excelsiorlef
Member
Reigns at 30 will be comedy moment of the year.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
WWE Royal Rumble '17 |OT| Follow The Buzzers
- Thread starter Sephzilla
- Start date
- Status
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
The shows headlined by Roman drew less than the shows headined by Ambrose when they were champions.
Meltzer has gone through this about a million times. Roman isn't a draw.
But it's already been proven that Reigns isn't a draw.
His tours didn't do any better than Ambrose's tours.
The only reason he sells merchandise is because he has like 10x the amount of merchandise everyone outside of John Cena. Or do you not remember when they kept giving him a new catchphrase and t-shirt every week?
blackaroni
Member
We're still talking about the guy that didn't win the title nor the royal rumble match?
For someone who is bad at wrestling, Reigns sure does seem to have a lot of really good matches.
Like, as much as people give grief to Reigns about being a face who gets booed, no one seems to like to talk about the fact that Jericho and Owens, who are supposed to be heels, keep getting cheered. You know, making them just as terrible at their jobs as Reigns supposedly is.
Reigns is fine - he's miscast as a babyface, or at least the smiling babyface. But like Cena, people want him to turn heel so they can cheer him again. He's had fan-favorite heels (Lesnar, Rollins, Owens) to deal with, which makes it worse. As much as his failure to take off has been on WWE booking, it's also been on the failures of Rollins and Owens to be effective heels. People forget that the Shield made Daniel Bryan over in WWE, because the Shield were awesome heels who legitimately got people angry at them.
Like, as much as people give grief to Reigns about being a face who gets booed, no one seems to like to talk about the fact that Jericho and Owens, who are supposed to be heels, keep getting cheered. You know, making them just as terrible at their jobs as Reigns supposedly is.
Reigns is fine - he's miscast as a babyface, or at least the smiling babyface. But like Cena, people want him to turn heel so they can cheer him again. He's had fan-favorite heels (Lesnar, Rollins, Owens) to deal with, which makes it worse. As much as his failure to take off has been on WWE booking, it's also been on the failures of Rollins and Owens to be effective heels. People forget that the Shield made Daniel Bryan over in WWE, because the Shield were awesome heels who legitimately got people angry at them.
JesseEwiak
Member
What made more money? Roman merch + house shows he main evented or Ambrose merch + house shows he main evented?
I'm asking this honestly, because we don't know. And neither does Meltzer. Yes, obviously, Vince will push the guy he wants because fuck the fans, but he's not going to push a guy who's losing him tons of money.
And to the "oh, but Roman has more merch." - Again, if Roman t-shirt #6 wasn't selling any t-shirts but Dean shirt #3 was sold out everywhere, do you honestly think they wouldn't make Dean t-shirt #4 and cut bait on Roman t-shirt #6? LIke I get it, Vince is terrible and knows nothing, but there are limits. It's like you guys don't want to believe, that rightly or wrongly, people are buying Roman merch. Not close to Cena obviously, but probably more than anybody but Cena and/or The New Day.
excelsiorlef
Member
No one cares about Orton.
When you get a hardcore crowd like Chile booing the fuck out of Roman Reigns and cheering for Rusev and Lana, it means that your "main eventer" shouldn't be Roman. And he got more boos than Sheamus. Let's sink that in.
New Day merch + house shows they participated.
Professor Beef
Banned
With none of the charisma
HashtagLapsed
Member
People can say people who hate Reigns are just holding a grudge or upset he is pushed too hard like every other face of a promotion or whatever.
Doesn't change the fact he barely has a character/personality and WWE haven't given anyone a reason to be emotionally invested in what he is doing in any way at all.
Doesn't change the fact he barely has a character/personality and WWE haven't given anyone a reason to be emotionally invested in what he is doing in any way at all.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
There's a word to describe making an argument based on "honestly" asking a question you freely admit can't be answered.
"Disingenuous."
UberTag
Member
Orton won me the GAF Rumble Lottery. Hence I care about him.
Nah, I don't really care about him. Harper, though... he gives me feels.
blackaroni
Member
Roman can do nothing right. People whine whether he wins or loses.
UberTag
Member
Fans don't hate Roman. They hate what he represents.
Which is none other than Vince's stubborn insistence that he's a creative genius when he's been hindering the booking of his flagship product for well over a decade.
Lol at this revisionist history. Bryan was over since 2011, there was reason why everyone lost their minds when he won MITB.
nobody hates Reigns because he gets booed as a face. They hate the people that write his character and push him as a face when it doesnt work.
Wait did you just say The Shield made Daniel Bryan over? Whut?
Bryan was over since 2011 when he won the MITB briefcase and had a feud with Mark Henry and then he went heel and started YESSING to the road of Wrestlemania, he went over as fuck after the 18 seconds and the rest is history. Hell, I can even say that Bryan was over by 2010's SummerSlam when he joined team WWE against The Nexus.
