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WWDC 2017 |OT| iOS 11, macOS 10.13, watchOS 4 & tvOS 11

jts

...hate me...
That price ain't gonna happen
Probably a stupid assumption to make that the device was going to be more in line with the Echo Dot than with the Echo.

At $200 they will need to sell it to me tomorrow, or I'll leave it for later. iPhone's "hey siri" and Apple TV as Homekit hub works fairly well otherwise.
 

mrklaw

MrArseFace
Echo integrating with iCloud calendar means less need for a Siri speaker - the attraction would have been pushing notifications etc through to my iPhone but that's less useful now
 

SourBear

Banned
negativeman.png

Assuming it'll be a sub $100 device, should be a fairly insta-purchase tbh, pending region-availability.

I'm also hoping for loads of Siri advancements to go along with it.

Fair to assume as well that it can take place as the Homekit hub (duh). Wonder if, going forward, they'll drop that functionality from Apple TV to push that device. Probably not.

I'm hoping this Siri Home thing has a great speaker. Because we are due a decent airplay speaker god damn it.
Honestly kind of wish Apple would buy Sonos already and integrate Siri into those speakers.
 
There was rumours the Siri Speaker was going to be a Sonos competitor. I would like that even thought I've just started to get into Sonos. If they do release it and it's a good speaker, I might switch over. Killing two birds with one stone there.

also praying for line in!!!
 

Guess Who

Banned
10-bit color screen may also be possible. May be updatable to support HDR down the road once Apple starts supporting HDR videos.

I've been wondering for a while - why exactly isn't the 2016 MBP screen 10-bit? It's P3, which usually implies 10-bit support. The Ultrafine 5K is 10-bit. But the MBP display shows as 8-bit in system profiler.
 

kaskade

Member
if they want the speaker to be successful they really need to allow voice control of more services, especially Spotify. I think focusing on sound quality would be smart too as the google home and echo aren't really great in that regard. Even then they'll have a tough fight unless they really overhauled Siri. I think at this point they actually have to, we haven't had too much of an upgrade in quite some time.
 

Majine

Banned
craig-federighi.jpg


If anything, we should get a nice load of dad humor from its prophet, Hair Force One himself, Craig Federighi.
 

jts

...hate me...
Lol. Be surprised if it's sub $200

If it's a nice little music speaker, sure. Was out of the loop and thinking something more barebones just for Siri and homekit.

Being a music speaker makes for a much easier narrative to sell the product to the public.
 

jolux

Neo Member
Isn't the 32gb ram coming in the fall?

I bough my MacBook Pro last fall and I guess I should have waited. I still love it but would love a Mac mini

I believe Kaby Lake still has the 16GB limit on DDR3L that Skylake does. Really going to regret getting this top-of-the-line 15" in January if it has more though.
 

Meh3D

Member
I really hope FCPX gets some attention. It has a terrible memory leak issue and could use some UX/QoL improvements. By default it's a Disk/SSD hog and I can't stand it's file management ( unnecessary file abstractions. )

There is more good than bad with FCPX and I'd really hate for the software to go the way of Aperture.


This is a long shot but I wish Apple would allow me to highlight "projects" and just send them to compressor to start in a render queue. It's obnoxiously annoying having to click individual projects and mouse over to "send to compressor" only to have to click each individual file in compressor and give it settings.
 

LeleSocho

Banned
Kaby Lake is a minor update. H.265 acceleration is nice but non-essential. I would strongly bet against any notable changes to either batteries or RAM limits.

Kaby Lake is minor but substantial, brings Netflix 4k and h265 encoding in general which will be more and more essential going forward and raises the ram limits.
So yeah it would surely be a more refined product than what they are selling now.
 

Guess Who

Banned
The only way the next MBP has 32GB of RAM is if they use desktop DDR4, which they already made a very specific and conscious decision not do on the last model, both because it would use more power and take more internal space (and thus, take more space away that could be used for more battery).

The terraced battery rumored to be in the MBP but then scrapped also wouldn't help, not that I'm even all that convinced that such a design was ever in the cards (unless Apple once planned for the MBP to be wedge-shaped), because the entire benefit of the terrace design is that it lets you fill a wedge-shaped laptop with more battery as it tapers, which isn't applicable to the flat, even-thickness design of the MBP.

qx5sry3.jpg


There is already more room in the 15" model for slightly bigger batteries if they wanted to go that route, but they didn't, probably because it would add more weight - and because, once some software issues were resolved, the battery life on the existing models is already good enough (I say, as I type this on 2016 15" Pro that has been on battery for 7.5 hours and still has 46% remaining).

