, I really want to knock them the fuck out for making the left look really stupid.

I can deal with Susan Sarandon, and it isn't just because I had a crush on her from White Palace. I think she actually has a clue about what she's talking about. People like Barbera Streisand though just sound like complete idiots.

Fixed.

:lol :lol :lol




I recall someone being murdered at a Rolling Stones concert back in the late '60's. Think it happened right in front of the stage. The rock industry got the same sort of overly negative coverage that the rap industry does now. The amount of high powered rock stars that OD'd in the 60's and 70's was pretty ridiculous. Of course that fast life image also helped create it's appeal as well. It isn't much different to the rap industry now, except the bodyguards carry guns (chances are Lennon's still breathing if he had bodyguards with guns on 'em). There are a lot of positives in rap, but the negative is always easier to cover.

 

[Xenon]

To me it just seems like these idiots are forced to backup the stuff they rap about. I think people should just view these events like a hockey game and think of the fight as just another aspect of the show. Get some refs and have a penalty box.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

I recall someone being murdered at a Rolling Stones concert back in the late '60's. Think it happened right in front of the stage. The rock industry got the same sort of overly negative coverage that the rap industry does now. The amount of high powered rock stars that OD'd in the 60's and 70's was pretty ridiculous. Of course that fast life image also helped create it's appeal as well. It isn't much different to the rap industry now, except the bodyguards carry guns (chances are Lennon's still breathing if he had bodyguards with guns on 'em). There are a lot of positives in rap, but the negative is always easier to cover.

i think you are talking about Altamont. Some guy got stabbed to death in the crowd (don't think it happened right in front of the stage, as the Stones kept on playing IIRC and had no idea what was going on) because some moron had the bright idea to hire the friggin HELLS ANGELS to run security for the show. The "security" ended up being the ones that beat/stabbed this guy to death.

 

[Flynn]

i think you are talking about Altamont. Some guy got stabbed to death in the crowd (don't think it happened right in front of the stage, as the Stones kept on playing IIRC and had no idea what was going on) because some moron had the bright idea to hire the friggin HELLS ANGELS to run security for the show. The "security" ended up being the ones that beat/stabbed this guy to death.

For those who don't know, back then the Hell's Angels weren't just a bunch of burly guys who like Harleys. They were an honest-to-god gang who's mains source of income was selling crank (called such because they stashed it in the motorcycle crank case)..

 

[Dram]

Don't they still do that?

 

[Trakball]

Yeah but it's all about meth nowadays (same as crank? I dunno)

 

[Flynn]

Yeah but it's all about meth nowadays (same as crank? I dunno)

Crank is Crystal Meth.

And the Hell's Angels aren't half as dangerous as they used to be.

 

[RobotChant]

Yeah but it's all about meth nowadays (same as crank? I dunno)

Basically it's the same thing. Crystal meth (Crank) is the smoked form.

 

[Trakball]

Oh, okay.

 

[G4life98]

way too much drug knowledge on this board :lol

 

[RobotChant]

Go karasu it's your birthday. We gonna party like it's your birthday :/

A list of people that probably lived in the ghetto and was murdered like many others in the ghetto is suppose to define rap as a whole?

I think people should just view these events like a hockey game and think of the fight as just another aspect of the show.

Yeah, fights in hockey are a necessity. Without it, players would start smashing each others face in with their sticks.

 

[Renegade]

Seriously, how stupid.

You don't open your eyes much, do you?

 

[Shinobi]

i think you are talking about Altamont. Some guy got stabbed to death in the crowd (don't think it happened right in front of the stage, as the Stones kept on playing IIRC and had no idea what was going on) because some moron had the bright idea to hire the friggin HELLS ANGELS to run security for the show. The "security" ended up being the ones that beat/stabbed this guy to death.

:lol Yeah, that was the part I forgot...that was a smooth move. :lol I think they hired the Angels cause the Stones were friends with some of those guys, and they could be hired for cheap. It isn't like the Stones intentionally hired these guys to start trouble...it's just the way things turned out. Same deal with the Vibe Awards.

Yeah, fights in hockey are a necessity. Without it, players would start smashing each others face in with their sticks.

I used to buy into that argument, but I think it's just bogus...nobody fights in the playoffs, nobody fights at the Olympics or in the World Cup, and fights rarely happen in Europe. It's just an "eye for an eye" culture that permeats North American hockey (the sort of culture that lead to Bertuzzi getting his ass in trouble). Which isn't to say I don't like hockey fights...I absolutely love watching two evenly matched guys go toe to toe. But I'll never fool myself into thinking it's a neccessary part of the game.

 

[Mike Works]

I used to buy into that argument, but I think it's just bogus...nobody fights in the playoffs, nobody fights at the Olympics or in the World Cup, and fights rarely happen in Europe.

