How about "Buy me a new Display or Fuck your HDCP"....
http://www.apcstart.com/teched/pivot/entry.php?id=6
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Vista hardware req's....m*&$^% F*#kers
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How about "Buy me a new Display or Fuck your HDCP"....
http://www.apcstart.com/teched/pivot/entry.php?id=6
ManaByte said:
That's not true at all. There aren't any legal versions of Hollywood movies, but other stuff can be made without any copyright protection.
And yes, there will be unencrypted HD movies. I believe that HDCP will be a hardware requirement however, and therefore you still will have to watch downgraded video without an HDCP connection.
3rdman said:
that's fine, but realize that HD players won't work on older versions of windows. Hollywood is very serious about trying to stop all piracy of their HD content.
3rdman said:
your component only HD is analog. This is for digital, to prevent bit perfect copies.
Who knows if they'll do the same for analog VGA - they might. Even though HD STBs are already on the market with analog component outs (and HDD recorders for perfect copies),
I doubt you'll see a bluray player doing anything more than 480p via component. Heck, even upscaling DVD players don't upscale unless you have HDCP, and thats not even real detail.
As annoying as it is, why on earth would they spend money protecting home systems, yet leave PCs open for abuse?
deadhorse32
Bad Art
DVD = not mandatory copy-protection
HD = mandatory copy-protection
HD = mandatory copy-protection
I heard about that years ago so AFAIK it's true 
It even extends to your personal documents etc, not just video and audio
If it happens then MS can go fuck themselves. There is no way I am letting them have that kind of control over my private information. It basically boils down to asking for permission to access my own files? If you think people will stand for that then they're in for a big fucking surprise
It even extends to your personal documents etc, not just video and audioIf it happens then MS can go fuck themselves. There is no way I am letting them have that kind of control over my private information. It basically boils down to asking for permission to access my own files? If you think people will stand for that then they're in for a big fucking surprise
123rl said:I heard about that years ago so AFAIK it's true
If it happens then MS can go fuck themselves. There is no way I am letting them have that kind of control over my private information. It basically boils down to asking for permission to access my own files? If you think people will stand for that then they're in for a big fucking surprise
People will stand for it because they're idiots, and because Windows is the biggest OS on the market.
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
Actually I'll wait for the fine hackers who will no doubt fuck that shit.Dan said:
But seriously, it is if like MS wants me to drop Windows for Linux. Too bad Linux sucks for serious gaming, otherwise Bill would have one customer less.
Burger
Member
I wouldn't stress out.
They said the same shit about DVD's, now you can by T-Shirts screenprinted with the DeCSS code.
The fact is, this shit will be bypassed. Perhaps not straight away, but it will happen, in time.
There is alot of evidence to suggest that if a group or company release a product that is overly restrictive, consumers simply do not adopt. See the Divx DVD format for example. You had DVD's which were initially cheaper to purchase, but then you had to repurchase to watch again 48 hours later, not to mention a special player, a phone jack. It's sheer lunacy.
It's the same with all this DRM music and video shit. I want what's on my computer to be mine to do with as I please. Not, you can play this on this hardware only, even though all this other stuff you have is equally capable.
They said the same shit about DVD's, now you can by T-Shirts screenprinted with the DeCSS code.
The fact is, this shit will be bypassed. Perhaps not straight away, but it will happen, in time.
There is alot of evidence to suggest that if a group or company release a product that is overly restrictive, consumers simply do not adopt. See the Divx DVD format for example. You had DVD's which were initially cheaper to purchase, but then you had to repurchase to watch again 48 hours later, not to mention a special player, a phone jack. It's sheer lunacy.
It's the same with all this DRM music and video shit. I want what's on my computer to be mine to do with as I please. Not, you can play this on this hardware only, even though all this other stuff you have is equally capable.
Phoenix
Member
rastex said:
The ability to keep running Windows and Windows-based products is what you get out of it because Microsoft will trigger an upgrade obsolesence cycle after Vista comes out - only making some core technologies that you need to run certain programs available on Vista. Don't worry, Apple does it too - its what pushes you to upgrade.