Kaby Lake is minor but substantial, brings Netflix 4k and h265 encoding in general which will be more and more essential going forward and raises the ram limits.
So yeah it would surely be a more refined product than what they are selling now.

Kaby Lake does not raise the LPDDR3 RAM limit or add LPDDR4 support.
 

Future

Member
I use a Mac Mini for my htpc. Give me control over that thing, or a superior applets via voice and i would buy a $300 siriEcho.

It still amazes me that not one company has gone for the full batman computer setup for the home yet. Amazons echo doesn't communicate with the firetv... and even if it did it's limited to video services mostly. Apple TV is limited the same way.

Chromecast feels like the closest, but I want full voice control with correctly designed switching of focus. Examples:

"Siri, show me what's playing" *tv turns on, shows me album artwork and song info"

"Siri, play the next episode of handmaidens tale on Hulu" *stops music, switches to Hulu app, stars next episode

"Siri, show me a map to Disneyland" *pauses video, loads up web page with google map to Disneyland

"Siri, thank you" *closes page and resumes video

"Siri, FaceTime my wife" *pauses video, Apple TV cam turns on. Calls wife and I talk to her through the tv. Call ends, video resumes

Basically want a full demo of use similar to the very first iPhone demo that jobs showed, where it seemingly switched app focus from music to maps to internet to phone. Just now with Apple TV like device, from video, to web page pop ups with info, to maps, to video calling, to music, etc. Cuz the execution with how seemlessly it switches to the correct task is what matters
 

Majine

Banned
I hope FaceTime finally gets some attention.

Group calls is the obvious one, but I'd also love screen sharing and send a picture or a document and view it together.
 
We aren't doing a tucked/untucked bet beforehand? :(

Looking forward to iOS 11 and watchOS improvements. Hope the TV gets attention, and further expanding of Siri to third parties (not just select partners).

Edit: Also, the fact that after all this time I still can't call someone with FaceTime Audio and leave a message is frustrating. That, and I want to switch the default of FaceTime to audio and not video. I just want to say "FaceTime blank" instead of "Make a FaceTime Audio call to blank".
 

SFenton

Member
Not in for a Siri speaker for the same reason I'm not in for any announced Cortana speaker: I don't really have faith that either of these are nearly as robust as Google or Alexa, and even they aren't... amazing. Do like my Echo and my roommate's Home though.

Really hope WatchOS 4 comes with an easier way to skip tracks that aren't in the music app. Makes using Groove or Spotify way way too inconvenient, especially when I'm running.
 

Meh3D

Member
Kaby Lake is a minor update. H.265 acceleration is nice but non-essential. I would strongly bet against any notable changes to either batteries or RAM limits.

I disagree. My MBP 13" 2015 with max CPU/RAM drops frames and stutters left and right playing back 4K videos from my iPhone 6s (Photos chugs playing back my videos.) Granted, I'm not saying there isn't any software improvements Apple can make to help. I just don't expect Apple to do that over just using the latest Intel tech improvements.
 

Guess Who

Banned
I disagree. My MBP 13" 2015 with max CPU/RAM drops frames and stutters left and right playing back 4K videos from my iPhone 6s (Photos chugs playing back my videos.) Granted, I'm not saying there isn't any software improvements Apple can make to help. I just don't expect Apple to do that over just using the latest Intel tech improvements.

Your iPhone 6S doesn't record in H.265, so Kaby Lake doesn't solve that.

I also can't speak to how the 2016 13" Pro fares, but my 15" has no trouble playing back my iPhone 6S Plus's 4K videos in Photos. Doesn't even go to the dedicated GPU.
 

The Real Abed

Perma-Junior
Oh wow! Had no idea this was tomorrow. Looking forward to seeing what iOS 11 brings and hopefully a beta.
Dev beta will probably be available tomorrow. Public beta always comes within about 2 weeks depending on how stable or unstable the first few Dev releases are.

I can't wait personally. I haven't even installed the iOS 10 betas on my new phone. But I am ready to put 11 in.
 

Meh3D

Member
Your iPhone 6S doesn't record in H.265, so Kaby Lake doesn't solve that.

