Insane Metal
Member
I enjoyed the first episode a lot. 😊
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Westworld - Live in Your World, Play in Ours - Sundays on HBO
- Thread starter RatskyWatsky
- Start date
PlayALLtheGames
Banned
Ok new page so I'll ask here again:
Why do they store the decomm'ed hosts? Why not grind them up or recycle them for parts or something? All that storage space to have them standing around?
Why do they store the decomm'ed hosts? Why not grind them up or recycle them for parts or something? All that storage space to have them standing around?
Straight Edge
Member
Hopefully so daddy Abernathy can persuade them to rebel in a later episode!
Smart bet would be
it's a policy implemented by one of the brains behind the park (probably AH's character) who is backing the robot revolution.
What a weird experience for me. I love the premise and enjoyed the episode but something felt a bit off and underwhelming at the same time. Almost like the plot is epic and leaves a lot of room for mystery, but the dialog scenes seemed to mostly fall flat until the final moments of the episode.
Can't wait to see what's next.
Can't wait to see what's next.
If they already have the facility, why not just keep them? Probably a lot of money invested and maybe they can find some use later.
Would you even call the hosts robots? It's certainly not as clear cut as it was in the original film. Underneath the surface, they have a replica human skeletal structure, blood flows through them, and yet everything is inorganic and they are programmable through other technology.
It's very nit-picky I know, but they aren't quite androids, where to me everything below the skin resembles nothing like a human (and sometimes even on the surface), and yet they can't claim to be cyborgs because little to nothing in them is natural and organic. Replicants maybe?
It's very nit-picky I know, but they aren't quite androids, where to me everything below the skin resembles nothing like a human (and sometimes even on the surface), and yet they can't claim to be cyborgs because little to nothing in them is natural and organic. Replicants maybe?
Yeah it makes sense on a lot of levels to me and that's a good point as well.
From the logic of the universe it also makes sense.
It has to be less complicated to program these beings and keep the illusion up when they are designed for a world where the ideas and technologies to explain what they are is so foreign to them. Like the photo the AI was pondering over forever and given this is America, the myths of the western frontier are easy pickings for the authors and keeps the stories rather centrally located. Not to mention anywhere with swords would make it harder to do the whole killing indulgence with robots.
You do Rome and what? You travel across countries to go on a campaign for glory and then come back for a triumphant? You'd need thousands of AI for that.
Man Called Aerodynamics
Member
I don't think anyone was expending much thought and effort on how to store them. It looked like they were in some kind of abandoned sub-basement. It was flooded with water and the HVAC system had failed two weeks ago and no one cared. It may as well have been a landfill that they were burying them in.
Steelyuhas
Member
Not that any of us will likely take his advice from the last tweet.
I can't believe you'd even bring it up!
Cornballer
Member
I suppose self-delusion is a gift of natural selection as well.
More_Badass
Member
Also given how part of the appeal is being out in nature, that "natural splendor", makes me curious if everyday life is some ruined industrial climate-changed disaster, and being able to experience fishing and riding horses in pristine untouched landscapes is a luxury
Garrett 2U
Member
They fly was incredible symbolism.
Obviously there's the whole "They can't even hurt a fly."
And throughout the episode we see the AI show no reaction to a fly landing on them.
Why not? They are programmed not to hurt a living thing, there's nothing they can do about the situation.
But there's more to it than that.
We see the fly land on the sheriff and it malfunctions, in front of a couple guests.
The development team investigates for hours but they can't figure out the "BUG" that caused the issue.
Why did the sheriff malfunction at that point in time? It was going through an internal struggle to swat the fly, to kill a living creature.
A fly landing on a person is such a small event that went completely unnoticed to the guests and investigators, but it is a blaring signal to the audience that the AI is fighting against its programming.
Then there is the wonderful interview between Dolores and the security guard.
He straight up asks her "Would you hurt a living creature?" And she responds "No".
And in the next scene we see her casually, and instinctually, kill the fly.
The symbolism is that no matter how closely monitored the robots are, humans aren't able to catch the small signs that the AI is evolving against its programming.
Controlled by software, so I'd say it's appropriate.
I assumed they did it to keep things somewhat fresh. I.e. they periodically cycle Hosts back into the park, so guests get to see new faces/Hosts/stories.
Impossible to say at this point. Are older Hosts incompatible with new updates? Is it cheaper to create new Hosts than it is to store them? Is there any irreparable damage that can be done to them? Can they be reprogrammed for new storylines?
Considering that Dolores is one of the oldest hosts in the park, it seems they can be updated fine.