V
Vennt
Unconfirmed Member
The problem is that the "push to upgrade" has either slowed or stalled for many. PC game releases are slowing (And PC game displays are rapidly shrinking in gamestores near me.)
What real need for the kind of processing power we currently have in the home desktop without gaming remains? Hobbiest video/graphics maybe, Audio editing etc. certainly can manage on lesser hardware.
I would give up PC gaming period before I'll let shit like that fuck with my PC / Data.
Without gaming I have no need to be "cutting edge".
So it's starting to look like Microsoft may be making one of the perceived weaknesses of Linux irrelevant, clever!
What real need for the kind of processing power we currently have in the home desktop without gaming remains? Hobbiest video/graphics maybe, Audio editing etc. certainly can manage on lesser hardware.
I would give up PC gaming period before I'll let shit like that fuck with my PC / Data.
Without gaming I have no need to be "cutting edge".
So it's starting to look like Microsoft may be making one of the perceived weaknesses of Linux irrelevant, clever!
Hurricane_Chris
DDK
OSX Next and Vista will hav the same content protection stuff built into it. We can only hope that Apple keeps Quicktime as tightly coupled with the core OS as it is now so hackers can continue to use Quicktime API's and libraries to work around OSX's protection. After all, if you actually own a Mac and know how it works all of the DRM stuff Apple has implemented thus far can be bypassed without much effort.
Burger said:
But that's why it's so serious this time. They want to prove that they have a perfect copy protection system and that means this ridiculous system.
tbh I just will NOT accept using this system. I'll stick with XP for a few more years (I'm perfectly happy with it now) and then I'll move over to Apple who - I assume - won't make me ask for permission when I want to look in my address book, write a letter or watch a trailer on the internet
RonaldoSan
Member
How is this all Microsoft's fault? They just either support it or not. It will be the same with every other legit os/platform.
123rl said:
Yep. That's why it's so serious this time. Do you guys know WHY it's so serious? Because, this is the last "double dip" on the horizon. Once we get HD movies with 5.1 sound, what's left? More extras? Longer lasting media? Nope, nothing. The HD movies I buy will be as relevant to me as they are to my grandkids. And that is the ONLY crux (besides keeping the movies off the internet...ahem... :lol ). They know that the HD movie I buy tomorrow will be in my child's collection when I die, and the days of double dipping are numbered. Not double-dipping for DD's sake, but dd because the records/tapes wear out, or dd because the movie looks so much better. There is no reason for us to buy their old shit more than one more time, and that scares the studios to death.
All I say is, they better make that CP good, because once it's broken, they are going to have to take us all to court, and god knows that's working out so well this time.
Good point. I never thought of it like that actually. There'll always be something better on the horizon but I'd say hi-def is here to stay for at least another 10-15 years. The Japanese are working on a successor to HD already though, that has 4000 lines of horizontal resolution!! Apparently it's so detailed that it is identical to real-life
Burger
Member
DJ_Tet said:
You sir, are wrong.
Thats a typical "640k of memory will be enough for everyone" viewpoint. There will always be better, always. What about when in 10 years time movies are stored in full 3D to view on your holocine megaprojector ? It will come stored in a crystal cube no bigger than your fingernail.
Believing that HDDVD is the be all and end all of home cinema is a pretty short sighted outlook.
I don't *really* give a shit about all this HDCP protection bullshit. Someone will find a way around it, perhaps not for the average consumer, but for me, there will be a way to make the content that I purchase mine to do with as I please. Perhaps thats a short sighted viewpoint, as copy protection technology IS improving. But I believe it will happen.
Sorry guys, using another OS isn't necessarily going to be a viable route.
People are asking "Why would I want to buy a monitor that has all this shit in it?" The answer is "Because you want to watch high-def content." Without the monitor, you're not going to get the content in true high-def.
It's a similar reason for why MS are putting this stuff into vista. They're just making sure they make the product that the consumer wants. They're going to want to be able to play high-def content and to do that, they need to play ball with the high-def standards groups - they turn round to MS and say "If you want to be able to enable your users to watch this content, you need to give us these guarantees that our content is going to be safe in these particular ways." If they turn round and say "No thanks, we can't agree to those terms" they can't have that feature in vista. They could possibly hack a workaround but that'd be a huge legal risk.
