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[Dilbert]

Hey GAF fitness experts -- what is the best regiment to follow for the sole purpose of losing weight? Ideally, I'd like a specific schedule to follow: day, duration, type/intensity of activity.

Some specific questions:

1) What is the proper balance of cardio in the "cardiovascular improvement zone" (higher heart rate) versus the "fat burning zone" (lower heart rate)?

2) I have heard it said that it is not possible to lose significant weight AND gain muscle at the same time...but I've also heard it said that your body preferentially burns muscle tissue, rather than fat. What amount/type of weight training is appropriate to maintain current strength during intensive weight loss?

3) Is there any advantage (rather than convenience) for exercising in the morning versus at night?

4) Any tricks to keep from plateauing?

 

[borghe]

1. the biggest factor in burning fat (as energy) is more length of time than heart rate. for running for example, you will burn more energy in minutes 40-50 than you will from minutes 1-30. the trick is to burn as many calories as possible and that almost always is accomplished by keeping your heart rate up for an extended period of time continuously.

2. this is absolutely correct. however the real purpose of weight loss isn't generally to lose weight but to lose fat. in that sense, while it is difficult to lose weight while gaining muscle, it is easy as pie to lose fat while gaining muscle. My brother, over about 3 months lost 40 pounds. It was measured however that he loss closer to 50-60 pounds of actual fat and put on around 10-20 pounds of muscle (VERY out of shape to begin with). So if you want to lose weight total quickly, do a lot of cardio. if you want to combine fat loss and muscle growth, do a balanced weight training workout (like usually 2-3 sets of 10-15 reps to negative failure). of course you could also just do massive weight training and keep the fat.. like 1-2 sets of 4-6 reps.

3. just depending on if you are a morning or night person. but there is no physical advantage. just make sure you eat something before hand if you do it in the morning.. even a piece of peanut butter toast can help immensely.

4. remain consistent. NEVER sway from your regimine. Working out is like a job. You don't do it because you like it, and even if you don't want to do it you do it anyway because you have no other choice. You get paid from it just like you do from a job, only instead of getting paid in money you get paid in improved or maintained health.

 

[Kabuki Waq]

lots of cardio and eat right no other way.


I find just playing sports and running will eventually do the trick no need to worry about specifics.

 

[Kung Fu Jedi]

Any increase in physical activity can help you to burn fat and lose weight. I generally recommend that you find something that you enjoy doing and start doing it more regularly, at least for a start. Once you get going, it's easier to mix in other activities, especially as your energy levels increase. Plus, it helps to break up the monotony of having a constant routine.

As for me, I run, lift weights, ride my bike, and take a martial arts class. When I can, I find time to kayak and rock climb too. Running is a great way to get your cardio going, of course, but its also harder for a lot of people to get into. It can be painful to start!

 

[theo]

if you want to burn fat, try an elliptical machine. its more effective than a treadmill, and is very low impact.

 

[aparisi2274]

Hey GAF fitness experts -- what is the best regiment to follow for the sole purpose of losing weight? Ideally, I'd like a specific schedule to follow: day, duration, type/intensity of activity.

Some specific questions:

1) What is the proper balance of cardio in the "cardiovascular improvement zone" (higher heart rate) versus the "fat burning zone" (lower heart rate)?

2) I have heard it said that it is not possible to lose significant weight AND gain muscle at the same time...but I've also heard it said that your body preferentially burns muscle tissue, rather than fat. What amount/type of weight training is appropriate to maintain current strength during intensive weight loss?

3) Is there any advantage (rather than convenience) for exercising in the morning versus at night?

4) Any tricks to keep from plateauing?

I am on Weight Watchers. I started about 4 months ago. In that time I lost 35lbs. My routine was 4-5 days of Tae Bo Cardio. It is a 45min workout that constantly keeps you going and you build up a nice sweat. I highly suggest it. It has helped tremendously, that coupled with my diet routine has helped me go down 4 pants sizes as well.

 

[karasu]

Training in the morning ups your metabolism causing you to burn more calories throught the day. I tend to train early in the morning on an empty stomach. That way instead of burning carbs, my body is burning fat.

 

[Mr Mike]

Training in the morning ups your metabolism causing you to burn more calories throught the day. I tend to train early in the morning on an empty stomach. That way instead of burning carbs, my body is burning fat.

I'd read that training on an empty stomach meant that you had less energy to train with. Or is that wrong? I'm not trying to correct you or criticise - the whole thing's a mystery to me and something I'd like to get right.

 

[karasu]

Yeah, it's kind of the point though. It makes your body use a secondary energy source, fat. That's not to say that you won't have enough energy to workout, once the momentum hits you're good to go.