More_Badass
Member
Which makes you wonder if Dolores is unique in any other ways besides nostalgia. Old Bill didn't get that treatment. Why are some kept for years, decades, continually being repurposed and repaired, while others are placed in storage? Are those all machines that had dangerous glitches or went "off script" like the father?
PlayALLtheGames
Banned
That's what I would have thought but if they were capable of just wiping them and reprogramming then I'd think they'd never need to fully decommission one. Or maybe it's a lot more complicated for the really messed up ones and they just put them there for the meantime, though it seems like some have been down there a long time.
Guessing that fact that she was constantly getting upgraded/parts replaced plus her popularity, given the man in black has been a constant costumer. I bet popular hosts get used longer while less popular hosts get rotated out.
Probably a liability risk to put a malfunctioning host back in the park. If it did somehow hurt a guest and there were problems in the past with that unit, it would seem worse.
ZeroCypher
Member
Traces of old code? Ghost in the shell
Just so you know, "The woman in the white shoes", also sometimes red shoes, is a very old toast, and is the kind of semi-crudity you'd expect from an aged cowboy in his cups. I wouldn't attach any particular meaning to it unless it becomes a recurring theme.
More_Badass
Member
Maybe she HAS been pulled out of rotation in the past. They definitely say she's the oldest host, but does anything ever indicate that she's been active the entire time?
People seem to be assuming that the storage area is effectively end of life for these Hosts, and the way the area is treated supports that, but we can't be sure yet.
I could also read "oldest Host" as referring to her character, or model, without being specific serial number. Like she's vintage, but not neccesarily the original.
Edit:
I keep thinking about it as a desktop admin. If I have a PC that crashes on a user, I'll probably try to repair/restore it in whatever way gets them working fastest. If they have further issues later on, I might go as far as replacing some components and/or wiping it to install a fresh OS. If something happens again after that though, I'm probably going to give them new hardware and dispose of the old stuff completely.
In the meantime, I've got a shelf with 20 or so spare PCs that were left when employees quit, or we did an IT refresh, etc.
dead souls
Member
Incredible symbolism? More like obvious and trite.
Damn this thread is going off the rails with hyperbole.
More_Badass
Member
The episode was called "The Original" so I imagine that's what we're supposed to imply.
I think it's about evolution. If we consider that hosts are retired if they are shown to be outpaced by newer models, or that their core code just hasn't adapted enough to be of use in the new demands of more complex settings, or that their programming flaws surface and make the management uncomfortable, then Dolores must be the host who has adapted most successfully over the years. This means as she is upgraded she is able to learn quickly and be just as useful and effective as any other new model, and if she has any flaws, she does a very good job of hiding them so she is never taken out of service. True AI evolution.
Well yeah Delores is literally the first host (or at least the first host that was polished enough to begin making more hosts based on her tech that would also go I to the park), and thus has special meaning to Anthony Hopkins, and so he has kept her updated. If there were prototypes before her they aren't really relevant as she was the fist deemed "good enough" to commission her as the model for hosts in the park.
I alsp think ah is in cahoots with ed Harris and knows that ed Harris is fucking with Delores to see if he can get her core programming to adapt over time based on treatment from guests.
I alsp think ah is in cahoots with ed Harris and knows that ed Harris is fucking with Delores to see if he can get her core programming to adapt over time based on treatment from guests.
More_Badass
Member
I think that was them checking out his brain to figure out the issue, not necessarily indicating that Harris had scalped him
I can still interpret that multiple ways, but that's just playing devil's advocate.
The obvious interpretation is that she is, if not the ACTUAL original, the oldest active Host. It could also be a twist that one of the human employees is in fact a Host that has existed longer. Hopkins would be the obvious choice here based on the episode, but maybe Harris.
Speaking or Harris, I have a theory about him currently. I'll spoil it just in case:
He was involved with the incident 30+ years ago. I actually lean towards him being a victim of it to some degree, and everything he's done since has been him coping with it, or just flat out seeking (misguided) revenge.
Like someone close to him was killed by Dorothy, and he believes she's more sentient than the company says, and has spent 30 years trying to make her miserable. Or he thinks the company covered it up, and he's trying to find ways to sabotage the entire place now.
Either way, it can sort of account for why he has the money to be there so often. He won some huge settlement from them.
Like someone close to him was killed by Dorothy, and he believes she's more sentient than the company says, and has spent 30 years trying to make her miserable. Or he thinks the company covered it up, and he's trying to find ways to sabotage the entire place now.
Either way, it can sort of account for why he has the money to be there so often. He won some huge settlement from them.
PlayALLtheGames
Banned
I'm in IT so I can relate, but if you have a machine you won't reuse, presumably you'll strip it for parts and recycle the rest. Imagine if you just stored every single one, forever, in a storage room.
