Which was more impressive for its time: Code Veronica or RE4?

In playing RE4 I must say that I'm distinctly reminded of the feelings I got when I first fired up Code Veronica on my Dreamcast some 4+ years ago. The impression that the series had been taken to another level was overwhelming back then, and I dare say that RE4 has done Code Veronica one better.

CV's graphics were just as impressive for its day as RE4's are now. The full 3D was obviously revolutionary for its time, and the sharp richlycolored textures and well-rounded models made the transition from the world of pre-renders pretty seamless. I remember being blown away by the facial animations, the lighting, and the realtime water rippling (probably the only visual weakness was the non-rendered "circle shadows"). Where the game didn't do a whole lot in pushing the genre forward was the gameplay department, where despite a few improvements, it remained largely the same RE in shiny new clothes. The fact that the camera angles now had some pan-and-scan was nice, but the view was still constricting.

RE4 comes in as perhaps the most stunning looking game this gen, sporting copious amounts of polys, ridiculous lighting, and generally fantastic texture work. I remember thinking back in 1996 how I couldn't wait until consoles could do "rendered" looking games in realtime, and RE4 is about as close as they've yet come IMO. RE4 has also taken the liberty of knocking the dust off the gameplay, keeping the good stuff and spicing/speeding/tearing up the rest for about as playable an experience as the series has yet delivered.


Its almost sad looking back now, remembering how blown away I was by CV and thinking to myself "this is the new standard", only to be thoroughly disappointed when the series reverted back to prerenderville (although I did play both ReMake and 0). Perhaps thats why RE4 is so reminiscent of CV, because I'm finally back in the full-poly world the series first entered (and should have remained in) in 2000. Its hard to say which game impressed me more..although CV popped the visual cherry and was a solid addition to the series, RE4 somehow manages to retain the great RE feel while at the same time feeling like a different style of game altogether.

Playing RE4 has given me a strange itch to go back and play CV (which was my first solo experience with an RE title, mind you), which I never finished due to the fact that I didn't have an empty fire extinguisher to finish the last segment of the game, and had saved over my previous save inadvertently...I would have had to start the game all over again. Maybe its a sign. Here's hoping I don't have the same problems finishing RE4!!
 
If you think RE4 is the best looking game this gen, you should definitely play more Xbox and PC games...

And coming from low-res unfiltered, jaggy PSOne graphics to Code Veronica was definitely more impressive than the jump from REmake to RE4.
 
segasonic said:
If you think RE4 is the best looking game this gen, you should definitely play more Xbox and PC games...

And coming from low-res unfiltered, jaggy PSOne graphics to Code Veronica was definitely more impressive than the jump from REmake to RE4.


Umm, I've played Halo 2, HL2, MGS3 etc, and I definitely consider RE4 in the conversation with them as among the best looking games this gen. Perhaps RE4's only weakness lies in some occassionally muddled textures and the lack of X-Box and PC specific shaders. But the modeling, lighting, frame rate, majority of the texturing, and sheer amount of polys puts the game on par with anything I've seen outside of HL2 on a maxxed out PC rig.

Regardless, the thread isn't about gfx alone, but more about the total package of each game and what they meant to the series and to gaming as a whole.
 
I think tha RE4 is the most impressive game in graphics this gen , BUT Code Veronica impressed me more overall , due the characters and history , the weak points of RE4
 
Code Veronica was more impressive for its time. Not just due to the graphical leap in quality, but it was also the first traditional Resident Evil to do away with pre-rendered backgrounds.

I remember when it came out people were saying "If this doesn't sell the Dreamcast...nothing will"... :(
 
I was commenting on gameplay, graphics aren't so big to me, story isn't so big to me for RE, although it is nice to pick up snippets of things from collected documents, it is far from critical and really only serves towards the atmosphere on the whole IMHO and thats what interested me in RE4, just the experience of playing it
 
RE4 is more impressive. Bear in mind that Code Veronica isn't really doing much more than Blue Stinger etc are doing. The jump is more the fact that its the first Resident Evil with some realtime camera movement, not because of the graphics technology shown.

Its unfair to compare PS1->DC, you should compare with existing DC games of the time. RE4. Otherwise you have to compare RE4 with PS2 games.
 
RE4 was more impressive for me, not because of visual features but because it was such a monumental leap forward for gameplay that it definitely will be remembered as a signpost for this generation in general. A truly unforgettable gaming experience.
 
The original DC version of RECV impressed me more with its visuals and length of playtime (for an RE) for the time...I still like the storyline, the feeling of progression and overall sense of adventure found in CV compared to 4...but 4 is just more fun to actually play. Time for Capcom to milk the series again and redesign CV with RE4's gameplay...I'd buy it.
 