 

[videogamer]

Hey GAF fitness experts -- what is the best regiment to follow for the sole purpose of losing weight? Ideally, I'd like a specific schedule to follow: day, duration, type/intensity of activity.

Some specific questions:

1) What is the proper balance of cardio in the "cardiovascular improvement zone" (higher heart rate) versus the "fat burning zone" (lower heart rate)?

2) I have heard it said that it is not possible to lose significant weight AND gain muscle at the same time...but I've also heard it said that your body preferentially burns muscle tissue, rather than fat. What amount/type of weight training is appropriate to maintain current strength during intensive weight loss?

3) Is there any advantage (rather than convenience) for exercising in the morning versus at night?

4) Any tricks to keep from plateauing?

(><) Have you tried taking gym classes? The fact that they have a regular schedule is a tremendous help. That and the boot-camp like instructor help a lot in the motivation department.

Spinning, aerobics, and dance classes can all help make you drip with sweat without making it such a planned out chore (which your post sounds like). Spinning is great if you are a noob.

 

[El Papa]

I've been running about 4-5 miles a day recently, and I'm already seeing results. Nothing major yet, but I can tell that it's shrinking the pesky winter insulation (turkey, mashed potatoes & gravy, honey ham, etc.). It takes me about 1 hour to 1 hour and a half to finish my route. There's no way I can use a stationary machine for running, I hate it. Maybe a recumbant bike or something. I've also avoided sweets for the most part and have cut my bread/starch intake by 75% at least. I'm also drinking alot more water again, about 2-3 liters a day. So given all that, I went from 189 to 165 in about a month, most of it obviously water weight and the fact that I stopped lifting to do alot more cardio, so I lost some muscle. I want to be around 175, muscular/toned with no stupid man-gut. My suggestion is just do cardio for at least an hour every other day, or every day or you're a manic like me and eat small often, cutting back on starch and sugar, especially refined sugars like in junk foods. Of course, a turkey or tuna sandwich on whole wheat bread doesn't hurt to much when you're doing cardio.

 

[demon]

Well obviously a decent amount of cardio is really important, but try to make it "fun" (not agonizingly dull) like doing it in front of the TV or using an mp3 player. Nothing's worse than monotonous cardio, because you get bored of it fast and might lose the motivation to do it.

Also, supposedly HIIT (high intensity interval training (?)) is more effective at fat-loss than the light-medium cardio. Instead of doing light cardio for 45-50 minutes once a day, do 15-20 minutes of intense cardio once or (preferably) twice a day, but only if you're in good enough shape to handle it. I think that's been working at shedding that last stubborn-as-a-motha' layer of fat on me that regular cardio never got rid of, although the green-tea pills have probably helped as well. Green tea has been shown to increase metabolism and fat-burning. I use a stationary bike while watching tv, by the way.

 

[El Papa]

I've been wanting to try HIIT, but I've wanted to get back into decent enough shape to do it. What's your routine like? I wish I had a stationary bike, I would be on that thing for hourse and play World of Warcraft . Looks like I'm going to start drinking green tea instead of coffee, thanks for the heads up.

 

[borghe]

Yeah, it's kind of the point though. It makes your body use a secondary energy source, fat. That's not to say that you won't have enough energy to workout, once the momentum hits you're good to go.

this is incorrect.. your body doesn't process fat for energy first. it processes protein and muscle mass. after sleeping at this point your muscles are already depleted of stored carbs and your body has already begun atrophying your muscle. at this point you will literally be running on empty. while you are correct in that the muscle stimulation will eliminate the atrophy and your body, carb starved, will begin to metabolize body fat AFTER the workout, it doesn't change the fact that during the workout, at least when just waking up, your body will have absolutely no energy from which to draw from. your body won't be able to metabolize the fact soon enough to give you energy from that, your muscles have no stored carbs in them from sleeping, and you have no digested food metabolizing to give you energy either. So while the effect seems optimal, in reality you are burning WAY fewer calories than you otherwise could with additional energy. studies on active nutrition dot com and I believe muscle101 say that even eating just 75 calories of carbs an hour or so before a workout in the morning can dramatically increase your results of the workout.

during the day is a different story. because you have presumably already eaten during the day your body has metabolized the nutrients into stored energy so eating right before you work out (1-2 hours before) will have a lesser effect than it will in the morning. however it should still be noted that in many studies, it has still shown that even during the day most people will benefit from increased energy by eating 1-2 hours before working out during the day. the insulin rush from eating and the lowered glucose levels can give a surge of energy effectively allowing you to burn more calories than you would otherwise be able to.

the important thing to remember during all of this is that just the simple act of exercise isn't enough. it is directly proportionate to how many calories you are capable of burning. you need to supply yourself enough calories during the day to convert to energy to accomplish the activity level you want to maintain, but need to consume few enough calories that you send your body into a deficit at night when your body will then matabolize reserves and where you actually lose weight (yes, you lose almost all of your weight when you are sleeping).

anyway, long story short is you will see better energy levels and thus burn more calories and be able to exercise harder in the morning if you eat an hour or more before you exercise.

 

[Dilbert]

(><) Have you tried taking gym classes? The fact that they have a regular schedule is a tremendous help. That and the boot-camp like instructor help a lot in the motivation department.

Spinning, aerobics, and dance classes can all help make you drip with sweat without making it such a planned out chore (which your post sounds like). Spinning is great if you are a noob.

Nice idea, but a) I hate all of those class topics and b) I couldn't guarantee that I'd be able to make the start time for the class on a consistent basis. (In fact, that seems to be exactly the problem these days.) I actually don't mind hitting various cardio machines with an MP3 player -- I don't really get "bored" at the gym.

My specific issue is that I DO have to schedule time to work out, since it seems to get bumped off the daily plan otherwise. I'm just asking the question about how many times a week, how long each session ought to be, and what other "prep items" have to be in the schedule so that I allocate the right amount of time for maximum effect.

 

[karasu]

this is incorrect.. your body doesn't process fat for energy first. it processes protein and muscle mass. after sleeping at this point your muscles are already depleted of stored carbs and your body has already begun atrophying your muscle. at this point you will literally be running on empty. while you are correct in that the muscle stimulation will eliminate the atrophy and your body, carb starved, will begin to metabolize body fat AFTER the workout, it doesn't change the fact that during the workout, at least when just waking up, your body will have absolutely no energy from which to draw from. your body won't be able to metabolize the fact soon enough to give you energy from that, your muscles have no stored carbs in them from sleeping, and you have no digested food metabolizing to give you energy either. So while the effect seems optimal, in reality you are burning WAY fewer calories than you otherwise could with additional energy. studies on active nutrition dot com and I believe muscle101 say that even eating just 75 calories of carbs an hour or so before a workout in the morning can dramatically increase your results of the workout.

during the day is a different story. because you have presumably already eaten during the day your body has metabolized the nutrients into stored energy so eating right before you work out (1-2 hours before) will have a lesser effect than it will in the morning. however it should still be noted that in many studies, it has still shown that even during the day most people will benefit from increased energy by eating 1-2 hours before working out during the day. the insulin rush from eating and the lowered glucose levels can give a surge of energy effectively allowing you to burn more calories than you would otherwise be able to.

the important thing to remember during all of this is that just the simple act of exercise isn't enough. it is directly proportionate to how many calories you are capable of burning. you need to supply yourself enough calories during the day to convert to energy to accomplish the activity level you want to maintain, but need to consume few enough calories that you send your body into a deficit at night when your body will then matabolize reserves and where you actually lose weight (yes, you lose almost all of your weight when you are sleeping).

anyway, long story short is you will see better energy levels and thus burn more calories and be able to exercise harder in the morning if you eat an hour or more before you exercise.

I have to disagree, if only because it works for me and everyone I've trained with. I feel so much better after working out in the morning, before breakfast. There are a ton of reputable sources, both trainers and athletes, who recomend getting your fat burning in before breakfast. There are also studies suggesting that you can burn up to 300% more bodyfat with this method. You recomend as few as 75 calories before working out? That's like a glass of juice. No problem there.

"A study carried out at Kansas State University (Wilcox, Harford & Wedel Medicine & Science in Sports and Exercise, 17:2, 1985), indicates that a kilogram of fat will be oxidized sooner when exercising in the fasted condition in the morning than when doing the same exercise in the afternoon. By measuring respiratory gas exchange, caloric expenditure, and carbohydrate and fatty acid metabolism, these researchers showed that the mass of fat burned during aerobic exercise amounts to 67% of the total energy expenditure achieved when the same exercise is done later in the day or in the fed state."

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/matt13.htm

http://www.bodybuildingforyou.com/articles-submit/adrian-bryant/2-ways-fat-loss.htm

http://msn.runnersworld.com/article/0,5033,s7-53-85-0-628,00.html

http://www.anabolicinsider.com/articles_tra_tqa1002.htm

 

[borghe]

what you are saying is ok for a pure fat burning workout, however for typical training (not necessarily aimed at sole weight loss) you will have an overall better workout by eating a light munch before the workout

On the other hand, exercising on an empty stomach can also be difficult for some people, as they feel drained or out of energy. The ideal time to exercise would be approximately one-to-four hours after a meal.