I'm making a lot of assumptions since we have only one episode to go by though.
WhiteRabbitEXE
Member
He did say oldest host "in the park", which could mean that she's the oldest host actually in service, in contrast to the decommissioned Old Bill generation of hosts. The episode title "The Original" does indeed to indicate otherwise however, and it would be more significant for the actual first to be the one changes everything.
It's also possible the name refers to Abernathy though, with him being "patient zero" for the viral spread of self-awareness (thinking in terms of viruses is useful, since the original film was the first real depiction of a computer virus).
Of course, it could also simultaneously refer to both, and possibly other things.
It's also possible the name refers to Abernathy though, with him being "patient zero" for the viral spread of self-awareness (thinking in terms of viruses is useful, since the original film was the first real depiction of a computer virus).
Of course, it could also simultaneously refer to both, and possibly other things.
Maybe I missed it but where exactly is West World located? Like what state or whatever? And what was that huge map thing? When they looked into it it looked like they were looking into a 3D simulation. It made me think west world was a matrix type place but it's clearly in the real physical world. hmm.
Also what happens when a guest kills another guest because they're indistinguishable to the hosts? Or they do it intentionally?
And did that guy say that all disease and sickness has been cured?
Also what happens when a guest kills another guest because they're indistinguishable to the hosts? Or they do it intentionally?
And did that guy say that all disease and sickness has been cured?
Napoleonthechimp
Member
I work as a film editor and I always store my past projects (including footage) for future reference. It eats up storage space but I'd rather keep it and not need it than delete it and need it later.
These robots are hardware but if they've got no issue with available resources and can create them with ease then why not store them away.
WhiteRabbitEXE
Member
We don't yet know the real world location. And the huge map is just a real-time 3D projection of the park.
More_Badass
Member
We don't know. There's some speculation that the park might not even be on Earth, due to the comments about rotations and going home
Yup, that's why I assume they have a plan to reuse the ones in storage. It goes against every instinct I have to just use storage space for junk like that.
I could understand a temporary storage option before they get recycled/tossed, but they seem to imply that some of those have been down there a long time.
That's still a purpose though. As far as we can tell based on this episode, the only reason they're kept is so Hopkins can boot them up when he feels nostalgic. That's a bit suspicious, of course.
WhiteRabbitEXE
Member
It's also worth noting Nolan said the park was "terraformed". So at the very least it's most likely not in actual Utah.
We don't know the locations by the curators commented that they were working there on like a tour of duty.
So it is either somewhere on earth very far away from the rest of civilized society or it is on another planet (or the moon). If I had to guess it's on a terraformed moon.
The subterannean levels suggest there may have been some sort of apocalyptic event on earth and that West world was perhaps built on top of the ruins of an old city as well. If it is anywhere on earth though the tours of working don't really make sense though as you would think they could travel home for the weekend and visit their families in rotating shifts, etc.
So yeah I think it's on the moon or mars, or maybe an earthlike planet in another system. Like waaaaaay in the future where they have perhaps built on top of a failed previous space colony.
That's what I took from that. She's the oldest still in use, not necessarily the first of her technological type.
a) They seem to have lots of space not being used at the moment, so storage isn't a concern.
b) Given the hosts are some complicated mix of 3D printing, it's unclear whether the materials used are particularly costly or hard to come by for the company. Doesn't seem like they could just swap parts in and out for new models, so there might not be a significant impetus to recycle them in the short term.
c) The hosts are, to a certain extent, works of art, so I think you could forgive people giving an apparent visionary like Ford the desire to keep them for posterity, even if that may turn out just to be a cover story or something. We certainly get indications from the security crew that some people do believe there are concerns with having them around. I think Ford's been granted some leeway here beyond what might be most fiscally prudent.
We don't know. Utah, Mars, elsewhere?
I think we have to wait to learn more about the rules and restrictions that applied to both the guests and the hosts.
Could be somewhere odd like Antarctica, as well. Greenland. Australia. Any of the barren wastelands that modern people avoid if they have even a drop of sanity.
More_Badass
Member
There was little lines that I think added to the world building. Like the guest saying when he came with his family, they went fishing and whatnot. You pay all this money and all this effort to do something as mundane as fishing? I think that could imply a task like fishing might be impossible or rare back in everyday life, thus being able to do in natural wilderness is a luxury and something worth experiencing
The argument against it being on Earth is that the HQ looks like it is built into a rock formation but goes down over 83 floors deep, and the basement level looks like the company's original entrance lobby. So they built everything around stuff which is really old, but somehow couldn't just demolish and build a new building instead. Very curious. Almost like it is part of essential infrastructure.