RE4 is an awesome game. It's graphics though didn't impress me that much. First of all, the game only runs at 640x320 with 30 fps. The lighting is completely static, the textures while being artistically well done are rather low-res. What I did like were effects like fire and explosions, high poly-counts of both the environments and the characters, and of course the gore effects.

All in all RE4 is a very beautiful game, but far from the graphical pinnacle of this generation.
 
I don't get why everyone lauds RE4's graphics. They're terrific, don't get me wrong, but far from the best of this generation of consoles. I wouldn't put it above... say... DOAU or Chronicles of Riddick or Doom 3.
 
the only thing that matters to me graphically, is if I blow a guys face away will his head fly backwards while his hat falls forward? what else is there?
 
code veronica = entire lack of scary or fun
RE4 = not really scary but an increadibly fun game

code veronica = in line with what was out on the DC (enough to be considered one of the better looking DC games).
RE = in (sortof) line with the best looking in the GC but it's art and style easily bring it up to one of the more impressive console games on any platform IMO

Code Veronica = control downgrade from RE3
RE4 = changing the camera angle so that the controls actually make sense and are a non-hinderance to the gameplay...just need to add (again) that it's a very fun game to play and PWNED me in my opinion that the C-stick sucked for aiming
 
RE4 i reckon. Graphically the only thing impressive about RE4 is its art. Most of the game feels like it could be in an 8bit color pallete but the art is so good it doesnt matter.

Its my fave game this generation, well almost. Ninja Gaiden just tops it.
 
RE4 is much more impressive to me. I enjoyed CV, but I was also a bit disappointed with several aspects of it. Also, MDK2 was released at the same time and I ended up loving that game much more. RE4 was also more of a surprise, as I was not particularly hyped for the game and the demo didn't impress me.
 
CV was awsome for its time. I remember thinking the graphics were awsome and plus this was the first true 3d RE game. But still, RE4 I was more awed by cause the gameplay was so different and so much more fun.
 
RE4 is the first game I've played that's actually made me say to myself, "I can't believe this is running in realtime." So, yeah, I think that says something.
 
I would have advised to wait some time until the wow of RE4 wore off on people and they could see the games for what it is. Not that I feel one is better than the other, but I personally think it's obvious that some of you might have slightly glossied skews on RE4 because of it's recent release.
 
segasonic said:
RE4 is an awesome game. It's graphics though didn't impress me that much. First of all, the game only runs at 640x320 with 30 fps. The lighting is completely static, the textures while being artistically well done are rather low-res. What I did like were effects like fire and explosions, high poly-counts of both the environments and the characters, and of course the gore effects.

All in all RE4 is a very beautiful game, but far from the graphical pinnacle of this generation.
No offense boss, but did you take idiot pills before playing it?
:)
 
RE4 without a doubt. I don't even understand the hesitation. For whatever CV did for it's time and place, it was still a poorly designed POS to play. RE4 was a riot, whether or not it's story was any good. I'd say it's a front runner for GOTY whereas I just wanted Code Veronica to be over.

The graphics might have been stunning at the time for CV, but RE4 actually redeemed a whole series. It wins.
 
Gattsu25 said:
so you disagree but can't counter his arguments without using insults

tell us how you really feel
Pft! It was meant in good spirit, don't be such a baby.
It's just I feel that to apply numbers and tech babble to Resi 4 is rediculous. It's an astonishing looking game and for my money, visual game this gen.
 
Folder said:
Pft! It was meant in good spirit, don't be such a baby.
It's just I feel that to apply numbers and tech babble to Resi 4 is rediculous. It's an astonishing looking game and for my money, visual game this gen.


disregarding the fact that this makes no sense...



Musashi Wins!: you..er...win. That's exactly how I feel
 
Which was more impressive for its time: Code Veronica or RE4?

RE:CV for the visuals.
RE4 for the huge upgrade in overall gameplay/ funfactor.

So I guess I'm not choosing between the two.

^_~
 
The way I see it, RE4 has many claiming best graphics this gen, near the end of the generation. Code: Veronica was near the start of the generation, and it wasn't even the best looking game on DC when it released (that would be MDK 2). Not to mention RE4's scope is in another league.
 
I guess RE4. The only thing I found impressive about RECV was the intro movie which was FMV. Other than that, the graphics weren't anything special.
 
Ned Flanders said:
Its almost sad looking back now, remembering how blown away I was by CV and thinking to myself "this is the new standard", only to be thoroughly disappointed when the series reverted back to prerenderville (although I did play both ReMake and 0). Perhaps thats why RE4 is so reminiscent of CV, because I'm finally back in the full-poly world the series first entered (and should have remained in) in 2000. Its hard to say which game impressed me more..although CV popped the visual cherry and was a solid addition to the series, RE4 somehow manages to retain the great RE feel while at the same time feeling like a different style of game altogether.