To get the most out of a cardiovascular workout, I suggest that you eat lightly, about one hour before you exercise. This will give you some time to digest the food, and will give you the energy you need for your workout. Some fruit, or low-starch vegetables like green beans or carrots would be good choices. Once digested, these fresh foods will supply carbohydrates for energy without a lot of calories. Avoid fat foods, or high protein foods like nuts and legumes this close to a workout, since they take longer to digest. Stay away from high calorie sugary foods like soda and candy, they may give you a sugar-buzz, but they won't give you more energy.

Most fitness experts recommend having a healthy meal around two hours before exercising, or if this isn’t possible, a carb-rich snack such as a banana or bowl of high-fibre cereal with semi-skimmed milk about one hour before. If you leave too long between eating and exercising, your blood sugar levels are likely to be low and this can may make you feel dizzy, weak or faint, as well as leaving you low on energy so that you don’t get the most out of your workout.

All bodies will use fat for energy when no blood glycogen is available. But the efficiency of this usage varies and can be trained. For example, the average person takes around 18 hours to burn a pound of stored fat, whereas a trained cyclist can burn a pound in 3 hours. This is done by training your body to use its stored fat by forcing it to do so during low-level workouts.

It really takes 3 hours or so for your body to break down complex carbs and turn them into blood glycogen, which is the fuel for your workout that is needed to push beyond your anaerobic threshold. All workouts at your limit require stored glycogen to enable you to push hard, otherwise you do what's called "bonking".

Close to a workout, you can replenish blood glycogen quicker by ingesting simpler carbs, like sports food, in a protein/carb ratio that shouldn't exceed 1 part protein for 4 parts carbs. Fat at this time interferes with the metabolic process and can cause gastric upset during a workout. Meals with very much fat should absolutely follow the 3 hour rule. Protein too, for that matter, because they don't breakdown quickly. So a lot of protein and fat in a meal taken in, say, one hour prior to exercise will be undigested in your stomach during your workout, which can only have a negative effect.

 

[karasu]

Word. I see where you're coming from.

 

[teh_pwn]

2) I have heard it said that it is not possible to lose significant weight AND gain muscle at the same time...but I've also heard it said that your body preferentially burns muscle tissue, rather than fat. What amount/type of weight training is appropriate to maintain current strength during intensive weight loss?

I keep hearing this but I don't understand it.

I got slightly out of shape by not working out for a few months late last year. I started again in March. I've lost 15 pounds and I lift 50%-100% more weight than when I started. I have more muscle definition, and I've lost a lot of fat at the same time. My 6-pack is beginning to show again.

All I do gym-wise is about 30-40 minutes of weight training with machines, and 30 mintues of elliptical cardio. 3-5 times a week. Immediately after workout I take a scoop of whey protein.

Diet wise I eat about 2000 calories a day, mostly whole foods (fruits, vegetables, whole grains, nuts) but I do eat pizza every couple of days. I only drink water, and I'd say about 4-6 cups a day. Occasionally I drink green tea, usually pre-workout.

if you want to burn fat, try an elliptical machine. its more effective than a treadmill, and is very low impact.

agreed. Especially the ones that you can work your arms too. You won't wear out your knees like you would with running, and at the same time it's not a exhasting.

 

[OmniGamer]

I'll just say that when I lost 80 pounds last year, I was doing the "cardio in the morning before eating" thing...that, combined with weight training(I workout at home, so I wasn't training for mass...couldn't even if I wanted to, due to dietary restrictions as well, readrotein intake), and better(not ideal, again restrictions, but much better) diet, allowed me to lose weight at about 10 pounds a month, for several months. But i've also read what karasu was talking about recently, that eating before cardio is actually more beneficial, from a fat burning standpoint. At the time though I was like "well I got the results I got doing what I was doing, so meh"...plus for me, I can get lazy very easily, and if I eat, that's it...no cardio for me. But what borghe mentions, like just 75 calories of carbs an hour before, seems pretty good. That's like a slice of whole grain bread(Btw, which would be better pre-cardio, a slow digesting carb like the whole grain bread, or a fast digesting carb like the glass of juice karasu mentioned?).

Btw, what's the consensus on protein pre-cardio? I read somewhere that it helps buffer the effects of lactic acid buildup in the muscles during cardio(which sounds like what creatine does).

Oh, and i'm right there with you demon with that stubborn-as-a-mutha layer of fat...80 pounds down, and I can see damn hints and suggestions of my sixpack, teasing me underneth this *@$)*$))!@! sheathe of flab. I'm thinking of starting a stair routine with the staircase in my apartment, thinking of going 2-steps at a time, with an intial target duration of 8-10mins, and try to go up from there.

