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[scorcho]

i frequent the gym around 3 times a week and have been doing so on and off for a few years. i'd like to think that i have a solid foundation of muscle mass all around (for you homoerotic gents and game-loving ladies out there, this includes the nice v-shaped back, firm supple chest, cute roundish delts, biggish tris and thighs like veiny trunks), but have a hell of a time getting motivated to work on my abs.

as such, while i've gained almost 20 pounds of muscle mass since high school, i still have that pudgy jelly ring around my middle section. yes, that includes oh so slight, but cute, love handles. i know cardio is needed to burn that crap off, as are ab/oblique exercises, but which are the most effective? as to why i haven't worked on either much in two years - i HATE doing abs, and my lungs have only just recovered from my old smoking habit to allowed for sustained running.

i'm fearing that i'll become like the boatload of older gents at my gym who are built solid all around, but look pregnant. suggestions?

 

[Deleted member 1235]

I would like to know the answer to this question....

I think the answer is going to be a shit load of running, a shit load of situps and a very careful diet though. Which isn't practical. I need QUICK FIXES PEOPLE

 

[Particle Physicist]

I would like to know the answer to this question....

I think the answer is going to be a shit load of running, a shit load of situps and a very careful diet though. Which isn't practical. I need QUICK FIXES PEOPLE

same here. QUICK FIX WITHOUT THE PILLS AND OR SURGERY!

 

[scorcho]

diet isn't always that important. i'm not a voracious eater by any stretch of the means. i avoid soft drinks, avoid refined sugar, and lay off the fatty, fried foods. the only thing i do see myself changing are my eating times, as i often go for a midnight snack right before i sleep, which is a HUGE NONO when it comes to the belly jelly.

help me GAF!

 

[Ninja Scooter]

 

[scorcho]

hell no. i see this frosted hair freak way too often on my cable sports network. way too often. he ranks up there with falon gong in terms of annoying cable ads.

 

[Particle Physicist]

it also seems like he is barely able to move.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

it also seems like he is barely able to move.

yes, but look at those abs!

 

[Ristamar]

Sensible diet + ab exercises 3 or 4 days a week + exercise/cardio = six pack. Simple, but true. Of course, metabolism and genetics also play a role. Cardio might not even be useful if your metabolism is naturally high.

 

[Boomer]

abs are made in the kitchen, girls.

 

[WordAssassin]

I must also have the answer! I've got a slow ass metabolism and my hormones are all fucked up so it's hard for me to retain muscle mass.

HOW DO I MAKE TEH PUDGE DIE?

 

[teiresias]

"belly jelly" is about the queerest slang term I've heard in my entire queer life.

 

[demi]

 

[scorcho]

"belly jelly" is about the queerest slang term I've heard in my entire queer life.

haaay! and to think, i thought belly pooch was even gay-erer.

 

[effzee]

Simply its fat lose, combined with using weighted excerises for your abs. I got a six pack in a month from doing cardio, eating right and doing only two ab workouts once a week. I'll go through the workout first:

1. Cable Crunches (at heaviest weight possible)
2. Leg raises (with weights held between ur legs)

For eating, even if you can't change ur diet too drastically try to do little things like eat smaller meals but more often during the day. The more times u eat, the less reason you give ur body to store fat. Other things like eating (protein/carb) meal right when waking up and taking flax seed oil (1 table spoon a day) are really helpful. There are numerous lil things that you can do without it taking up too much of your time.

As for cardio, i only do 16 minutes interval training (running for 1 minute, jogging for 1 minute, etc... to the whole 16 minutes) going at my own pace but making sure i'm going fast enough that by the end of the 16 minutes i can't go on.

If you guys want i can list some more nutritional tips a lil bit later when i get back home.

 

[scorcho]

Simply its fat lose, combined with using weighted excerises for your abs. I got a six pack in a month from doing cardio, eating right and doing only two ab workouts once a week. I'll go through the workout first:

1. Cable Crunches (at heaviest weight possible)
2. Leg raises (with weights held between ur legs)

i've always thought of cable crunches and weighted leg lifts as more of an advanced workout. it does sound good though, i'll give it a shot tomorrow.

do you use high reps and a low weight? what's a good starter weight to begin with?

