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Working Designs is a goner.........
- Thread starter Tenacious-V
- Start date
Musashi Wins!
FLAWLESS VICTOLY!
I don't really care about all the fanboy bullshit.
I think this is a sad moment for gamers. Bye WD. Thanks.
I think this is a sad moment for gamers. Bye WD. Thanks.
F*********************************************CK
Another nail in this industry's coffin.
All the real ones are going down the drain, it was written in the sky someday it would be Working Designs.
I pray for the day this industry will have 2 sides (pretty much like movies).
There will be Hollywood (EA, Activision,Ubisoft,Konami etc) and there will be the "B scene"
where creativity and vision will prevail. I'm sure this industry is getting big enough for this to become possible. Maybe the Revolution will help. I truly hope.
In the meantime, i shed a tear for Working Design. I part of my passion for videogame is gone somehow. I had alot of respect for this developer/publisher
.
Another nail in this industry's coffin.
All the real ones are going down the drain, it was written in the sky someday it would be Working Designs.
I pray for the day this industry will have 2 sides (pretty much like movies).
There will be Hollywood (EA, Activision,Ubisoft,Konami etc) and there will be the "B scene"
where creativity and vision will prevail. I'm sure this industry is getting big enough for this to become possible. Maybe the Revolution will help. I truly hope.
In the meantime, i shed a tear for Working Design. I part of my passion for videogame is gone somehow. I had alot of respect for this developer/publisher
.
Wyzdom said:
As much as I love Working Designs I do not see them closing as an "industry problem". WD had been really, really slow in getting games out in recent years and honestly they weren't bringing over the right games. They really needed another "Lunar" game under their belts. Their Saturn / PSOne run was nothing short of amazing though. I just wish they could've ported Dragon Force to PS2/PSP before they closed. :\
At least we have Atlus and Xseed to fill the void for quirky Japanese -> U.S. ports.
It seems like Vic has been around forever on various newsgroups and message boards, at least since '94 when I first got online. I've probably purchased every WD product, even when my interest was lukewarm, because I at least knew I was getting a quality item and always wanted to support "that guy from the newsgroups." Here's hoping Vic keeps getting work and that Working Designs comes back some day.
Jugendstil
Member
Even though I didn't always agree with some of the changes they made to games, some of the first console rpgs I played were the ones WD brought out here. It's easy to forget that back in the day we were denied a large amount of the rpgs that were released in Japan. WD was one of the only companies to support the genre back in the dark ages. The two Lunar Sega CD games are still amazing, and were a total revelation back then. Lunar the Silver Star is still my favorite rpg. Releasing rpgs, releasing shooters, supporting the Turbo Grafx, the Sega CD, and the Saturn, making sure their games always had top notch presentation, and getting into discussions/arguments with people on the Sega newsgroup. Thanks for all the entertainment, Vic. I'm pouring out a 40oz for you guys.
..pakbeka..
Member
damn, I really wanted that Goemon..... 
Working Designs, you will be missed
Working Designs, you will be missed
I wonder if they could merge with XSEED
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
I always liked the idea of WD, but never the product. Not into JRPGs at all, and the rest of their stuff was so-so.
Vic is a master at playing the victim, though. I don't suppose there's a reason that his stuff doesn't get approved, is late, etc, that is ever his fault.
Vic is a master at playing the victim, though. I don't suppose there's a reason that his stuff doesn't get approved, is late, etc, that is ever his fault.
This has been coming for a long time. Once it became clear that there was a profitable niche market for "alternative" RPGs (ie, not Final Fantasy), japanese publishers like Atlus and Nippon Ichi starded bringing them over themselves.
I do have to thank Vic for bringing a lot of really good titles over here, as well as getting publishers to pack in soundtracks and whatnot, but in a way, he's a victim of his own success.
I do have to thank Vic for bringing a lot of really good titles over here, as well as getting publishers to pack in soundtracks and whatnot, but in a way, he's a victim of his own success.
Razoric said:
Well, i didn't mean they didn't do mistakes or bring the over the right games (though, they did bring the right games most of the time imo).
I mean that this company was having a nice purpose, they had more vision than many.
Small companies with purposes, small companies with innovation and also vision are rarer and rarer and it's a problem imo. They can't survive anymore but we need them to feed this industry. Videogames are a form of expression just like movies or music imo.
