FlowersisBritish
fleurs n'est pas britannique
I didn't really think about it this way, but yea. Every time I debunked a weird thing to my democratic friends, they just accept it.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Vox: Democrats are falling for fake news about Russia
- Thread starter Makonero
- Start date
I didn't really think about it this way, but yea. Every time I debunked a weird thing to my democratic friends, they just accept it.
DontBeThatGuy
Member
Well, I'm not sure about all of them.
ViperVisor
Member
That stuff tends to stay narrow-cast.
The conservative nonsense often reaches the airwaves on radio or fox news or even up to elected Republicans.
The conservative nonsense often reaches the airwaves on radio or fox news or even up to elected Republicans.
maquiladora
Member
When there is more than enough real news to prove this, you don't need fake news.
Lord Frieza
Member
Article feels like it's reaching, for sure. I mean, this stuff is out there, sure, but it rarely gains traction. The left generally gets their news from multiple sources, so a lot of fake news loses credibility pretty quickly, and I feel those on the left are generally more skeptical. I mean, I'm sure that there are people who fall for it hook, line and sinker, but it's not nearly as widespread as I feel this article is trying to make it. Can't help but feel like this is a bit too much of a 'both sides' piece.
hmm...
https://www.theguardian.com/media/2017/may/16/fake-news-sites-reports-facts-louise-mensch
Embarrassing how many Gaffer re-post the bilge she tweets.
BlastProcessing
Member
It's all obvious bullshit. It's hopium laced fanfic peddled to a scared and needy audience.
Ok, all but that one.
Ok, all but that one.
7DollarHagane
Banned
Being gullible isn't a part of your political views. It's human nature. We all have to be persistent in thinking critically.
DangerMouse
Member
Yeah I agree and the OP doesn't even include much stuff I've seen get around anyway, and we don't need fake stuff since like you said plenty of the real stuff also makes it pretty clear Trump has done some of this stuff (even accidentally admitting it) and goes beyond Trump, from their own lies and contradictions trying to cover it up and write it off that have come out to what they've been telling since the beginning.
This.
catapult37
Member
I've never heard any of the stuff in the OP. Guess it pays to avoid facebook.
DangerMouse
Member
Yeah I don't even have one lol.
Costa Kid
Member
Look at the millions who fall for Alex Jones' CRAZY conspiracy theories.
adamsappel
Member
It also seems like some of this fake news isn't being spread by actual lefties. I'm suspicious of some of the accounts who try to peddle it here. "I'm on GAF but only post in Trump-related threads and don't even like videogames." Smacks of "What's this Gamergate thing? Some game developer sleeping with journalists for good reviews? I'm just asking questions."
One Eyed Willy
Member
This
Version 3.0
Member
Fake alt-right news gets debunked - by leftists.
Fake leftist news get debunked - by leftists as well.
When's the last time you saw even a GOP elected official debunk right wing bullshit? McCain saying Obama wasn't a terrorist in the 2008 election?
Fake leftist news get debunked - by leftists as well.
When's the last time you saw even a GOP elected official debunk right wing bullshit? McCain saying Obama wasn't a terrorist in the 2008 election?
Shake Appeal
Member
This is particularly insidious because the Russia-Trump collusion story clearly has legs and requires long-term, thorough investigation. And it may well end this White House.
That's why I'm sympathetic to people getting pulled into the more farfetched stuff that orbits the core story. Whereas a lot of conspiracies on the "other side" have literally no basis in anything resembling reality.
That's why I'm sympathetic to people getting pulled into the more farfetched stuff that orbits the core story. Whereas a lot of conspiracies on the "other side" have literally no basis in anything resembling reality.
TheCochese
Banned
Going to copy this permalink for the next time I see bullshit peddled.
There is definitely some truth to Democrats falling victim to the same fake news tactics in light of this ordeal since it seems just following along in big breaking news threads, poorly sourced news and teases pop up from Twitter but fortunately from what I've seen, people tend to call it out and the reason I even know of names like Mensch and Taylor is because people on here have call their credibility and sources into question when their tweets have been posted here. Some of that certainly is due to a thirst for news on the scandal and part of it is honestly just due to how rapidly breaking news is actually unfolding around this.
I think Democrats, liberal pundits, and everyone else really needs to take a deep breath since all this Russia stuff is still only getting started. Even with how fast things are moving, it will be a long process and even if people are anxious to get the answers now, and I do feel there is at least a degree of time sensitivity to finding out ASAP, it's a process that needs to be methodical, if I've learned anything in all the history lessons about Watergate in the last couple weeks. I also think that Mueller seems like the type of person that is especially thorough, which means to cover something that has the potential scope of something like this, especially if there is various agents and compromised figures in a complex web of corruption, we need clarity in a time of confusion. That applies to everyone watching, even when it's easy to watch the whole ordeal and get swept up in the theatrics, finding the truth is the most important thing that we all need to agree on.