 

[borghe]

the point I think that people try to make is that doing JUST cardio you probably could have lost 20-30 pounds in the same amount of time. but you are right, losing fat AND replacing it with muscle is certainly the best route to go. muscle mass means metabolism and metabolism means lots and lots of stored energy.

(Btw, which would be better pre-cardio, a slow digesting carb like the whole grain bread, or a fast digesting carb like the glass of juice karasu mentioned?).

Btw, what's the consensus on protein pre-cardio? I read somewhere that it helps buffer the effects of lactic acid buildup in the muscles during cardio(which sounds like what creatine does).

slow digesting carb is always preferable to sugar. sugar or any carbs with a high glyc index basically have the sugar crashing problem. they cause insulin to be released immediately giving you energy but are metabolized without providing you any real energy aside from the insulin release. without the sustained energy from a complex carb you can crash. of course I am only talking about lots of sugars, but still, complex carbs are just an all around better source of energy. the only problem with complex carbs is that you have to wait longer after eating them before feeling their effects, as opposed to sugars which will give you an insulin rush pretty much right away. as for what foods have what glyc index http://www.youcanbefit.com/glyc.html is a good resource. juices seem to be fine, just make sure you are having 100% No Sugar Added juices.

as for protein, one of the articles I linked to above suggests 1 gram protein for every 4 grams of carbs for a pre-workout munch.. sounds like a good place to start.

 

[demon]

and I can see damn hints and suggestions of my sixpack, teasing me underneth this *@$)*$))!@! sheathe of flab.

Ugh, I'm with ya on that one. It's pissed me off for over a year.

 

[Richard Cranium]

I keep hearing this but I don't understand it.

I got slightly out of shape by not working out for a few months late last year. I started again in March. I've lost 15 pounds and I lift 50%-100% more weight than when I started. I have more muscle definition, and I've lost a lot of fat at the same time. My 6-pack is beginning to show again.

It's possible to lose fat and gain muscle IF you have a significant percentage of body fat. However, gaining strength is not the same as building muscle - hence the difference between hypertrophy specific and strength specific training. You can gain strength without gaining much muscle because there are other components (such as neurological) that go into strength.

The reason why it's so difficult to lose fat and gain muscle is because muscle building is an anabolic process while fat burning is catabolic. Due to the calorie deficit, the body is in a catabolic state where the cellular biochemical mechanisms are geared towards breaking down molecules. To build muscle, separate anabolic reactions need to be carried out requiring different molecules that aren't present during catabolism. The mechanisms are designed so that one pathway shuts down while the other one is active - otherwise the body would just be burning energy needlessly.

this is incorrect.. your body doesn't process fat for energy first. it processes protein and muscle mass

I don't believe this is true for most individuals. At higher fat percentages i.e. >15%, the body will preferentially burn fat if it can. Fat metabolism is simple and liberates a ton of energy. Protein metabolism is much more complex; the body won't resort to this unless it feels it has to. At lower fat levels, though, the body will resort to metabolizing fat and proteins, which is why body builders need to go through extreme measures just to get low levels of fat.

 

[WHOAguitarninja]

It's possible to lose fat and gain muscle IF you have a significant percentage of body fat. However, gaining strength is not the same as building muscle - hence the difference between hypertrophy specific and strength specific training. You can gain strength without gaining much muscle because there are other components (such as neurological) that go into strength.

The reason why it's so difficult to lose fat and gain muscle is because muscle building is an anabolic process while fat burning is catabolic. Due to the calorie deficit, the body is in a catabolic state where the cellular biochemical mechanisms are geared towards breaking down molecules. To build muscle, separate anabolic reactions need to be carried out requiring different molecules that aren't present during catabolism. The mechanisms are designed so that one pathway shuts down while the other one is active - otherwise the body would just be burning energy needlessly.

While this is absolutely true, it's a bit easier to understand if put like this: Burning fat requires that you expend more than you take in. Building muscle requires that you take in more than you expend. Since you can't do both at the same time, you're going to have to choose one or the other.

 

[borghe]

I don't believe this is true for most individuals. At higher fat percentages i.e. >15%, the body will preferentially burn fat if it can. Fat metabolism is simple and liberates a ton of energy. Protein metabolism is much more complex; the body won't resort to this unless it feels it has to. At lower fat levels, though, the body will resort to metabolizing fat and proteins, which is why body builders need to go through extreme measures just to get low levels of fat.

http://www.essentialnutrition.org/lowcarb.php

When faced with no dietary carbohydrates, the brain first causes the body to metabolize the stores of carbohydrates in the liver and in the muscles and then to metabolize protein in the muscles, which can be converted to carbohydrates.

there is another page I was reading which was saying essentially that during longer lower stress workouts your body will resort to burning fat in lieu on protein, but from anything I've ever read in most states your body will burn protein preferentially to fat. If you have information otherwise I would be interested in reading it.

this has always been my understanding of working out. that your body essentially won't break down your muscles if they remain active, so the goal is to put your body into an active state where it will go through all of your stored carbs and then resort to fat and leave your working muscles alone... again, if this is wrong I would be interested in reading anything you have.