 

[Particle Physicist]

Simply its fat lose, combined with using weighted excerises for your abs. I got a six pack in a month from doing cardio, eating right and doing only two ab workouts once a week. I'll go through the workout first:

1. Cable Crunches (at heaviest weight possible)
2. Leg raises (with weights held between ur legs).

can you explain what those exercises mean? im guessing there is a machine called the cable crunch.. ?

 

[scorcho]

can you explain what those exercises mean? im guessing there is a machine called the cable crunch.. ?

if i'm understanding him, it's using the cable machines. you hook the rope grip onto the upper hook, set what resistance weight you want on the machine, get down into a prayer position on your knees, and kowtow while pulling down on the rope to give resistance for your abs.

 

[Claus]

You can't spot reduce fat. You can do all the crunches and situps you want, your body will ultimately decide where it will lose the fat from.

 

[scorcho]

Quoted for truth-- ab excercises won't help a pudgy tummy.

people have been recommending cardio in addition to exercises, and in my particular case that's all the fat i have on my body. whatever fat i lose will have to come from my belly as i'd be hard pressed to see where else it'll come from.

 

[teh_pwn]

I remember reading about how belly fat in men is different than normal fat. For women, it's the thighs.

Situps will make stronger abs, but it's cardio that will trim the fat away.

 

[demon]

people have been recommending cardio in addition to exercises, and in my particular case that's all the fat i have on my body. whatever fat i lose will have to come from my belly as i'd be hard pressed to see where else it'll come from.

Working out your muscles (as opposed to cardio) will not do much if anything to help burn fat. It will also do nothing to help you burn fat faster in that particular area. If you want to burn off fat anywhere, the only thing you can do is general cardio and diet well. And anything to help boost your metabolism (which is what burns fat). You can try green tea pills, for one thing. Also, I suppose working out muscle can help build fat in that the more muscle you have, the higher your metabolism is. But it's near impossible to build muscle (at least a substantial amount) and lose fat at the same time.

I remember reading about how belly fat in men is different than normal fat. For women, it's the thighs.

Situps will make stronger abs, but it's cardio that will trim the fat away.

Different how, do you know?

 

[teh_pwn]

The fat is different in that it can gather deep between muscles and organs and that it's the first place your body stores fat.

 

[demon]

Dude's head is too big for his body, and he looks like he belongs on some stupid fucking 80s/early 90s sitcom. Maybe it's the dumb haircut. Also, why is he curling like 10 pounds there?

 

[pnjtony]

Yeah, ab workouts didn't help me much. I mean I have strong abs, but they're buried under a fat gut. I think running and less soda and more small meals would be helpfull.

 

[effzee]

Btw, before I say anything, I wanted to say all the info I got was from Max OT website, so for those really committed, I suggest checking out their website and reading all the info first hand.

For the workouts, here is a page that explains how to do the workouts in detail: For Leg raises http://www.ast-ss.com/training/exercises/execution.asp?bp=Ab&pn=4

And for Cable rope crunches http://www.ast-ss.com/training/exercises/execution.asp?bp=Ab&pn=9

Do the workout with heaviest weight u can do for low amount of reps (8-10 reps) and 2 sets of each workout I listed above.

people have been recommending cardio in addition to exercises, and in my particular case that's all the fat i have on my body. whatever fat i lose will have to come from my belly as i'd be hard pressed to see where else it'll come from.

Regardless of whether you can clearly see the fat, you have it. Unless your cut up like Bruce Lee, believe me you have fat besides in your belly. But it certainly is a plus that you don’t have much fat besides the belly, it will certainly increase your chances of reaching your goals faster.

But it's near impossible to build muscle (at least a substantial amount) and lose fat at the same time.

This is not true at all. Its just one of those body building myths.

Also, I remember I wrote this up for a friend a few months back, I still have it so I figured it would helpful to just post it here. Just keep in mind that you don’t have to do all that (god knows I never would myself) but if you can add any of these things into your schedule, it will be helpful.