But the industy isn't as mature as movies or music yet. There is still place for true artists in between Britney Spear and Ashley Simpson. There should be place for Katamari Damacy in between "EA sequel big shot #53".
There's a second scene, a B scene, back-up scene that needs to devellop and stuff like
Working Design closing isn't an positive indication that videogames are going that way.
Well...Lunar is my favourite RPG hands down, and Dragon Force isn't far behind. I'll admit that I usually make sure to buy every Working Designs game, and on the Sega CD and Saturn, they were golden.
That said, the little goodbye post at the beginning here is typical Vic. It's always someone else's fault, and had nothing to do with decisions like fighting to release one of the worst PS2 launch games years after the fact. I feel sorry for the folks that worked at WD, as I always hate to hear of people losing a job, but I have to admit I have a hard time feeling that sorry for Vic.
Maybe it was his irrational behaviour. Maybe it was the time he threatened to pull ads because I used a freelancer he didn't like. Maybe it was the time he called for my termination when I didn't like Arc the Lad. Who knows?
Had that happened in the mid-90s, I'd be more upset, because back then WD was championing good games that no one wanted to bring here. Nowadays, there are so many more publishers that are doing it right, WD is pretty much irrelevent anyway.
Thanks for the memories, Vic. But this was inevitable.
That said, the little goodbye post at the beginning here is typical Vic. It's always someone else's fault, and had nothing to do with decisions like fighting to release one of the worst PS2 launch games years after the fact. I feel sorry for the folks that worked at WD, as I always hate to hear of people losing a job, but I have to admit I have a hard time feeling that sorry for Vic.
Maybe it was his irrational behaviour. Maybe it was the time he threatened to pull ads because I used a freelancer he didn't like. Maybe it was the time he called for my termination when I didn't like Arc the Lad. Who knows?
Had that happened in the mid-90s, I'd be more upset, because back then WD was championing good games that no one wanted to bring here. Nowadays, there are so many more publishers that are doing it right, WD is pretty much irrelevent anyway.
Thanks for the memories, Vic. But this was inevitable.
wow, i thought they'd abandoned goemon years ago. i can't remember hearing anything good about the ps2 version, but as a fan of the franchise, i hope wd's localization comes out in europe.
i've lost interest in jrpgs, but i'll remember wd's lunar translations fondly -- faithful or no, they were sufficiently lively that i actually enjoyed talking to townspeople, which is generally an alienating chore. and while i import my 2d shooters, it's awesome that wd brought so many over...even if they thought fit to call their shooter label "spaz." :/
i've lost interest in jrpgs, but i'll remember wd's lunar translations fondly -- faithful or no, they were sufficiently lively that i actually enjoyed talking to townspeople, which is generally an alienating chore. and while i import my 2d shooters, it's awesome that wd brought so many over...even if they thought fit to call their shooter label "spaz." :/
Dr. Kitty Muffins
Member
I was really hoping that WD would get absorbed into Nippon Ichi's US localization team. I think it would have benefited NI to back the games WD was working on and doubling their localization team would have got more of NI's games out the door faster.
And GAF should sticky a tribute thread to this company for a month. Maybe even do a tribute article on the front page.....
And GAF should sticky a tribute thread to this company for a month. Maybe even do a tribute article on the front page.....
Jonnyboy117
Member
They made Lunar: SSSC a special game for me, so I'm sad to hear this news.
Is the Goemon game he mentions the awful PS2 one? Cuz I think I played that at E3 2001 or something. It was forever ago, really, and it wasn't worth localizing from what I played.
Is the Goemon game he mentions the awful PS2 one? Cuz I think I played that at E3 2001 or something. It was forever ago, really, and it wasn't worth localizing from what I played.
DS games is because of WD did years ago.
Wulfer
Member
Your right it's better not to have any games at all! My gosh I'm going to turn over a new leaf and hate all gaming companies because I'm sure we'll get more games that way!
When you have something that's actually worth saying then maybe you can speak until then silence is golden...
Community Forum
Member
Well this is certainly depressing news to wake up to. One of the highlights of my hobby was meeting Vic at E3 2002. Good luck in your future endeavours!
VictimOfGrief
Banned
Come on Microsoft... release your press statement already......
WULFER said:
You want to hear what I have to say?
