wobedraggled
Banned
MightyHedgehog said:
They wont...I leanred my lesson this time, luckily they also made it into a nice little media center with the help of a chip and a big old hard drive
Why would anyone in their right minds want this generation to end?
- Thread starter koam
- Start date
They wont...I leanred my lesson this time, luckily they also made it into a nice little media center with the help of a chip and a big old hard drive
MightyHedgehog
Member
Ok, so why the hate? Doesn't make any sense to me.
There is some Xbox hatin' going on in here. I'm excited for next gen. Why not? Improved graphics and capabilities with things like physics and AI. I suppose it depends on the genre's you enjoy. If you like FPS and Stealth type titles then the improvements shoudl make the games more realistic and immersive.
If you like platformers and puzzle games I could see where you wouldn't really be interested in spending the money to upgrade.
If you like platformers and puzzle games I could see where you wouldn't really be interested in spending the money to upgrade.
wobedraggled
Banned
TeTr1C said:While you may think they're a joke, they're also the most successful.
Heh, talk about PS2's online capability! Or even Gamecube for that matter! :lol Then compare it to MS's online. No fucking comparison.
They are hardly #2 , that doesn't = sucessful, and they are bleeding cash from that diuvision, if it weren't for thier monopoly they would have caved by now.
And noone pays for ps2 online, nor should they Live made a bunch of promises that they never kept. (dedicated servers etc etc etc)
wobedraggled said:
Which is exactly what they were touting coming into this generation.
It apparently isn't going to happen but I wish every company had put in a HD
Screw paying $30 for damn memory cards and then still having to manage your save files. The saved music is nice too!TeTr1C said:While you may think they're a joke, they're also the most successful.
Heh, talk about PS2's online capability! Or even Gamecube for that matter! :lol Then compare it to MS's online. No fucking comparison.
Actually, I like free online gaming. So whatever PS2 games come around that have it = win for me.
Strange. I should probably be really upset that the Xbox's lifecycle is coming to an end so soon. I mean, I bought it about a year and a week ago. Guess all those free games from Microsoft must've made up for it.
I'd rather pay yearly for online capability set up right, rather than have a free one that has practically no set up. While MS did promise some things for Live, I guess that's what next-gen is for. For a first try on the console gaming market, I'd say they're pretty damn successful, and not JUST because high-end hardware. And better hardware = better games. Who wouldn't want that?
wobedraggled said:
They built a brand that might be able to rival Playstation, beat Nintendo in the west, created a great online subscription service (people were moaning about MS keeping it broadband only.. remember that?? one GamerTag was a great idea, voice chat is now mandatory for every online game i play) and managed to create one of the best known games in gaming (halo). They've done enough, more than anyone predicted.
Mr_Furious
Member
And if some of you graphic whores had your way, a new console would be released every year. It's been the industry standard for over 25 years that the average shelf life for any successful platform has been a MINIMUM of 5 years and that's with solid support from 1st parties. MS has essentially aborted their Xbox only 3 years into it to jump at it's profitable successor in order to regain a successful business model. I don't care how you paint that scenario, it's a dicked move and it's going to fuck MS's own Xbox userbase the most.Redbeard said:
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
Mr_Furious said:
exactly! not that I blame only MS. Sony is also jumping the gun with their PS3, granted it has been out a year longer. It is not that I want to be "stuck" in the gen, just I don't want to have to drop 2000$ quite yet. Companies are just starting to get all they can from today's systems, like the thread starter said. Look at RE4, and imo DMC3 is also a good example of taping the ps2 power
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
Blackace said:
Oh they're so not. The earliest we're going to see the PS3 will be March next year, and that'll make it 6 years old in Japan. That's the absolute most I want to wait before the next console, I'd prefer it at 5 years if possible, but 6 will do.
As for just now getting the most out of the hardware, that's true, but that could probably go on forever to some degree. We still have at least a year of PS2 games to come, probably half a year after the PS3's release of good games still coming to the PS2.
Personally, I'm completely fed up of the level of graphics this gen provides. I blame the way the systems have been spread out. From the DC to the Xbox there was a 3 year gap, yet the best looking DC games would still be passable, if not that great, on the latter system. Even a DC launch game, Sonic Adventure, still looks this gen. It'd look crap if it was released now, but it'd be accepted as built on the current gen systems.
So I've been seeing the same sort of levels of graphics since the end of 1998 (earlier as the DC was obviously shown off before it was launched), and I'm completely bored with it. I need that huge step up each new generation provides, and hopefully I won't have to wait 7 years next time.
Mama Smurf said:
Up until about a month ago or so, I wasn't at all excited for next gen. My backlog is sizeable, with games from this generation and a few from last (and even a SNES game or two), so I've got plenty to keep me busy for months to come. However, playing God of War has made me realize that the time for a new console truly is drawing nigh. I am not at all knocking God of War, realize that. There are some truly awesome moments graphically, where I look at the game and think "man, this console's still got it." On the other hand, there are moments where I think, "gee, this would be utterly kick-ass on PS3." I truly hope the sequel is on PS3, I think it will be timewise.
I distinctly remember thinking this same way when playing through Vagrant Story. The PS2 wasn't quite out yet, I think it came out 5 months or so later, but deep in my heart I have always wanted a PS2 remake of it. It would just look so much different, so much better. There have been some really great games graphically this gen (MGS3, RE4) but I'm beginning to be ready to see what's next.
IIRC, the Playstation launched here (America) in 1995 (I was taking a two-year hiatus from gaming at the time, shame on me). I know the PS2 launched, however weakly, in Fall 2000, so you've got 5-plus years between the two. With a pending PS3 launch in late '06, the gap will be even wider. It's time.
Naked Shuriken said:
This is exactly the stupid low-minded and capitalist-brainwashed comment i was waiting for.
What you just said guy it's very sad. it means: " Getting screwed is good for me. I'm used to get screwed."
Yeah and sorry if i ever hurt you personally, it's not the goal here lol
Having played Doom 3, Half Life 2, and Far Cry on my 6800 Ultra, console games now look like garbage.
I'm sick of blurry 640x480 resolutions (in the case of RE4 and some PS2 games, even lower). It's time to move on. Yes games are largely about graphics, that's what drives each generation to replace the other.
And as mentioned earlier, having a Dreamcast makes this generation very old. Almost 7 years now.
There's hardly any games left that I'm interested in from this generation. Zelda and FFXII. Pretty much it.
I'm sick of blurry 640x480 resolutions (in the case of RE4 and some PS2 games, even lower). It's time to move on. Yes games are largely about graphics, that's what drives each generation to replace the other.
And as mentioned earlier, having a Dreamcast makes this generation very old. Almost 7 years now.
There's hardly any games left that I'm interested in from this generation. Zelda and FFXII. Pretty much it.
Mr_Furious said:
:lol Yeah okay...and if MS waits and Sony beats 'em out the gate first, everyone would say MS were dumb fucks for waiting too long. They're fucked either way, so they might as well get aggressive and be done with it.
And where's all this frothing rage regarding DS dropping a mere 3 years after GBA (and with GBA2 talk already in the wings)? Hell, maybe PSP should be blamed for "forcing" Nintendo to release DS, and maybe GBA2 in a year and a half. Hasn't stopped people from jacking off to PSP of course.
Tech's always on the move...nobody needs to move with it, but it isn't gonna wait just cause some people haven't been bothered to finish their current games off yet. Isn't like anyone has to buy a new system at launch either. Just wait a year or two if it irks you that much.
Mama Smurf said:
Agreed...hell for me I've been seeing these sort of visuals since I first played VF3 and Super GT at the arcade in '97. That's eight years ago, getting on nine...enough already.
Mr_Furious said:
how is it three years? 2005-2001 = 4.
Also launching first is the hardest thing to do. You need to
1.) convince third parties to your system even though you're the only next-gen one out
2.) have competitive hardware that won't be outclassed by your competitors
3.) have a killer app out before your competitors.
4.) Convince the consumers that you are truly next-gen
PS1/PS2 all managed those, Dreamcast couldn't (the third parties)
If MS can do these they'll be very successful, which I think is very achievable going by the
rumors and everything.
Also the Halo 2 launch was marketing brilliance. Who else has pulled off 2+ million sales in launch day? If they can orchestrate something like that again, it will be interesting to see how the launch will be.
I have one problem with the so-called 'next generation'. If what I'm lead to believe, the graphics will be a significant step up from this gen. Technology becomes more powerful for cheaper. No problem there. But graphic artists and modellers don't. Development times for games will become longer, aswell as more expensive. Which means one of two things:
1) Games will become more expensive.
2) Games will become more shallow, gameplaywise/storywise, everything but graphics wise.
This makes me disappointed. Graphical wowness can only go so far if you're still only doing so much with it gamewise(as Doom3 attested to). I want to see the power go into other areas, besides polygon numbers and audio channels.
I want to see real driving in Gran Turismo. I want to see speech synthesisng in games (to put your name in voice dialogue). I want to see new technologies from next generation. Do I think we will get that? It seems less and less likely.
1) Games will become more expensive.
2) Games will become more shallow, gameplaywise/storywise, everything but graphics wise.
This makes me disappointed. Graphical wowness can only go so far if you're still only doing so much with it gamewise(as Doom3 attested to). I want to see the power go into other areas, besides polygon numbers and audio channels.
I want to see real driving in Gran Turismo. I want to see speech synthesisng in games (to put your name in voice dialogue). I want to see new technologies from next generation. Do I think we will get that? It seems less and less likely.
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
Don't forget the market's growing all the time. Sure, development costs go up, but then sales will go up too.
Personally I still think developers are going about the next gen completely wrong when it comes to game prices. They're going up, or planning to, and I can understand why, but I think if they did the very opposite and lowered the prices, the market would expand hugely. Not only would we as gamers be able to buy more games, but people who don't play games will see it as a more accessible hobby. Instead we're going to see even more people who won't want to get into gaming, some people perhaps being frozen out of gaming altogether, and we gamers will buy fewer and fewer games.
It'd take time to get through to people that gaming isn't so expensive anymore, but if a few major publishers could just stick with it, I think it'd be to everyone's benefit. Raising costs is a short term solution (not to mention one which could backfire badly, as if the average gamer cares why costs are going up) and it can't go on forever. What about the generation after next? That'll be even worst. What should we expect then, $70 games? $80? How about a few generations time, $100 games? Sounds like a good way to crash the market to me.
Personally I still think developers are going about the next gen completely wrong when it comes to game prices. They're going up, or planning to, and I can understand why, but I think if they did the very opposite and lowered the prices, the market would expand hugely. Not only would we as gamers be able to buy more games, but people who don't play games will see it as a more accessible hobby. Instead we're going to see even more people who won't want to get into gaming, some people perhaps being frozen out of gaming altogether, and we gamers will buy fewer and fewer games.
It'd take time to get through to people that gaming isn't so expensive anymore, but if a few major publishers could just stick with it, I think it'd be to everyone's benefit. Raising costs is a short term solution (not to mention one which could backfire badly, as if the average gamer cares why costs are going up) and it can't go on forever. What about the generation after next? That'll be even worst. What should we expect then, $70 games? $80? How about a few generations time, $100 games? Sounds like a good way to crash the market to me.
Mama Smurf said:
The overall trend for game prices has been steadily downward and it will probably continue that way. Even the CEO's who talk about $60 games next generation admit this. These $60 games are going to be trial balloons for the big titles. If sales drop off, you won't see it anymore. Once studios get their next gen engines built and developers get familiar with the new platforms, you'll probably see even more under-$50 games next gen than there was this one. Every week there are probably 5+ $20 titles released. Granted, we're at the end of this generation, but it seems like publishers have caught on to this. If your title isn't high profile, $20 or $30 MSRP is a big help (at least, it seems to be by the number of titles).
mrkgoo said:
What exactly do you propose? That the current generation continues another five years? And you'll still be asking the same questions then anyway.