I think Democrats, liberal pundits, and everyone else really needs to take a deep breath since all this Russia stuff is still only getting started. Even with how fast things are moving, it will be a long process and even if people are anxious to get the answers now, and I do feel there is at least a degree of time sensitivity to finding out ASAP, it's a process that needs to be methodical, if I've learned anything in all the history lessons about Watergate in the last couple weeks. I also think that Mueller seems like the type of person that is especially thorough, which means to cover something that has the potential scope of something like this, especially if there is various agents and compromised figures in a complex web of corruption, we need clarity in a time of confusion. That applies to everyone watching, even when it's easy to watch the whole ordeal and get swept up in the theatrics, finding the truth is the most important thing that we all need to agree on.
IrishNinja
Member
yeah, i'm just blocking these 3 so ill know it's shit when i see them retweeted elsewhere...vox makes a fine point about nothing preventing the left from falling for this shit as well
This is also very true. I remember seeing a couple studies recently proving that the left not only falls for less fake news than the right, but that the left also debunks/moves on from fake news much faster.
While I get really annoyed at Mensch and everyone posting random Twitter shit on here, in no way is it comparable in severity or scale with what goes on with the right.
Lord Frieza
Member
Receipts?
Also, Mensch and Taylor do have "some" sources mixed in with their bullshit, they have been right on some very large things. They are far more credible then what many people consider actual "fake news" which is the "Hilary Clinton Sold Children Slaves to Iran."
These things are like baseball rumour mills, and I assume most people treat them as such. (Just like I assume some people take them far too literally). Idk why you'd even bring it up though, these type of journos have existed for a very long time
These things are like baseball rumour mills, and I assume most people treat them as such. (Just like I assume some people take them far too literally). Idk why you'd even bring it up though, these type of journos have existed for a very long time
boiled goose
good with gravy
Id like to see numbers of Democrats that actually believe such things first.
Earthbound64
Banned
Are they falling for it or tasked with spreading it...
There are definitely enough nutty people on the left to legit spread this stuff. Come on, dudes. We don't need to resort to meta-level "actually it's Russian propagandists talking about Russian propagandists" or whatever.
I don't see a ton of this being posted on gaf, though maybe I'm in the wrong threads. I only really remember that one dude with the skull avatar.
Earthbound64
Banned
So, not very many people (relatively speaking), then?
(To be clear, my comment is with regards to the subscription numbers of NYT and WP)
Raven117
Member
This....Great first post.
... and yet they are often right... and they clearly have some connections.
e.g. today Taylor correctly cited Kushner as the person of interest that the the Washington Post's headline story is referring to.
Joy Reid and The Independent have gone on to confirm this:
https://twitter.com/Independent/status/865676301809700864
That's not to say that we must believe everything they post, but "fake news" is not strictly applicable here.
e.g. today Taylor correctly cited Kushner as the person of interest that the the Washington Post's headline story is referring to.
Joy Reid and The Independent have gone on to confirm this:
https://twitter.com/Independent/status/865676301809700864
That's not to say that we must believe everything they post, but "fake news" is not strictly applicable here.
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
I haven't heard of any of these and Louise Mensch is a crazyperson. I didn't realize the NYT published an op-ed from her though. That's embarrassing.
BrutishMrFish
Member
When there were literally only two people it could have been, that does nothing to help Taylor's credibility. And even then, Taylor and the others aren't "often" right, they are "sometimes" or "occasionally" right with a whole lot of crap thrown in that people wave away because it's what they want to hear.
Zeus Molecules
illegal immigrants are stealing our air
The Piss tapes and anything related to them is Bait. Even if they existed I doubt we will ever see them. Louise Mensch and Claude Taylor also are fake news in my opinion.
If 25,000 shares or similar is considered widespread deception the Left has it pretty good. There are things Russia and the Alt-right pushes that gets shared hundreds of thousands of times if not millions and that is not counting the Air Time Foxnews and the like will give it.
Anything on the internet should be taken with a heavy dose of healthy skepticism. I don't care who is saying it unless they are the exact individual involved there can be spin or misleading presentation of facts.
That's where the difference is too. There is maybe unfounded information pushed that yeah Trump is about to go to prison and its all gonna happen today and that is misleading and it may take years if ever. That is different from peddling PedoPizzagate etc. where there is nothing but intention to harm and cause destruction.
Anything on the internet should be taken with a heavy dose of healthy skepticism. I don't care who is saying it unless they are the exact individual involved there can be spin or misleading presentation of facts.
That's where the difference is too. There is maybe unfounded information pushed that yeah Trump is about to go to prison and its all gonna happen today and that is misleading and it may take years if ever. That is different from peddling PedoPizzagate etc. where there is nothing but intention to harm and cause destruction.
Airola
Member
Well, right now it feels as if many news networks are competing on who gets to break the next Trump scandal.
I mean, have we actually gotten any actual 100% confirmed news where things have been studied and it can be said without a question that something certain has happened or will happen. No, it's always something about some "top official" and "sources" telling things are crazy. To me, feeling the need to bring out these "sources have told" stories with many "might be / might have / could be / could have" added to them shows they are craving for being able to break in the next hot story. You get the hottest new take on how Trump will soon fall and you've got your much needed clicks and followers in minutes.
I just can't help but see the parallels between what is happening now and what has happened for years and years with the right-wing nuts, and hell, even in god damn video game culture
The closer E3 or some other major gaming event is, the more there are "sources" saying whatever. And most often nothing is real. It's really not that much different with politics either.Not to say none of the claims aren't true or can't be true, but for crying out loud, for the past week it seems as if they are writing new scandals daily. And people here have been totally ecstatic about the amount of "bombs" are dropping. And it even feels like for many the amount of different things happening must be a proof of it all being real. Like, the more you hear about it, the more real it gets.
It's like a day without another Trump scandal is too boring.
which it kinda really is though, can't deny it's exciting and even entertaining.
EDIT:
Also I still find it absurd how things have changed concerning Russia. Left used to ridicule the right for their phobia towards Russia / Soviet Union, and rightfully so. It has turned completely upside down. Now the left fear Russia like nothing else and right tries to be ok with them (or at least Trump tries to, lol).
Yeah. Even if she were 50/50, that's still a pretty shitty track record for a so called journalist. She's a rumor monger and anti-Russian conspiracy theorist (which is pretty damn unnecessary considering what they actually do). Anything legit she picks up on will come out in outlets like NYT or WaPo, after real journalists have done the leg work.
As for fake news, Democrats aren't clinging to it at nearly the level Republicans have been. It's important to see that it is spreading though, and to stay vigilant. We certainly don't want it to reach that level.
Astral Dog
Member
Reading all the threads you would think Trump is going to get kicked out of the White House and jailed any moment,unfortunately i don't think thats the case but still interesting
Vincent Alexander
Member
Agreed completely. Hell, I never even heard of any of these fake new stories, but I sure heard about a billion of the GOP ones.
No they aren't. You only remember the stories they get right.
It'd be like taking PizzaGate seriously because the instigator was the first to identify Susan Rice in that unmasking thing.
Funkyhamster
Member
Why do Claude Taylor and Louise Mensch always get lumped together? It seems like Taylor's track record is better, as of right now.
I've said this before, but I think there are two main differences between the Twitter Trump/Russia conspiracy theorists and "fake news:"
1. The Twitter conspiracy theorists (or Claude Taylor, at least) are making concrete, falsifiable claims, and these claims aren't disputing mainstream reporting. If a WaPo story were to come out that contradicted Louise Mensch, and she continued to stand by her story and claim that the mainstream media was lying, I would consider that "fake news" (maybe she's already done this, and I just don't know about it).
2. The conspiracy theories are generally about Team Trump facing the consequences of their actions, not the actions themselves (and again, this might be less true of Louise Mensch than the others). It would be bad if a bunch of liberals were evaluating Trump poorly because of fake news, but as far as I can tell, liberals despise Trump because of factual, well-established sources, and the conspiracy theories are just letting them fantasize about the future.
Edit: I did not expect to be on the top of the page, plz be gentle
I've said this before, but I think there are two main differences between the Twitter Trump/Russia conspiracy theorists and "fake news:"
1. The Twitter conspiracy theorists (or Claude Taylor, at least) are making concrete, falsifiable claims, and these claims aren't disputing mainstream reporting. If a WaPo story were to come out that contradicted Louise Mensch, and she continued to stand by her story and claim that the mainstream media was lying, I would consider that "fake news" (maybe she's already done this, and I just don't know about it).
2. The conspiracy theories are generally about Team Trump facing the consequences of their actions, not the actions themselves (and again, this might be less true of Louise Mensch than the others). It would be bad if a bunch of liberals were evaluating Trump poorly because of fake news, but as far as I can tell, liberals despise Trump because of factual, well-established sources, and the conspiracy theories are just letting them fantasize about the future.
Edit: I did not expect to be on the top of the page, plz be gentle
Similar threads
- Locked