Nobody fights in the playoffs, Olympics, and the World Cup because every single game you play in those formats is direly important, and you don't want to hurt your team by instigating or even focusing on anything like that. If you get slashed across the leg, you have to take it and get it out of your mind, else you risk taking a retaliation penalty.

The regular season is 82 games, so you can take the chance of maybe hurting the team and maybe costing them the game. And Europe is Europe, what are they going to do, have the Sedins fight the Sundins?

 

[Luscious LeftFoot]

Not sure if it's been mentioned...

Seems Young Buck committed the stabbing, a warrants been issued for his arrest.

Well, that about wraps it for his career.

 

[Master Z]

Not sure if it's been mentioned...

Seems Young Buck committed the stabbing, a warrants been issued for his arrest.

Well, that about wraps it for his career.

Unfortunatley, in today's rap climate that charge and any future conviction has just guaranteed his next album will sell at least 3 million copies...

 

[Trakball]

....which is reenforcing the point I've been trying to make.

 

[Master Z]

The only point that re-enforces is: violence sells. What else is new?

 

[Trakball]

The only point that re-enforces is: violence sells. What else is new?

So it's cool, then? Same old same old?

 

[Master Z]

What's cool? That violence sells? I really don't care. I'm not buying that shit.

 

[karasu]

Bitches. That doesn't prove shit other than that you assume your conjectures are
facts that mirror the state of the world at large. His next album could flop just like every other inmate wannabe MC. :lol

 

[Shinobi]

Nobody fights in the playoffs, Olympics, and the World Cup because every single game you play in those formats is direly important, and you don't want to hurt your team by instigating or even focusing on anything like that. If you get slashed across the leg, you have to take it and get it out of your mind, else you risk taking a retaliation penalty.

The regular season is 82 games, so you can take the chance of maybe hurting the team and maybe costing them the game. And Europe is Europe, what are they going to do, have the Sedins fight the Sundins?

But that's my point...when a game is important, nobody fights. The regular season is a glorified exhibition schedule, so nobody cares if they ejected from those games. Hell, they probably look to get ejected, just to spare themselves from the bordem. And who fights 95% of the time anyway? Team A's goon versus Team B's goon. You're rarely gonna see the goon fighting a skilled guy or a cheap shot artist, cause he'll get an instigator and be called a bully or a coward.

I say take the goons out of the game and let the skilled guys fight for themselves. At least then the fights would have some meaning.

 

[Flynn]

Not sure if it's been mentioned...

Seems Young Buck committed the stabbing, a warrants been issued for his arrest.

Well, that about wraps it for his career.

Suge's career didn't end with incarceration.

 

[Master Z]

Bitches. That doesn't prove shit other than that you assume your conjectures are
facts that mirror the state of the world at large. His next album could flop just like every other inmate wannabe MC. :lol

This is G-Unit. Get ready for the flood of "FRee Young Buck" shirts if he gets convicted. G-Unit is like a brand name. They will hype his return and people will buy it. It could be shit but it's guaranteed to sell. And how will he be viewd as a "wannabe inmate MC?" This award show incident just backs up what he's been saying on every song. Now the public has seen it. He's "real".

 

[shuri]

What's cool? That violence sells? I really don't care. I'm not buying that shit.

But it works with the target demographic. Who cares!

 

[Mike Works]

But that's my point...when a game is important, nobody fights. The regular season is a glorified exhibition schedule, so nobody cares if they ejected from those games. Hell, they probably look to get ejected, just to spare themselves from the bordem. And who fights 95% of the time anyway? Team A's goon versus Team B's goon. You're rarely gonna see the goon fighting a skilled guy or a cheap shot artist, cause he'll get an instigator and be called a bully or a coward.

I say take the goons out of the game and let the skilled guys fight for themselves. At least then the fights would have some meaning.

I wouldn't mind seeing the true "goons" taken out, like the Proberts of past, but where do you draw the line? Domi's a goon, but he also contributes offensively more than some, and also provides a spark to the team when they often direly need it. As you mentioned, even if you take out the real goons, you'll still have fighting thanks to skilled players who don't mind dropping the gloves, like Iginla, Jovanovski, Thornton, Guerin, Shanahan, etc.

Who would you suggest taking out of the league?

 

[Trakball]

But it works with the target demographic. Who cares!

I fucking do. I'm not the only one, either, but I'm definitely in the minority.

I used to wonder why people didn't give hip-hop credit. Why they didn't take it seriously. I think I understand why, now.

 

[Fresh Prince]

This is G-Unit. Get ready for the flood of "FRee Young Buck" shirts if he gets convicted. G-Unit is like a brand name. They will hype his return and people will buy it. It could be shit but it's guaranteed to sell. And how will he be viewd as a "wannabe inmate MC?" This award show incident just backs up what he's been saying on every song. Now the public has seen it. He's "real".

I'm here ready with the 'Free Young Buck' shirts.

rc213's made a purchase you can too, only $10.