 

[Richard Cranium]

Your link gives information about ketosis, which is a different body state where glycogen stores are completely depleted. Anyway, dietary protein can be converted to sugars at a relatively high percentage; it doesn't have to be all muscle. Brain cells absolutely require glucose for energy, so this is necessary. Other cells can still use fat for energy. AFAIK, low-carb diets tend to be muscle-sparing compared to some other diets.

Edit: I was a bit wrong about brain cells. They can't use fat for energy, but they can use ketone bodies, which come from the breakdown of fatty acids.

My information comes from biochemistry classes I took, but I have seen online sources with some of the same information. I'll have to look it up, but it really does not make sense for the body to burn protein preferentially if there are adequate stores of fat. It is extraordinarily difficult to build muscle. It is extremely easy to store and burn fat; adipocytes are basically the body's energy bank. It's also pretty dumb for the body to be burning essential molecules (muscle isn't the only source of protein) when the major role of fat is to store energy.

 

[Kung Fu Jedi]

Personally, I can not work out on an empty stomach. That doesn't mean I need to eat a huge meal by any means, but a small snack an hour or so before I workout does me wonders. On the other hand, you also have to be very careful what it is that you are eating before hand, or it can totally screw up your work out as well.

If I workout without something to eat before hand, especially in the morning, I generally tend to feel like shit the rest of the day.

 

[demon]

How the hell does eating nothing but a small snack at least an hour before a morning workout fit into someone's schedule?

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

How the hell does eating nothing but a small snack at least an hour before a morning workout fit into someone's schedule?

Wake up an hour earlier.

 

[Drozmight]

Intense exercise isn't a real good way to lose weight. It's good for a lot of of other things though. The reason is after a period of intense exercise your body will want to compensate and will react by increasing your appetite. The best way, as I've found out, is to just eat right and remain active (walking, brushing my teeth, ect.). I found after I lost a lot of poundage through running, I gained a lot back through my increase in appetite... and you can't really fend the appetite off forever... just like you can't hold your breath under water forever.

 

[Kung Fu Jedi]

How the hell does eating nothing but a small snack at least an hour before a morning workout fit into someone's schedule?

I also tend to workout in the afternoon. Morning exercise and me don't mix well either. At least not getting up and running 5-6 miles or more. I've never been a morning person.

So, I have a snack around 3-3:30pm. Get off work around 4:30, hit the gym or go for a run. Works great for me. Also, some recent studies have shown that people have better cardio capacity in the afternoon. I know for me, it's much better to workout at those times.

 

[acidviper]

1. the biggest factor in burning fat (as energy) is more length of time than heart rate.

Wrong its your level of metabolism. You want to be at the point before producing lactic acid as long as possible - so running to lose fat is retarded. BTW The fat burning zone on your Treadmill/Stepper/Glider is useless.

2. this is absolutely correct. however the real purpose of weight loss isn't generally to lose weight but to lose fat.

Absolutely wrong. The body chooses sugars first.

3. just depending on if you are a morning or night person. but there is no physical advantage.

Absolutely wrong. Its best in the middle of the day. Too early and your muscles are going to be too stiff. Too late and you won't be able to sleep.

This is hilarious. I was a personal trainer for 4 years and apparently all the stupid shit we are forced to tell clients works because you are spewing the same shit over and over without a clue. Note: Gyms/trainers don't want you to lose weight properly because then you don't come back.

 

[demon]

so running to lose fat is retarded.

Now why is that? What is best? I use a stationary bike, now.

 

[Richard Cranium]

The body uses carbohydrate and fat for energy during exercise, but lipid oxidation becomes more important during prolonged exercise.