Increase calcium intake
Source: High protein dairy products and high in calcium (Calcium helps speed up metabolism)

Calcium Comparison:
*Low fat milk (1 cup)...................................300mgs
*Powdered non fat milk (1 tablespoon)......50mgs
*Non fat yogurt (1cup)................................400mgs
*Non fat cottage cheese (1 cup).................400mgs
Sardines (with bones)3oz...........................370mgs
Salmon (with bones)3oz.............................210mgs
Spinach (1 cup)...........................................170mgs
Broccoli (1 cup)...........................................150gms
Turnip greens (1cup)...................................190gms


Eat breakfast between the first 30 minutes of waking up
Source: Anything with high amounts of protein and carbohydrates

Increase meal frequency without increasing total calories consumed
Example: If you eat 3 meals usually with 3000 calories total (1 meal =1000 cals), you should try to eat 6 meals a day with 3000 calories total (1 meal= 500 cals)

Increase vegetable intake
High bulk and low calories, tricks your body into thinking your eating something with large amount of calories

Leave room for improvement in cardio
Progressively step up the difficulty in the cardio, that way your body constantly keeps increasing the metabolic rate because your body constantly keeps getting challenged.

Drink more water
Water increases your metabolic rate and prevents you body from going into a catabolic state

After working out, increase your calorie intake
Working out increases your metabolism greatly for the 3-6 hours after the training and because of that you have to consume a lot more calories after working out to make sure your body muscle tissues are not broken down. Since the muscles promote fat breakdown and increase you metabolism, this will help in losing fat

Timing of eating after working out:
Half and hour after working out: Take in a small amount of carbohydrates and than take in a large amount of protein (preferably in liquid form because it dissolves straight into the blood stream)

After the half and hour window for eating ends: eat a meal also consisting of carbohydrates and protein.
An hour later, eat another meal: Also consisting of carbohydrates and proteins. So in the three hours after working out, you should have consumed 3 small meals high in protein and moderate in carbs.

Do two sessions of cardio a day, 2-3 days a week
Doing two 15 minute sessions of cardio 8 hours apart from each burn twice as many calories as one 30 minute session of cardio.

Green Tea
Increases metabolic rate and helps in keeping the weight from accumulating again after you have lost it

Increase Caffeine Intake
Best way to do this is sugar free coffee because not only does coffee provide the right amount of caffeine, it also has many other benefits like reducing muscle pain, lowering risk of cancer, etc…

Chlorogenic acid and Caffeine, which are both found in coffee have been proven to effectively increase individuals metabolism rates significantly if taken moderately throughout the day (3 times a day) 400 milliliters

Calories in should be less than calories out
Basically the amount of calories you consume per day should be less than the amount of calories you burn. The fastest way of using this system to your advantage is simply by lowering your calories by slightly adjusting your diet and at the same time, increasing your cardio to burn more calories. This will speed up the fat loss program by two folds.

 

[BlackSalad]

Mountain Biking and a healthy diet

 

[pnjtony]

Question for effzee.................

You said to eat more after a workout. Is this in keeping with the 300 calorie diet you were mentioning or does it mean pig out? I'm confused. Like let's say I am eating 6 500 calorie meals...should I just increase that calorie intake if I work out?

 

[Fatghost]

There is no quick fix to success.


6 hours a week of exercise (a mix of strength and endurance training), a healthy and sensible diet, and perserverance are what it takes.

 

[effzee]

Question for effzee.................

You said to eat more after a workout. Is this in keeping with the 300 calorie diet you were mentioning or does it mean pig out? I'm confused. Like let's say I am eating 6 500 calorie meals...should I just increase that calorie intake if I work out?

I think your asking two different things here...

1. Yes this is part of the 3000 calorie diet i was mentioning (which btw is a number i just made for example purposes), but say on the days you are working out, majority of your calories(out of the 3000) should be consumed with the meals you have right after the workout.
2. If you are starting to workout, your going to have to increase your calorie intake because muscles require more calories just to maintain them. So the more muscle you gain, the more you will be forced to eat if you wish to keep seeing progress or just keeping the muscles.

 

[demon]

Do two sessions of cardio a day, 2-3 days a week
Doing two 15 minute sessions of cardio 8 hours apart from each burn twice as many calories as one 30 minute session of cardio.

Really? Any more info on why two shorter cardio sessions is better than one twice as long? I've read from a lot of sources that your body doesn't begin to burn fat until about 20 minutes into a cardio session. And is 2-3 days a week really enough? I try to do cardio at least 5 days a week.