I also can't speak to how the 2016 13" Pro fares, but my 15" has no trouble playing back my iPhone 6S Plus's 4K videos in Photos. Doesn't even go to the dedicated GPU.

H.265 isn't the only improvement. Kaby Lake according to the Anandtech preview and reviews articles improves 4K decode/encode across the board compared to Broadwell (the one in my MBP13.)

However, I'm also convinced my MBPr 13 2015 is not working correctly.
 

jstripes

Banned
Oh wow! Had no idea this was tomorrow. Looking forward to seeing what iOS 11 brings and hopefully a beta.
There will almost certainly be an iOS 11 Beta. You just need to be a registered developer with a paid account (or know someone who is.) The Public Beta usually drops a week or two later.

10-bit color screen may also be possible. May be updatable to support HDR down the road once Apple starts supporting HDR videos.

I've been wondering for a while - why exactly isn't the 2016 MBP screen 10-bit? It's P3, which usually implies 10-bit support. The Ultrafine 5K is 10-bit. But the MBP display shows as 8-bit in system profiler.
The graphics chipset probably needs to support HDR. That's something I'm eager for, too. If the next iPhone supports HDR capture and the MBP supports HDR that will be a dream for photography.

Isn't the 32gb ram coming in the fall?

I bought my MacBook Pro last fall and I guess I should have waited. I still love it but would love a Mac mini
I'm just hoping 32 GB pushes 16 GB down to a more affordable level.
 
I'm afraid if they do announce a new ipad pro I'll want it! Can't afford it though and have a perfectly usable Air 2.

Note taking with the pencil though is extremely interesting.
 

jetsetrez

Member
Really looking forward to seeing how iOS 11 evolves, especially for iPad. I haven't looked forward to an Apple keynote in a while, but I've been really wanting to get a tablet again because I'm reading my textbooks digitally and it's a huge pain on my laptop and especially phone.

Ever since they announced the new iPad for such a good price, I've been really wanting to pick one up, and that big Marvel sale gave me a ton of comics I'll be wanting to read as well. I just hope they don't lock a lot of the iPad features to the Pro. Come on Apple, blow us away with some amazing new iPad features! Also it's always fun watching Hair Force One give a presentation.
 
If grouped notifications aren't back, I'm moving to android.
I like both OS' but this barebones feature being gone in iOS 10 bugs me. Also iOS has felt extremely limited in the past few years. Hoping iOS 11 is a huge shakeup.
 

Chittagong

Gold Member
I think this might be one of the least leaked keynotes since Jobs era. We have nearly no idea of what OSX, iOS, tvOS or watchOS will do, we haven't seen any pics of the Siri speaker, and just some vague dimensions of the new iPad Pro. Super exciting, hopefully the lack of leaks is not because they've been busy designing door knobs to their new office, rather than making new stuff.
 

The Real Abed

Perma-Junior
No leaks is telling me there will be no hardware on this event.
No new hardware. Doesn't mean there won't be bumps. Then again, obviously they won't show off bumps. But they can still release them at the same time. Maybe a throwaway announcement. "By the way, we updated the MacBooks. They're available now."

Shame that also means the Mac mini and iMac are still gonna wait.
 

Majine

Banned
No new hardware. Doesn't mean there won't be bumps. Then again, obviously they won't show off bumps. But they can still release them at the same time. Maybe a throwaway announcement. "By the way, we updated the MacBooks. They're available now."

Shame that also means the Mac mini and iMac are still gonna wait.

Kaby Lake MBPs seems reasonable, but I think Siri Speaker is a no-go tomorrow.
 

Somnid

Member
Kaby Lake MBPs seems reasonable, but I think Siri Speaker is a no-go tomorrow.

I can't imagine how badly that would hurt not to have it tomorrow. It's already an uphill battle but to let Amazon release 2 more devices and some Prime Day sales before it's even announced would make things a lot worse.
 

The Real Abed

Perma-Junior
Kaby Lake MBPs seems reasonable, but I think Siri Speaker is a no-go tomorrow.
That would be shocking. Especially since every seems to be so sure it's coming. No chance Apple sits out this growing product category. And it would be perfect to show off their new better Siri... if they even have one. They know Siri has problems. So we're hoping she's been fixed for iOS 11 and 10.13. Maybe they'll reveal it in September instead when iOS actually comes out and people can actually use the "new" Siri.