In a carefully conducted series of experiments, these studies demonstrated a number of fundamental metabolic relationships that still hold true today. They showed that both carbohydrate and lipid are used as fuel for muscular work and that the oxidation of lipid provides less ATP per liter oxygen consumed than carbohydrate. The role of exercise intensity and duration in fuel metabolism was also well defined. During prolonged exercise, lipid oxidation became more important as carbohydrate stores were depleted, whereas carbohydrate metabolism became quantitatively more important with increasing exercise intensity

http://jap.physiology.org/cgi/content/full/93/4/1185


Maximal fat oxidation occurs at around 61% of maximal heart rate

For each individual, maximal fat oxidation (MFO) and the intensity at which MFO occurred (Fatmax) were determined. On average, MFO was 7.8 ± 0.13 mg·kg fat-free mass (FFM)–1·min–1 and occurred at 48.3 ± 0.9% maximal oxygen uptake (O2 max), equivalent to 61.5 ± 0.6% maximal heart rate.

http://jap.physiology.org/cgi/content/abstract/98/1/160

 

[borghe]

Wrong its your level of metabolism. You want to be at the point before producing lactic acid as long as possible - so running to lose fat is retarded. BTW The fat burning zone on your Treadmill/Stepper/Glider is useless.

please do not take my answers out of context. I was specifically referring to his question. That is, length of exercise is much more important to fat burning than intensity of exercise. as for your metabolism solely controlling your fat burn, this is wrong. your metabolism determines at what rate your body turns fat, carbs, and protein into energy, but your energy expenditure is directly related to what your body metabolizes. If you burn 2000 calories, your body will metabolize 2000 calories. if you only burn 200 calories, your body will only metabolize 200 calories. metabolism just determines how efficiently your body does this, but regardless of ones metabolism, it goes to stand that the more energy expended, the further a caloric deficit you put your body into. and your comment running to burn fat is retarded is even more retarded. any type of cardiovascular exercise which sustains an increased heart rate will burn fat if you create a caloric deficit.

Absolutely wrong. The body chooses sugars first.

what does this have to do with what you quoted? what you quoted wasn't even saying anything scientific. just pretty fundamental. when people want to lose weight, in reality they want to lose fat. yes your body will burn carbs first, what is your point? that has nothing to do with what I was saying.

Absolutely wrong. Its best in the middle of the day. Too early and your muscles are going to be too stiff. Too late and you won't be able to sleep.

if you don't stretch before exercising you deserve stiff muscles. if you stretch before exercising, you can work out in the morning just fine. if you workout in the evening and still allow your body adequate time to rev down and enter normal state you won't have any problems getting to bed.

This is hilarious. I was a personal trainer for 4 years and apparently all the stupid shit we are forced to tell clients works because you are spewing the same shit over and over without a clue. Note: Gyms/trainers don't want you to lose weight properly because then you don't come back.

check your ego at the door. you didn't counter a single fucking thing I said. you argued for things I wasn't even talking about and then say based on those I don't know what I am talking about. And you don't even know my background. fucking idiot.

 

[sans_pants]

if you don't stretch before exercising you deserve stiff muscles. if you stretch before exercising, you can work out in the morning just fine. if you workout in the evening and still allow your body adequate time to rev down and enter normal state you won't have any problems getting to bed.

agreed, i usually work out around midnight and i never have a problem going to bed

 

[acidviper]

any type of cardiovascular exercise which sustains an increased heart rate will burn fat if you create a caloric deficit.

Thanks Richard Cranium: Maximal fat oxidation occurs at around 61% of maximal heart rate

Notice marathon runners are not fat. Notice that marathon runners don't drink lard and oil in their races.

if you don't stretch before exercising you deserve stiff muscles. if you stretch before exercising, you can work out in the morning just fine.

This proves you don't know what you are talking about. Unless you can stretch at a very high level it is worthless. You are better off warming up using relevant muscles groups. Only noobs or high level athletes stretch.

 

[borghe]

Thanks Richard Cranium: Maximal fat oxidation occurs at around 61% of maximal heart rate

Notice marathon runners are not fat. Notice that marathon runners don't drink lard and oil in their races.

listen dispshit.. I already fucking said running for extended periods of time burns fat. then you said I was wrong, and now you are saying it's right.. are you fucking drinking when you are posting?

This proves you don't know what you are talking about. Unless you can stretch at a very high level it is worthless. You are better off warming up using relevant muscles groups. Only noobs or high level athletes stretch.

my god.. now you are saying stretching is worthless? ugghh.. look on any fucking site and they will say either to warmup and then stretch, do a rigorous stretching regimine first, or warm-up, exercise, and then stretch after. either way I have never seen a fucking thing that says stretching is worthless. on the contrary every god damn site specifically states that because of the fact that any workout (including most aerobic ones) are simple muscle contractions and releases this isn't any sort of stretching occuring in most workouts. this is why you stretch to increase elasticity and movement range, something that typically doesn't happen during the workout. but I can see how you think that is worthless. and nowhere did I say to substitute stretching for a warmup.

my god you are clueless. welcome to the first person to make my ignore list.

 

[OmniGamer]

Well this thread sure took a trip to Roid-Rage land...