Also gansta rap != the whole of Hip-Hop. I wish 'other' types of rap would take over the mainstream.

 

[Trakball]

Also gansta rap != the whole of Hip-Hop. I wish 'other' types of rap would take over the mainstream.

It's the most popular genre, it's the genre on TV the most, it's the genre that most white folk see on tv with thugs wylin' out and say "rap is crap" or something really fucking stupid

 

[Fresh Prince]

It's the most popular genre, it's the genre on TV the most, it's the genre that most white folk see on tv with thugs wylin' out and say "rap is crap" or something really fucking stupid

Yes I know that. That is why I would like the more positive genres/elements of Hip-Hop to be in the Top 40 charts ie Nas- I Can (even though it was a bit corny)

 

[Shinobi]

I wouldn't mind seeing the true "goons" taken out, like the Proberts of past, but where do you draw the line? Domi's a goon, but he also contributes offensively more than some, and also provides a spark to the team when they often direly need it. As you mentioned, even if you take out the real goons, you'll still have fighting thanks to skilled players who don't mind dropping the gloves, like Iginla, Jovanovski, Thornton, Guerin, Shanahan, etc.

Who would you suggest taking out of the league?

Anyone racking up more then 150 PM's for starters.

It's hardly on the top of my priority list...I'd rather see the rinks widened and the refs call all the annoying clutch and grabbing that's been taking place for far too long. Again I enjoy fighting, so if it stays forever (even with the goons) it won't bother me. But no one can convince me that it's an important part of the game.

 

[Master Z]

rc213's made a purchase you can too, only $10.

:lol No thanks. If Young Buck goes to jail that's none of my concern.

Also gansta rap != the whole of Hip-Hop. I wish 'other' types of rap would take over the mainstream.

Yeah, it would be nice if artists like that could get more play on radio and tv.

 

[Trakball]

Yes I know that. That is why I would like the more positive genres/elements of Hip-Hop to be in the Top 40 charts ie Nas- I Can (even though it was a bit corny)

eh, fuck Nas, he hasn't been shit since "Illmatic"

 

[Fresh Prince]

Street Disciple would say otherwise
Easily Hip-Hop album of the year*

*Waiting for Common's album to be better

 

[Trakball]

Street Disciple would say otherwise
Easily Hip-Hop album of the year*

*Waiting for Common's album to be better

I'd put "Or Stay Tuned" by People Under the Stairs, "Madvillian" by MF Doom & Madlib, "Taste the Secret" by Ugly Duckling or Vikter Vaughan's "Vaudville Villian" in the top spot.

And Common? maybe he's got some fire in his belly now that he's not with Erykah; that woman does wierd things to mens' creativity

 

[Fresh Prince]

Just my opinion ....although I think Vaudeville Villain came out in 2003.

 

[Mike Works]

Anyone racking up more then 150 PM's for starters.

It's hardly on the top of my priority list...I'd rather see the rinks widened and the refs call all the annoying clutch and grabbing that's been taking place for far too long. Again I enjoy fighting, so if it stays forever (even with the goons) it won't bother me. But no one can convince me that it's an important part of the game.

God, I'd give anything to get rid of the clutching, especially considering how less effective it would make some teams. Like the Flames. And their fucking clutching. MOTHER FUCKING

But yeah, watching tapes of the Canucks vs Jets, you watch thinking, "HOW DID THAT GUY JUST GO END TO END ON A STRIDE" and realize it's because he was able to stickhandle and not get his jersey grabbed. It's frustrating, but one of the few positives of the lockout is we don't have to deal with it.

On a sad note, I put on my Cooke jersey yesterday just to remember what it felt like wearing one.

 

[Trakball]

I think Vaudeville Villain came out in 2003.

Yeah I think you're right. Definitely not VVII though, that's atrocious

I would put MF Doom's "MMMM Food" on there, but the bootleg version I've had for the last few months is soooo much better than the one he just released (damn sample clearances!)

 

[Shinobi]

God, I'd give anything to get rid of the clutching, especially considering how less effective it would make some teams. Like the Flames. And their fucking clutching. MOTHER FUCKING

But yeah, watching tapes of the Canucks vs Jets, you watch thinking, "HOW DID THAT GUY JUST GO END TO END ON A STRIDE" and realize it's because he was able to stickhandle and not get his jersey grabbed. It's frustrating, but one of the few positives of the lockout is we don't have to deal with it.

On a sad note, I put on my Cooke jersey yesterday just to remember what it felt like wearing one.

:lol Sadly, improving the way the game is played has gotten lost in all this lockout crap. I don't think they have to change that much...the refs just need to call any impeding of progress with the stick a hook (even if they don't fall down), and I think that would improve things dramatically. I also think they need to make the boards and glass a lot softer...we'll probably never see it the way it used to be at the Boston Garden or the Aud, but they need to have more give then they do right now (which is like, zero).