Also, is it true that you shouldn't work out* soon after or before exercising*?

*to me, "work out" = muscle work out, and exercising = cardio

2. If you are starting to workout, your going to have to increase your calorie intake because muscles require more calories just to maintain them.

Now what do you mean by this? If you're working out and trying to build muscle and need to inrease your calorie intake because of it, how do you burn fat with a calorie surplus?

Also, the poster under me brought this up and I'm curious....is eating before bed really a bad thing as long as you're still watching your daily total cal intake?

 

[sans_pants]

diet isn't always that important. i'm not a voracious eater by any stretch of the means. i avoid soft drinks, avoid refined sugar, and lay off the fatty, fried foods. the only thing i do see myself changing are my eating times, as i often go for a midnight snack right before i sleep, which is a HUGE NONO when it comes to the belly jelly.

help me GAF!

this information is entirely false

diet is extremely important if you want a 6 pack and eating before bed is not a bad thing

 

[sans_pants]

and it is very unlikely that you can build significant muscle while cutting, your best bet is to try and preserve what you have by doing low reps with heavy weight

 

[sans_pants]

and then i killed the thread

 

[demon]

Yeah thanks a lot fucker. Now I'm going to be 300 pounds forever.

 

[Particle Physicist]

cutting ???

 

[sans_pants]

cutting ???

lol no

losing weight basically

 

[demon]

Cutting is basically getting rid of that last bit of fat (the impossible last stretch in weight loss) to get good muscle definition, isn't it?

 

[sans_pants]

Cutting is basically getting rid of that last bit of fat (the impossible last stretch in weight loss) to get good muscle definition, isn't it?

cutting is a term mostly used by bodybuilders and serious weightlifters. it basically just means losing fat. I mean yeah people cut down to low bf%s but they also cut from 20% to 15% etc etc.

 

[effzee]

Really? Any more info on why two shorter cardio sessions is better than one twice as long? I've read from a lot of sources that your body doesn't begin to burn fat until about 20 minutes into a cardio session. And is 2-3 days a week really enough? I try to do cardio at least 5 days a week.

I should have been a bit more clear on what kinda cardio I was talking about. When I say 2 short cardio sessions, I mean high intensity cardio sessions, which is basically working at an intensity that is high enough that you can’t continue past 15-20 minutes. The reason why these short cardio sessions are better than one long one is that for one thing, after 20-25 minutes of high intensity cardio, you risk losing muscle mass, which in turn will work against your goal of losing fat. Also, short intensity workouts tend to also increase your metabolic rate, infact I read an article from the website I previously mentioned that went over the same points. I received it via email so I can’t link to it so I’ll just paste it.

High intensity exercise promotes better fat loss

by Paul Cribb, B.H.Sci HMS
AST Director of Research


Some people never learn when it comes to exercise and fat loss. Walk into any gym in the United States and you'll see folks pedaling leisurely on a bike while reading a magazine or staring at a plasma screen. Others clutch the handles on a treadmill as they stroll along. These poor misguided souls have been lead to believe that low-intensity exercise is good for fat burning. However, the research-based information on this topic clearly shows that fat loss only comes from expending more calories than you consume.

Exercise is just like everything else in life, you only reap what you sow. Body fat utilization only comes from elevating the metabolism and burning more calories than you put in on a daily basis. Low intensity aerobic exercise doesn't burn calories and stoke the metabolism the way intense exercise does. Vigorous cardio exercise Max-OT style is the most effective way for healthy people to shed body fat and keep it off as this form of exercise burns more calories during the workout and stokes the metabolism for hours after the workout.

Long-term Studies from Laval University have confirmed that people who train intensely have more muscle and less body fat, even though they exercise for less time. Research from Duke University has confirmed that people can lose weight without having to worry about counting calories if they exercise intensely every day.

Another benefit of intense exercise is that it's very time efficient. All you need is 16 minutes a day. Anyone can find that. Max-OT Cardio is a science-based, structured approach to intense exercise. Without a doubt Max-OT Cardio is the most effective exercise that strips away body fat.

Also, is it true that you shouldn't work out* soon after or before exercising*?