 

[borghe]

agreed. I hope jinx and the rest found the info and links I had to offer helpful. RC - thanks for the links and info. Some of it I knew, but some of it I didn't. Always cool to see the things from a biology perspective. As much as I have gotten into working out, biology has never been overly interesting to me. but I am not going to participate in a thread any longer where some wannabe bally's reject starts in on stuff I never even meentioned or implied just to try and prove something.

 

[acidviper]

listen dispshit.. I already fucking said running for extended periods of time burns fat. then you said I was wrong, and now you are saying it's right.. are you fucking drinking when you are posting?

Nope walking is supposed to be an activity that is 61% of maximal HR. Running is not someting you can do at 61%HR. You can't lose weight running noob.

my god.. now you are saying stretching is worthless?

For the average person yes it is useless. It is basically a way for personal trainers to gouge clients or for gym teachers to take attendance. There are so many dipshits like you who are ignorant and just repeat what they read in Men's Health or websites. I normally don't advocate websites but I've got no time for noobs like you.


Here's a link

I&#8217;ve never advocated stretching before exercise, and now results of a new study suggest that stretching doesn&#8217;t prevent workout-related injuries. Epidemiologists at the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) reviewed 350 earlier studies on flexibility, stretching, and injury prevention. They concluded that no evidence demonstrates that stretching prevents injuries. One of the studies the researchers evaluated compared injury rates among two groups of young Australian Army recruits. Both groups did warm-up exercises before physical training, but one did an additional 20 minutes of leg stretching. After 12 weeks, recruits in both groups had about the same rate of injuries.

The CDC researchers suggested that future studies attempt to define normal flexibility for various activities and try to identify the best stretching routine and determine when it should be performed. They also suggested that future research investigate the best ways to prevent
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injuries among people of different age groups and athletic abilities. Their study results were published in the March 2004 issue of Medicine and Science in Sports and Medicine.

Instead of stretching, the best way to warm up for a workout is to do a slower version of the exercise you&#8217;re about to perform: if you run, walk, then jog to warm up. If you plan to walk, start off slowly, not at full speed. And if you&#8217;re doing strength-training exercises, start off with lighter weights, using slow, deliberate form with enough repetitions to get used to each movement. Then, move on to heavier weights.

 

[sans_pants]

Well this thread sure took a trip to Roid-Rage land...

how about kill yourself

 

[OmniGamer]

how about kill yourself

Oh Junior....someone needs a cup of warm milk and his teddy.

 

[acidviper]

Well I am just trying to clear up some very ingrained misconceptions on exercise. I don't know why you can't take the truth man. I only brought science into this because your defence mechanism is to ask for proof and then run away because you got pwned.

If you want to believe some guy who can't handle the truth fine run at dawn and midnite after stretching for a good 40-50 minutes everyday.

If you want to lose fat start walking and don't bother stretching. If you have a HR monitor or a watch make sure your HR while walking is only around 110-20 bpm. God I think my way is even easier. Walking sure as hell beats running and you won't need to eat everything in your fridge.

 

[borghe]

way to include everything but the last paragraph... which is all I was saying about stretching.

Although stretching may not prevent injuries, it does improve flexibility, lengthen muscle tissue, improve posture and body awareness and helps neutralize stress. For best results, stretch after your workout when your muscles are warm and most elastic.

owned by your own link, at least with what I was referring to. At least it was worth taking you off of ignore for a second to laugh at you as your own post contradicts your statement. your post only refers to preventing injuries which I never said. my comment on stretching was solely related to you talking about muscles being stiff in the morning hence working out in the morning being bad. but yeah, I can see why only noobs would want those benefits from stretching.

ok, back to ignore.

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

man my heart rate when I run is like 170, im guessing thats bad

 

[demon]

Well this thread certainly took a turn for the better.

 

[Boogie]

Ugh, I'm with ya on that one. It's pissed me off for over a year.

Meh, it doesn't bother me any. I'm fit, my tummy's flat and toned, but no visible six-pack. I just don't care anymore. I assume it's genetics, plus the fact that I'm not that concerned about my diet (I eat all right, but don't hesitate about snacking once in a while).

 

[Loki]

Well this thread sure took a trip to Roid-Rage land...

how about kill yourself

:lol

<shakes head>

 

[WrathOfOtaibah]

The biggest aspect of losing fat is diet. If you're not eating clean, you're not going to see decent results. I don't care if your buddy eats Double Whoppers and never gains a pound. No simple carbohydrates (sugar), no fast food, and even fruit is kind of iffy. I rarely ate fruit and lost 105 lbs. Vegetables are better than fruit anyway.