PHOENIXZERO
Member
I regret re-subbing but as much as I hate it I'll probably do the same for Takeover in Orlando, fittingly set for April Fools day though the only potential match I have any interest in would be Ember Moon/Asuka so if that's not on there I probably won't bother even though that seems to be the logical route to be taken.
nobody hates Reigns because he gets booed as a face. They hate the people that write his character and push him as a face when it doesnt work.
Wait did you just say The Shield made Daniel Bryan over? Whut?
This statement is disingenuous because literally every match with Roman has people crying about how shit he was, how shit the match was, or how the other guy carried Roman to a 4.5 star match. People refuse to give him his due. Those who say it's just the character they don't like are the same that instantly groan and whine whenever Roman gets the advantage in a match or shows up in anything.
JesseEwiak
Member
The Shield did help Bryan get over the hump from upper midcard quasi-comedy babyface who happened to win the title in a fluke as a heel the previous year to top level babyface who could main event shows, especially during the spring and summer of 2013. I'm not saying it wasn't totally their doing, but having a great heel squadron did help things.
But he was already main eventing shows before 2013.
Professor Beef
Banned
Even when Roman loses, they can't be happy. Jericho took the US Title from him, and people were mad at Roman for losing. It's ridiculous.
Discotheque
Banned
the best pure striker in sports entertainment.
Professor Beef
Banned
Now we know why JR kept calling them soup bones. Because Taker ate everything around them!
No, people were mad because they thought Roman losing meant he was beating KO. Of course that didn't happen and people are still mad.
excelsiorlef
Member
hey fuck you buddy
Let me rephrase no one cares about Orton winning the Rumble. Up until recently his work as a Wyatt is the best he's been in years, they've since rushed the program too much to my liking and it's almost definitely gonna end with Orton as master manipulator champ who not only beat Bray but ended the family... making Bray look like a chump for the 57478th time but the ride's been good, it just didn't need an Orton Rumble win.
People are mad because even when he has the mid card belt or no belt at all he is always at the main event scene, despite everyone complaining about that for the last 3 years
He lost to KO? Yes, and then show up at number 30 at Mania and it's probably gonna fight against freaking Undertaker on Wrestlemania, and it could be the last match of Taker
excelsiorlef
Member
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I think you're confused. People aren't mad that Roman was in the match at all. People are mad that 1) the match was a disappointment but set up a surprise 30th entrant and it was just Roman again to do more superhero shit and 2) that Vince would ever consider Taker vs. Roman at Mania to be a good idea when it's a terrible idea unless you want the guy to go heel. I hate Roman's character but I don't think the guy playing him deserves the nuclear heat he's going to get against the most popular wrestler ever on his signature stage.
Did while Randy was posing.
Evening Musuko
Black Korea
For all the talk about Reigns being booed since the Rumble 2 years ago, let's not forget about the shit they did to him in the months leading to it.
He was booked to face Seth Rollins at Night of Champions in 2014. They had a match the Raw before that PPV where Roman pinned Rollins clean. So what's the point watching on Sunday? He then got emergency surgery the Saturday before the PPV and was out for 3 months.
Instead of showing him slowly recover and training to come back they have him cut promos where he's just acting like...some guy. Like he was being forced to talk to someone but you can tell he didn't want to. He had that one promo about making it rain in that bitch that actually felt like an in-character promo, but that was way towards to end.
So they had him come back and he's cutting promos about Jack and the beanstalk. Ok.
And then they have him win the shittiest Rumble in years. Compared to the previous year where he's throwing people left and right, he's just lying down for most of it and to add insult to injury they have the rock come out and save him in the most transparent "CHEER ROMAN DAMMIT" way. They didn't even try with him and the fact of the matter is, they haven't tried with Roman in 2 years because just about everything they've done with him has been completely baffling.
Roman gets cashed in by Sheamus and loses the WWE title and is on the verge of tears. WHat happens the next night? HE'S SMILING. It took him a month before he actually got pissed enough at the authority to start wrecking shit and, surprise surprise, people are actually cheering for him.
That doesn't last long, so does WWE adapt? No they make things worse. At the Rumble 2016 he's #1 and he's defending the title, instead of having him go the distance and fighting until he can fight no more, you know like a babyface, he's sent to the back, and not even stretchered out, he's walks to the back on his own two feet, only to come back later in the match to even more boos.
Meanwhile, Kevin Owens had a grueling match against Dean Ambrose earlier that night and yet, even with a limp, he still walks to the ring and competes.
And people wonder why Kevin Owens gets more cheers than Roman Reigns.
It's like CM Punk said. They want to "Make Roman look strong" but instead of doing simple things that make sense, they go out of their way to make him look even worse.
It's simply amazing that's it's been 2 years and yet Roman Reigns is still getting shit on and yet people still think it's just because of the smarks. You cannot look at Roman's past 2 years and tell me he's been booked like someone people want to cheer for, for a good part of it.
He was booked to face Seth Rollins at Night of Champions in 2014. They had a match the Raw before that PPV where Roman pinned Rollins clean. So what's the point watching on Sunday? He then got emergency surgery the Saturday before the PPV and was out for 3 months.