Playing RE4 has given me a strange itch to go back and play CV (which was my first solo experience with an RE title, mind you), which I never finished due to the fact that I didn't have an empty fire extinguisher to finish the last segment of the game, and had saved over my previous save inadvertently...I would have had to start the game all over again. Maybe its a sign. Here's hoping I don't have the same problems finishing RE4!!
To be fair REmake had to be prerendered to keep the feel of the original. And 0 started on the N64. And I hate to tell you this but you don't need the empty fire extinguisher to finish CV just if you want the magnum. The medicine for Claire is on the shelf before the fire. Unless the DC CV is diffrent from PS2 CVX.
 
I've bitched about this to no end, but personally I have to penalize RE4 for the letterboxing. It is not as impressive to me because they "cheated" to get the final reult. The game looks phenomonal, but what if they did the same with MGS3? Or SC: CT?
 
Haven't played RE4 yet but as RE:CV was my first RE game I played I'll never forget the experience. And the intro was beatiful as well.
 
shantyman said:
I've bitched about this to no end, but personally I have to penalize RE4 for the letterboxing. It is not as impressive to me because they "cheated" to get the final reult. The game looks phenomonal, but what if they did the same with MGS3? Or SC: CT?

Christ, that's goofy. I wish more developers would cheat. Not to mention that this game's setting is more "framed" like a film than most any other game made. To think that they continued to go after that effect and still made it fun to play? Damn.
 
RE4 is an artistic triumph, but far from a technical one. RE4's engine suffers from low resolution, low color output, low framerate, and low textures. No way it can compete with the better XBox engines.

The engine is good enough for it's purpose, but it's far from sufficient to be turned into a FPS engine for instance with it's sub 30 frame rate even when using a game controlled camera system.

Yeah, I know I know.... Most of you GC guys couldn't give a shit about FPS.

But engine wise, FPS are much more taxing than a 3rd person one like RE4. Even DC's CV had a unlockable 1st person mode because it could handle the immediate perspective change from the user without cripling frame rate drop. There's no way the RE4 engine could allow for a first person mode in that game. It would make even the most seasoned FPS veteran puke up his/her guts.
 
shantyman said:
I've bitched about this to no end, but personally I have to penalize RE4 for the letterboxing. It is not as impressive to me because they "cheated" to get the final reult. The game looks phenomonal, but what if they did the same with MGS3? Or SC: CT?
Someone linked to an interview on the forum that mentioned the letterboxing was more for cinematic effect rather than due to technical limitations. Like Shog mentions, the RE4 engine isn't anything that technically complex, it's just an above average engine with fantastic modeling/art.

RECV wasn't anything special engine wise either. Not too surprising considering it was coded by Nextech though.
 
Shogmaster said:
RE4 is an artistic triumph, but far from a technical one. RE4's engine suffers from low resolution, low color output, low framerate, and low textures. No way it can compete with the better XBox engines.

The engine is good enough for it's purpose, but it's far from sufficient to be turned into a FPS engine for instance with it's sub 30 frame rate even when using a game controlled camera system.

Yeah, I know I know.... Most of you GC guys couldn't give a shit about FPS.

But engine wise, FPS are much more taxing than a 3rd person one like RE4. Even DC's CV had a unlockable 1st person mode because it could handle the immediate perspective change from the user without cripling frame rate drop. There's no way the RE4 engine could allow for a first person mode in that game. It would make even the most seasoned FPS veteran puke up his/her guts.

What? RE4 runs at a very steady 30fps. The only real instance of reproducable slowdown I've seen is the windy area right before you go through the gate of the walkway area. And isn't 3rd person typically more demanding than 1st person? You have to render a wider frame of view, plus the player's character model.
 
dynamitejim said:
What? RE4 runs at a very steady 30fps. The only real instance of reproducable slowdown I've seen is the windy area right before you go through the gate of the walkway area.

I don't know if you played the same game I did, but I remember thinking that the game dropped below 30 in plenty of places.

And isn't 3rd person typically more demanding than 1st person? You have to render a wider frame of view, plus the player's character model.

NO WAY. 1st person is way more demanding than any 3rd person one because you give the player the total control over the camera. 3rd person game allows for more tight control over polygon rednering budget because the dev can rule out just about all situations that would let the player make the engine render over it's budget.

Just think about this: In just about any 1st person game, you can spin the camera 360 around the character in less than a second (as long as you adjust the analog controller speed). That will make the engine render much more than any 3rd person game that does not allow for total camera control.

Remember, in FPS, your perspective out of the character's eyes is the camera.
 
Shogmaster said:
Just think about this: In just about any 1st person game, you can spin the camera 360 around the character in less than a second (as long as you adjust the analog controller speed). That will make the engine render much more than any 3rd person game that does not allow for total camera control.
Er, you can do this in RE4 as well (by using the 180 degree turn twice).
 