*to me, "work out" = muscle work out, and exercising = cardio

Well it all really depends on what your goals are. If your in it for the sake of body building, than cardio should not be done anywhere near your weight lifting session. You should weight atleast 8 hours. The reason being if you weight lift first, your body will need nutrients to start muscle recovery immediately and if you do not eat and instead continue doing cardio, you seriously compromise your muscle recovery and growth. If you do cardio first, your body will not be able to work at its highest potential and therefore you will not be able to lift weights you usually would be able to.

Now what do you mean by this? If you're working out and trying to build muscle and need to inrease your calorie intake because of it, how do you burn fat with a calorie surplus?

Well if your working out, you will “need” to increase your calorie intake because your muscles will require it. So increasing your calorie intake once u start working out with pretty much just help you maintain the body weight you have. This will not cause any excess fat to develop. You will burn the fat through cardio and keep it off with a well maintained diet. Remember even though fat loss or gain is mainly counting calorie intake and calories burned, it is also important to remember that what you eat and what types of food your getting your calories from also effects fat loss. High protein diets for people that workout is very useful for reducing body fat because your body requires so much protein for muscle recovery, most of the protein is put to good use. Someone getting most of their daily calories from tuna fish (virtually fat free) vs. someone getting their calories from beef can make a huge difference. The number of calories is the same but the two people will have incredibly different results.

Also, the poster under me brought this up and I'm curious....is eating before bed really a bad thing as long as you're still watching your daily total cal intake?

Again it really depends on what you’re eating. For body builders, it’s very important to have sufficient nutrients to last them all night so an hour before sleeping, eating a meal containing slow absorbing protein with some carbohydrates with a low GI would be ideal. More importantly, I think people really neglect breakfast. When your wake up, your body is ready to absorb nutrients after such a long period of time with no food and so it’s very important that people eat a meal within a half and hour of waking up.

 

[demon]

Hmm, interesting. What about how many times per week, though?

Right now I have a bit of stubborn fat left around the belly (and a bit in the bitch-tit area) and while I'd like to gain a little more muscle, I'm okay with just keeping what I have as long as I shed this last layer of fat.

 

[effzee]

and it is very unlikely that you can build significant muscle while cutting, your best bet is to try and preserve what you have by doing low reps with heavy weight

It is likely, but for most of us, just not feasible in terms of time. I'm in the process of studying for my finals LOL so I'll keep this short. Muscle gain causes less fat in the body and no where is it written that losing fat impairs muscle growth. The misconception that you can't get significant muscle growth and lose fat at the same time is from the people that don't realize how they have to time their cardo and workout sessions and what is the proper nutrition for bodybuilders. In the past people use to try to bulk and do cardio right with it and obviously did not see as good results. However if you follow what i said above like "Waiting atleast 8 hours after cardio or working out before doing anything else" and at the same time getting the proper nutrients (sufficent protein and carbs, low fat) you will gain huge amounts of muscle and lose fat at the same time.
Also another thing to warn against people who bulk up and not pay attention to what they eat until they want to cut down, fat cells are unique in that they don't go away. When we work out, they get smaller but the fat cells remain there. So if you are not always watching your diet all year long, your really setting yourself up for really hard times as you get older because the fat will start to come back much quicker and you will have to restrict your diet further and further.

Hmm, interesting. What about how many times per week, though?

Right now I have a bit of stubborn fat left around the belly (and a bit in the bitch-tit area) and while I'd like to gain a little more muscle, I'm okay with just keeping what I have as long as I shed this last layer of fat.

Well idealy you should do cardio once a day, but that is not really feasible for most people. For me, i try to workout three times a day, and 3 days I do cardio twice a day. One day i do nothing and eat whatever i want. But really its just personal preference, set up something you can follow and make sure u constantly keep add challenging your body. Try to increase how far you ran or at what speed you were running or even how many times a week you do it. I started the semester by doing cardio once a week, than later on twice, than 3 times, than i started doing it twice a day, three times a week so i kept increasing how much cardio i was doing. It did wonders for me.

EDIT: Oh and make sure u get the proper nutrition after the cardio sessions too (Protein shakes preffered). There 7 different types of muscle fibers and weight lifting works out only one of those, cardio v. excerise works out the other 6. So taking protein and good nutritional diet after cardio will actually help u build muscle too.

 

[bjork]

http://ultimatewarrior.com/WWorkout.htm