The same line of reasoning goes to graphics card and monitor manufacturers. The problem isn't MS, it's the technology (HD-DVD and Blu-Ray) and its protection.
Anyway, have a read of this excellent article: http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/hardware/hdcp-vista.ars
People are asking "Why would I want to buy a monitor that has all this shit in it?" The answer is "Because you want to watch high-def content." Without the monitor, you're not going to get the content in true high-def.
It's a similar reason for why MS are putting this stuff into vista. They're just making sure they make the product that the consumer wants. They're going to want to be able to play high-def content and to do that, they need to play ball with the high-def standards groups - they turn round to MS and say "If you want to be able to enable your users to watch this content, you need to give us these guarantees that our content is going to be safe in these particular ways." If they turn round and say "No thanks, we can't agree to those terms" they can't have that feature in vista. They could possibly hack a workaround but that'd be a huge legal risk.
The same line of reasoning goes to graphics card and monitor manufacturers. The problem isn't MS, it's the technology (HD-DVD and Blu-Ray) and its protection.
Anyway, have a read of this excellent article: http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/hardware/hdcp-vista.ars
Sorry, meant to say a few words on encryption and the breaking of it.
I think we've had it fairly good when it comes to cracking/hacking things. Just because things have been cracked easily in the past doesn't mean this will always be the case. Then there's a thing called "key revocation" so that if a program is cracked, the content providers can do something about it. It's touched on in the article I linked to above though it doesn't really explain it that well and I'm a little confused as to how that will actally work but still, it goes to show that a hack could be shortlived.
I think we've had it fairly good when it comes to cracking/hacking things. Just because things have been cracked easily in the past doesn't mean this will always be the case. Then there's a thing called "key revocation" so that if a program is cracked, the content providers can do something about it. It's touched on in the article I linked to above though it doesn't really explain it that well and I'm a little confused as to how that will actally work but still, it goes to show that a hack could be shortlived.
Burger said:
There will always be better. I should have qualified what I said by saying any movies shot on film, but I figured everyone would be able to figure that out. I'm nearly 30, by the time we have 3D movies stored on a cube, maybe I'll have my hovercar and be living on the moon. Most likely we'll both be dead though, and HD movies will still be the standard.
It's not the end-all-be-all, but it's the end of double dipping through past cinema classics. One more time, that's all they got, and if they screw it up this time, their property might as well be public access with the way high broadband is coming.
A 3-D Gone With The Wind? I won't hold my breath. And at the lack of quality coming out of studios recently, don't think that they devalue their classics like you seem to.
---edit 3d movies seems to be a bad idea to begin with, now change that to 3d sports broadcasts and you have something
123rl said:
:lol :lol :lol
if there's any software company that is just as bad about DRM as Microsoft, it's Apple. Plus, the fact is that these encryption technologies are being forced by the studios (RIAA and MPAA), not the software companies themselves. So you won't see a hardware player that works with any OS that is not fully "secure".
iapetus said:
Well, I don't think I'll be buying Vista. I think I'd be afraid to. Yeah... looks like I'll stick to XP for years to come or finally use how to learn Linux. Perhaps all of this news will make even the most hardcore of Linux users realize a user-friendly comparable to Vista Linux distro should be in the works.
All of this news is really disgusting. I use my PC for browsing, mp3's, WoW, backing up DVD's and AIM. That's all I want. They're making Vista an extremely beefy, complex OS. They're trying too hard. And the demands of the MPAA/RIAA are ridiculous, not to mention I think they should be unconstitutional.
And making people blow another $500 on a decent display is pure evil. There's nothing wrong with my SyncMaster 710T, a DVI display that was probably made to last for years to come, but if I have Vista it sounds like I would have to buy another LCD.
Then again are we overreacting? What if you just use a media player like Winamp for audio and video? How can the OS block or monitor your usage of such programs? Ditto for DVD (and, eventually HD-DVD or Blu-Ray) Decrypter. BitTorrrent... pick an obscure port; how is Vista going to know to report it to the RIAA or MPAA?
If this is all supposed to be tied into Windows Media Player and IE, fine by me, I don't use those programs anyway.
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