I'm going to hold that CV impressed me more, because it was the first time that a true RE game was in 3D and I was giddy as fuck about it.

This doesn't mean the RE4 isn't more impressive in every way (I'm gonna say "not storytelling" though) but it's presentation in 3D, which I agree is incredible, felt belated to me after the move back to pre-render for two whole games.

The combat in RE4 is seriously great, but it and all the other interface enhancements simply had a feel of "it's about damn time" to me.

In short, I'm saying that RE4 lost a lot of impress points from me because it took Capcom so damn long to make the game that it is. I did not appreciate Zero; not a bit.
 
jarrod said:
Er, you can do this in RE4 as well (by using the 180 degree turn twice).


I don't know what crazy settings you are using on the game, but I can't make it do 360 in less than a second. Hell, even the 180 turn takes up the whole second.
 
dynamitejim said:
What? RE4 runs at a very steady 30fps. The only real instance of reproducable slowdown I've seen is the windy area right before you go through the gate of the walkway area. And isn't 3rd person typically more demanding than 1st person? You have to render a wider frame of view, plus the player's character model.

Well, it really depends on how the engine gives control of the camera to the player. Devs certainly take shortcuts in this area by forcing the camera to pan at slow rates, although many games certainly give you full "snap"-control these days.

And I agree with the general consensus. RE4 isn't really doing anything mind-blowing (or even that impressive, really) technically, but it deosn't stop the game from being beautiful. I am somewhat disappointed that the widescreen wasn't anamorphic, though :-p (not like I would've benefitted, played it on a friend's TV ... but you get the picture).
 
Shogmaster said:
I don't know what crazy settings you are using on the game, but I can't make it do 360 in less than a second. Hell, even the 180 turn takes up the whole second.
Sorry, wasn't really paying attention to the "less than a second" part. Even so, RE4 seems pretty speedy overall... the engine seems very solid and honestly I haven't noticed much in terms of frame drops either.



Anyway, this thread needs some lists. Here's the RE series on consoles sorted by coders...

Capcom Studio 4
-Resident Evil (PS)
-Resident Evil: Director's Cut (PS)
-Resident Evil 2 (PS/GC)
-Resident Evil 3: Nemesis (PS/GC)
-Resident Evil (GC)
-Resident Evil 4 (GC/PS2)

Nextech Corp
-Resident Evil (SS)
-Resident Evil Code: Veronica (DC)
-Resident Evil Code: Veronica Perfect (DC)
-Resident Evil Code: Veronica X (PS2/GC)
-Resident Evil Survivor 2: Code: Veronica (PS2)

Angel Studios (now Rockstar San Diego)
-Resident Evil 2 (N64)

Capcom Tokyo R&D (disbanded)
-Resident Evil 2 (DC)
-Resident Evil 3: Nemesis (DC)

Capcom Studio 3
-Resident Evil Survivor (PS)
-Resident Evil 0 (GC)
-Resident Evil: Dead Aim (PS2)

Capcom Studio 1
-Resident Evil Outbreak (PS2)
-Resident Evil Outbreak: File #2 (PS2)
 
RE:CV impressed me alot, but considering I had just made the jump from n64 to DC, it's not that surprising. It's mighty impressive though of RE4, coming out close to the end of a console generation, shortly after games like Halo2, Half-Life2 and Doom3, and it's still able to make my jaw drop to the floor.

RE4 is in my eyes the best looking game this generation. I'm playing SC: Chaos Theory right now which looks absolutely phenomenal, it has without a doubt better textures than RE4 or any other game for that matter- but RE4 is not about individual textures, nor about any other technical mumbo-jumbo.
There are technically better looking games than RE4 out there, but personally I don't care which game has more bump-mapping. RE4 blows me away with amazing design, incredible effects for fire, water, smoke, dust, mist, rain etc. and an overall package better looking than any other game I've seen.

Some people don't seem to be able to look past the letterboxing, and my advice to them is this: Take a week off and go to a mental institution. Electric shocks always helps.
 
The only time I ever noticed slowdown in RE4 was when there were about 8 enemies on screen at once and I shot a rocket point blank. The game is almost entirely a solid 30fps.
 
Yeah, I've only seen a drop when the onscreen action was absolutely insane.

RE4 is more impressive to me to answer the thread question. Besides there being a major overhaul to the gameplay, the visuals kick the shit of Code Veronica. Even if it's not a technical masterpiece, the difference between RE4 and CV make it hard for me to believe that the Dreamcast is in the same generation. As much as I loved the machine, it's cases like this that clearly put to bed myths about the untapped potential of the DC.
 
I can't tell between 30 and 60 fps, but I know when frames drop, and RE4 does see its share of frame drops. Strangely, I haven't seen them drop because of enemy encounters (I haven't bought a RL yet, though). It was usually in the village when raining, and running across a big environment. Subtle but noticeable, really no big deal.
 
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