Those challenges are going to exist no matter when the next generation is ushered in. Hell, many would tell you those issues exist THIS generation. So what difference does it make?
As far as game prices go, DC's prices were comparable to that of PSX when it launched, but they went up by ten bucks a pop when PS2 came out. I don't recall that being a huge barrier of resistance for people. After a year or two they dropped back down. Chances are we'll see that happen this generation.
Again, I don't know why this is so fucking complicated. People act like they're under some sort of binding contract to buy a new console at or near launch. Nothing could be further from the truth. Nothing wrong with waiting a year for the first price drop and the REAL next generation games to show up. Everybody knows that the second generation of software is when (A) a console really begins to mature and show it's teeth, and (B) the tools begin to mature and developers really start to crank out the gems. That's the console era I'm looking forward to, and it's two years away for XBox 2 and probably another six to twelve months more for PS3. So why the hell would I want these systems to get moved up, pushing their second generation of games up all the more? Fuck that shit.
Mr_Furious
Member
Answer me this. What's wrong with waiting and releasing simultaneously against the PS3? I hate it that just because some people may hate that MS is aborting their Xbox prematurely that others automatically assume that we want the Xbox2 to ship after PS3. What the fuck is your logic here?Shinobi said:
I don't know where you've been but there's plenty of threads voicing against Nintendo's "3rd pillar". We all know wtf the DS is and it's not what Nintendo claims.
thorns said:
2005? Most of MS's dev have shifted over to the Xbox successor back in 2004 and other than 2 games (Forza and Conker) that are supposed to release in the 1st half of 2005, there is nothing else in development. EVERYONE in MS's camp is working on Xbox2 software.
Mr_Furious said:
:lol Are you fucking serious? What has EVERYONE been saying the last few years? If MS doesn't beat Sony to market they're pretty much fucked, since Playstation is the defacto game standard and people will go towards them if all things are even. The logic with going first is that you make such a big splash that you firmly entrench yourself as legit first console option. And this has worked before...Genesis didn't wait for the SNES, Playstation didn't wait for the N64, and Playstation 2 didn't wait for the Gamecube. Don't think it hurt those systems at all.
And what's MS supposed to do, sit on tech and just wait a year? Console design isn't fluid enough where you can just keep increasing the specs right up until your competitor announces their plans. A faster graphics card has to be accounted for in the body design, including more space inside for air flow, and specific ventilation design to allow the air to move in and out as effeciently as possible. It isn't like they just get a slab of plastic, shape it up a bit in a few hours and call it a day.
Of course if MS waited till Sony announced their new console, they'd be the ones making most of the noise, since they're not only the dominant player but first off the mark to boot. And who knows when Sony would announce their plans anyway? They could wait till 2007 to get serious with PS3 for all we know. MS obviously can't wait that long, since they'll never make a dime off the XBox hardware.
That's a big part of the equation BTW...MS can't make money off XBox 1, and while their financial resources are huge, they would like to see a profit from this venture at some time. And since making anything off the current machine is impossible, the prudent business move is to release new hardware where they've got a better then decent shot of making a profit two or three years in.
It should also be said that XBox 1 isn't neccessarily being killed off either. Hell, PSX was still getting games as late as last year. So assuming XBox will get nothing game wise in 2006 is pretty premature.
Oh people bitch about DS, but that's more due to the system being a pointless underpowered piece of shit. The last GBA2 thread I saw (If it was announced at E3, what would you do) had seemingly half the people in that thread say they'd preorder without giving it a second thought.
Even if nothing for XBox dropped after Forza and Conker (which I doubt, but it's possible), it's still closer to four years then three.
Dunno about pointless, but I wouldn't call the tech underpowered piece of shit. Except PSP, the other gaming handhelds currently on the market aren't exactly better, most of them are worse actually, especially if you're comparing graphic chipsets.
I guess its failing point is the missing texture filtering, which makes the visuals look all too reminiscent of PS1 graphics - despite the fact that DS is actually a fair bit stronger then any machine from that generation was (in both 2d and 3d aspects also).
Outside that, it'd probably make little sense increasing hw power without making screens bigger and flashier first
Musashi Wins!
FLAWLESS VICTOLY!
Fight for Freeform said:
Yea, I keep seeing "The Xbox has no titles, etc." post, but it has a far healthier release schedule than GC at this point. There's Zelda and ..... Zelda. Just look at recent releases. Are average reviewed titles like DK Jungle Beat or crap like Star Fox creating a renaissance? The PS2 is having a fantastic schedule right now too. I'd think Nintendo fans would want to start over again at this point.
Mama Smurf
My penis is still intact.
Sigh...once again, Zelda is not the only game coming. Third party support is pretty crap, yes. Nintendo's support is as strong as ever:
Zelda
Fire Emblem
Kirby Adventure
Pokemon XD
Odama
Advance Wars: Under Fire
Geist
Mario Baseball
DDR with Mario
Nintendo Pennant Chase Baseball
Donkey Konga 2
Then there's Mario 128, which no one's really sure if it's GC or Revolution at this point, Mario Kart Arcade, which could be ported over but may not, and possible E3 surprises.
As for third parties, there still some decent stuff coming, though I think it's all multiplatform. You know, Killer 7, Splinter Cell, Shadow the Hedgehog...oh actually I think there's an exclusive Harvest moon coming.
So yeah, if you think that's crap, fine. But please stop saying Zelda's the only thing coming.
Zelda
Fire Emblem
Kirby Adventure
Pokemon XD
Odama
Advance Wars: Under Fire
Geist
Mario Baseball
DDR with Mario
Nintendo Pennant Chase Baseball
Donkey Konga 2
Then there's Mario 128, which no one's really sure if it's GC or Revolution at this point, Mario Kart Arcade, which could be ported over but may not, and possible E3 surprises.
As for third parties, there still some decent stuff coming, though I think it's all multiplatform. You know, Killer 7, Splinter Cell, Shadow the Hedgehog...oh actually I think there's an exclusive Harvest moon coming.
So yeah, if you think that's crap, fine. But please stop saying Zelda's the only thing coming.
CrimsonSkies
Member
Yet another let's bash the shit out of Microsoft, the Xbox, and the games on it. Whee. Do the flip on the PS2 or Cube and you're a Xbot troll with a ban. Whee.
TheDiave said:
Yup. And they had momentum with Halo2 but started to talk about the Next-box instead.
They should have continue to support the Xbox that could have become eventually more popular than the PS2 (ok except in Asia) and then launch the Xbox2 head to head with the PS3 to put the gamers in EXTREME dilemna and maybe grab a larger part of Sony userbase.
Now it's "oh shit, let's come out already and try to grab the most sales possible before Sony arrives". Now because of that Sony is accelerating the PS3 plans and it will come out earlier that what it could have been. It must also put alot of pressure on Nintendo that have to be there earlier now too in order not to get ditched away.
Sons of bitches? -- well said dude.
DJ Sl4m said:
:lol :lol :lol
The truth hurts, doesn't it ? It's not my fault that XBOX has little to no AAA games planned for this year. Ok, if you begin considering Forza and Spikeout as major releases then sure I am wrong but I don't think this should be the case.
Anyways, think whatever you want. If XBOX has so many good releases then stink to it and don't buy a Xenon...However I don't think this is gonna be your case.
ourumov said:
That's because MS understands that this generation's "war" ended at the end of 2004 with the release of Halo 2. Everything else is pretty much icing on the cake, AAA or not.
Why would you choose to stick around with 5 or 4 year old tech? It really is time for the new generation.
ourumov said:
sure until xenon is released it has plenty of great stuff to go around..
off the top of my mind:
-oddworld
-mercenaries
-brothers in arms
-splinter cell : chaos theory
-conker
-forza
-jade empire
-doom 3
-unreal championship 2
-gta: sa
-midnight club 3
-phantom dust
-pariah
-psychonauts
-timesplitters
-mx vs. atv
-republic commando
-destroy all humans
etc. etc. lots of great games out and coming. If YOU personally don't care for those games, it doesn't make them any less great.
Project Midway
Member
what kind of logic is that? a blind nintendo fanboy logic? Sheesh... different tastes....I think GCN has zero AAA titles but I'm keeping it to myself...well, most of the time.ourumov said:
:lol
Just because I fear that the next gen is full of adapted stuff that was rejected at the last minute from this gen...Remember ED, RE0, SFA and many other obscure releases that jumped from N64 to GC ? That's what I mean. I would have loved N64 to end its lifespan in a more decent way that it did. The same goes for GC.
Stupid logic...As stupid as saying that MS hasn't cut XBOX lifespan in favour of some first-gen Xenon titles.
Game Republic, Q Games, Rare, MGS...All working for Xenon instead XBOX.
ourumov said:
Blame Nintendo for that stuff. Microsoft's developers should be more than ready for the new generation.
I say this.
Look at the Xbox, Gamecube, and PS2. When games start getting near 10's in graphics, but the graphics aren't getting significantly better (Like with Resident Evil 4, God of War, Ninja Gaiden, and most assuredly Conker), it's time to move on. Nintendo doesn't possess the will to tap the Cube's true potential, Sony has clearly tapped the PS2's, and the best looking Xbox game already trumps the best efforts of other consoles. What's left? If things like Katamari Damacy are the answer, I'd rather see that in a prettier package, thanks.
The Xbox is slowing down big time too...but it has the benefit of some vital 3rd party releases, and Xbox Live (where you can play 2 year old games and still have a blast and it's still fresh).
But yeah...I think the answer for the most part...Nintendo fans. I'm a fan of Nintendo games (yes, there is a difference between being a fan of Nintendo and a fan of their games) and I'm looking forward to their next console more than anything. I think they should just wrap this generation up ASAP...
But yeah...I think the answer for the most part...Nintendo fans. I'm a fan of Nintendo games (yes, there is a difference between being a fan of Nintendo and a fan of their games
) and I'm looking forward to their next console more than anything. I think they should just wrap this generation up ASAP...Now you've gone and made me do it.... *drumroll please*
The list of good to great Xbox games that will be or have been released in '05 (some exclusive, some ports, some multi with the best version usually on Xbox):
Stranger
Brothers in Arms
Star Wars: RC
Doom III
Fight Night II
MVP Baseball
Timesplitters 3
Project Snowblind
Super Monkey Ball DX
Street Fighter 3 Live
Splinter Cell 3
Winning Eleven
Mercenaries
MechAssault 2
Phantom Dust
Jade Empire
Psychonauts
Lego Star Wars
Midnight Club III
Unreal Championship II
Forza Motorsport
Pariah
Star Wars Ep III
Conker
Pirates
Destroy all Humans
Advent Rising
Rainbow Six Lockdown
San Andreas
Call of Cthulhu
The list of good to great Xbox games that will be or have been released in '05 (some exclusive, some ports, some multi with the best version usually on Xbox):
Stranger
Brothers in Arms
Star Wars: RC
Doom III
Fight Night II
MVP Baseball
Timesplitters 3
Project Snowblind
Super Monkey Ball DX
Street Fighter 3 Live
Splinter Cell 3
Winning Eleven
Mercenaries
MechAssault 2
Phantom Dust
Jade Empire
Psychonauts
Lego Star Wars
Midnight Club III
Unreal Championship II
Forza Motorsport
Pariah
Star Wars Ep III
Conker
Pirates
Destroy all Humans
Advent Rising
Rainbow Six Lockdown
San Andreas
Call of Cthulhu
Uhm, I own an Xbox that I received as a gift. I bought Halo because I kept hearing so many good things about it, and then turned around and traded it in less than a month later because I wasn't impressed. Since Halo didn't succeed in blowing my skirt up, I didn't bother getting Halo 2. Personally I find the Time Splitters series to be way more entertaining.CrimsonSkies said:
And did I say the Xbox sucks? No. I just made the point that there are no more AAA titles (like Halo 2) coming to the Xbox. Its wad has been blown, now MS is moving onto the next system, leaving those with an Xbox in the dust; especially if the new system isn't backward compatible.
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