It's you type of people that limit gaming (and anime and manga and whatever other localization industries) in the West. You and your low standards of "well, as long as it's in English, that's all that matters to me" BS. As if that excuses everything else that was dropped. If people were that easy to please, then I would screw around with customers too.
I have a friend who kinda shared your mentality. He's somewhat into like dating sims and stuff right? So when Thousand Arms was announced for US, he was more than happy to pick it up. I was like, WTF, why? It's such a horrible game, both as a RPG and as a romance-lite adventure. His response? "Well if I don't buy it, then they may not want to bring over games like Tokimeki Memorial to the US."
I'm appalled at such a mentality. Why should anyone purchase sub-par games in order for the fleeting hope that it may influence a company to bring something you really want over here? Why should you? English gaming is not all that matters and really. It's not intellectually challenging to play Silhouette Mirage, Thunderforce V etc in Japanese. Heck, it's not even intellectually challenging to play LUNAR in Japanese either.
Don't sell yourself short and compromise the other game elements just because of what language the text is in. You deserve better.
As Gerg Stewy over there put it, Lunar has always been one of my fav game series of all time (hence the Ghaleon avatar from like 10 years ago), but the company had some serious problems in later generations. And just like the whole Sega fiasco, putting blame on SCEA for most of what transpired is probably exaggerating a bit.
Still, I thank them for the awesome TG-16 CD and Sega CD games. I believe I still have every game they published back then.
Still, I thank them for the awesome TG-16 CD and Sega CD games. I believe I still have every game they published back then.
WD had problems, certainly. (Every company does.) Vic wasn't perfect, and I'm not sure I'd want to work for him. They certainly did some mystifying "tuning" of difficulty and mechanics.
Nevertheless, WD was a great company, full of people who cared about their work. Despite all the gibberings of the haters, they made some great games available to people who did not have access to imports. In the pre-WWW world, that made a hell of a lot of difference.
Vic Ireland and all the WD staff over the years deserve any thanks they get and a good deal more. Thanks, guys.
Nevertheless, WD was a great company, full of people who cared about their work. Despite all the gibberings of the haters, they made some great games available to people who did not have access to imports. In the pre-WWW world, that made a hell of a lot of difference.
Vic Ireland and all the WD staff over the years deserve any thanks they get and a good deal more. Thanks, guys.
I know licensing costs were probably really high for such a small company, but I can't help but wonder if they couldn't have made a killing on something like the GBA. If they wanted to do Goemon so bad, they could've done Goemon I & II. You've got several potentially awesome RPGs, a couple shooters, some action games, all things WD was always so high on. And I really would've liked to see what they did with GBA packaging..
WrathOfOtaibah
Banned
Vic sounds like an elitist prick...and it bit him in the ass.
Still, a developer that specializes in bringing Japanese games over closes down isn't a good thing.
Still, a developer that specializes in bringing Japanese games over closes down isn't a good thing.
This really saddens me - I will always fondly remember their Dragon Force localization.
I know some people disliked their overly pop-culture centric translations, but I personally got a major kick out of them. Lunar SSS and ES were only palatable to me because of their work. Loves me the satire.
"Sample my goods!"
I know some people disliked their overly pop-culture centric translations, but I personally got a major kick out of them. Lunar SSS and ES were only palatable to me because of their work. Loves me the satire.
"Sample my goods!"
The game wasn't that great, but I thought Vanguard Bandits may've been their best translation. Considering what they had to deal with, I really thought they gave the characters a lot of, well.. character in the amount of screen time they got. There were some really funny quotes, and it was all around really polished.
Duck of Death
Member
Thanks for bringing us some great games, Working Designs. You'll definately be missed.
MassiveAttack
Banned
john tv said:
There was never any plan to grow the series. Alundra 2 was never developed as an Alundra sequel. It was an original ARPG developed by Matrix that SCEI slapped the "Alundra 2" moniker on at the last minute. This is a large part of why the game was received so poorly. It's connection to Alundra was non-existent in everything but name.
which is funny, because when i said that in my gamespot review, the producer (or whoever) at activision FREAKED THE FUCK OUT on joe fielder (then EIC of gamespot).MassiveAttack said:
hee.
as for WD, it's very sad, and they formed a very important part of gaming history for RPG fans, but it was also completely inevitable. there's something to be said for concentrating so heavily on the fans, but face it -- it's no way to run a business. obviously. times change.
the sad thing is the localizations kept getting better. i did find some of the jokey ones bad (albert odyssey's is the pits) but growlanser was really, really good.
I´m not agree, what SCEA must do is what the rest of SCE does, a correct quality control but without damaging small developers, imposing the way they should release their product as they have an undertanment of "what is best for you".
They have no idea about quality production of a game, they have been complete shit that has been released to the market and SCEA hasn´t done anything about it.
We don´t need SCEA putting walls for valid products in the most profitable market. I don´t see SCE in Japan saying anyone they have to release "2 games in a bundle" in order to give an approval. They make sure the game works correctly and the content is not offensive (Hentai and so) and that is all.
Small companies, are... well.. small (duh) they have little resources, they can´t waste lot of time in negotiating stupid details or trying to get unprofitable bundles in order to release something to the market.
SCEA is very responsible of that, beyond the logical mistakes a company can commit. They should help this type of companies, but they discourage them and make their work harder without a good reason to do it.
HomerSimpson-Man
Member
People bringing up Sega? You know they screwed themselves over all ready several times, no need to bring it up.
Shouta
Member
ferricide said:
This is really is the sad thing because Growlanser showed just how good Vic and the crew were good at doing translations and just how much they kept improving over the years. It was a huge step over Arc The Lad's translation and that was pretty damn good even for them. They did get a couple of odd jokes and they did give Viktor a Rusky accent and had Hans speak Spanglish but other than that I really don't recall any overt jokes.
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
Wow. Yeah, this is the end of an era.
I didn't always like what WD did, and didn't always like Vic's attitude, but WD was more than Vic. They were the hardcore before it was seen as hardcore in today's light. And I do think it's fair to say that they probably did alert other publishers to the fact that the serious enthusiast did exist, did want localizations better than 2-cent crap, and would pay top dollar for it every time.
It's also probably true that WD put themselves out of business thanks to opening up the niche market a bit more and getting outbid. But that's not the first time such a thing has happened - it is not uncommon in business. Often the first folks to innovate do not become the leader; somebody else with a better foundation comes along and adopts their practice, and has the staying power to outlast them.
Wild and weird and sad.
It's a bit ironic that Nintendo themselves almost appears to have benefited from the attitude of groups like WD. I mean, look at how seriously they take localizations of complex games (such as the Mario RPGs) these days, and the niche titles they're picking up now (ToP GBA).
I didn't always like what WD did, and didn't always like Vic's attitude, but WD was more than Vic. They were the hardcore before it was seen as hardcore in today's light. And I do think it's fair to say that they probably did alert other publishers to the fact that the serious enthusiast did exist, did want localizations better than 2-cent crap, and would pay top dollar for it every time.
It's also probably true that WD put themselves out of business thanks to opening up the niche market a bit more and getting outbid. But that's not the first time such a thing has happened - it is not uncommon in business. Often the first folks to innovate do not become the leader; somebody else with a better foundation comes along and adopts their practice, and has the staying power to outlast them.
Wild and weird and sad.
It's a bit ironic that Nintendo themselves almost appears to have benefited from the attitude of groups like WD. I mean, look at how seriously they take localizations of complex games (such as the Mario RPGs) these days, and the niche titles they're picking up now (ToP GBA).
BuckRobotron
Member
Just saw this news when cruising through Gamespot. Sad news. I appreciated Working Designs most especially for bringing over 2.5D shooters TFV, Raystorm, Raycrisis, and Silpheed PS2.
If you owned either a Sega CD or TG16 than this news should hit pretty hard. WD was really the first notable company in my mind to put a lot of work into their localizations. Back when most videogame manuals were printed on flimsy paper in black and white, WD was printing them on glossy paper in full color with the game's art adorning the pages. Some beautiful work there.
I didn't really have any experience with Vic and his politics until I started lurking here, and I don't think I would even like the guy in real life. But I don't like a lot of people. He still puts a lot of passion into what he does and I will always respect that. I think it's pretty sad whats happened and I hope he lands something good with the 360 because his talents could still be used.
I didn't really have any experience with Vic and his politics until I started lurking here, and I don't think I would even like the guy in real life. But I don't like a lot of people. He still puts a lot of passion into what he does and I will always respect that. I think it's pretty sad whats happened and I hope he lands something good with the 360 because his talents could still be used.
UltraMarioMan
Member
Depressing. I guess this means no Lunar 3 ever...