Instead of showing him slowly recover and training to come back they have him cut promos where he's just acting like...some guy. Like he was being forced to talk to someone but you can tell he didn't want to. He had that one promo about making it rain in that bitch that actually felt like an in-character promo, but that was way towards to end.
So they had him come back and he's cutting promos about Jack and the beanstalk. Ok.
And then they have him win the shittiest Rumble in years. Compared to the previous year where he's throwing people left and right, he's just lying down for most of it and to add insult to injury they have the rock come out and save him in the most transparent "CHEER ROMAN DAMMIT" way. They didn't even try with him and the fact of the matter is, they haven't tried with Roman in 2 years because just about everything they've done with him has been completely baffling.
Roman gets cashed in by Sheamus and loses the WWE title and is on the verge of tears. WHat happens the next night? HE'S SMILING. It took him a month before he actually got pissed enough at the authority to start wrecking shit and, surprise surprise, people are actually cheering for him.
That doesn't last long, so does WWE adapt? No they make things worse. At the Rumble 2016 he's #1 and he's defending the title, instead of having him go the distance and fighting until he can fight no more, you know like a babyface, he's sent to the back, and not even stretchered out, he's walks to the back on his own two feet, only to come back later in the match to even more boos.
Meanwhile, Kevin Owens had a grueling match against Dean Ambrose earlier that night and yet, even with a limp, he still walks to the ring and competes.
And people wonder why Kevin Owens gets more cheers than Roman Reigns.
It's like CM Punk said. They want to "Make Roman look strong" but instead of doing simple things that make sense, they go out of their way to make him look even worse.
It's simply amazing that's it's been 2 years and yet Roman Reigns is still getting shit on and yet people still think it's just because of the smarks. You cannot look at Roman's past 2 years and tell me he's been booked like someone people want to cheer for, for a good part of it.
Paracelsus
Member
The writing was terrible, but beyond the default over-the-top rope booking.
Monster eliminates other monster? Oh boohoo I'm so mad about the elimination I'm totally gonna leave in silence, after staring at whoever did it.
Monster eliminates other monster? Oh boohoo I'm so mad about the elimination I'm totally gonna leave in silence, after staring at whoever did it.
excelsiorlef
Member
I am absolutely convinced that the rumor that there are folks in creative sabotaging Reigns might be true.
Not to mention we were supposed to believe Braun almost killed Roman, but Roman can shrug that off after a short limp after appearing at #30, then go toe-to-toe with a fresh Undertaker, with zero in-Rumble pay off from Braun's interference in KO's match.
Every booking decision in the entire company begins with what to do with Roman Reigns, and that's where every problem with their booking begins also.
And the problem with him isn't that he's bad, he's just boring and undeserving of such attention.
Every booking decision in the entire company begins with what to do with Roman Reigns, and that's where every problem with their booking begins also.
And the problem with him isn't that he's bad, he's just boring and undeserving of such attention.
blackaroni
Member
Were they really teasing a surprise number 30 entrant?
They weren't teasing any surprises, really.
But why does Reigns get to be in the Rumble and not AJ?
Aside from the obvious booking reason of setting up Reigns and Taker.
For casual fans, how does that not just look like Reigns is getting preferential treatment from the people in charge who supposedly don't like him?
It's literally like last year where they had this grand plan to get the title off Reigns by making him put it on the line at the Rumble...only to give him an opportunity at a title shot the very next night.
As much as WWE writing want to pretend that Reigns is anti-corporate or isn't the chosen one, what they show on TV goes against it all the time.
Sorta not exactly 30 but they always play up the fact that there will be surprise entrants.
Having Reigns come out not only underminds that but honestly hurts the rumble more than helps it.
Rumor is it's going to be Reigns vs Strowman at Fastlane.
So probably no heel turn at all. Even though Strowman maybe turned face in most people's eyes by attacking Reigns tonight.
Paracelsus
Member
If he turns heel it's confirmed he will get a clean pin over Taker, because Taker believes in time-honored tradition and he will do the job as he leaves.
It's also the only way to give him nuclear heat as a heel, otherwise people will just cheer Taker and not care for him at all.
Thought it was Goldberg/Reigns rumored?
blackaroni
Member
Preferential treatment? Really? How can you even set aside the altercation with Undertaker? Also, a rematch typically works that way.
This makes no sense. How did it hurt the rumble?
They already announced 22 participants, so if you were counting the unknown entries, you knew 30 was going to be someone not announced. They even cut to the tron before the music so you could clearly see who it would be and... yep, Roman.
Personally I didn't think the Rumble was bad at all. You were kidding yourself if you thought the final three were going to be Nakamura, Joe, and Angle. It had a lull in the middle, but there were entertaining spots throughout and there wasn't an obvious winner. Before the match you could've picked half a dozen guys who had a good chance of winning, and even in the final three you still weren't sure. There are many stories you can tell from the match and some like Corbin had big moments you can highlight. I do wish there was one non-current wrestler that appeared and some guys were in the match way too long only to be tossed like nothing.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked