We're talking about the competition for people's time and money on home entertainment in general. It doesn't actually matter what the iPad is capable of, it could be a multimedia tablet or a box of springs. The simple fact that Apple is such a huge name in people's homes for entertainment automatically makes them the competition; it's not up to Nintendo to "try" to compete with Apple, it's happening no matter what. By making the most powerful home-based tablet device around, Nintendo stands to win back at least some of the public's time that's currently being spent on the iPad.
Wii U Speculation Thread 2: Can't take anymore of this!!!
- Thread starter ClovingWestbrook
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blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
I had a friend in high-school who had an 128zx+. I had an 6502 oric clone and I was green with envy, as z80 assembly made 6502's look like a toy. But hey, at least now I'm at an age where I can openly admit those things are toys ; )Yup, Binatone Pong for me too. My family then bought an Atari VCS 2600 which at the time was amazing, playing arcade games such as Space Invaders and Asteroids in your own home and in colour was pretty gobsmacking tbh.
From the Atari VCS I then progressed to the 48K Speccy and contributed to the Console Crash of 84. From there I went onto PC gaming before going back to console gaming with the PS1, PS2, PSP and Wii. Bought myself a PS3 after that and got myself a 360 for free via a Cokezone promotion.
Now I've got myself a 3DS which is seven kinds of awesome and will be getting a U as soon as I possibly can.
And I'm 41 in October...an old git(
Y'know, I want to ask.
Exactly what HUD elements would you be comfortable putting on the Upad? I wouldn't want to have to look down to see my HP, but coins/rupees wouldn't be a problem to be down there. But then again, they dont' take up any real estate...
Idk, people trumpet this HUD thing but I'm not sure it has that much potential...
Exactly what HUD elements would you be comfortable putting on the Upad? I wouldn't want to have to look down to see my HP, but coins/rupees wouldn't be a problem to be down there. But then again, they dont' take up any real estate...
Idk, people trumpet this HUD thing but I'm not sure it has that much potential...
So controllers should have stayed as a single stick with one button and let the games innovate forever yes?
Also you don't have to prefer an option, because its optional....
Think of a racing game - the track layout, position, speed, laps to go and rearview can ALL go down on the bottom - leaving you with an uninterrupted, clean image on your TV.
Offers a more immersive, involving experience.
What inspired you to say that? This current generation, and the last generation have been quite different than previous generations in terms of controllers. Nowadays the controllers for 360/Xbox/PS2/PS3/PC have been pretty much the same thing, unlike the past where each console was sporting their own thing.
I want the option to use something like I've stated above.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
I don't know about HUD elements like HP and rupees and all that but you can't sit there and pretend like it wouldn't be amazing for inventory. Equip things on the fly, have a good view of everything you have, manage it on screen quickly.
Pretty much.
People are way overrating the potential of this thing, imo. Bottom screen of the DS works because it's a centimetre away from the top screen. This requires looking down and looking back up at the TV screen. Talk about a headache.
I like the idea of playing my console games in bed with the controller screen. But that's about it.
Jaded Alyx
Member
I wouldn't want to look away from the screen in a racing game to see my position and laps, etc.
EatinOlives
Member
That wouldn't work at all. Looking at the controller screen is going to have you crank your neck down on the controller, completely taking your eyes off the screen (in a racing game...) just to see what position of the race you're in. It's nothing like moving your eyes a couple of millimeters to the left/right to quickly check your position for an instant at all.
I agree with udivision. The screen has some good potential but the whole HUD thing won't be as good as some people think it'll be. A real-world example of this is looking at the wireless 360 controller. When the controller's running out of battery the player number LEDs start doing a little dance. With my controller in my lap, the LEDs are either completely outside of my peripheral vision or just barely on the edge, meaning I either don't notice at all or if I do, I have to go "BWA?! BATTERIES RUNNING OUT?" and crank my neck down. If I see the LED dance just as it's finishing its animation it sometimes stops by the time I look down, meaning I have to constantly look down on the controller to see if I'm really running out. After a couple of minutes I just look up the battery meter on the damn dashboard menu on the TV anyway.