All I want tomorrow is iOS and macOS. That's all I need. All I expect. And a new Siri is an important thing to me. I use her every day for stupid simple shit like timers and alarms. I find myself ALWAYS opening Google just to do other searches because Siri is really really dumb with dealing with queries. She should always default to opening a browser to a search result if she doesn't understand your command as a normal command. But she doesn't. Instead she either says she doesn't understand or she makes some wisecrack joke. Stop it. Always assume I want to search when you can't understand what I say as a command. Then again I'd also rather it use Google to search and open the Google app when it's a search query. I never used Bing's search app but I really love the audio feedback Google gives you for most searches. If I could I'd set it up so unrecognized queries simply open the Google app. (In a special "doesn't need to unlock the device" mode) But we can all dream.

A couple weeks ago I decided to do some testing of Siri vs. Google for providing what I need. I posted three attempts to Twitter. On a whim I decided to just casually sing some lyrics to Siri...
https://twitter.com/TheRealAbed/status/866062691881955329
This right here is the exact major problem with Siri as a service vs. Google's offering. @Apple better have big plans for Siri at WWDC.
DATfabOXsAAuCSl.jpg
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In my first attempt, we see the problem I've been talking about. Choosing confusion over assistance when she can't understand the command.

https://twitter.com/TheRealAbed/status/866083929488580608
Then on the flip side of the coin there's areas where Siri is better than Google surprisingly.
DATyt9CXoAAIXLC.jpg
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Next I decided to ask for a random number. I needed to "flip a coin" at work with my coworker and so I decided to give it a try not knowing if she'd be able to do it. Siri got it every time. Number was always different. Google however sometimes showed the image above. Like it didn't understand what I meant. However in Google's defense it did occasionally give me a random number. However it still showed me a search result much of the time so it was still a point to Siri. After that I played around with Siri's math stuff and integration with Wolfram Alpha. Which is really really nice to have.

https://twitter.com/TheRealAbed/status/866102942641922048
And another point to Siri. Built-in Shazam is wonderfully useful. I don't even have the app. And now Siri is 2 for 3.
DAUEAQyXgAAT-AA.jpg
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And lastly on a whim I decided since Apple touted Siri's built-in Shazam feature as such a big deal that maybe Google had something similar. I mean it's Google. They have mountains of data, right? Surely they do music recognition.... Nope. Not at all. At least not on the Google app. (Someone tell me if it does on Android.)

Yeah I know it's trivial stuff, but this is everyday convenience stuff really. Being able to recognize a song when you need to (I still don't even bother installing Shazam itself. Why bother? This is all I need.) or doing simple math and number related stuff. Siri making a choice for me was nice. It's just all about that first problem. Not searching by default in cases of confusion. Fix that and we're fine. Or at least I am. For now. I'm sure there's a lot of shit Google Assistant does that I'm not even thinking of. I do find the Google app very useful, but I would barely need to open it if Siri could do the same stuff.
 

The Real Abed

Perma-Junior
Can you retest in the Google Assistant app, not the Google app? Aren't They supposed to be different?
I dunno. Is there a separate app? Why is there a separate app? Is it the same app? Does it have the same features? I really don't want more apps on my phone. If I'm gonna have a Google app on my phone it's only going to be one. It's bad enough I need to have both FaceBook and Messenger on my phone.

I mean I'll download and try it out. If it can do the same stuff, I'll actually replace my Google app. I literally use the Google app for anything search related even though I could easily just open Safari, create a new tab, tap the search box, tap the microphone, say my query, hit Done, wait for it to send the audio to Apple, then view the results, because that's soooooo simple. No seriously though, the Google app is really convenient. If Assistant can do all the same stuff, it'll definitely replace the Google app.

Fake edit: Yes, the two apps are completely different. The Assistant app seems to want to be like someone you're having a conversation with. I'd miss the Google cards from the search app though. I'd rather all these apps be in one place. I hate having multiple apps on my phone.
 
There was rumours the Siri Speaker was going to be a Sonos competitor. I would like that even thought I've just started to get into Sonos. If they do release it and it's a good speaker, I might switch over. Killing two birds with one stone there.

also praying for line in!!!


I am in the same boat, i am pretty close in buying a Play 5 for the living room.

I just want to say to Siri,

Hey Siri play some music by Kanye West in my bedroom.

And it figure out to play Kanye on my sonos speakers in the bedroom.
 
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