I don't know if this happens to other people, but at least for me I've already had experience cranking my head down looking down at controllers several times during gameplay and let me tell you it's not comfortable. It'd be atrocious for HUD hiding.
That would be cool to press a button and send all those elements to the Subscreen. The problem is when I wanted to look at my position, the track layout, speed, etc, I'd just press that same button and have it pop up back on the main screen without having to take my eyes of the main screen and risk making a mistake.
I'm talking about HUD elements, not the existence of the touch-based subscreen.
I don't really see the point. The screen is small and you won't hold the pad all that close to your eyes. HD would be a waste of processing power and bandwidth.
Oddly, I like the idea of actually interacting with your real world space. I know the 3DS/Vita already do stuff like that with AR games and the likes.
And perhaps in the minority, but like the idea of like detective mode or the various visors in the Metroid game being on the controller and holding it up to the screen.
I also think we're going to see a lot of games that include AI director-esque multiplayer modes in the living room.
Is it though? 3 million units sold becomes less impressive considering all the cable boxes and Live subscribers out there. Not to mention the burgeoning smart tv market, and the fact that TiVo is even still breathing.
Apple is an undeniable tech behemoth, but they really have yet to dominate the living-room space, and there are services out there (including the constantly evolving Xbox Live) that are ensuring they probably never will. So I don't think Nintendo is in a position where they have to compete with Apple, at least not in the console space.
Nor do I think that anybody planning to buy an iPad is going to be enticed to buy the Wii U instead, or vice versa. They're not similar devices just because they both feature touch screens. The iPad's biggest strength is that its slim and portable. It can function as a computer replacement on the go. The upad can't. It's a terminal; a controller with a screen on it and nothing more. It's every bit reliant on the console as if it were tethered to it. It'll be able to provide superior gaming to the iPad, but that's because it's a console, not an iPad competitor.
Of course Nintendo should add extra functionality to take advantage of the touch screen, but I think it would be a huge waste of resources if Nintendo approached next gen as though Apple were their competition.
Cerebral Assassin
Member
Now that the main controller has shoulder buttons/triggers I think the arrows would be unnecessary, but I see your point.
I agree. The playing the console while on your bed thing sounds nice, but at the end of the day it's not that major.
Right, so stuff the second DS screen can't do. I'm looking forward to that stuff too.
I'm just not sure if many devs are going to utilize it as anything more than an inventory screen, or maybe throw some maps and hud down there. In other words, the bottom screen of the DS.
I can't see how this will benefit a, say, Mario or Zelda.
Well Zelda I think is easy.
With moving the inventory and stuff to the bottom screen.
Maybe finally get my dream of being able to use multiple items at once to solve a puzzle in a Zelda game.
But this is why also excited for e3.
I mean with the Wii, we got the Wii Sports/Wii Fit stuff to showcase the console.
The GameCube bought us Luigi's Mansion and Pikmin for that controller.
Of course got Mario 64, Ocarina of Time and others for the n64.
I want to see what other there concept Nintendo has for the controller. And what new game IP they deliver.
User Name Here
Member
I'd say, pretty much anything that doesn't require your immediate attention 90%+ of the time.
Lord Ghirahim
Member
I posted something to that effect in the Durango (?) HD tablet rumor thread. I don't see the point of 6" HD screens. Not for next generation systems anyway.
TheExplodingHead
Banned
90% of the let's call it "traditional existing design paradigms" will only be really improved by the Upad with a extended UI/feature integration as it pertains to stacking functions seamlessly into a game that weren't possible before. That will be the true strength of this interface for more traditional games/ports. Inventory improvements are arbitrary at best, and really adds very little.
What I'm looking forward to are ground up concepts that utilize the Upad in creative ways to bring entirely new ideas/types to gaming (something I feel the Wiimote failed miserably at for the most part).
What I'm looking forward to are ground up concepts that utilize the Upad in creative ways to bring entirely new ideas/types to gaming (something I feel the Wiimote failed miserably at for the most part).
I think putting all HUD elements on the subscreen would work well, for me. I'm sitting on my couch right now, and if I pretend to be holding the subscreen in my hand, no problem glancing down at it and then back to TV.
While I drive I'm regularly looking at side and rearview mirrors, the radio, etc., and don't have any problems staying on the road and avoiding collisions. =)
I can see the argument people are making, and it definitely will be different strokes for different folks, but for me I don't think it'll be a problem at all.
Edit: I shouldn't say "all" HUD elements, I suppose. There will be games where I'll want some things on the screen. The minimap in COD, for one. So yeah, hopefully developers will just give us the option of what goes where.
While I drive I'm regularly looking at side and rearview mirrors, the radio, etc., and don't have any problems staying on the road and avoiding collisions. =)
I can see the argument people are making, and it definitely will be different strokes for different folks, but for me I don't think it'll be a problem at all.
Edit: I shouldn't say "all" HUD elements, I suppose. There will be games where I'll want some things on the screen. The minimap in COD, for one. So yeah, hopefully developers will just give us the option of what goes where.
JohnTinker
Limbaugh Parrot
How many times more powerful than the 360 does it need to be to not display a HUD
Have you used it?
How do you know what improves and what doesn't until it's given the opportunity to do so? "I don't see how anyone could possibly do anything to improve anything" is different than "It can't possibly improve anything".
The touch screen adds x number of buttons as well. Then there's waggle for functions that make sense. I mean, what do you want - this?
Tell me, good sir, how is it that games are going to continue innovating with a controller design from 1996? You know what would be awesome? A time machine. I would love to go back in time and told Nintendo to redesign Mario 64 with the NES pad in mind. Input method goes hand-in-hand with game design.
It's only a "gimmick" until it works. Analog sticks were gimmicks, triggers were gimmicks, rumble was a gimmick, rear touchpads are a gimmick - etc etc. What you fail to mention here, however, is that sometimes these "gimmicks" do improve gameplay. You cite that using dual-analog is your preference... how in the name of the flying spaghetti monster do you play FPS/TPS titles, then? When aiming is far superior on the Wiimote/Move? And it is even more superior on a mouse. Why would you relegate yourself to using a "gimmick" like an analog stick to aim, which requires a cheat enabled (autoaim) to work and designers to succumb to levels designed around it (horizontal-based enemy placement instead of heavy emphasis on vertical, greatly limiting the imagination of said level designers)? Why can't we improve? Why do we need to be stuck on a "gimmick"?
P.S. gimmick gimmick waggle gimmick gimmicky gimmick
15, or 1.5 Samaritans...
I'll answer your question with another question, can you imagine playing Smash Bros. with this controller?
It's called the Nintendo DS, and 3DS. And what makes it enjoyable is the fact that the screens are right in front of your face.
No. What currently is the norm is fine for me.
I answered this question earlier.
And another thing is that I don't consider this an innovation, it's more of a nuisance to me. I also said that innovation should be in the gameplay, not the controller, meaning the designs from the past decade have been superb.
When were more buttons a gimmick? And how does a touchscreen controller really improve on what's already been done? From what we've seen so far, having to look away from the screen, or walking around your room using the Wii U as a camera, isn't really that shocking.
I wouldn't be surprised if they had like uPad app games/downloadable titles like that.
But why would anyone forgo having an option of playing the game on TV?
Agreed, Z80 rocked. I first had a SpectraVideo that was Z80A and did a little assembly in that (Back in the days when we had to poke bytes into memory as there was no IDE per se) then moved to Amiga where I did a lot of assembly. While I love C++, writing assembly was a great feeling although I imagine if I had to write anything as large as a game in it nowadays I'd go mad.
Nibel, loving the mockups. One thing I think I'd like to see is a version with less rounded boxes and "text bubbles". Makes things look a little too busy I think.
ShockingAlberto
Member
I imagine there'll be ways around that, through audio notifications and other things.
I could see it making sense for small DD titles and such, but doesn't fit for a large scale release.
With the Right Stick as well.
That would be counter intuitive would it not? but anyways, no, I pretty sure they wouldn't disallow it. the sub-screen leaves too many concepts to be hindered like stupid rules and regulations like that. I just had like a day dream of a platformer going from the tv screen to the wii U screen and back as a type of puzzle. this console couldn't come any sooner ={. there needs to be creative indie games on this thing day one.
IceDoesntHelp
Banned
Yep.
Yeeepppp.
PS: I guess you're trying to say it would be uncomfortable, but this leads to the original question. Have you used it? How would you know it would be uncomfortable without ever using it?
I understand your hesitancy but it does feel like you're jumping to a whole bunch of conclusions. Considering most devs will likely allow you to play on the just the Upad screen, there'll be controller configs designed so you don't have to look back and forth from screen to screen if that's not your cup of tea. Hopefully those controls will be available for play on TVs as well, ultimately meaning you don't have to use the screen if you don't want to.
The other points - circle pads and lack of clicky sticks - I'm more empathetic about, but in no way are those things absolutely required for the vast majority of games (though apparently some feel CoD is simply wholly unplayable without em). It's more or less a normal controller with a big ass screen in the middle that all reports say is very comfortable to hold.
InfiniDragon
Member
Absolutely.
Circle pads are a downgrade from analog sticks. the 3DS one makes me sick, and I can't imagine the Wii U pads being much better. In a game like Smash Bros, I'd like some precision.
I think Smash would play like shit with that controller.
I'll be using the classic controller/third party gamecube controller.
I think Smash would play like shit with that controller.
I'll be using the classic controller/third party gamecube controller.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
Everyone already knows how I feel about the controller and how it lacks things for no discernible reason other than "Nintendo being nintendo".
But with that said, I've come to the conclusion that I refuse to talk about it anymore until I see the final thing. They could have added/tweaked anything.
But with that said, I've come to the conclusion that I refuse to talk about it anymore until I see the final thing. They could have added/tweaked anything.
ShockingAlberto
Member
I don't really use the right stick in Smash Bros., but the things I have used it for would theoretically not be any more difficult to do than they were on the Gamecube's right stick.
I think you're missing the plot. Console games are, and have always been, in competition with TV, movies, socializing, books, girlfriends, sports, etc. It doesn't matter that playing a Nintendo game is different from playing a sport, they both require the same commodity - time. They obviously aren't in direct competition with each other, but it's competition nonetheless.
Now add to that list the iPad, iPhone, iPod Touch, Android, and all the other touchscreen devices in use today. These are things that either didn't exist or weren't as prevalent 7 years ago when this console generation started. Where in some ways Nintendo addressed competition with sports, socializing and girlfriends with the Wii, the Wii U is now addressing the competition with those new types of handheld devices. Again, it's not direct competition, but it is competition nonetheless. Also, I didn't mean it's only the iPad Nintendo is up against, that was just the one example I used.
It's speculation. I'm just stating my concerns on the layout, and I just can't imagine it being as fast. That specific part is something I will have to test, but I doubt it it will be as effective as a C stick under the A button.
It's called asymmetrical gameplay and it's going to be awesome. I don't think the upad should be considered a gimmicky controller simply due to your lack of imagination or vision.
It's not a lack of imagination, and I've already mentioned it's that "I consider it a gimmick" not "It's a gimmick, and a fact". I think the touch screen is a unneeded gimmick, I don't think the controller is.
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